Rifle Scopes Pair of PH 5-25's

M

MTETM

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Dec 11, 2007
912
217
Montana
#1
IMGP4863.jpg

The end result of almost a year...
They are keepers...
The scopes showed up (Thank You Scott!!) the day before my best friend and his lonesome rifle arrived for a long weekend.
We got them mounted and zeroed Friday evening and put almost 900 rounds under them this weekend shooting P-Dogs and steel.

Opinions...
Fantastic glass, very easy on the eyes after many hours of non stop use in the heat and dust.
Knobs...The size is great. Very nice to get a hold of... <span style="color: #6633FF">Update: Premier has supplied a second set of clicker components with 2 springs. The feel is very good now. VERY positive. They have a distinct feel and while the MTC is not quite as distinct, there is no question when you get to a full mil value. I am now VERY PLEASED with the feel and no longer have any complaints regarding the scope and the adjustments!! </span>.
We both really like the MTC,

Tracking was spot on. We ran 10 mil elevation and 4 mil windage "box" tests early Saturday am. Other than you have to make damn sure the toggles are tight, they track correctly.
Parallax adjustment knob is works well, the resistance has a good solid feel to it and neither of us felt slighted without an adjustment scale.
Reticle: I love it!! I will have it in all my future scopes. The lines are fine even in the 20-25 range. They get very fine on the low end, and if you are shooting in low light conditions on low power, the lighted reticle will be needed, but I used it on 5x in bright conditions with a mixed background and did not have any problems picking it up.

Now, the not so good parts. First the PR scope caps do not stay on. If you try to open the cap quickly, the entire cap comes off in your hand. If you bump it, it comes off in your hand. This problem occured when it was 90-100 degrees, things got better when the temps dropped back to the 70's. While we were p-dogging we just left them off and will find a Butler Creek that will fit, or make a set similar to NF for the future...
 
#2
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

Shot mine all weekend at ASC and agree COMPLETELY with your comments regarding the AMAZING clarity, the tracking, the feel of knobs and the GARBAGE ocular cover. At least two shooters using PH scopes lost the cover when carrying the rifle slung. The only thing to do was take the cover off at the begining of the day and replace when done.

The scope needs a new ocular bell that can be used with BC covers.

Chris and Jerry- You have made ALMOST the perfect scope. Change the ocular bell so BCs fit (or use a better cover), make the clicks more distinct and add some reference lines to the parallax and I'll sell all my S & Bs!!
 
#5
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SD669</div><div class="ubbcode-body">out of curiousity, what stock is that on the <span style="font-style: italic">light colored</span> rifle? </div></div>

Manners... MCS GAT...

Great feeling stock
 
#6
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

Put a little hair spray on the inside diameter of the cap.

Let it get tacky then put it back on the scope.

Just a thought... it works great for bicycle handlebar grips.
 
#7
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tigerbikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Put a little hair spray on the inside diameter of the cap.

Let it get tacky then put it back on the scope.

Just a thought... it works great for bicycle handlebar grips. </div></div>

TB-

I wish it were that easy. The mounting ring an the PH caps is about 1/4" wide and snaps over the machined in lip in the ocular making it a real bitch to use a butler creek.
 
#8
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MTETM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Now, the not so good parts. First the PR scope caps do not stay on. If you try to open the cap quickly, the entire cap comes off in your hand. If you bump it, it comes off in your hand. This problem occured when it was 90-100 degrees, things got better when the temps dropped back to the 70's. While we were p-dogging we just left them off and will find a Butler Creek that will fit, or make a set similar to NF for the future... <span style="font-weight: bold">
Knobs...The size is great. Very nice to get a hold of...<span style="color: #FF0000"> but I can not stand the feel of the adjustments. They are too soft. On mine, there is almost zero feel to the windage adjustment. I tried to back the pressure off on the toggle to increase the "feel" only to have no adjustment because there is not enough pressure. The elevation has a bit more feel, but still not great. With gloves there is no way I will feel any of them. I tried making adjustments all day and could not get them exact without looking.
We both really like the MTC, but feel the "clunk" at each mil should be what each .1 mil should feel like with a bigger clunk at 1 mil. </span></span>
</div></div>

Man, that is really disconcerting. That was the main reason I sold my NXS looking for a scope with S&B-like glass and adjustment feel. I guess I will just have to play with a PH before I drop the coin on one. But, I think I'll wait to check out the new Vortex Razor before I make my choice.
 
#9
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

My adjustments don't feel that bad, but not the best I've felt either.

The ocular lens cover <span style="font-size: 26pt">SUCKS</span>

Tempted to dremel the ring off and put a BC on
wink.gif


My eyes aren't what they used to be, but I didn't cream in my jeans over the glass relative to my USO's. Perhaps I was expecting a "WOW" difference-don't get me wrong, the glass i very very good.
 
#10
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 19Scout77</div><div class="ubbcode-body">TB-
I wish it were that easy. The mounting ring an the PH caps is about 1/4" wide and snaps over the machined in lip in the ocular making it a real bitch to use a butler creek. </div></div>
I have a 3-15 now and know about the objective lip thingy.
I thought they had done away with that on the 5-25.
My mistake.
 
#12
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 4thSeal</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A 17 or 18 BC cap will fit over the end </div></div>

But how much will it interface with the ocular before running into the lock ring for the reticle focus? This needs a minor change to fix a major PITA.
 
#13
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's



I played with one of these scopes this weekend, I fore one really can´t relate to what you are saying,

perhaps one of the better feels of adjustmement I have ever felt,

I would even call it to stiff out of the box and then softened by working it,

the USMC version of S&B feels like there is grit in the rings and I found that the mil marks were so hard/stiff that adjusting them tended to make them jump and add two or so klicks,

however as there was som 15 people playing around with all sorts of scopes it soon became apparent that everybody had there own idea of what is the best feel..

So to each his own.

Best regards Chris





<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hunter223</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MTETM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Now, the not so good parts. First the PR scope caps do not stay on. If you try to open the cap quickly, the entire cap comes off in your hand. If you bump it, it comes off in your hand. This problem occured when it was 90-100 degrees, things got better when the temps dropped back to the 70's. While we were p-dogging we just left them off and will find a Butler Creek that will fit, or make a set similar to NF for the future... <span style="font-weight: bold">
Knobs...The size is great. Very nice to get a hold of...<span style="color: #FF0000"> but I can not stand the feel of the adjustments. They are too soft. On mine, there is almost zero feel to the windage adjustment. I tried to back the pressure off on the toggle to increase the "feel" only to have no adjustment because there is not enough pressure. The elevation has a bit more feel, but still not great. With gloves there is no way I will feel any of them. I tried making adjustments all day and could not get them exact without looking.
We both really like the MTC, but feel the "clunk" at each mil should be what each .1 mil should feel like with a bigger clunk at 1 mil. </span></span>
</div></div>

Man, that is really disconcerting. That was the main reason I sold my NXS looking for a scope with S&B-like glass and adjustment feel. I guess I will just have to play with a PH before I drop the coin on one. But, I think I'll wait to check out the new Vortex Razor before I make my choice. </div></div>
 
#14
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

wow looking at that reticle makes it look like it would completely cover a p-dog at normal ranges!(100-400 yards with a 203 or 223)

can you get a picture of one bisected in the reticle? thanks a lot.
 
#15
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

I would agree with Swedish Guy...

"...however as there were some 15 people playing around with all sorts of scopes it soon became apparent that everybody had there own idea of what is the best feel..

So to each his own."

PLEASE SEE FIRST POST FOR CLICKER FEEL UPDATE....

I would have to say the feel of the knob adjustments is a personal expectation.
I expected to feel a very distinct difference between adjustment points. There is a "click" but it is very light. I would not say they are mushy, as there is not really any play within or between the "clicks", they just are not as distinct as I would like. The adjustments are solid (stiff) in that a bump will not move them.
I am going to continue to use the hell out of the knobs and I am sure with more time behind the scope I will become more competent in making fast accurate adjustments.

Hasgun...I have never used a S&B so I can not give a direct comparison, but I have owned NF and there is no comparison. As it was pointed out to me when I asked about the feel of the PH to the NF prior to having my own, the PH is a "14 mil turn as compared to the 5 mil on the NF". Much more space for a larger "clunk"

Razor...I will try to get a pic this pm. I did not have any problems 1/4ing a p-dog.
 
#16
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: razor100</div><div class="ubbcode-body">wow looking at that reticle makes it look like it would completely cover a p-dog at normal ranges!(100-400 yards with a 203 or 223)

can you get a picture of one bisected in the reticle? thanks a lot. </div></div>

The reticle is fine enough to shoot golf balls at 300.
 
#17
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 19Scout77</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 4thSeal</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A 17 or 18 BC cap will fit over the end </div></div>

But how much will it interface with the ocular before running into the lock ring for the reticle focus? This needs a minor change to fix a major PITA.

</div></div>

the BC Cap goes over the top of the locking ring and will sit almost flush with eye piece. it really isnt a big deal and I am surpised no one has tried it... its snug but it works, i would suggest getting the BC Cap warm to help get it on
 
#18
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 4thSeal</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 19Scout77</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 4thSeal</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A 17 or 18 BC cap will fit over the end </div></div>

But how much will it interface with the ocular before running into the lock ring for the reticle focus? This needs a minor change to fix a major PITA.

</div></div>

the BC Cap goes over the top of the locking ring and will sit almost flush with eye piece. it really isnt a big deal and I am surpised no one has tried it... its snug but it works, i would suggest getting the BC Cap warm to help get it on </div></div>

I'll give it a shot. I too have found that near boiling water is a BC caps friend!
 
#20
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

If your turrets are mushy give Premier a call they will fix it for you. They had batch with metallurgy problems. One metal used was softer than the other. I sent mine in and now it's like snapping toothpicks. They should be able to figure it out with your scopes serial#.
 
#21
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Joeyhotfizzle</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If your turrets are mushy give Premier a call they will fix it for you. They had batch with metallurgy problems. One metal used was softer than the other. I sent mine in and now it's like snapping toothpicks. They should be able to figure it out with your scopes serial#. </div></div>

Thanks for the info. I will contact them today.
 
#23
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tigerbikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Let me get this straight... you guys are having issues with the objective cover, eye/ocular cover, or both?</div></div>

My original comment was in regards to the supplied ocular cover. I am just going to put an objective Bulter Creek on it or a bikini type cover...in the grand scheme of things it isn't a big deal, except that the ocular is machined for the supplied cover...
 
#24
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tigerbikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Let me get this straight... you guys are having issues with the objective cover, eye/ocular cover, or both? </div></div>

Ocular cover (in my case). Being that only part of the circumferance of the cover engages the lip on the scope, it is easily knocked off. I would think that if they took the time to make a proprietary cover, they'd make on that securely engages the lip they engineered into the ocular part of the scope.
 
#25
Re: Pair of PH 5-25's

Bump for an update on the feel of the adjustments.
Please see the original post...

Thank you to all the folks at Premier for providing a very good fix to the soft "click" or feel of the adjustment knobs. They have made the scope great now in my opinion.
After contacting Premier, I had the parts in a couple of days.
 
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