New guy with Savage and Mosin

R

romulus22

Private
Minuteman
Sep 1, 2010
23
0
41
KY
#1
Hey guys. Just found this site looking for parts for my rifle. First let me say I'm still very new to this so if you ask questions and I don't know what your talking about, I apologize. But I am here to learn that's why I signed up.

I kinda jumped the gun without doing any research and bought a Savage Edge In 30-06. Now I am finding it hard to find any sort of aftermarket support for this rifle. New, yes I know it takes time. Anyways I have ordered a select match bull barrel in 26" with 1:12 twist and muzzle brake due to their recommendations on the ammo I'm using. I managed to get the trigger pull down to 2 lbs with virtually no creep. Just a good snap. Oh and I'm using a pretty cheap scope for now. Still hard for me to spend the big money on the good stuff being as new as I am.

My Mosin Nagant is nothing special. Worked on the trigger a little bit. Took out a lot of the slop but that's about it. Haven't checked the trigger pull yet. Did order a PU scope off of ebay and right now my bolt body is off getting turned into a sniper bolt from an ebay seller.

Enough of the boring talk. Onto the pictures.

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#2
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

haven't handled that savage. the others--10/12 etc--all shot very well out of the box.

I would suggest setting up some lower rings for the scope if you can. A good cheek weld will be tough as it is.

That is a pretty new rifle, so parts may be tough to come by. However, I see no reason to be bothered. 30 06 is a very good cartridge and will kill any animal around here AND it will make a fine target rifle.

I suggest you get some money together and look into getting a nice single stage press set up and learning to reload. Once you know what you are doing, that is the single best upgrade you can do for any rifle.

The mosin is a fun rifle. How does it shoot? Good bore?
 
#3
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

As far as the scope goes. The rings came with the scope. The third ring I put on there because the scope was moving at first and I figured why not. I'm waiting on my barrel before I order a new scope and rings till I know the exact clearance I will have. It should be here early Nov. But yes, It was impossible to get any sort of cheek weld until I put the pad on there.

Ive thought of reloading and people tell me I should but at this point I really don't know how serious I want to get into it right now. So for the time being the ammo I'm shooting Federal 168 grain Gold Metal Match.

The Mosin Ive only taken out once so far. Shot it iron sights at 100yrd off the elbow technique. I can't brag and say I did well but I managed to keep all 40 rounds on the piece of notebook size paper I use for putting my target dots on. Once my bolt body get back I plan on spending plenty of time shooting this gun. I have way too much ammo sitting here. The bore looks to have good rifling if that's what you mean?
 
#4
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

The reason you have the three rings is because they are crappy, thats why it takes three of them to keep the scope from moving, they are also too high, thats why you have the cheek pad.Buying a new barrel may be an unessessary expense, it may shoot better than you, as do many savages right out of the box. Your money may have been spent far better in a quality optic. The muzzle break is a fine idea, though I wouldn't have it installed until I was sure the current barrel is satisfactory, which you wont find out until you get some good practice and pills through it. I would recommend learning to reload as well, you will get better accuracy through practice and reloading, and a good scope will bring out the best of your efforts there. Good luck!
 
#5
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

Rifle Basix makes a trigger for the Edge.

The only lacking support is for a decent stock. I bet if you'd call Stockade, Kevin would be able when stocks will be available for them.
 
#6
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: coldboremiracle</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The reason you have the three rings is because they are crappy, thats why it takes three of them to keep the scope from moving, they are also too high, thats why you have the cheek pad.Buying a new barrel may be an unessessary expense, it may shoot better than you, as do many savages right out of the box. Your money may have been spent far better in a quality optic. The muzzle break is a fine idea, though I wouldn't have it installed until I was sure the current barrel is satisfactory, which you wont find out until you get some good practice and pills through it. I would recommend learning to reload as well, you will get better accuracy through practice and reloading, and a good scope will bring out the best of your efforts there. Good luck! </div></div>

I'll give you that. It is a cheap scope and I knew it was when I bought it. Regretting it now knowing that's $200 that could have went to much better scope. I'm sure this rifle is a great shooter. I'm working on being a better shooter myself. The reason I went with the barrel is mainly for the muzzle break. I tend to flinch anticipating the recoil. Something Ive been working on and I'm getting much better. But I'm hoping the muzzle break and added weight of the heavy barrel will lessen the recoil and keep me from pushing into the gun as much.

Before I spend an hour trying to search for stuff I know nothing about what would you guys say a starter reloading setup would run. I say starter because I feel that number will be easier for me to handle.
 
#7
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: geargrinder</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Rifle Basix makes a trigger for the Edge.

The only lacking support is for a decent stock. I bet if you'd call Stockade, Kevin would be able when stocks will be available for them. </div></div>
I'm pretty happy with my trigger for now. Ive emailed a couple companies that sell stocks. Most didn't reply. The other couple that did really didn't have a plan for the Edge any time soon.
 
#10
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

this is your problem almost all rifles have a recoil lug pinched between a barrel nut and the action or between the barrel itself and the action you were right in choosing a savage to build up yourself however the savage edge and tikka t3 rifles are a different breed of jackalope they have the recoil lug in the stock that slides between the barrel nut and action this in my opinion is better out of the box because most recoil lugs dont touch anything until they are bedded

here is a picture of my wifes edge in 223 you can see the silver recoil lug in the stock

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#11
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

this is a better pic it shows that the recoil lug goes into a cutout in the reciever itself

so what does all of this mean to someone who is new ... you can buy a different rifle to modify to do what you want it to or you will be one of the first to be doing a rebarrel on a edge and with no aftermarket you will have a hell of a time and may not be able to do what you originally wanted with it due to lack of aftermarket support

153wo7b.jpg
 
#13
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: coldboremiracle</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Wow, dont know if I like that or not. </div></div>

I don't.

That's one of the dumbest things I've seen.
 
#14
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

dont intend to steal your thread romulus just want to post a few pis so maybe others can provide more feedback

x5dnaa.jpg


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just keep in mind that this rifle was built with the intent of being the most budget of budget rifles while still maintaning savage accuracy

notice that there is no rear tang that is part of the trigger and safety mechanism
 
#15
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

Ah I did notice that silver lug thing. didn't know that was called a recoil lug. Are you saying when I install my new barrel this will be a problem? Or you just don't like the idea for some reason? Not sure what could go wrong when I install the new barrel. It has the same threads and will use the same nut. Remember I'm new so I really don't know the plus or minus of the recoil lug.
 
#16
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

The edge really isn't a rifle worth investing money in. Its an entry level sport/ hunting rifle. Just shoot it as is and save up for a model 10/110 or model 12.
 
#17
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

you can get a complete stevens for a donor receiver for about $200ish. that recoil system looks like its gonna be hard to defeat. i regular type lug wont be able to lock up. you can get a bare receiver from jim at northland shooters supply. keep the edge the way it is and build another rifle with the barrel that you ordered.

see the thing is when you get a new barrel you will still be stuck with stock unless someone comes out with an aftermarket option.

for reloading a tried and true RCBS rockchucker press or kit is decent. buy the press and fill the rest of your needs in the classifieds here. eventually you will need a trimmer, but a decent caliper and scales and a powder measure would be nice, possibly a trickler. the little case tools like a primer pocket brush or chamfer/deburr tool. you can fulfill your gadget fetish in this hobby easily as your wallet is depleted at the same time, lol. cruise ebay, gun broker. know what the biggies (midway, midsouth, widners, grafs, brownells) sells stuff for and know what is and isnt a bargain. i snagged my RCBS kit used at a gunshow for $300. had everything the retail kit did plus a trimmer and alot of other little stuff that i mentioned all in a plano tackle box. call jim about a receiver.

http://savageshooters.com/SavageForum/index.php/board,64.0.html

shoot what you got, build while you shoot.
 
#18
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AXEMAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
see the thing is when you get a new barrel you will still be stuck with stock unless someone comes out with an aftermarket option. </div></div>

Is this whats so bad about the design of the recoil lug? because it is pressed into the stock and not part of the receiver. I really don't mind the factory stock. Once I couldn't find one online I went ahead and made room for a larger barrel and filled the void with epoxy to stiffen it up.

Also here's a couple pictures of my trigger I meant to post in my first post, Forgot. Not sure on the thickness but it's a sheet of stainless formed around the front and the zip tie just holds the back half sturdy. Polished everything metal on metal the best I could. And the rear spring is just out of a pen. Haven't had any issues so far. I'm very careful with it though and there is never a live round in the chamber unless I'm looking down range ready to take a shot.

006-2.jpg


007-1.jpg
 
#19
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bodywerks</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The edge really isn't a rifle worth investing money in. Its an entry level sport/ hunting rifle. Just shoot it as is and save up for a model 10/110 or model 12. </div></div>

No disrespect when I ask this but what would be the difference? I still am lost on the recoil lug thing. Is that it? Or is is the aftermarket support? If I used the new barrel on a 10/110 wouldn't they be pretty much the same as my Edge with the same barrel?

Excuse my newbness. I feel like a little kid again asking all the adults in the room whats this, why, how.
 
#20
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

i think thats it mostly. can you put a better trigger in? a SSS or factory accutrigger? the one thing about savage is that when they keep doing these variations, it ends up coming back in chatter as a negative. like the center -vs- stagger feed? the screw spacing, the safety and the cocking indicator and all the stuff that takes away from the fact that they are good shooters is what is wrong with this way of doing good stuff.

it seems that with this design, your only as stiff as the plastic is in that area around your lug. with a standard lug, you can bed properly for best consistancy. also with the way they cut the bottom of the receiver, it pretty much assures this cannot be used with a conventional lug. since you cant tighten the nut and clamp the steel lug you have between the receiver and the barrel nut all as one unit. you are having to rely on a receiver thats dropped on to a lug. the tolerances cant be so good that its a tight fit. its gotta have some slop id guess. more than the conventional way.

shoot it while you learn about savage and build off a stevens or savage receiver from northland, or a sale on stevens in your area. you will get better results, less frustration and more satisfaction, plus just better equipment in the end.

but i could be crazy

who typed that?

ps...sweet job propping up the trigger
 
#21
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

Now I understand about the lug. That made a lot more sense. I plan on doing some shooting this weekend now that I'm getting a little more free time. At this point I'm working on shooting in 5 round groups. I always manage to get 3-4 touching but I always push 1-2 rounds. My best so far is 1.375" group at 100yrds. most are around 1.5"-1.675" I'm sure this is from me pushing into the rifle.

I really appreciate all the help so far guys.
 
#22
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Romulus</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bodywerks</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The edge really isn't a rifle worth investing money in. Its an entry level sport/ hunting rifle. Just shoot it as is and save up for a model 10/110 or model 12. </div></div>

No disrespect when I ask this but what would be the difference? I still am lost on the recoil lug thing. Is that it? Or is is the aftermarket support? If I used the new barrel on a 10/110 wouldn't they be pretty much the same as my Edge with the same barrel?

Excuse my newbness. I feel like a little kid again asking all the adults in the room whats this, why, how. </div></div>
Well that recoil lug design is reason enough. Most recoil lugs are an integral part of the barreled action and are far more solid. Plus the trigger group is atypical and over complicated looking and, as you have already discovered, aftermarket options are limited. Just leave the gun the way it is. I think any attempts to modify it will just hurt its accuracy potential.
 
#23
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Romulus</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AXEMAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
see the thing is when you get a new barrel you will still be stuck with stock unless someone comes out with an aftermarket option. </div></div>

Is this whats so bad about the design of the recoil lug? because it is pressed into the stock and not part of the receiver. I really don't mind the factory stock. Once I couldn't find one online I went ahead and made room for a larger barrel and filled the void with epoxy to stiffen it up.

Also here's a couple pictures of my trigger I meant to post in my first post, Forgot. Not sure on the thickness but it's a sheet of stainless formed around the front and the zip tie just holds the back half sturdy. Polished everything metal on metal the best I could. And the rear spring is just out of a pen. Haven't had any issues so far. I'm very careful with it though and there is never a live round in the chamber unless I'm looking down range ready to take a shot.
</div></div>

Looking at the pictures you could replace the trigger with a standard 3 screw. You'd have to rig something for the spring is all.
 
#24
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

AXEMAN the tolerances cant be so good that its a tight fit. its gotta have some slop id guess. more than the conventional way. [/quote said:
I was curious to see so I stopped on the way home and picked up a digital caliper.

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002-1.jpg
Click to expand...
 
#25
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

thats pretty tight. better than that and you get more issues. your good til you look for a better stock. if your groups are spreading, stock flex is what everybody calls sooner or later as a possible issue. i still say shoot it, build a better rifle with savage or stevens as a base. that design will limit you and there isnt any reason to pump money into that when it will be better served fixing up a traditional lugged rifle.

yours isnt bad or anything, just limited. but buy a 12 receiver, a match barrel from someone, pick a trigger, there is an HS in the used for $400 for a savage or any other stock and youll be better served with the results.
 
#26
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AXEMAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">thats pretty tight. better than that and you get more issues. your good til you look for a better stock. if your groups are spreading, stock flex is what everybody calls sooner or later as an issue. i still say shoot it, build a better rifle with savage or stevens as a base. that design will limit you and there isnt any reason to pump money into that when it will be better served fixing up a traditional lugged rifle.

yours isnt bad or anything, just limited. but buy a 12 receiver, a match barrel from someone, pick a trigger, there is an HS in the used for $400 for a savage or any other stock and youll be better served with the results. </div></div>

Really I do appreciate your alls help but at this point I already have the barrel on order. I don't feel like having parts laying around while I try to build on a better base. I think I'm going to install the barrel on this and go with that. By the time the barrel gets here I'l have more practice time in. Early Nov. is the expected date. If anything I can always transfer the barrel over to a 10/110 later if I went that route right? The scope I'm going to deal with until I save up for a while.


Also the USPS man delivered my Mosin bolt body. This guy does terrific work. It really does look like it was made this way. Ide recommend him to anyone looking to convert theirs over.

http://cgi.ebay.com/MOSIN-NAGANT-SNIPER-...=item20b3625f91

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#27
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

Just wanted to mention also and I know I say this with every new hobby but I'm not looking or expecting professional accuracy. Just something I can be happy with myself.
 
#28
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

ok well look at it this way. shoot what you have, shoot it til you get as small a group as possible. but keep your old barrel. later invest in a $200-$300 purchase of a good receiver and swap that old barrel back, the new one on to the new receiver and you will have two rifles. savage is easy to swap barrels, i did mine with no prior experience.

just do not expect a super accurate rifle with that system. then again it might suprise us. but also, dont get fustrated when your current wont shoot well. remember this thread and the links and shell out the cash
 
#29
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

Thanks again man. I know I cant expect the best but I'm really hoping to be surprised. But it's also going to take effort on my part and I'm still working on it. I'll keep you all updated as I shoot and progress through my leaning stages.
 
#30
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

I personally feel for a beginner the 30-06 AND THE 7.62X54r ARE WAY TO MUCH GUN for a beginner looking to get the fundamentals down. They can cause flinching in many shooters, not all but many. I personally think you should go get a 22 rifle and practice your basics till you can get nice, consistent groups with your Point of aim and point of impact. Far too many people buy a caliber because they read forums and think with a scope they'll be knocking targets at 1000m easy consistently. But that takes practice and time especially when that's some rounds and rifles limits
 
#31
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

Ive put thousands of rounds through my .22 and I can shoot it great, I don't flinch one bit with it. One of the things I was thinking might also be hurting my accuracy is I'm not 100% steady. As I'm aiming most of the time I can see my heartbeat and I try to squeeze a shot off at the right time. I think this is also whats causing me to push the rounds.
 
#32
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

I would agree with most everyone else here and say that is not a good platform to start customizing. You can change your order, or just hold that barrel until you get a better platform.

But I would also add that I would be shocked if that rifle, in its present form wont shoot 1 moa. I have no experience with that specific rifle, but I have owned a bunch of Savage rifles. They were all I would buy until I started buying custom rifles. And every single one of them I had, which were almost all model 10's, would shoot 1 moa or even quite a bit better.

I still think Savage offers the most accuracy per dollar. The only reason I lean to Remington now is the aftermarket options.

I really think you will regret putting a custom barrel onto a platform that doesnt allow you to mount a quality stock on it. If you are trying to make a precision rifle (why would you buy a custom barrel otherwise?) it is foolish to put a quality barrel into a flexing stock. The consistency just wont be there. Your results wont be what they should be given the money you are putting into the barrel/Smith work.

Just use that rifle as is for a hunting rifle or sell it to fund something that will allow you to fully customize it.

It would be akin to putting a supercharger onto an engine with tiny exhaust manifolds. Just not getting your moneys worth. You can change your mind now and do it right for about the same price. Just my opinion.
 
#33
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

I actually went shooting again today. I know I am far from perfect and still need to learn a lot before I consider myself good but today the rifle was inconsistent more than it has ever been before. I went through 60 rounds and my patterns were all over the place. First they started high left, worked the scope to get them on target within a half inch or so of center. Still my newbness was probably the culprit as I couldn't hold tight groups. But in my defense it was pretty sunny and a little warm. This was the first time Ive been shooting with this rifle and scope and the target looked like it was sitting behind a range top. The heat waves made it very hard to focus on the target. Anyways all of my shots started hitting high right. After this I called it a day and sighted in the scope on my Mosin.

This leads me to my new question leaning to what you guys have been telling me to do since the beginning.

If I were to start over now and use my barrel on order what would be the best receiver/stock/trigger to go with and links would be a great help? can this barrel be used on a 308? If so would this be a good platform that covers most of my needs?

http://www.impactguns.com/store/011356181398.html

I apologize for so many questions. I hate being the new guy on the forums.
 
#34
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Romulus</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

This leads me to my new question leaning to what you guys have been telling me to do since the beginning.

If I were to start over now and use my barrel on order what would be the best receiver/stock/trigger to go with and links would be a great help? can this barrel be used on a 308? If so would this be a good platform that covers most of my needs?

http://www.impactguns.com/store/011356181398.html

I apologize for so many questions. I hate being the new guy on the forums.

</div></div>

My opinion would be to get a long action Stevens 200 in any caliber you want. You could use any short action round with bullets seated long or you can use any long action round seated to the magazine, or any round seated long single shot.

The 338 Edge I built started as a Savage long action 308. I have a couple other long actions that I swap freely between between long and short action rounds. 22-250 up to 338win.

The only downside to the Stevens 200's is the really crappy stock. I think it's even worse than your Edge stock. Nothing a call to Kevin at Stockade and a couple hundred bucks won't fix.

Once you sell the barrel and stock from the Stevens, add your new barrel, and Stockade stock I'd guess you be into it less than $750-$800. Still way cheaper than the factory one in the link, and way better with the better barrel.
 
#35
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: geargrinder</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
My opinion would be to get a long action Stevens 200 in any caliber you want. You could use any short action round with bullets seated long or you can use any long action round seated to the magazine, or any round seated long single shot.
</div></div>

I have no idea what you just said. but I do load one round at a time now. I think its just as easy as pulling the mag and loading four rounds then shooting. Are short action receivers better due to less flex?
 
#37
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

I have a savage 10FP and like it a lot. Savages are a lot of fun to tinker on. If I were you I would sell that thing asap in "like new" condition and pick up a used model 10 short action and you could re-barrel that and put it in a decent stock and have a tack driver. Just my .02... And I cant believe somebody hasn't said it yet, but DRY FIRE!!! practice by aiming at something a ways off. Pay atention to your breathing and getting comfetable squeezing the trigger and holding the same steady sight picture while you do it. Ps- I'm sure you could get into a reloading set up for a few hundred pretty easy. That's where you can really tune in your accuracy. Also, see if there are any clubs in you area and get hooked up with the guys there. I'm sure there are guys in your area that might even teach you how to reload and let you use their stuff to get started.
 
#38
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

Its pretty far from like new condition now. About 260 rounds through the barrel. Clearanced the stock and filled it with epoxy. Painted it. I'll probably give it to my brother.
 
#40
Re: New guy with Savage and Mosin

ok, there is/was a $400 HS stock in the used section. you can get a bare receiver from Jim at northland for 350 ish and a stevens for less. you dont have to buy a whole rile and sell off parts unless thats cheaper or easier. savage means you can do the barrel swap/install yourself. look at the options and read a few threads. click on my name and view my posts. i only know savage so i post alot in the threads. you can get all the info there
 
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