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Rifle Scopes New SCHMIDT BENDER Reticle - LRR-Mil - detailed info and pics - ***UPDATE 7/30/19 - 5-45 LRR NOW AVAILABLE

jb1000br

jb1000br

Jason@EuroOptic
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Dec 23, 2001
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On my Belly
S&B rolled out their new reticle at SHOT Show this year, and while I must say that I have always hated a center floating dot, this one is well executed because it is so SMALL and I actually like it! Quite an appropriate aimpoint for ELR pursuits since it was intended for the new 5-45. They are also adding it to the 3-20 US, 5-25 and 3-27.

More info and detailed pics in the link below.



**SB LRR-mil RETICLE DETAILS**



Jason
 
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Thank you Jason, your information shows closeup detail of the reticle which Schmidt's product brochure did not so thank you for that. I don't like all the words they have inscribed but my guess is it won't bother me after a while. With the exciting news that Schmidt was dropping its prices and now this reticle I have something to be excited about from S&B. I would be interested in this reticle in the 3-20, any idea when those might become available?
 
This is great news!! Biggest Floating dot fan right here! What does that "dot" subtend to in mils? Thank you Jason
 
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Very interested in this new reticle and turret from SB!! In the marked for a new 5-25ish scope and this is on the short list.
 
tho98027 said:
Is the multi turn ii turret come standard on the 2017 5-25x56?
Click to expand...

Nothing will really be "standard" - all options are possible, but yes, that will be available - here was the direct info from SB:

The new Multi-Turn II™ will be available for the 3-20x50 PM II™ Ultra Short and 3-27x56 PM II™ High Power models, with 393 centimeters (39.3 Mils) adjustment value. It will also be available for the 5-25x56 PM II™ and 5-45x56 PM II™ High Power models with 270 centimeters (27.0 Mils) adjustment value. Furthermore, the new design offers click values in 0.5 centimeter (0.050 Mil), allowing for finer zeroing and greater precision for long-range shooting, it will be out for delivery somewhere late summer.

Our 5-45x56 will only carry the Flat Turrets so far; but as mentioned above you have the option of getting the new MTII instead.

Jason
 
Bustossa said:
This is great news!! Biggest Floating dot fan right here! What does that "dot" subtend to in mils? Thank you Jason
Click to expand...

That is in section 1 if you click on the link in the first post.

1.6mm@100M or 0.016MRAD or 0.055MOA by my math(slightly smaller than the line thickness of a Nightforce MOAR-T or NP-R1/NP-R2

Jason
 
jb1000br said:
Nothing will really be "standard" - all options are possible, but yes, that will be available - here was the direct info from SB:

The new Multi-Turn II™ will be available for the 3-20x50 PM II™ Ultra Short and 3-27x56 PM II™ High Power models, with 393 centimeters (39.3 Mils) adjustment value. It will also be available for the 5-25x56 PM II™ and 5-45x56 PM II™ High Power models with 270 centimeters (27.0 Mils) adjustment value. Furthermore, the new design offers click values in 0.5 centimeter (0.050 Mil), allowing for finer zeroing and greater precision for long-range shooting, it will be out for delivery somewhere late summer.

Our 5-45x56 will only carry the Flat Turrets so far; but as mentioned above you have the option of getting the new MTII instead.

Jason
Click to expand...

May have to do a trade in when these come out.
 
I don't understand why they wouldn't incorporate a christmas tree type reticle design for ELR work. If you are going to be holding 20+ mils of elevation on the reticle, it would be nice to have an actual wind hold as well, rather than guessing because the reticle is in empty space. Very rarely would you be holding 0 wind for ELR work. You can always dial, but that's not ideal IMO.
 
This new LRR-MIL reticle definitely has me interested. For what it's worth, I emailed S&B USA inquiring about it before seeing this thread. I was told:

"The release date of the first LRR-Mil reticles is in @ August and will be first delivered in the 5-25x56 models. We are not sure when the 3-20 US will follow."

I am new to long range target type shooting, mainly just been a big game hunter. However, as mentioned in my thread under the 7.62 section, I am planning on purchasing a S&B scope for my new FDE Larue 7.62 and this reticle might be worth waiting for. Still trying to research, learn, and get everything set up.
 
THRASHER said:
This new LRR-MIL reticle definitely has me interested. For what it's worth, I emailed S&B USA inquiring about it before seeing this thread. I was told:

"The release date of the first LRR-Mil reticles is in @ August and will be first delivered in the 5-25x56 models. We are not sure when the 3-20 US will follow."

I am new to long range target type shooting, mainly just been a big game hunter. However, as mentioned in my thread under the 7.62 section, I am planning on purchasing a S&B scope for my new FDE Larue 7.62 and this reticle might be worth waiting for. Still trying to research, learn, and get everything set up.
Click to expand...

I sent them an email when this thread started and they told me June availability. Guess it moved to August. They also told me it will be available for present owners of the 5-25. He couldn't tell me the cost but said it will be comparable to other reticle swaps.

I want to know whether a present owner of a 5-25 will also be able to swap the DT turret for the new Multi-turn 2. I would do both changes at once. Don't know if that will be possible but hope it will.
 
Lever is garbage as its not foldable and is huge. Imagine carrying rifle with that thing on, it has potential to poke some "serious" holes in your body. I mentioned that to S&B rep. at IWA and he took notes so perhaps it will be foldable.
 
Nik H said:
I sent them an email when this thread started and they told me June availability. Guess it moved to August. They also told me it will be available for present owners of the 5-25. He couldn't tell me the cost but said it will be comparable to other reticle swaps.

I want to know whether a present owner of a 5-25 will also be able to swap the DT turret for the new Multi-turn 2. I would do both changes at once. Don't know if that will be possible but hope it will.
Click to expand...

Nik H - I wish what they told you, June, was correct. Maybe we will get lucky and it will be. I just went back and looked up the date of the email I got from S&B USA and it was from 5-8-17. Maybe the date will get pushed up a bit though. Regarding the Multi-Turn 2.... I am definitely interested in that too. I think I'll email them about that and see what response I get. Will keep everyone advised.
 
Please do...I would really like the new turret along with the new reticle. I would have asked but only knew about the reticle at the time when I sent them the email.
 
Nik H - New email to S&B USA has been sent. Will keep you up to date when they respond.
 
Nik H - Still no reply. I think I am going to resend the email. It's been nearly a week.

Anyone else have any news on the new LRR-MIL reticle or Multi-Turn 2? I'd really like to see some more in depth explanatory videos. I'll update any info I receive when I get an email response from S&B USA.
 
Nik H - Here is the question I sent to S&B on your behalf and their answer. It's a direct copy and paste.

I have a friend who has a 5-25x56 PMII. He is interested in updating to the new LRR-MIL reticle and also the Multi-Turn II turret. When will this upgrade be available to current owners and what will the cost be? At least estimated cost.

Response: "From what we have been told this reticle will be constructed in such a way that it cannot be installed in the models. It would require the purchase of a new scope with the LRR-Mil reticle."

Well that's definitely disappointing to hear for the current S&B owners that were interested. However, he did say "from what we have been told," so maybe that leaves a glimmer of hope. I have emailed them twice and both times, after a week of no replies, I have had to reach out again and then magically I get a quick response. Kind of frustrating especially considering the amount of money I am going to be spending on their product. I also asked the following that some might find interesting:


As of now, I am leaning towards a PMII 5-25x56 with the LRR-MIL reticle. I'd also like it with the new Multi-Turn II Turret. When will this combo be available in the US?

Response: "We have been told August / September time frame."


davidwiz - I don't have any pricing information. I did ask this in the email:

Are prices set by S&B or are they at the discretion of the dealer?

Response: "S&B establishes an MSRP / List price. Dealers cannot be told what to sell the scopes for however they cannot advertise below the MSRP / LIST price. You would need to shop for the best price."



 
That is interesting since they told me the opposite at least regarding the reticle. It is no biggie though. I figure when they start shipping it; we will get the real scoop. I like my S&B now. Looking at the 5-45 model also. If they don't offer an upgrade, I may trade mine in towards a 5-45.

Thanks for doing that for me!
 
Hmmm. I'm conflicted now. My heart was all set on getting a Kahles K624i SKMR3 LW for PRS, now I'm wondering if the LRR Mil would work too? (I know what the street price is for the Kahles, wondering if this version of the S&B is comparable).
 
Any new info on the release of the LRR?
 
Can someone help me understand the value of the power identification indicators in the lower right hand quadrant? Why is it important to know what power you're on? Is this a cross over feature for second focal plane options, perhaps?
 
It's probably a carry over from the European Forces when using NV, because they cannot see in the dark .

The Hensoldt has it too, and it's in their NV specific optics, in a FFP it's not really needed but they may have wanted it for whatever reason, reporting etc.
 
Thanks, Lowlight!

The rest of the reticle look really interesting. I'm plotting on a new 3-20 ultra short with this reticle and maybe the new multi turn turret, but I'd like to see more info about that turret before selecting it over the current low profile ultra short turret.
 
Maybe I missed something, but has anyone considered that maybe that reticle will be offered in second focal plane models at some point and the power ranges are in the reticle so you don't have to look at the power ring to check if you're on the right magnification or not?


Better to have it and not need it, than to not have it and say oh shit.....
 
THRASHER said:
Nik H - Still no reply. I think I am going to resend the email. It's been nearly a week.

Anyone else have any news on the new LRR-MIL reticle or Multi-Turn 2? I'd really like to see some more in depth explanatory videos. I'll update any info I receive when I get an email response from S&B USA.
Click to expand...

So Jerry sent me another note regarding this reticle.

He says that due to demand for it in new builds, it won't be available as a service center item until Q1 2018
 
Any leads on when it will be hitting stores on the 5-25?
 
Covertnoob5 said:
Maybe I missed something, but has anyone considered that maybe that reticle will be offered in second focal plane models at some point and the power ranges are in the reticle so you don't have to look at the power ring to check if you're on the right magnification or not?


Better to have it and not need it, than to not have it and say oh shit.....
Click to expand...

Well, for one you missed that the reticle does not shift in size along with the magnification in a SFP scope, so just how would the power markings in the reticle change?
 
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Seems there has been some rumors about the LRR reticle not happening, so rather than "assume" that person who "works for SB" was right, I went to the factory for a response:

"the LRR will be out for 5-25x56 in Jan 2018; other models shall be available summer 2018"

Now this is several months behind what we expected(to be expected in this industry), but indeed it is still happening. We have every version showing below (and maybe some that aren't) on order, so you can get on the top of the list for these if you want, let me know.

***LINK TO SCHMIDT & BENDER LRR-mil RETICLE OPTIONS***

As for retrofit options, that will not happen until at least MONTHS after first deliveries, so I would not worry about anything that is said on that subject until then. They have to make production scopes before they worry about dedicating parts to retrofits as you can imagine.

Jason
 
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jb1000br said:
Seems there has been some rumors about the LRR reticle not happening, so rather than "assume" that person who "works for SB" was right, I went to the factory for a response:

"the LRR will be out for 5-25x56 in Jan 2018; other models shall be available summer 2018"

Now this is several months behind what we expected(to be expected in this industry), but indeed it is still happening. We have every version showing below (and maybe some that aren't) on order, so you can get on the top of the list for these if you want, let me know.

***LINK TO SCHMIDT & BENDER LRR-mil RETICLE OPTIONS***

As for retrofit options, that will not happen until at least MONTHS after first deliveries, so I would not worry about anything that is said on that subject until then. They have to make production scopes before they worry about dedicating parts to retrofits as you can imagine.

Jason
Click to expand...

Thanks for the heads up, by the way your link isn't working.
 
Safeshooter - thanks for the heads-up, looks like the search page expired - it worked when I set it up, sorry! I fixed to link to go to all SB options. if you go to the link in my post above, then search lrr-mil - then click Schmidt Bender under the manufacturer tab and re-search it should sort out all the LRR options.

Jason
 
Covertnoob5 said:
Maybe I missed something, but has anyone considered that maybe that reticle will be offered in second focal plane models at some point and the power ranges are in the reticle so you don't have to look at the power ring to check if you're on the right magnification or not?


Better to have it and not need it, than to not have it and say oh shit.....
Click to expand...

I'm with you on this one. Not sure I completely understand the true need for the magnification indicator. If I can see everything I need to in my scope then why am I worried what power its on? If I cant, then I either power up or down until I achieve what I'm after - Again not sure I totally see the use and it would make the reticle less clustered without it (I do understand that it is in the lower right corner but still)
 
My question is why does the 5-25 get it first? Is it because it is the high runner? I would think it would be on the flagship models before the 5-25.
 
Nik H said:
My question is why does the 5-25 get it first? Is it because it is the high runner? I would think it would be on the flagship models before the 5-25.
Click to expand...

I'd guess it's their bread and butter - probably the most amortized and most popular product.
 
So I have another update regarding the LRR-MIL reticle and Multi-Turn II turrets. I emailed a contact in Germany that works for Schmidt & Bender in the "Research and Development" department.

First, here is what I wrote:

"Guten Morgen,

Ich hoffe meine Freunde in Deutschland gehen gut.

I wanted to email you again to see how things are going for the LRR-MIL reticle. I am still patiently waiting. Is there an updated timeframe for the reticle? Will it still be produced and will it be sold in the USA? Also, how about the Multi Turn II?

I plan to put the new Schmidt und Bender on the Larue Tactical rifle attached in the picture. For now it is sitting and waiting. Currently, I don't have a flight scheduled to Germany, but the next time I do, I will have to buy you a Licher Bier!

Talk soon!

Ich freue mich darauf, von Ihnen zu hören. Es tut mir leid, mein Deutsch ist nicht so gut. Ich habe viel vergessen."

Chris


Here is his response:


'Hello Chris,

thinks for the LRR-MIL run a little bit sluggish but this is due to our supplier.

The reticle will available for spring next year. The Multi Turn II is available two in spring next year.

The LRR and the Multi Turn II will also be available in the USA.



I guess the 3-20 Ultra Short is the right Scope for this rifle.



Best regards from Germany





Mit freundlichen Grüßen / With best


I know we were all hoping for an earlier availability date, but at least it's confirmed it is still be produced and we will eventually be able to get our hands on one. Eventually.........





 
I spoke with S&B this week a few times and discussed this new reticle a bit. I didn't get any warm fuzzies regarding a firm release date. She said they are having issues getting the price in line with their other reticles. As it stands now this new LRR is coming in very close to the Horus and Tremors in terms of price.

I'm paraphrasing here, but essentially... "it will happen, we just don't know when or if the market will pay the premium for this reticle."
 
I also wrote to them a bunch of times bacause they did not allow me to buy it even though their website said late 2017 (this was a while back), and glade to see they changed the text.

The last time I had a reticle replaced it toke 3 months from when it was send to when I had it back in my hands. S&B told me it was because they had to change their policy! Before they did the change (of a reticle for example) before the customer had paid. Now S&B insist on having the payment etc which means the customer needs to be given a coute first etc.

I am getting the LRR for my 5-25x56
 
Good luck with that.

I was told that it is unlikely that it will be offered as an upgrade on the 5-25 due to some specifics that were not mentioned. It wasn't a final decision but one could gleam a bunch from what was said:

1. The reticle is very complex.
2. Production has been delayed until Q1 of 2018. First scope to get it will be NEW 5-25 PMII models.
3. Once they get caught up, it will be migrated to the 3-27 and 5-45. Estimated availability is summer 2018.
4. Once all of that is done, they will determine the upgrade policy

You're better off buying a new 5-25.
 
I’m tempted by the 3-27.....this wait is killing me. Brand new Larue needs a scope.
 
jb1000br said:
Guys - first LRR-Mil scopes have landed - I have some detailed thru pics I will add when I am able! 5-25 LRR-MIL
Click to expand...
Oh come on Jason! I just spent a bunch of money with you ;) Seriously, these came in quicker than I expected, maybe the pressure from the MSR2 and other reticles. I'm not in the hunt for a 5-25 right now but am curious to see how the ret looks through the scope
 
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