Precision Reloading Effiency Tools

[peaceatwar]

Been reloading .308 for a few months now.

My current process is (and it doesn't deviate from this)

• Deprime with Deprime die in Forster COAX
• Tumble in SS media for 4 Hours
• Dry
• Lube
• FL Resize with Forster Ultra FL resize .308 (expander rod & ball removed)
• Trim with WFT
• Uniform/Ream Primer Pockets on Lyman Case Prep Center
• Inside/Outside Chamfer on Lyman Case Prep Center
• Tumble in SS Media for 30 mins
• Dry
• Use Chargemaster Combo to drop powder
• Use Forster Micrometer Seater to seat bullet
  
  

As i get faster and things get committed to memory I will become more efficient.

My question for the hide is where can my process improve from a consistency perspective (we all dream about ultra precise loads) and from an efficiency perspective (we all want to spend less time reloading, I used to shoot factory ammo only but it wasn't good enough)


Suggestions I am expecting for More precision:

Use a bushing die and neck size or FL resize with a bushing
Turn Necks
Anneal

Suggestions I am expecting for more efficiency

Get a giraud trimmer
Get a prometheus
Get a Progressive Press

On average I get a spread of 9-15 FPS, with a recent 20 shot string with an ES of 13. To me that is impressive I am using a magneto speed choronograph. So I am not up for fixing something that isn't broken just looking for some input on how to improve.

Peace

 

[Fuzzball]

I don't know about "effency" but speed and precision don't belong in the same loading room.

Why don't you use the proper expander in your sizer? I'd bet if you run your ammo through a concentricity gage you'd be shocked at how much run-out you're getting from that.

 

[lightman]

Not exactly sure what you are looking for here! You process looks ok. Your 1st tumbling time is probably a little long, about 2hr should do ya. 9 to 15 fps difference in velosity is pretty good. Am also wondering about not using the expander ball. It would also help to know what kinda rifle you are shooting and what your groups look like. Are you seeing an improvement over factory? What kinda factory?

The kinda trimmer you use probably not affect anything except the time you spend trimming. The Giraud is fast and will stay within .001. A progressive press will let you load faster, but don't look for more accuracy from one, only less time at the loading bench. I have no experience with a Prometheus, so I will offer no opinion. Bushing dies and neck turning can improve accuracy, but may not be enough to justify the time spent or the cost of the tooling, unless you are shooting BR. An annealing machine, and the annealing process can make for more consistent neck tension, as your cases are fired more times. It will also extent your case life. Lightman

 

[sjb269]

Tell me more about your double tumble system...
What do you add to the first tumble and the second tumble? do you alter the mix?

I found that tumbling after sizing, I had to run the cases up into a die with the expander just far enough to round out the necks. My eye was picking up a slight out of round condition after the tumble.

 

[sjb269]

Double post

 

[kansas]

I'd be concerned about runout also. You can reduce runout by using a Lee collet die. I certainly woundnt go to a progressive for precision shooting. And my next item will probably be an annealer

 

[Natty Bumpo]

As far as efficiency goes: I don't ream/uniform primer pockets. But is it something that needs to be done each time the ammo is loaded? Do they deform that much on firing? Have you deburred your flash holes? I thought sizing dies undersided the neck by a good amount and the expander ball expands it to a more appropriate size. With the Forster dies, the expander ball floats on the decapping spindle so it shouldn't pull the neck to one size and contribute to runout.

 

[lightman]

Natty, uniforming the primer pocket is considered to be a one time deal. I do mine everytime because I use the same tool to clean the carbon out of the pocket. I do get a little brass out on later firings, as the brass does migrate a little, under pressure. Deburring the flash hole is a one time deal. I don't have any Hornady dies, so I can't comment on the floating expander. I usually leave my expander loose and let it self center, which should do the same thing. Lightman

 

[peaceatwar]

Not exactly sure what you are looking for here! You process looks ok. Your 1st tumbling time is probably a little long, about 2hr should do ya. 9 to 15 fps difference in velosity is pretty good. Am also wondering about not using the expander ball. It would also help to know what kinda rifle you are shooting and what your groups look like. Are you seeing an improvement over factory? What kinda factory?

The kinda trimmer you use probably not affect anything except the time you spend trimming. The Giraud is fast and will stay within .001. A progressive press will let you load faster, but don't look for more accuracy from one, only less time at the loading bench. I have no experience with a Prometheus, so I will offer no opinion. Bushing dies and neck turning can improve accuracy, but may not be enough to justify the time spent or the cost of the tooling, unless you are shooting BR. An annealing machine, and the annealing process can make for more consistent neck tension, as your cases are fired more times. It will also extent your case life. Lightman

Will get to more of this post when I can but it's a GAP Tempalr .308 24" bartlein #7 loading 155 scenars with 46.5grains of varget with 210M primers in Winchester brass.

It will put 5 shots consistently 1/3-1/2 MOA at 100-300. Don't really to test further except in matches where I have noticed a night and day improvement over 168gr or 175gr .308 FGMM. Everyone I talked to told me to ditch the expander ball.

 

[peaceatwar]

Tell me more about your double tumble system...
What do you add to the first tumble and the second tumble? do you alter the mix?

I found that tumbling after sizing, I had to run the cases up into a die with the expander just far enough to round out the necks. My eye was picking up a slight out of round condition after the tumble.

Both times I tumble its 5 lbs of stainless media with 9mm case of lemi shine and two tablespoons of dawn. The second tumble is to remove the lube.

 

[1SMALLJOHNSON]

There is nothing wrong with using a progressive. I've got a Dillon 550B, and I've used the same one for years. I use it for match shooting, from service rifle, and 300 meter, International. As a matter of fact, the last time I shot 300 meters, I used a 6mm BR with 107 Sierra's. I used 748 powder. My accuracy was 1/2 the x ring, at 300 meters, shot prone. That's better than 1/2 minute. Actually, if memory serves me right, it's 1/3 minute.

Unless you're using your 308 beyond ~ 700 yards (assuming a high BC bullet), you really have no purpose in weighing your charge weights. Go ahead and run your own test to confirm it.

Just be sure to set your dies up right. The expander ball is old technology, unless you've got dented case necks. Use a bushing die.

A neck sizing die is not necessary. Just use a full length sizer, but be sure to just "kiss" the shoulder. Just enough to bump it back 2-5 thousandths or so.

Sounds as if your brass prep is pretty good, so you probably won't have any problem seating the primers to consistent depth.

I'd recommend you not chamfer the flash hole, by getting overagressive with the flashhole deburring tool. Too much of that, and you could affect how your primer interacts with the powder bed. Probably nothing to worry about, but I seem to recall a Precision Shooting article about how a chamfered flash hole was not necessarily beneficial.

Generally, don't mess with crimping the rounds. But if you do, make sure that the crimp doesn't affect concentricity. If I crimp, I"ll set up my independent crimp die (station 4) with consistently trimmed brass (Forster drill-press set-up), and watch for the crimp die to affect concentricity. Back if off until there is no detrimental affect.

400 rounds per hour, if you do your part.

But hey, some people just like to reload, more than they like to shoot. Whatever floats your boat!