Origin short action and Hawkins Hunter DBM

[KYAggie]

I have a Bighorn Origin short action that I want to put in a Peak 44 carbon stock that takes M5 bottom metal. I’m interested in using the Hawkins Hunter DBM, but ran across this comment below on a website. My SN is in the 2400 range. I emailed the company that had it for sale and they had no idea.

Do any of you know if Hawkins Hunter short action DBM bottom metal only fits Origins in a SN range above 5350? And if so, why?

 

[spife7980]

This seems like a question for the pros
@Zermatt Arms

I suspect it’s a slight forward movement of the feed ramp to eliminate bullet tips getting caught under the actions feed ramp when using a non binder plate mag but that is 100% speculation.

 

[drwood96]

The issue is not with bottom metal but with the hunter magazines hit the action on earlier versions. Later version they extend bottom cut a little bit to clear. When I talked to Zermatt, they advise taking the action to a gunsmith. After looking at the pieces in hand, you can just notch the back of the hunter magazines. Without the notch, the mags would not lock in.

 

[KYAggie]

The issue is not with bottom metal but with the hunter magazines hit the action on earlier versions. Later version they extend bottom cut a little bit to clear. When I talked to Zermatt, they advise taking the action to a gunsmith. After looking at the pieces in hand, you can just notch the back of the hunter magazines. Without the notch, the mags would not lock in.View attachment 8557949

Well that looks easy enough. Is it only an issue with Hawkins mags then? Do normal AICS mags like MDT mags still fit or would they need to be notched as well?

I have the action in a KRG-b right now and I’ve not had any issues with the MDT mags.

 

[drwood96]

They should fit without issue. The Hunter are billet and thicker for a tighter fit. FYI, mine is a LA and they don’t work with AICS mags so the SA may be a little different.

 

[Zermatt Arms]

They should fit without issue. The Hunter are billet and thicker for a tighter fit. FYI, mine is a LA and they don’t work with AICS mags so the SA may be a little different.

This is correct. It's only a fitment issue with the Hawkins Hunter magazine system in those older Origin receivers. All other AICS magazine systems have been good to go to our knowledge.

Thank you - Ray

 

[KYAggie]

This is correct. It's only a fitment issue with the Hawkins Hunter magazine system in those older Origin receivers. All other AICS magazine systems have been good to go to our knowledge.

Thank you - Ray

Thanks, I appreciate the information straight from the horses mouth! Looks like an easy fix too. I picked up the Hunter bottom metal in a BF sale for $146. I’m putting together a stock and lighter barrel set up for my Origin so I can hunt with it.

 

[santee116]

My origin has an early serial number of 013xx and it runs the SA hunter mag just fine, fwiw.

 

[powdahound76]

My 2 Origins I run the hunter DBM on are 12xx and 42xx SN range.

Newer mags. Run flawlessly.
6.5 creed and 300 wsm

I did not like the rattle of an AICS mag in the Hunter DBM.
Magpul poly still was loud.

My daughter requested to use 5 rd mag, so just swapped one for a Hawkins M5 DMB and Magpul poly mag running like a champ.
She only needed 1 rd, and felt better having more I guess….

 

[KYAggie]

My 2 Origins I run the hunter DBM on are 12xx and 42xx SN range.

Newer mags. Run flawlessly.
6.5 creed and 300 wsm

I did not like the rattle of an AICS mag in the Hunter DBM.
Magpul poly still was loud.

My daughter requested to use 5 rd mag, so just swapped one for a Hawkins M5 DMB and Magpul poly mag running like a champ.
She only needed 1 rd, and felt better having more I guess….

All the mags I have are right now are AICS mags from MDT; I have 3,5, & 10 rounders that are poly and metal, and a couple Magpuls. Sounds like I’ll need to throw down some coin for a Hawkins mag or two.

Thanks!

 

[powdahound76]

The Hawkins Hunter mags are really nice…..

 

[K80/6.5]

My origin has an early serial number of 013xx and it runs the SA hunter mag just fine, fwiw.

Same, mine feeds perfect .

 

[Defender32]

I had one for a while in a Manners LRH. I never used the flush magazine as all I carried was MDT/ AICS 5 round mags. I never had an issue.

 

[KYAggie]

Follow on question for you all who have run Hawkins mags in your short action Origin with a 300wsm or a 6.5 prc. I have a 300 wsm and the tips of round 2 and 3 are hanging up on the bottom of the feed ramp on my Origin causing failure to feed. I already have the bullets seated .1 off the lands, so I don’t want to go deeper. Look at the pictures below, am I looking at a milling job? Interestingly, the mags click in just fine even though my action is an earlier SN. I have also sent Zermatt an email with these pics and I’m sure they will respond quickly; they have always been very helpful. I just wanted to see if any of you have seen this.

 

[powdahound76]

Havent had that issue with mine.
(Manners EH1, Hawkins hunter DBM and mag, 200 gr eldx in Norma 300 wsm brass)

What bullet is that with the grey tip?

My SN is lower than yours by 1/2

Without looking, cant remember my jump and almost sure it isnt that much!
My barrel is a TL3 Proof prefit with an HLR lug.

The less than perfect hit last year piled up a bull in 12 yds. 209 yd shot.
He was 1/4 to more than I could tell/notice so shot hit at a steeper angle vs straight through the lungs.
Bullet was in the offside ribs. Dumped an estimated 2800 ft/lbs of force entirely into the elk.

 

[KYAggie]

That’s a Nosler 210ABLR. They are going 2725 fps out of that 20” barrel with R26. I sent that one at 600 yards and it hit just right of the center, so I guess bullet tip deformation doesn’t really matter . Case study of one round.

 

[powdahound76]

200 eldx at 2816 with 7828ssc for me.

Will hold 1/2 MOA to 600 yds.

Open to trying a different bullet?


I do know Ray or someone from Zermatt will be back with you pretty quickly.
They just rock

 

[KYAggie]

200 eldx at 2816 with 7828ssc for me.

Will hold 1/2 MOA to 600 yds.

Open to trying a different bullet?


I do know Ray or someone from Zermatt will be back with you pretty quickly.
They just rock

I got them up to 2800 fps, but the groups opened up even worse. This barrel has been the pickiest barrel I’ve ever owned. It coppered up in the last 6” like mad even though I folwed the recommended break in procedure. I finally went back to shoot one, clean, shoot one clean, for a few and that finally smoothed it out; well, that and the other 175 rounds down the tube . It pretty much negated all the 180 and 200 Accubond bullets I sent down range trying to find a load. I was told that my KRG-b might be causing the fliers I was having as well as switching bullets and some times powders while testing loads, without cleaning in between and shooting 5-15 rounds to re-season the bore………thank goodness none of my other rifles require this; from my 44 year old Ruger 7 mag to my $200 close out Aero 6.5 cm barrel. It’s now sitting in my Peak 44 Bastion and seems to shoot a little bit more consistent, although that could be because the barrel finally broke in. My other rifles and barrels don’t seem to care if I clean between changing bullets or not and just consistently turn in decent groups. I’m running out of time, as my range requires a 2.5+ hour round trip drive and I’ve been out there 5 times……..I went yesterday and this load shot from 1/2 moa to 1 moa, with most being closer to 1 moa. I just don’t have time to go back and try the Accubonds, which have worked well in my other guns. Yesterday, I took out my old 7 mag, that’s going to be my backup gun, and for the first time tried some 160 Accubonds with R26 in it. That rifle has been abused, I got it when I was 13, and it suffered through my Barnes bullet and cleaning with CR-10 phase 25 years ago. It grouped 1-1.5 moa until the load with old Remington 9.5M primers and then went to 1/2”. One range trip, load development complete. If you saw the inside of the barrel, you would not guess 1.5 moa or less would be possible, but there it is.

All these headaches because I want to hunt suppressed . It would have been much less trouble to use my 25 year old R93 300 win that tosses 200 Partitions boringly into 3/4” at 2972 fps, but it’s not threaded. I looked at getting a custom 20” threaded 300 wsm barrel for it, but it was going to cost $1975. I should have just dropped the coin instead of being cheap and buying a $1050 match barrel for my Origin, but who knew

 

[KYAggie]

Here’s what I’m looking at with the 300wsm, note the smallest group was at 200 yards……..

When shooting the .751” group in the middle picture, I literally shot one, then cooled the barrel with a mattress pump and hose, then shot another one for three shots. I was trying to see if barrel was moving as it heated up, but the results are inconclusive. I wish I had a closer range to shoot at.

 

[KYAggie]

Meanwhile, old abused 7 mag:

I know, it’s only one group and I need to shoot it more, but this gun seems to like those old Remington 9.5M primers. It did the same thing a couple years ago when shooting 168 Custom Comps with H4831SC……..maybe I should try those primes in my wsm……..

 

[powdahound76]

What barrel? (You may have said in another thread, but my memory is shorter than, well, other things!)




I feel silly for it and have 5 proof CF hunting barrels…..

They all shoot and are easy to find a great load for.
3 prefits (300 wsm 24”, 20” .308, 22” 6.5 creed)
2 are blanks bought on a great sale and chambered by a smith (16.5” 6.5 creed, 22” 6.5 PRC)