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New To reloading - .223/.308 Match Grade Reloading Setup Help

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I've been saving all my brass (pistol and rifle) for the past 2 years. I have a ton of .223/308 match grade (FGMM, Hornady Match,) brass that I would like to reload. I've never reloaded and I don't own any reloading equipment. I do have a few people that can show me the basics (they reload but not match grade ammo). I have no idea what all I need, and I only want to buy once cry once. I was looking at the all in one kits like the RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme Master Reloading Kit but read a lot of people end up buying new/better equipment after getting the hang of reloading.

I want to load match grade .223 77gr SMK and match grade .308 175gr SMK. I was looking at the RCBS Rock Chucker single stage press. I just ordered the Lyman 49th Edition Reloading Handbook to start reading. If you were going to buy/piece together a quality reloading setup to load accurate precision ammo what parts list would you purchase?

List your buy once cry once parts list for a quality match grade .223/.308 reloading setup. I don't want to buy parts I'm not educated enough to pick out or buy an all in one kit then learn in 2-3 months once I'm reloading that I need to replace half the parts.

Thanks in advance for your help.
 
I bought a single stage press to start out with. (Lee, if you must know). I quickly got tired of how long it took to put together finished rounds. I stepped up to a Dillon 550, and never looked back. I reload 260 rem, 9mm, and 223 on it. I shoot some pretty small groups with rifle ammo loaded on it.

I would seriously consider starting with a single stage, to learn the processes. Once you get to understanding it all, then step up to the progressive. The single stage will still be useful for decapping or other odd tasks.

As to what manufacturer of presses, pick a color, they all make ammo.
 
The Lyman reloading manual is pretty good in walking you through step-by-step of reloading. Once receive it, carefully read through it and build your list from that. For match type loads you'll want quality dies with a micrometer bullet seater. Stay away from bushing dies for now - use the K.I.S.S. approach to get started. Lyman tools are fine for brass preparation. Look at Lee and Sinclair priming/powder tools. The RCBS 10-10 powder scale is a good value for a powder scale.

Welcome to the world of hand loading.
 
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Thanks for the info so far. I'm definitely going with the single stage for now. I'm not worried about pumping out plinking rounds right now as I'm pretty stocked in that department (although I've saved ALL brass in case I want to do that in the future).

Right now I want to work up some quality 77gr hand loads for my WOA 16" SS Match 1:7 AR15 Recce barrel and my POF P308 14.5" Rock Creek barrel. Once a go to load for each barrel is found, I hope to be able to reload cheaper than factory match ammo and/or shoot more for the same price.

Any quality .223 and .308 dies with micrometer bullet seater you could recommend?
 
I basically am in your exact situation. I load smaller batches of .308 and .223 match. I also purchsed a RC master supreme kit. Here's my suggested list of add-ons :

1) Powder trickler (I got this one, it's super heavy and stable :
Frankford Arsenal Powder Trickler

2) Good quality dial calipers
3) Case trimmers. I like the modular setup from Lee : you can chuck up in a bench top drill press, once you get a feel for removing material they are fast for trimming brass especially thick walled mill spec LC brass :

Cutter & Lock Stud - Lee Precision
Cutter & Lock Stud - Lee Precision

4) primer pocket reamers.
 
http://www.snipershide.com/[email protected]


padom said:
I've been saving all my brass (pistol and rifle) for the past 2 years. I have a ton of .223/308 match grade (FGMM, Hornady Match,) brass that I would like to reload. I've never reloaded and I don't own any reloading equipment. I do have a few people that can show me the basics (they reload but not match grade ammo). I have no idea what all I need, and I only want to buy once cry once. I was looking at the all in one kits like the RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme Master Reloading Kit but read a lot of people end up buying new/better equipment after getting the hang of reloading.

I want to load match grade .223 77gr SMK and match grade .308 175gr SMK. I was looking at the RCBS Rock Chucker single stage press. I just ordered the Lyman 49th Edition Reloading Handbook to start reading. If you were going to buy/piece together a quality reloading setup to load accurate precision ammo what parts list would you purchase?

List your buy once cry once parts list for a quality match grade .223/.308 reloading setup. I don't want to buy parts I'm not educated enough to pick out or buy an all in one kit then learn in 2-3 months once I'm reloading that I need to replace half the parts.

Thanks in advance for your help.
Click to expand...
 
I would choose a micrometer seating die, it's especially useful in load development. I which I had bought those first , for my 223 and 30-06 loading. I also use a Dillon 550 for rifle and pistol. I keep thinking I need a Forester CO-Ax, but I can't come up with a better reason than it looks so cool.
 
Accuracy is largely going to be a function of your components. Don't expect 1/2 MOA accuracy from scrounged range brass and pulled 147gr FMJ bullets. In terms of equipment here are a few buy once cry once items that will improve accuracy:

Bench source annealer (or some annealer)
Redding type-s full length bushing die ( with correct sized bushing)
Forster or Redding sliding sleeve micrometer seating die (Forster is slightly cheaper)
 
If you are truly looking for answers, the first thing you should buy is this book.

Zediker Publishing

It will save you countless dollars chasing the wrong equipment and the wrong methodology. Great book, I had been reloading for a long time, and I learned a bunch from it also.
 
there are a few excellent stickies you should read right in this forum. they helped me a lot.
cheers
 
Carnivore said:
If you are truly looking for answers, the first thing you should buy is this book.

Zediker Publishing

It will save you countless dollars chasing the wrong equipment and the wrong methodology. Great book, I had been reloading for a long time, and I learned a bunch from it also.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link. I received my Lyman 49th Edition reloading book yesterday and read it all night. Really made things clearer to me on what I'm doing and what I need to buy. I just ordered this book you linked to as my goal is loading precision ammo at the moment. If this is the book to read on doing that then I need it.

I am fully aware that precision is not coming from picked up range brass and crappy bullets. I've shot and saved brass from over 1000 FGMM 168 & 175gr ammo as well as Hornady Match AMAX ammo. At this point my goal is to reload the once fired cases from the match ammo I shot. Probably buy some Lapua brass in the future once I get the hang of reloading. I will be reloading .308 168/175gr SMK and 168/178gr AMAX.

I've also saved all my .223 Match brass to reload but don't have as much as I do in .308. I plan to reload 77gr .223 as well with the brass I saved. I may reload .223 62gr plinking ammo in the future with the 1000's of brass cases I saved but not anytime soon.

I am pretty set on going with the RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme press. I'm thinking of actually getting two off the bat and use one for case prep, depriming, priming, resizing and the second for seating bullets or something along those lines to save time switching out dies and such.

Anybody use the Hornady lock and load system on their RCBS Rock Chucker? Is it worth installing for fast die switching?

I'm also looking at the following 2 components. Anyone have any experience with them? Are they good to go or is their something better for the money?

RCBS Uniflow Powder Measure
Lyman Micro Touch 1500 Electronic Scale

I'm having a hard timing finding the micrometer seating die for .223 and .308 (or I'm not looking in the right place). Can someone point me to quality ones for .223 and .308? I am reloading for my POF P308 AR10. In reading the "Reloading 101" sticky he states if reloading for magazine fed guns you should seat based off OAL vs Ogive. Does that mean I don't need micrometer seating dies when reloading for my AR15 and AR10? Unclear on this....

Cleaning brass is another topic that has so many options. What is everyone using? I'm looking at the Hornady M2 Case Tumbler.

I am a buy once cry once type of guy which is why I don't want to buy one of the kits. I want to buy quality components for loading precision .223/.308 one time.

Thanks for all the help so far.
 
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I would highly recommend reading Elfster1234 epic journey piece. Solid info and instructions.
 
davidpipes said:
I would highly recommend reading Elfster1234 epic journey piece. Solid info and instructions.
Click to expand...

I did already read Elfster1234's epic journey right after he posted above. It was a world of valuable information and have it bookmarked for future reference once I receive all my equipment and its time to start reloading.
 
Just ordered the RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme from Sinclair. They are on sale for $104.99. Cheapest I could find by far.

I also ordered Forster Ultra .308 die set with Micrometer seating die, some shell holders, 175gr SMK's and 178gr AMAX's.
 
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Whidden makes VERY nice dies, and available in .223:

Whidden Gunworks

If you have only one scale, I prefer a beam scale. Electronic scales can have issues. If you go electronic, DEFINATELY get a set of scale check weights.

Powder measures are not great with the extruded powders typically used for precision loads. They cut the granules. The RCBS Chargemaster Combo if you want to automate, otherwise a scope (you can make your own or Lee has a nice set) and a trickler.
 
Not extremely expensive so I will get both a beam scale and electronic scale. I already have a set of check weights to make sure the scale stays accurate.

Thank you for the power measuring info. I will do it manual to start with a trickler.
 
The Lee perfect powder measure is a very effective and economical thrower that doesn't cut kernels.
I had two set up before I started using the RCBS chargemaster and still use them occasionally for time efficiency.
I used the RCBS scale that came with my Rockchucker kit until I went Chargemaster.

I really like the Redding Competition S die as you can get just the right amount of neck tension with different brass by swapping bushings and there is no guesswork as to adjusting seating depth.
I've been handloading for over 10 years and still use two single stage presses.

I bought every manual out there and I think the most economic way to go with manuals is to buy the spiral bound manuals that are solely for one caliber.
They scan and reprint from almost every other manual and compile them.
Quickload is the reference I use the most to gauge starting loads and keep primers in the cases.
That's definitely a cry once purchase but once you've called in for support a couple times and realize what a resource your money bought you it's well worth it.

I definitely prefer hand priming over press priming.
There are a lot of options out there and it boils down to preference.
I hate changing out the shellholders in the RCBS so I use the Lee priming tool.

308 and 223 are easy to load for and you have at least 5 powders that simply rock for both cases.
It's not like some of the other more overbore cases that are finnicky about what they like.
 
I will look into the Lee perfect powder measure. I did get the Hornady Lock-n-Load Conversion kit to make changing dies quicker and easier as recommend in the Reloading 201 sticky along with the Hornady Sure-Lock rings.

What powders would you recommend that can be found today for loading precision .308 rounds (and even .223). I've found 1lb jugs of 4064 which I have load data for in my Lyman reloading manual and I see a bunch of people on SH using this powder with 175gr SMK.

At first I will be loading .308 only even though I am buy parts to load .223 as well. I need to learn to load, test my loads and perfect so I can make 250 rds in time for Oct 24/25 Precision Rifle class where we will be shooting 100-1000yds. Since I will be shooting these out of my POF P308 14.5" AR10 I want to work up an accurate 175gr SMK load before the class for my specific rifle.
 
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If you truly wish to make superior match ammo then you really need to charge them one at a time. It really does not matter what press. They all press well. Invest in dies and a good scale.

Here is what I use;

Press - RCBS and Lee
Dies - Redding or Forster
Scale - RCBS Chargemaster 1500
Case Prep - Frankfort Arsenal Prep Center - trim, camfer, primer pocket
Thumblers Tumbler SS Media

You should also invest in a set of Hornady COAL and Headspace guages
 
4064 will be tough to stuff into the little 223 case without a drop tube but it shoots the lights out in 223 and 308.
Everyone will knee jerk Varget as its the reloading equivalent of a small block Chevy.
I really like 8208 XBR in 308/223/223AI.
4064 is my favorite powder for 308 though.
 
Danco411 said:
If you truly wish to make superior match ammo then you really need to charge them one at a time. It really does not matter what press. They all press well. Invest in dies and a good scale.

Here is what I use;

Press - RCBS and Lee
Dies - Redding or Forster
Scale - RCBS Chargemaster 1500
Case Prep - Frankfort Arsenal Prep Center - trim, camfer, primer pocket
Thumblers Tumbler SS Media

You should also invest in a set of Hornady COAL and Headspace guages
Click to expand...

Thanks for the case prep info. There are so many case prep tools I wasn't sure which one to get. I will look into the Frankfort Arsenal prep center.

I did already purchase the Hornady Lock-N-Load Headspace Gauge Kit and the Hornady Lock-N-Load Comparator Set.
 
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BTW the Whidden sizing die is a bushing die also, uses the same bushings as Redding.

VERY good people to work with. And nice also. :)
 
Carnivore said:
If you are truly looking for answers, the first thing you should buy is this book.

Zediker Publishing

It will save you countless dollars chasing the wrong equipment and the wrong methodology. Great book, I had been reloading for a long time, and I learned a bunch from it also.
Click to expand...

I also recommend the book "Handloading For Competition". The author explains the different tools and ways to make accurate ammo.
 
Forester micrometer seating die, redding shoulder bump die for pushing the shoulder back a few thousandths and a lee collet die for neck sizing. I like rcbs, redding and hornady single stage presses and a good electronic scale. I agree also you need a good set of calipers.
 
I already have a good set of calipers. I havent bought a shoulder or collet die yet. Only the Forster set with Micrometer seating die and a Lee Universal decapping die.
 
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First shipment of reloading gear arrived today. Press won't be here until next week.

 
Just posted the following on another thread regarding achieving single digit ES and SD. Maybe it will be of use to you. Worked for me :)




Equipment

Gun - T2K chambered in 6XC - Krieger 27 inch barrel 1:7.5 twist
Brass - Norma
Bullets - Lapua Scenar L 105gr and DTAC 115gr BN coated
Powder - H4350
Powder charge weight- 39.50 gr
Primers - Wolf large rifle
Chronograph - Magnetospeed V3

Brass prep for pre fired and prepped brass

1. deprime with Lee recapping die - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadi...prod33745.aspx?avs|Die Style_1=Decapping Dies

2. tumble brass in stainless steel media with H2O and Lemishine in Thumler's Tumbler for 3 hrs - this does a great job on primer pockets - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadi...-tumbler-stainless-steel-media-prod42994.aspx

3. separate media and brass with separator and rinse in filtered or distilled H2O - CM-2000 Case/Media Separator: Case Preparation Equipment
4. dry in oven at 200deg. F for 2 hrs
5. anneal after EACH FIRING with Benchsource annealing machine - New Case Neck Annealing Machine
6. spray lube cases and inside of case necks with One Shot spray lube - make sure you don't spray inside of case body - just the necks - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadi...ay-case-lube-w-dyna-glide-plus-prod55252.aspx

7. measure neck thickness of each case and sort by .0005 to .001 inch groups - I use the Sinclair neck thickness gauge - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadin...prod36959.aspx

8. full length size with Redding S type FL sizing die and proper size neck bushing to yield .0015 to .002 neck tension - I use a .269 bushing size. I use a RCBS single stage Rock Chucker Supreme press. Nothing fancy.

9. Expand neck using Sinclair expander - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadin...prod38807.aspx - Note : if the cases are new and haven't been inside chamfered yet I do that step before I expand the necks. I also sort brass in this step. If I feel the expander inserts into the case either too easily or too hard I pull the case out of the batch.

10. trim brass to length using Sinclair/Wilson trimmer - control length to .001 inch - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadin...prod39292.aspx

11. chamfer inside of neck with K & M adjustable chamfer tool - this is really important !! - keeps chamfer depth consistent - K&M Shooting - Controlled Depth Tapered Reamer, Large 6mm - .338

12. chamfer outside of neck with standard tool - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadi...y-locknload-case-prep-chamfers-prod56188.aspx
13. uniform primer pocket with K & M tool - K&M Shooting - Large Rifle Primer Pocket Correction Tool
14. chamfer, deburr and uniform inside of flash hole with K & M tool - pretty important - K&M Shooting - Flash Hole Uniformer, Professional - Standard 0.080

15. wash cases in warm soapy water
16. while washing brush inside of case necks with nylon brush to remove brass chips and case lube
17. while still wet, wet sand outside neck chamfer with 2000 grit sand paper. Make sure you do not thin the neck. Just smooth out any burrs on the outside chamfer

18. final H2O rinse in filtered or distilled H2O.
19. dry in oven at 200 deg. F for 2 hours

Finished brass sorting

1. weigh each case and separate into groups of .10 grain groups. Heavier cases will generally yeald faster MV while lighter cases will generally yield lower MV.

Priming

1. I use Wolf large rifle primers that are fairly hard and need to be carefully seated deep and to the same depth every time. I use the 21st Century adjustable primer seater. It's a work of art. Great piece of equipment - S.S. Priming Tool

Charging

1. Throw charge on a Chargemaster to 1 grain under my final desired weight. I use a Chargemaster to throw not because it is great but only because I have one. Better to use a charge thrower.

2. trickle up to final weight with an Omega II trickler - Ammo Reloading | Reloading Equipment | Omega Powder Trickler | Dandy Reloading Tools

3. I use a Sartorius Entris 64-1S analytical balance that weighs to one kernel or .001 grain easily. I switched from a Chargemaster to this scale and my SD and ES were cut in half immediately. Not cheap but worth every penny in time saving and accuracy. - Lab analytical balance Sartorius Entris64-1S

Here is a great video or the scale and the Omega II in action - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jr1Wso6P9ZI

Bullet sorting

1. With the DTAC 115 bullets I sort by bullet weight into groups to .10 grain. I use the Sartorius analytical balance for this. Very fast.
2. With the DTACs I also have to sort by bearing surface length using the Sinclair bearing surface gauge - ]http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadin...prod38769.aspx

3. With the Lapua Scenar L 105 grain bullets the QC is so incredibly good that I do not have to sort by weight or bearing surface.

Bullet seating

1. I use a Forster competition micrometer seater and seat both the DTACS and the Scenars .040 long and then just close the bolt gently on them to seat them in the lands. This way my seating depth is always the same. For me it yields great accuracy also. - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadi...idge_1=ASY_6 mm XC&avs|Manufacturer_1=FORSTER

2. I never check for bullet run out as I have checked it many times with my Hornady runnout gauge and it has never been more than .001 inch. I suppose I should probably be checking cases for neck concentricity but have not found it necessary so far. Maybe in the future.

That's about it. A lot of prep time and a lot of expensive equipment.

Note : I have recently been experimenting with a different method of sorting brass. Instead of sorting by weight I sort by MV when running over a crony. I record the MV of each test shot and then later group the cases by MV. This seems to yield better SD and ES than sorting by weight. I will also be experimenting with water weighing the cases as soon as I get the 21st Century tool - http://www.21stcenturyshooting.com/P...cket_Plugs.php - More pain in the ass and record keeping though.

Good Luck
 
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I recently picked up the following gear:

RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme
RCBS Chargemaster 1500
RCBS Tumbler with corn cob and walnut shell media
Lyman Case prep kit
5lb Varget

I also built a heavy duty reloading bench out of Premium support lumber (2x4's and 2x6's), Cedar 4"x4" posts, 3/4" Oak and 3/4" MDF for the bench top and bottom shelf and Select Pine trim boards. Just stained it a few hours ago. Will let the stain dry overnight then light sand and get 3 coats of Polyurethane Gloss on it tomorrow.



Everything should by dry so I can get my press mounted Thursday afternoon then will start depriming and case prep. I have 100 once fired FGMM .308 cases tumbling in Walnut Shells now with primers still in. Plan is to deprime with Lee universal depriming die, see if they need to be resized, prep flash hole, primer pockets and necks then go from there.
 
I ordered the Omega 2 from Amazon for like $74. Hasn't arrived yet.
 
So I had 2 options regarding primers. Get the CCI Large rifle primers locally, which is all my local store has or spend an additional $45 for Hazmat and Shipping on top of primer cost to get CCI BR2 primers online. I decided to get 1000 CCI Large rifle primers locally.

Since I am new to reloading, I am wondering how much of an accuracy difference I am going to see between the CCI and CCI BR2 primers? Or is this something I shouldn't even worry about?
 
Switching between primers with varying brisance is usually done in an effort to lower ES using a given powder/charge weight. Your load development process may or may not reveal any difference whatsoever between primers on the target, depending on how you are doing it. It is likely that you may not notice any significant difference in accuracy/precision at shorter distances (100-300 yd), where a lot of people do their load development. However, using a primer that gives you the lowest ES can definitely pay off at longer ranges where differences in velocity become noticeable on the target.
 
I'll be working up a load testing 175gr SMK and 178gr AMAX with Varget and 4064 to find the best load for my 14.5" AR10 to shoot between 200-1000 for a precision rifle class I have the end of October.

I will get a box of CCI BR2 primers to test with since I will be shooting between 500-1000 in my class.
 
I tumbled 50 FC 1xfired FGMM and 50 1xFired Hornady Match brass in my RCBS tumbler using Walnut Shells for about 2 hours each batch yesterday.

I got the third and final coat of Polyurethane on my reloading bench last night and it was nice and dry this afternoon. I mounted my single stage and deprimed 50 FC .308 brass (1xfired FGMM) and 50 1xfired Hornady Match .308 brass using my Lee Universal decapping die.

Following elfster1234's great thread I measured my case headspace with my Hornady Headspace comparator kit and got the following measurements:

LC 1xfired - 1.6250
Hornady Match 1xfired - 1.6225

Following elfster1234's guide I am resizing .004 from my measurement which looks like this:

LC 1.6250 - .004 = 1.621 (1.620 - 1.622)

So, I've FL resized all 50 of the FC brass using my Forster FL Resizing die and almost all came out exactly 1.621 after getting the die adjusted and set with a few at 1.620 which is fine


Now my question for you guys is the following. Do I resize the 50 Hornady Match with the same die setting as the FC brass 1.621? Or do I start over with the following formula:

Hornady 1.6225 - .004 = 1.618

Do I readjust die to get the Hornady brass to 1.6185 (1.617 - 1.619)?????
 
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I went ahead and resized the Hornady Match brass without readjusting the die. It came out exactly where it should be 1.618-1.619.

I also uniformed the primer pocket and reamed the flash hole on all 100 brass cases. My trimmer arrives tomorrow which is the last step before putting them back in the tumbler then its off to priming and dropping powder.
 
Well, it seems like they JUST released this new trimmer like 1-2 weeks so don't feel too bad but yeah, it's pretty awesome and Giraud is synonym with quality!
 
zipollini said:
Just posted the following on another thread regarding achieving single digit ES and SD. Maybe it will be of use to you. Worked for me :)




Equipment

Gun - T2K chambered in 6XC - Krieger 27 inch barrel 1:7.5 twist
Brass - Norma
Bullets - Lapua Scenar L 105gr and DTAC 115gr BN coated
Powder - H4350
Powder charge weight- 39.50 gr
Primers - Wolf large rifle
Chronograph - Magnetospeed V3

Brass prep for pre fired and prepped brass

1. deprime with Lee recapping die - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadi...prod33745.aspx?avs|Die Style_1=Decapping Dies

2. tumble brass in stainless steel media with H2O and Lemishine in Thumler's Tumbler for 3 hrs - this does a great job on primer pockets - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadi...-tumbler-stainless-steel-media-prod42994.aspx

3. separate media and brass with separator and rinse in filtered or distilled H2O - CM-2000 Case/Media Separator: Case Preparation Equipment
4. dry in oven at 200deg. F for 2 hrs
5. anneal after EACH FIRING with Benchsource annealing machine - New Case Neck Annealing Machine
6. spray lube cases and inside of case necks with One Shot spray lube - make sure you don't spray inside of case body - just the necks - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadi...ay-case-lube-w-dyna-glide-plus-prod55252.aspx

7. measure neck thickness of each case and sort by .0005 to .001 inch groups - I use the Sinclair neck thickness gauge - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadin...prod36959.aspx

8. full length size with Redding S type FL sizing die and proper size neck bushing to yield .0015 to .002 neck tension - I use a .269 bushing size. I use a RCBS single stage Rock Chucker Supreme press. Nothing fancy.

9. Expand neck using Sinclair expander - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadin...prod38807.aspx - Note : if the cases are new and haven't been inside chamfered yet I do that step before I expand the necks. I also sort brass in this step. If I feel the expander inserts into the case either too easily or too hard I pull the case out of the batch.

10. trim brass to length using Sinclair/Wilson trimmer - control length to .001 inch - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadin...prod39292.aspx

11. chamfer inside of neck with K & M adjustable chamfer tool - this is really important !! - keeps chamfer depth consistent - K&M Shooting - Controlled Depth Tapered Reamer, Large 6mm - .338

12. chamfer outside of neck with standard tool - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadi...y-locknload-case-prep-chamfers-prod56188.aspx
13. uniform primer pocket with K & M tool - K&M Shooting - Large Rifle Primer Pocket Correction Tool
14. chamfer, deburr and uniform inside of flash hole with K & M tool - pretty important - K&M Shooting - Flash Hole Uniformer, Professional - Standard 0.080

15. wash cases in warm soapy water
16. while washing brush inside of case necks with nylon brush to remove brass chips and case lube
17. while still wet, wet sand outside neck chamfer with 2000 grit sand paper. Make sure you do not thin the neck. Just smooth out any burrs on the outside chamfer

18. final H2O rinse in filtered or distilled H2O.
19. dry in oven at 200 deg. F for 2 hours

Finished brass sorting

1. weigh each case and separate into groups of .10 grain groups. Heavier cases will generally yeald faster MV while lighter cases will generally yield lower MV.

Priming

1. I use Wolf large rifle primers that are fairly hard and need to be carefully seated deep and to the same depth every time. I use the 21st Century adjustable primer seater. It's a work of art. Great piece of equipment - S.S. Priming Tool

Charging

1. Throw charge on a Chargemaster to 1 grain under my final desired weight. I use a Chargemaster to throw not because it is great but only because I have one. Better to use a charge thrower.

2. trickle up to final weight with an Omega II trickler - Ammo Reloading | Reloading Equipment | Omega Powder Trickler | Dandy Reloading Tools

3. I use a Sartorius Entris 64-1S analytical balance that weighs to one kernel or .001 grain easily. I switched from a Chargemaster to this scale and my SD and ES were cut in half immediately. Not cheap but worth every penny in time saving and accuracy. - Lab analytical balance Sartorius Entris64-1S

Here is a great video or the scale and the Omega II in action - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jr1Wso6P9ZI

Bullet sorting

1. With the DTAC 115 bullets I sort by bullet weight into groups to .10 grain. I use the Sartorius analytical balance for this. Very fast.
2. With the DTACs I also have to sort by bearing surface length using the Sinclair bearing surface gauge - ]http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadin...prod38769.aspx

3. With the Lapua Scenar L 105 grain bullets the QC is so incredibly good that I do not have to sort by weight or bearing surface.

Bullet seating

1. I use a Forster competition micrometer seater and seat both the DTACS and the Scenars .040 long and then just close the bolt gently on them to seat them in the lands. This way my seating depth is always the same. For me it yields great accuracy also. - http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadi...idge_1=ASY_6 mm XC&avs|Manufacturer_1=FORSTER

2. I never check for bullet run out as I have checked it many times with my Hornady runnout gauge and it has never been more than .001 inch. I suppose I should probably be checking cases for neck concentricity but have not found it necessary so far. Maybe in the future.

That's about it. A lot of prep time and a lot of expensive equipment.

Note : I have recently been experimenting with a different method of sorting brass. Instead of sorting by weight I sort by MV when running over a crony. I record the MV of each test shot and then later group the cases by MV. This seems to yield better SD and ES than sorting by weight. I will also be experimenting with water weighing the cases as soon as I get the 21st Century tool - http://www.21stcenturyshooting.com/P...cket_Plugs.php - More pain in the ass and record keeping though.

Good Luck
Click to expand...

Wow, thanks for that wealth of info zipollini!! Thought I'd share my "improved" once fired brass prep and will try to be as thorough:


  • Deprime & neck size only (since it's once fired, the case is sized exactly to my chamber) on my Lee. I do a full length sizing every 4-5 reloading tho... I also use the Lee Precision Breech Lock Bushings for consistency and ease of use.
  • Drop the brass in 1Gal of hot water with 1/4 cup of lemon juice. I usually let it sit overnight but if I start in the morning, I let it sit for 3-4 hours.
  • Rinse with tap water (our water is good here in Nor Cal) then let it air dry in the sun for a few hours.
  • Dry tumble for 45-60 mins.
  • Sort brass if needed (I try to run my brass in batches).
  • If I'm not reloading Lapua brass (not needed with Lapua brass because the hole is drilled), I deburr the flash hole.
  • Run a bore brush in the case mouth to remove even more residue, etc.
  • Inspect every single case to make sure no media is stuck in the case!
  • I trim to length, chamfer & deburr each case with my new Tri Way trimmer
  • Correct & uniform primer pocket with the K&M Large Rifle Primer Pocket Correction tool
  • Final inspection (inside and out)
  • Prime with the Lee Precision Auto-Prime XR (using Federal Premium Gold Medal Large Rifle Match Primers #210 M)
  • Quickly run my finger over each primer to make sure it's flush and seated properly.
  • Charge with the Lee Perfect Powder Measure (would love to get a RCBS ChargeMaster 1500 tho)
  • I don't sort bullets by weights as I only use quality bullets (Lapua Scenar or Berger) and they have great QC
  • I seat the bullet long so that it finishes seating into the lands.
  • Final check then get out and shoot :)

Hope it helps!
 
I have too little hair remaining to allow any significant hair pulling at my age. The only actual benefit age lends to my handloading success is the 30 years of experience that precedes this post.

Match grade ammo is a blanket term, dependent upon what sort of match you intend to shoot. National Match Highpower needs accuracy of about 1MOA, Benchrest requires an infinitely small group size, and F Class falls somewhere in between at about 1/2MOA. Perfect concentricity is a goal for BR, kinda helpful for F Class, and can be left on the table for NM HP. Tight chamber necks are needed for BR, optional for F Class, and generally non-applicable for NM HP. I would use SAAMI chamber specs for F class and NM, and shooters with tight necks could beat me if their marksmanship is up to the standards that make a tight neck an actual part of their accuracy equation. Premium gear and ammo alone are not enough to ensure success.

In my case, the limiting factor is not the ammo.

Over those thirty or so years, believe me, I have tried all the advanced techniques and do-dads, and done my utmost to gain insight into their capacity to improve my shooting. They all have some value, and they all have a cost. So I must be a cheapo bastich, because I have chosen to forego most of them. For my economics, they cost more than they are truly worth to me. If I were shooting BR they would be worth every penny and more, but BR is not my cuppa tea. The point here is about diminishing returns.

I have hung my hat on but two pegs; serious load development, and individually measured charges. Do those and the majority of practical needs are met.

The rest is all about personal preferences.

Greg
 
After a bunch of work over the past 2 days I have 50xFGMM FC and 50xHornady Match brass resized, trimmed, prepped, cleaned and primed. I uniformed the primer pockets, deburred the flash hole and deburred inside and outside of case mouths after trimming to size.
I tumbled in corn cob after all case prep was done for 2.5 hours (getting a Thumblers Tumbler next week).

I weighed all the cases and seperated them into matching groups. They have all been primed with CCI 200 LR primers. All cases sit flat on my table to ensure all primers were seated properly. I now will weigh and separate/group my bullets.

 
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My Lyman 49th Edition reloading book for .308 175gr Jacketed HPBT using Varget should be loaded between 40 - 45.2 grains.

I am loading Sierra 175 SMK for my POF P308 14.5" Mike Rock barrel with pinned brake.

It's now time to drop powder and I'm not sure where to start in the range suggested by my Lyman reloading manual. My goal is to load an accurate round with high velocity to shoot mostly between 200-800 but hit steel a few times at 1000 in a precision rifle class coming up the end of October. Should I load as follows?

40 - 5rds
41 - 10rds
42 - 10rds
43 - 10rds
44 - 5rds


Then take the best group or two out of the above and load another 5 or 6 5rd groups in .3gr increments up and down from that best original group?
 
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Hey guys, would it make sense to I trim to length, chamfer & deburr each case with the Tri Way trimmer THEN neck size?? Is there any reason why I should neck size first??
 
I FL sized but did that first then trimmed, chamfer and deburred.
 
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