New to Sniper's Hide- and I just picked up a Remmy 700 5R Milspec .308

[acemonster]

Hi All:

I'm new to Sniper's Hide, and to precision shooting. I recently bought a Remington 700 5R Milspec chambered in a .308 - 24in. I don't have any pictures yet since the rifle is on order and should arrive in a couple of weeks.

I've only ever shot Win .22's before and a friend's 30.06 // 8mm, so the .308 will be a little new to me. The plan is to compete in precision long-range shooting some day, while having a versatile enough weapon for good hunts upstate and around New England. That said, here is a list of planned mods that I would love and appreciate some advice and comments for:

Scope:
I could definitely use suggestions for scope. Since I'll primarily shoot at a smaller range at the East-end of Long Island, NY, I need something for their longer range targets (approx 300 yds out). However, I want something I can hunt in brush with, especially since I plan to travel upstate NY with a buddy of mine who hunts there often.

I'm looking at the following:

-Nikon Monarch 3, 4-16x50 in either Mildot or BDC
-Vortex Viper HS Long-Range 30mm, 4x16x50 in Dead-Hold BDC
-Leupold VX-3 in 4.5-14x40 or 4.5-14x50, Boone and Crockett
-Nikon M308 4-16x42, BDC 800

I'm looking at a range of $400 - $750.

Ammo:
Friends of mine have told me that they have had the best luck with 168gr FGMM, 168gr Open-tip match Hornaday and SouthWest Ammo. I'll definitely check out FGMM and Hornaday as my LGS usually has some good deals. Any other suggestions?

Rings:
I've heard Tallys are great, as are the Leupold and NightForce, but I suppose it depends on the setup. From what I hear, the M308 was sort of designed with AR in mind, so people have been successful with mounting it on Leupold rings and base. However, any other brands I should keep my eye out for would be appreciated.

Bipod:
-Harris Bipod with Swivel Base

I just can't decide if I should go with 6-9, or 9-13 in adjustments; or if I should get the notched vs smooth adjustment.

Any ideas?

Cleaning:
I'm planning on picking up a Hoppe's Bore-snake for quick range cleaning, but need a good set of patch/rod for thorough, in-home cleaning. Recommendations?
My cleaning plan for the new setup is to clean after every shot, up to my 10th shot, then clean after 5-round groups up to 30, then to a normal, after-range cleaning session thereafter.

Other Items:
-I would also appreciate recommendations for good, hard carrying cases that would fit the gun + accessories (stock bullet bag, bi-pod, boresnake, etc).
Anything else I missed? = )


Thanks to all in advance for the help.

Best,
Ace

 

[Shanerbanner10]

Optics: I would look into Weaver and/or SWFA with a mildot style reticle and 'target' turrets in either mil/mil or moa/moa so you can learn about either system, also both are well within your price range I believe. They can easy be used in hunting. Other things to consider if you want to go long range would be a new trigger (or replacing the spring, the xmark is shit), Timney will get the job done fairly cheaply or if you have the money to spend a Jewell will work great too. The HS stock is decent but depending on what you are used to you may want to replace it down the road. It sounds like you have a metric shit ton of reading and learning ahead of you, beyond that just get out and get trigger time.

 

[Quarter Horse]

Ace, welcome. You've picked a solid rifle. As to a scope, skip the BDC feature and get something with a mil. reticule and mil. turrets. Note the word turrets. Don't buy anything that does not have either tactical or target turrets. The BDC scopes will limit rather than enhance your shooting. Vortex, SWFA and Leupold have superb warranties that extend to secondhand buyers so you can buy used with confidence.

Your choices of ammo are good but start to look into reloading. Proper reloading will allow you maximize your rifles potential and reduce the cost after the initial investment. If you plan on shooting enough to get really good, you will find that ammo will be your biggest cost.

You will need a base for your rings and scope. Most would recommend a 20 degree rail for a .308.

Your choice of bi-pods is spot on but you need to get a locking lever for the swivel base.

Dewey rods are an excellent choice for cleaning. In addition you need to buy a bore guide to prevent ruining the throat of your barrel. Read about cleaning regimens. Most feel too much cleaning is the greater threat.

Hard cases are nice if you travel by air but unwarranted otherwise. Get a decent soft case for to and from the range or hunting.

As to other things, you've forgotten two. The first is training. Everybody's been to high school and every high school has a team that excels. They excel because that team has a good coach with a good program. Learn how to do it right the first time and you won't have to spend a lifetime unlearning the wrong way. The other is a good .22LR. If ammo ever becomes readily available again a .22 will give you more opportunity to perfect your shooting than any other cal.

Every question you have asked has been addressed time and again. Use the search function and read and then read some more. The quality of information that is available here is astounding.

 

[FUNCTIONAL]

I'm not far from long island (maybe 1 - 1.5 hrs) and have a weaver tactical emdr you can check out it has all the features you want and is in your price range. Also have a Leopold ts-30 you can take a peek through just to get some kind of glass comparison.

Also have both style Harris bipods with the lock lever you can see which you have a preference for. Personally I have no preference... One is easier to deploy the other is easier to fold up.

I've used badger rings in the past and they are what you would expect from a quality ring but the steel ones were very heavy. Currently using ARMS rings but have heard great things about the TPS and they have The one sided ring gap feature I really like.

I have no problem traveling down to your range or you can meet me half way in Tarrytown at blue mountain if you wanted to check any of it out before you decide on a purchase.

 

[djarecke]

What you've read thus far is great advice and spot-on. I'd spend some time poking around the classifieds for a used optic, and don't overlook a MIL/MIL Leupold. I enjoyed mine and it tracked well and had great glass. I just sold my Jewel trigger from my 5R and replaced it with a Timney 510. I'd read up on that one a bit. I was disappointed with the "vague" feeling of the Jewel, and I'm not alone on that one. I've never shot factory ammo in my rifle, but I'd grab any 168 or 175 grain stuff you can find and try it out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[29aholic]

Classy

I'm not far from long island (maybe 1 - 1.5 hrs) and have a weaver tactical emdr you can check out it has all the features you want and is in your price range. Also have a Leopold ts-30 you can take a peek through just to get some kind of glass comparison.

Also have both style Harris bipods with the lock lever you can see which you have a preference for. Personally I have no preference... One is easier to deploy the other is easier to fold up.

I've used badger rings in the past and they are what you would expect from a quality ring but the steel ones were very heavy. Currently using ARMS rings but have heard great things about the TPS and they have The one sided ring gap feature I really like.

I have no problem traveling down to your range or you can meet me half way in Tarrytown at blue mountain if you wanted to check any of it out before you decide on a purchase.

 

[09jisaac]

Like what was posted earlier, you should probably SKIP the BDC reticles. I think Boone and Crocket reticles are BDC also. BDCs are only accurate for one projectile traveling at a certain velocity in a certain atmosphere.

The BDC is not completely useless, it is just more of an estimate than a solid indicator.

I would either go with a mil dot (mil radian) reticle and a mil adjustment OR a minute of angle reticle and MOA adjustments. They are both essentially the same. It is like a yard vs a meter, but neither are Metric or English. The key is to get a scope that matches MIL/MIL or MOA/MOA. You can mix them, but with the modern line of scopes, there isn't much of a need.

Also, skip the 20 DEGREE rail that Quarter Horse recommended (He/she probably meant minute). A 20 minute rail will do just fine. This just depends on how far you wish to shoot and the adjustment on your scope.

Lets just say that your scope has 70 minutes of adjustment, around 35 (half) of them will be below your needs. Just think a scope usually doesn't need much adjustments to zero at 100yds. So that extra 35moa will put your reticle way high and you'll be hitting way low everywhere. The other 35 if for further ranges.

The 20moa rail brings that usable range of your scope to around 50moa. This will get you out to 1000yds easily with plenty of adjustments left. You don't want to run out of adjustments.

I have heard of people using a 1/2 DEGREE rails, but are used for extended range. Most people never need them.

With the BIPOD, get the notched legs. I have only used the smooth legs, but they aren't very easy to adjust to proper height on the go. I assume that this is what the notched legs addressed.

 

[acemonster]

Optics: I would look into Weaver and/or SWFA with a mildot style reticle and 'target' turrets in either mil/mil or moa/moa so you can learn about either system, also both are well within your price range I believe. They can easy be used in hunting. Other things to consider if you want to go long range would be a new trigger (or replacing the spring, the xmark is shit), Timney will get the job done fairly cheaply or if you have the money to spend a Jewell will work great too. The HS stock is decent but depending on what you are used to you may want to replace it down the road. It sounds like you have a metric shit ton of reading and learning ahead of you, beyond that just get out and get trigger time.

I'm likely going to stick with HS Stock for the time being and spend the money on good glass first. From what I hear, the resell on the HS stock is decent and I can always upgrade at a later date. I'll definitely take to the forums and read up on what I can.

Ace, welcome. You've picked a solid rifle. As to a scope, skip the BDC feature and get something with a mil. reticule and mil. turrets. Note the word turrets. Don't buy anything that does not have either tactical or target turrets. The BDC scopes will limit rather than enhance your shooting. Vortex, SWFA and Leupold have superb warranties that extend to secondhand buyers so you can buy used with confidence.

Your choices of ammo are good but start to look into reloading. Proper reloading will allow you maximize your rifles potential and reduce the cost after the initial investment. If you plan on shooting enough to get really good, you will find that ammo will be your biggest cost.

You will need a base for your rings and scope. Most would recommend a 20 degree rail for a .308.

Your choice of bi-pods is spot on but you need to get a locking lever for the swivel base.

Dewey rods are an excellent choice for cleaning. In addition you need to buy a bore guide to prevent ruining the throat of your barrel. Read about cleaning regimens. Most feel too much cleaning is the greater threat.

Hard cases are nice if you travel by air but unwarranted otherwise. Get a decent soft case for to and from the range or hunting.

As to other things, you've forgotten two. The first is training. Everybody's been to high school and every high school has a team that excels. They excel because that team has a good coach with a good program. Learn how to do it right the first time and you won't have to spend a lifetime unlearning the wrong way. The other is a good .22LR. If ammo ever becomes readily available again a .22 will give you more opportunity to perfect your shooting than any other cal.

Every question you have asked has been addressed time and again. Use the search function and read and then read some more. The quality of information that is available here is astounding.

Thanks for the advice on the scopes. I've been leaning more towards the Vortex Viper or PST, or the Leupold VX3 and will highly consider the mildot features for both.

As for the bi-pod, I'm picking up a pod-loc for it as well.

Could you recommend a decent soft // ballistic case?

I will definitely heed your advice for training. I started out with a .22, as my grandpa owned several and that's where I learned to shoot. I've also booked some time on a Mosin and a 30.06 savage. But, nothing beats proper training - definitely right.

I'm not far from long island (maybe 1 - 1.5 hrs) and have a weaver tactical emdr you can check out it has all the features you want and is in your price range. Also have a Leopold ts-30 you can take a peek through just to get some kind of glass comparison.

Also have both style Harris bipods with the lock lever you can see which you have a preference for. Personally I have no preference... One is easier to deploy the other is easier to fold up.

I've used badger rings in the past and they are what you would expect from a quality ring but the steel ones were very heavy. Currently using ARMS rings but have heard great things about the TPS and they have The one sided ring gap feature I really like.

I have no problem traveling down to your range or you can meet me half way in Tarrytown at blue mountain if you wanted to check any of it out before you decide on a purchase.

That is most appreciated, but I wouldn't want to inconvenience you in any way. However, I'll definitely look into your suggestion regarding rings.

What you've read thus far is great advice and spot-on. I'd spend some time poking around the classifieds for a used optic, and don't overlook a MIL/MIL Leupold. I enjoyed mine and it tracked well and had great glass. I just sold my Jewel trigger from my 5R and replaced it with a Timney 510. I'd read up on that one a bit. I was disappointed with the "vague" feeling of the Jewel, and I'm not alone on that one. I've never shot factory ammo in my rifle, but I'd grab any 168 or 175 grain stuff you can find and try it out.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'll definitely keep the Timney in mind, as I have heard this from multiple people and not just on this forum. My LGS currently has good stock on 168/175 match so I'll probably stock up for the time being. I've never loaded before, but I have a neighbor that hunts often and loads his own - I'll touch base with him.



Thanks to all for the great replies.

 

[djarecke]

Meant to say one more thing - that HS Precision stock is not bad at all, so don't feel like you have to replace it right away. Mine shot 1/3 MOA with that stock and trigger, and you might be surprised how well it does for you. Lastly - practice dry firing until the cows come home and have a ball!

 

[KelsonAK]

I'm going to be a party pooper here on the whole mil/mil tactical scope thing. Key words: Brush hunting, 300 yard range. Exposed turrets, adjustable parallax and brush hunting aren't the greatest mix. If the goal is to do a lot more tac comps than deer hunts, well - there ya go - but if you are only shooting out to 300 with known distance targets on the range and hunting the thick stuff I'd recommend capped turrets. You won't be dialing for hold and wind in the willows.... The BDC thing isn't really useful in the brush either. Well - that is if your brush is like my brush. For me - brush hunting is where your shots are limited to about 100 yards or less, and usually happen fairly quickly (not snap shots - just 'Oh look, there is a deer - bang.') If your brush is more like pastures with an occasional tree here and there - then have at... Just sayin that caps have a place on things that are carried a lot through thick stuff and need to be pressed into service quickly vs. things that are carried less and there is often time to set up, check the set up, and check it again before you pull the trigger - and the heavy posts/thin center may not be the best for guessing distance and hold over, but is fast and easy to pick up against a mixed background in a hurry.

 

[acemonster]

I'm going to be a party pooper here on the whole mil/mil tactical scope thing. Key words: Brush hunting, 300 yard range. Exposed turrets, adjustable parallax and brush hunting aren't the greatest mix. If the goal is to do a lot more tac comps than deer hunts, well - there ya go - but if you are only shooting out to 300 with known distance targets on the range and hunting the thick stuff I'd recommend capped turrets. You won't be dialing for hold and wind in the willows.... The BDC thing isn't really useful in the brush either. Well - that is if your brush is like my brush. For me - brush hunting is where your shots are limited to about 100 yards or less, and usually happen fairly quickly (not snap shots - just 'Oh look, there is a deer - bang.') If your brush is more like pastures with an occasional tree here and there - then have at... Just sayin that caps have a place on things that are carried a lot through thick stuff and need to be pressed into service quickly vs. things that are carried less and there is often time to set up, check the set up, and check it again before you pull the trigger - and the heavy posts/thin center may not be the best for guessing distance and hold over, but is fast and easy to pick up against a mixed background in a hurry.

This is a good point. Upstate NY has a lot of dense coverage in areas, and I know that scopes like the Monarch are capped and reset to Zero so as prevent accidental changes. The research continues . .. =)

 

[Pester]

Ace,
Welcome and congratulations on the new rifle. Great place to start and a few thoughts:

1. Ammo - I think Asym has to be at or near the top for factory ammo. FGMM works really well in my rifle (similar to yours) however I do get better groups with the Asym. I would also look at Black Hills. Also really exceptional ammo. As has been said here you will want to start reloading

2. I would STRONGLY recommend you take advantage of FUNCIONALS kind offer. I am not in an area where looking at different glass is easy. Things like glass and your stock really need to fit you and you can spend a lot of well intentioned money trying to find the right glass for you. Time with others spent is a great investment in yourself and I find I learn something new/interesting everytime.

3. Purchases and learning - lots of opportunities right here. Check out the classified section here and you might look at getting some of the videos from Frank or online training. While not as detailed as the SH training you can also check you tube. There are some videos from Frank as well as the NSSF. Too much of the other You Tube stuff is not always accurate.

 

[djarecke]

Also, look up Curt Drewel's Long Gun Training in Upstate. He's a former HOG and a very knowledgeable guy and great instructor.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[acemonster]

An update:

-I picked up Seekins Precision 20 MOA Base and Seekins 30mm Medium rings.
-I plan on mounting either a Vortex PST or HS-LR, Leupold VX-R, or Monarch 3 / M308.

-I also bought the Harris Bi-Pod 6-9 in Smooth with a Pod-Loc.

-I picked up a Caldwell DeadShot Boxed Front and Rear Bag Combo-Unfilled for the range along with a Condor Single Rifle Case (Olive Drab, 42 x 12 x 3-Inch) to take everything to the range.

 

[FUNCTIONAL]

No, worries bud, offer is there if you ever want to shoot sometime.

Good pick on the rings and base though, cant go wrong with Seekins.


EDIT: I don't remember reading it but if you haven't tried the BlackHills 175smks I would suggest it. the 168's shot great out of my rifle but the 175s were tighter yet. For 300yrds I don't think you can really go wrong with either though.

 

[broke_again]

Look at the Bushnell Long Range Hunter scope. Bit pricy but the turrets are not going to move it they get snagged in the woods

 

[acemonster]

No, worries bud, offer is there if you ever want to shoot sometime.

Good pick on the rings and base though, cant go wrong with Seekins.


EDIT: I don't remember reading it but if you haven't tried the BlackHills 175smks I would suggest it. the 168's shot great out of my rifle but the 175s were tighter yet. For 300yrds I don't think you can really go wrong with either though.

I'll keep that in mind. If anything I might visit ranges near you, as they are likely a greater distance than what we have out here on Long Island.

Look at the Bushnell Long Range Hunter scope. Bit pricey but the turrets are not going to move it they get snagged in the woods

I'll check them out, but for that price, the Vortex and Nikon's are a bit more feature-packed. I'm not, however, ruling out used glass. My LGS has a decent selection that I'm going to check out again this weekend.

 

[Night Eagle]

training will be your biggest asset at this time. find an instructor that will let you use his equipment, and put 1k rounds down range, and 10k dry fires before you make a big scope purchase. that will give you a very good idea what you need verses what you think you need now. that 5r is a great rifle and should be an invaluable tool in your tool box for learning to put a bullet downrange accurately and consistently.
did i say training will be your biggest asset...oh and i would get some training...

 

[acemonster]

Update 2:

I purchased the Vortex Viper PST 4-16x50 FFP EBR-1 MOA from CameraLand in NYC and got a great deal (got 10% on a brand new unit).
Can't wait to mount this baby - it's a beauty.

Ace