Tiger Valley is Looking at changing things up a little, which would everyone rather have a prize table or a cash pay out? The cash would be paid out to 9 shooters, first three then down a third of the shooters and the last third, much like a Glock match. Pay out would obviously depend on attendance
- Thread starter MADUCE
- Start date
Re: Prize format
Typically the top few shooters prefer a cash payout while the rest prefer a prize table.
Typically the top few shooters prefer a cash payout while the rest prefer a prize table.
Re: Prize format
I like prizes, but cash is always nice.
I like prizes, but cash is always nice.
Re: Prize format
works for me.
works for me.
Re: Prize format
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Okie Gordon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Typically the top few shooters prefer a cash payout while the rest prefer a prize table. </div></div>
I couldn't agree with Mr. Gordon more. I guess it depends if you want to reward only the top 9 shooters or more of your competitors.
I personally think if all the matches went to a top 10 type of payout the attendence would drop off. In my opinion the prize tables have been a big part of our sports rapid growth. With the prize table format a guy doesn't have to beat the best of the best to get a little something & that little something seems to keep them wanting more.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Okie Gordon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Typically the top few shooters prefer a cash payout while the rest prefer a prize table. </div></div>
I couldn't agree with Mr. Gordon more. I guess it depends if you want to reward only the top 9 shooters or more of your competitors.
I personally think if all the matches went to a top 10 type of payout the attendence would drop off. In my opinion the prize tables have been a big part of our sports rapid growth. With the prize table format a guy doesn't have to beat the best of the best to get a little something & that little something seems to keep them wanting more.
Re: Prize format
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dean253</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Okie Gordon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Typically the top few shooters prefer a cash payout while the rest prefer a prize table. </div></div>
I couldn't agree with Mr. Gordon more. I guess it depends if you want to reward only the top 9 shooters or more of your competitors.
I personally think if all the matches went to a top 10 type of payout the attendence would drop off. In my opinion the prize tables have been a big part of our sports rapid growth. With the prize table format a guy doesn't have to beat the best of the best to get a little something & that little something seems to keep them wanting more.
</div></div>
As a newer competitor, I agree. I don't go to competitions expecting to take something home, but the fact that I *can* conceivably walk with something makes it easier to justify the sometimes high entrance fees.
Also, it seems like it would probably be easier to get prizes from sponsors than cash. My unsolicited and uneducated guess would be that a cash only output would probably wind up being less overall than the value of the prize table you could put together.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dean253</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Okie Gordon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Typically the top few shooters prefer a cash payout while the rest prefer a prize table. </div></div>
I couldn't agree with Mr. Gordon more. I guess it depends if you want to reward only the top 9 shooters or more of your competitors.
I personally think if all the matches went to a top 10 type of payout the attendence would drop off. In my opinion the prize tables have been a big part of our sports rapid growth. With the prize table format a guy doesn't have to beat the best of the best to get a little something & that little something seems to keep them wanting more.
</div></div>
As a newer competitor, I agree. I don't go to competitions expecting to take something home, but the fact that I *can* conceivably walk with something makes it easier to justify the sometimes high entrance fees.
Also, it seems like it would probably be easier to get prizes from sponsors than cash. My unsolicited and uneducated guess would be that a cash only output would probably wind up being less overall than the value of the prize table you could put together.
Re: Prize format
The problem with the prize table is as our sport grows and we have the opportunity to shoot more and more matches, it becomes hard for the sponsors to support them all. I know that Shannon and I are looking at both. Some matches will have sponsored prize tables and others will be a cash pay out.
For me it's more about hanging out with friends, making new ones, and trying to hit the target.
Bryan
The problem with the prize table is as our sport grows and we have the opportunity to shoot more and more matches, it becomes hard for the sponsors to support them all. I know that Shannon and I are looking at both. Some matches will have sponsored prize tables and others will be a cash pay out.
For me it's more about hanging out with friends, making new ones, and trying to hit the target.
Bryan
Re: Prize format
I think TJ is talking about a Lewis system style of pay out. Example, 30 shooters, with shooters placing 1-10 then shooters 1-3 get paid, 11-20 shooters 11-13 get paid and 21-30 shooters 21-23 get paid.
Personally I like a prize table and have people go up per their ranking. You can get more from sponsors in product than cash. People can just sell any prizes they get for cash if they feel like it.
I think TJ is talking about a Lewis system style of pay out. Example, 30 shooters, with shooters placing 1-10 then shooters 1-3 get paid, 11-20 shooters 11-13 get paid and 21-30 shooters 21-23 get paid.
Personally I like a prize table and have people go up per their ranking. You can get more from sponsors in product than cash. People can just sell any prizes they get for cash if they feel like it.
Re: Prize format
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: T.J. PILLING</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tiger Valley is Looking at changing things up a little, which would everyone rather have a prize table or a cash pay out? The cash would be paid out to 9 shooters, first three then down a third of the shooters and the last third, much like a Glock match. Pay out would obviously depend on attendance</div></div>
the GSSF format would likely help attract more new competitors
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: T.J. PILLING</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tiger Valley is Looking at changing things up a little, which would everyone rather have a prize table or a cash pay out? The cash would be paid out to 9 shooters, first three then down a third of the shooters and the last third, much like a Glock match. Pay out would obviously depend on attendance</div></div>
the GSSF format would likely help attract more new competitors
Re: Prize format
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think TJ is talking about a Lewis system style of pay out. Example, 30 shooters, with shooters placing 1-10 then shooters 1-3 get paid, 11-20 shooters 11-13 get paid and 21-30 shooters 21-23 get paid.</div></div>
That would definitely piss me off if I came in fourth, got nothing, but the guys who was #11 got paid.
If that's the case, then prize table all the way.
I do believe prize tables will keep your attendance high. I don't shoot matches for the prizes, but sometimes the prizes or the winnings allow me to shoot more matches or run better gear.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think TJ is talking about a Lewis system style of pay out. Example, 30 shooters, with shooters placing 1-10 then shooters 1-3 get paid, 11-20 shooters 11-13 get paid and 21-30 shooters 21-23 get paid.</div></div>
That would definitely piss me off if I came in fourth, got nothing, but the guys who was #11 got paid.
If that's the case, then prize table all the way.
I do believe prize tables will keep your attendance high. I don't shoot matches for the prizes, but sometimes the prizes or the winnings allow me to shoot more matches or run better gear.
Re: Prize format
Everyone likes to win something. The prize can be in many diffrent forms. Cash, sponser donated, or trophys.
To me if a sponser donated prize is at a match that speeks highly of the sponser. Especially in this economy and with so many matches being held the sponsers get hounded regularly.
Seeing the top shooters recieve prizes should strive for you to practice harder if you want to win a prize.
GAP gave away a rifle at K&M to a raffle drawing. That was way cool too.That gave all the guys who were huge underdogs to win have a chance at winning a fantastic prize.
The easiest thing to do in my mind to generate a prize is take a percentage of the entry fee and apply it to a cash payout. If I sponser would like to donate.. Great. If not you still have a chance to win something.
Small matches, like the Panhandle Shooters challenge at K&M have a entry fee of 75.00. That is cheap for a fun filled day of shooting at a fantastic range. I think Charging a little more for the match or just having a side bet from the start would still be a value to shoot at that range and make things intresting. The side bet may be better as some people don't like to gamble and the bottom line is we want the sport to continue to grow.
Everyone likes to win something. The prize can be in many diffrent forms. Cash, sponser donated, or trophys.
To me if a sponser donated prize is at a match that speeks highly of the sponser. Especially in this economy and with so many matches being held the sponsers get hounded regularly.
Seeing the top shooters recieve prizes should strive for you to practice harder if you want to win a prize.
GAP gave away a rifle at K&M to a raffle drawing. That was way cool too.That gave all the guys who were huge underdogs to win have a chance at winning a fantastic prize.
The easiest thing to do in my mind to generate a prize is take a percentage of the entry fee and apply it to a cash payout. If I sponser would like to donate.. Great. If not you still have a chance to win something.
Small matches, like the Panhandle Shooters challenge at K&M have a entry fee of 75.00. That is cheap for a fun filled day of shooting at a fantastic range. I think Charging a little more for the match or just having a side bet from the start would still be a value to shoot at that range and make things intresting. The side bet may be better as some people don't like to gamble and the bottom line is we want the sport to continue to grow.
Re: Prize format
Thanks for all the ideas. Their appears to be strong support for venues. Matches for us are labor intensive. It normally takes us 6 days to prep for the match and another 2 days to run it and 2-3 days of tear down. Texas is lucky, lots of ranges are stepping up to the plate and running them. I will toss these ideas around with my guys and see what is viable. Thanks, T.J.
Thanks for all the ideas. Their appears to be strong support for venues. Matches for us are labor intensive. It normally takes us 6 days to prep for the match and another 2 days to run it and 2-3 days of tear down. Texas is lucky, lots of ranges are stepping up to the plate and running them. I will toss these ideas around with my guys and see what is viable. Thanks, T.J.
Re: Prize format
Don't forget 6 months to solicit for prizes. Hours and hours of emails and phone calls.
Don't forget 6 months to solicit for prizes. Hours and hours of emails and phone calls.
Re: Prize format
I wouldn't be a fan of the 1,2,3,11,12,13,21,22,23, payout at all, and while I agree with Dean, prizes have kept alot of people coming back and sparked the interest of new shooters to particular matches with insane prize tables... but prizes should not be any sort of entitlement by any means. Yes it's nice if everyone can walk away with a prize or two that may offset partial cost of the entry fee, bullets, travel etc. It's a fine balance of preformance and reward. If I shoot like ass but still walk away with a pair binoc's or custom knife, I don't feel so bad about my preformance. However, as matches with insane prizes grow so does the entry fees, 250, 275, 300 now... is it justified...having been on that end, I'd say yes, cause it's alot of damn work. It has become more and more of a business model, Sponsors are supporting the shooters, but really they are also padding the bottom line of the directors who put them on, and without them many matches simply just would not happen, so we all need to be thankful to those that support our matches.
I've been flirting with running a tier entry system.
No prize table means less work which can also translate to less entry fee.
Realistic conservative examples below, e.g.
$75 entry eligible for trophy only (low cost great for new shooters)
$150 entry eligible for trophy and cash payback. (payback includes 50% of all entries)
25 shooters*$150= $3850
20 shooters*$75= $1500
45 shooters Total=$5350
$5350*.50%= $2675 payout
1st $1000
2nd $500
3rd $300
4th $200
5th $150
6th $150
7th $150
8th $150
Middle of the pack award $75
I think you could nearly double the entry and have the same turnout but double the cash.
Also it would not be hard to drum up a few nice prizes for raffles, door prizes or additional stage winner prize awards.
I wouldn't be a fan of the 1,2,3,11,12,13,21,22,23, payout at all, and while I agree with Dean, prizes have kept alot of people coming back and sparked the interest of new shooters to particular matches with insane prize tables... but prizes should not be any sort of entitlement by any means. Yes it's nice if everyone can walk away with a prize or two that may offset partial cost of the entry fee, bullets, travel etc. It's a fine balance of preformance and reward. If I shoot like ass but still walk away with a pair binoc's or custom knife, I don't feel so bad about my preformance. However, as matches with insane prizes grow so does the entry fees, 250, 275, 300 now... is it justified...having been on that end, I'd say yes, cause it's alot of damn work. It has become more and more of a business model, Sponsors are supporting the shooters, but really they are also padding the bottom line of the directors who put them on, and without them many matches simply just would not happen, so we all need to be thankful to those that support our matches.
I've been flirting with running a tier entry system.
No prize table means less work which can also translate to less entry fee.
Realistic conservative examples below, e.g.
$75 entry eligible for trophy only (low cost great for new shooters)
$150 entry eligible for trophy and cash payback. (payback includes 50% of all entries)
25 shooters*$150= $3850
20 shooters*$75= $1500
45 shooters Total=$5350
$5350*.50%= $2675 payout
1st $1000
2nd $500
3rd $300
4th $200
5th $150
6th $150
7th $150
8th $150
Middle of the pack award $75
I think you could nearly double the entry and have the same turnout but double the cash.
Also it would not be hard to drum up a few nice prizes for raffles, door prizes or additional stage winner prize awards.
Re: Prize format
I think Rich has the right idea!
I think Rich has the right idea!
Re: Prize format
Not everyone who enters these matches expects to finish in the top half of the field. Or perhaps they get DNQ'd.
The ideal situation would be for the top competitors to receive cash and then have some lesser prizes such as ammo, t-shirts, data books ect for the guys who finish in the last half of the field. The lower cost prizes are easier to obtain from sponsors and I think it is important for as many of the competitors as possible to walk away from the event with something.
I put on firearms competitions for a living but you don't have to be a match director to see where all this is headed. The truth is there is good money to be made putting on QUALITY long range competitions. Allot of people are jumping on the bandwagon hoping to cash in. The portion of the firearms industry that services long range shooters is small relative to the general shooting industry. GAP, Surgeon, Lousiana Precision and others aren't big companies. They are big in our world but compared to Remington and others they are small operations. There is a finite amount of support they can offer the industry and remain profitable. The same goes for many of the other manufacturers who service long range shooters.
Some combination of cash and prizes is probably coming to most events whether we like it or not. The match directors like T.J., Rich, Shannon, and others who put on quality events will continue to get more sponsor support than the newer directors and that is as it should be. I guess what I am saying is that supply and demand is ultimately going to work this problem out for us as the manufacturers of long range related products are forced to supply prizes to only the top events in the country due to demand.
In my mind, long range shooting is set to really expand dramatically. There will be success stories and there will be casulties but as always the cream will rise to the top. Those that think putting on any type of shooting event is "easy money" will learn the truth by 4pm on day one!
Not everyone who enters these matches expects to finish in the top half of the field. Or perhaps they get DNQ'd.
The ideal situation would be for the top competitors to receive cash and then have some lesser prizes such as ammo, t-shirts, data books ect for the guys who finish in the last half of the field. The lower cost prizes are easier to obtain from sponsors and I think it is important for as many of the competitors as possible to walk away from the event with something.
I put on firearms competitions for a living but you don't have to be a match director to see where all this is headed. The truth is there is good money to be made putting on QUALITY long range competitions. Allot of people are jumping on the bandwagon hoping to cash in. The portion of the firearms industry that services long range shooters is small relative to the general shooting industry. GAP, Surgeon, Lousiana Precision and others aren't big companies. They are big in our world but compared to Remington and others they are small operations. There is a finite amount of support they can offer the industry and remain profitable. The same goes for many of the other manufacturers who service long range shooters.
Some combination of cash and prizes is probably coming to most events whether we like it or not. The match directors like T.J., Rich, Shannon, and others who put on quality events will continue to get more sponsor support than the newer directors and that is as it should be. I guess what I am saying is that supply and demand is ultimately going to work this problem out for us as the manufacturers of long range related products are forced to supply prizes to only the top events in the country due to demand.
In my mind, long range shooting is set to really expand dramatically. There will be success stories and there will be casulties but as always the cream will rise to the top. Those that think putting on any type of shooting event is "easy money" will learn the truth by 4pm on day one!
Re: Prize format
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: B. Morgan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The problem with the prize table is as our sport grows and we have the opportunity to shoot more and more matches, it becomes hard for the sponsors to support them all. I know that Shannon and I are looking at both. Some matches will have sponsored prize tables and others will be a cash pay out.
For me it's more about hanging out with friends, making new ones, and trying to hit the target.
Bryan </div></div>
+1 on that!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: B. Morgan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The problem with the prize table is as our sport grows and we have the opportunity to shoot more and more matches, it becomes hard for the sponsors to support them all. I know that Shannon and I are looking at both. Some matches will have sponsored prize tables and others will be a cash pay out.
For me it's more about hanging out with friends, making new ones, and trying to hit the target.
Bryan </div></div>
+1 on that!
Re: Prize format
I know this is off the wall but i am going to test it with a small group of my buddies and see how it works out.
we are going to do skins game style match 8 stages @ $10/ea. 50% payout probably 15 shooters so each stage won =$50. so if you win 2 stages you get $100 which is more than the entry fee of $80 and it gives guys the opportunity to win something even if they have a bad day everyone can have one great stage. any tie will be broken by the faster shooter of the stage.
I feel this accommodates the most winners and really ups the heckling which is great fun!!
I know this is off the wall but i am going to test it with a small group of my buddies and see how it works out.
we are going to do skins game style match 8 stages @ $10/ea. 50% payout probably 15 shooters so each stage won =$50. so if you win 2 stages you get $100 which is more than the entry fee of $80 and it gives guys the opportunity to win something even if they have a bad day everyone can have one great stage. any tie will be broken by the faster shooter of the stage.
I feel this accommodates the most winners and really ups the heckling which is great fun!!
Re: Prize format
I like this. Maybe we will give this a try.
I like this. Maybe we will give this a try.
Re: Prize format
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TeamSendIt</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I know this is off the wall but i am going to test it with a small group of my buddies and see how it works out.
we are going to do skins game style match 8 stages @ $10/ea. 50% payout probably 15 shooters so each stage won =$50. so if you win 2 stages you get $100 which is more than the entry fee of $80 and it gives guys the opportunity to win something even if they have a bad day everyone can have one great stage. any tie will be broken by the faster shooter of the stage.
I feel this accommodates the most winners and really ups the heckling which is great fun!!</div></div>
that's not a bad idea, so please give us an AAR and let us know how it works
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TeamSendIt</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I know this is off the wall but i am going to test it with a small group of my buddies and see how it works out.
we are going to do skins game style match 8 stages @ $10/ea. 50% payout probably 15 shooters so each stage won =$50. so if you win 2 stages you get $100 which is more than the entry fee of $80 and it gives guys the opportunity to win something even if they have a bad day everyone can have one great stage. any tie will be broken by the faster shooter of the stage.
I feel this accommodates the most winners and really ups the heckling which is great fun!!</div></div>
that's not a bad idea, so please give us an AAR and let us know how it works
Re: Prize format
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TeamSendIt</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I know this is off the wall but i am going to test it with a small group of my buddies and see how it works out.
we are going to do skins game style match 8 stages @ $10/ea. 50% payout probably 15 shooters so each stage won =$50. so if you win 2 stages you get $100 which is more than the entry fee of $80 and it gives guys the opportunity to win something even if they have a bad day everyone can have one great stage. any tie will be broken by the faster shooter of the stage.
I feel this accommodates the most winners and really ups the heckling which is great fun!! </div></div>
In a true skins format, ties carry over. Would make for some very interesting high value stages.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TeamSendIt</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I know this is off the wall but i am going to test it with a small group of my buddies and see how it works out.
we are going to do skins game style match 8 stages @ $10/ea. 50% payout probably 15 shooters so each stage won =$50. so if you win 2 stages you get $100 which is more than the entry fee of $80 and it gives guys the opportunity to win something even if they have a bad day everyone can have one great stage. any tie will be broken by the faster shooter of the stage.
I feel this accommodates the most winners and really ups the heckling which is great fun!! </div></div>
In a true skins format, ties carry over. Would make for some very interesting high value stages.
Re: Prize format
I vote prize table, as a mid to lower pack shooter it is nice to come home with something. If the match is 200-300 it is nice to have something other then a t-shirt. If the match is 30-75 you can just go and learn and enjoy the company.
At this point I am reluctant to shoot cash payouts. Just my thoughts.
I vote prize table, as a mid to lower pack shooter it is nice to come home with something. If the match is 200-300 it is nice to have something other then a t-shirt. If the match is 30-75 you can just go and learn and enjoy the company.
At this point I am reluctant to shoot cash payouts. Just my thoughts.
Re: Prize format
I guess we all shoot matches for different reasons. Some shoot for prizes. Others for the PRS points. Some for the comraderie(sp?). Some for the pure thrill of competition. For me it's more personal satisfaction. It's the only way I know to test my skills against the best shooters out there. Do I want to win? Of course that is the ultimate goal for anyone with a competitive nature. Do I expect to win? Not at all. That doesn't mean I'm gonna quit trying.
Just my opinion but here is how I feel about prize tables and cash payouts. The sponsors of the prize table matches always go above and beyond. Some of the bigger matches have prize tables that are just plain rediculous. Simply not possible without the sponsors. You have to wonder how far these companies can bend before they break. They just can't keep giving and giving without some sort of return on their investment. Quite frankly, if I finish 50th out of 60 shooters I don't feel like I earned a prize. What about the guys who consistently finish high in these matches? I have to wonder how many of them keep the top tier prizes they win compared to how many sell them to get the cash. Nothing wrong with doing that but let's face facts. The top shooters already have their preferred gear whether it be from sponsors or just what they have learned with. The cash helps them with travel expenses, ammo costs, and things such as that.
Cash payouts come directly out of the entry fees. Everyone who shoots matches foots the bill but none more than the match directors and the venues putting on the matches. When cash payouts are implemented it is taken directly from their bottom line. Some of them are doing both types of prizes just for the simple reason of not wanting to over tax the sponsors who we depend on for the big prize tables. To ask a sponsor to donate awesome prizes to the same matches 3 or 4 times a year is just not reasonable. The match directors and venues sacrifice so that we have more matches to shoot. The shooters win both ways. I've read comments on here that the match directors shouldn't be making money. That is rediculous. The time it takes alone is enough to keep most from even attempting to run a match. Not to mention all the physical labor that goes into it.
I like what GAP did with the raffle. Just to have a 1 in 100 or even better chance to win a new GAP rifle is worth the entry fee for the match. $250-$300 with a 10-1 payoff potential and you get to shoot the match for free and win some cash if you do well!!!!!LOL
In closing I think there is not only potential but also a need for both types of prizes. Just remember, if we shooters don't support the companies that support us as much as they possibly can then the cash payout matches will be all that's left!!!
I guess we all shoot matches for different reasons. Some shoot for prizes. Others for the PRS points. Some for the comraderie(sp?). Some for the pure thrill of competition. For me it's more personal satisfaction. It's the only way I know to test my skills against the best shooters out there. Do I want to win? Of course that is the ultimate goal for anyone with a competitive nature. Do I expect to win? Not at all. That doesn't mean I'm gonna quit trying.
Just my opinion but here is how I feel about prize tables and cash payouts. The sponsors of the prize table matches always go above and beyond. Some of the bigger matches have prize tables that are just plain rediculous. Simply not possible without the sponsors. You have to wonder how far these companies can bend before they break. They just can't keep giving and giving without some sort of return on their investment. Quite frankly, if I finish 50th out of 60 shooters I don't feel like I earned a prize. What about the guys who consistently finish high in these matches? I have to wonder how many of them keep the top tier prizes they win compared to how many sell them to get the cash. Nothing wrong with doing that but let's face facts. The top shooters already have their preferred gear whether it be from sponsors or just what they have learned with. The cash helps them with travel expenses, ammo costs, and things such as that.
Cash payouts come directly out of the entry fees. Everyone who shoots matches foots the bill but none more than the match directors and the venues putting on the matches. When cash payouts are implemented it is taken directly from their bottom line. Some of them are doing both types of prizes just for the simple reason of not wanting to over tax the sponsors who we depend on for the big prize tables. To ask a sponsor to donate awesome prizes to the same matches 3 or 4 times a year is just not reasonable. The match directors and venues sacrifice so that we have more matches to shoot. The shooters win both ways. I've read comments on here that the match directors shouldn't be making money. That is rediculous. The time it takes alone is enough to keep most from even attempting to run a match. Not to mention all the physical labor that goes into it.
I like what GAP did with the raffle. Just to have a 1 in 100 or even better chance to win a new GAP rifle is worth the entry fee for the match. $250-$300 with a 10-1 payoff potential and you get to shoot the match for free and win some cash if you do well!!!!!LOL
In closing I think there is not only potential but also a need for both types of prizes. Just remember, if we shooters don't support the companies that support us as much as they possibly can then the cash payout matches will be all that's left!!!
Re: Prize format
Guys, the companies that sponsor these matches are not stupid. They will not go out of business because they sent to much stuff.
I support companies that contribute to prize tables. Period. I try to get others to do so as well.
Companies may have to start choosing which matches to support and how much, just like we do as shooters. Don't take away their ability to help out and support this sport. The business model is obviously working or they wouldn't do it. I'm not saying they only do it for monetary gain, many just feel supporting us is important. Either way, I appreciate it, and I think this setup is working.
Guys, the companies that sponsor these matches are not stupid. They will not go out of business because they sent to much stuff.
I support companies that contribute to prize tables. Period. I try to get others to do so as well.
Companies may have to start choosing which matches to support and how much, just like we do as shooters. Don't take away their ability to help out and support this sport. The business model is obviously working or they wouldn't do it. I'm not saying they only do it for monetary gain, many just feel supporting us is important. Either way, I appreciate it, and I think this setup is working.
Re: Prize format
It looks like Tiger Valley will pass on a PR Match this year. Benjamin was my go to guy for sponsorship and he has gone to greener pastures. I don't have the time or tenacity to do any good "dragging the sack". I think from reading what I have that a prize table is still the way to go.
It appears that Texas will have more then enough matches to keep everyone hopping from location to location. Thanks and good luck shooting. T.J.
It looks like Tiger Valley will pass on a PR Match this year. Benjamin was my go to guy for sponsorship and he has gone to greener pastures. I don't have the time or tenacity to do any good "dragging the sack". I think from reading what I have that a prize table is still the way to go.
It appears that Texas will have more then enough matches to keep everyone hopping from location to location. Thanks and good luck shooting. T.J.
Re: Prize format
Prize tables have gotten out of hand the last few years. Years back a nice trophy and maybe a stock or a knife was top prize.
Now people get pissed if they finish fourth or fifth and dont score a scope or a case of ammo.
Im all about cool stuff on the table, but sponsors can only keep that stuff up for so long, then we're going to be back to trophies. Be fine with me.
Prize tables have gotten out of hand the last few years. Years back a nice trophy and maybe a stock or a knife was top prize.
Now people get pissed if they finish fourth or fifth and dont score a scope or a case of ammo.
Im all about cool stuff on the table, but sponsors can only keep that stuff up for so long, then we're going to be back to trophies. Be fine with me.
Re: Prize format
SniperCJ, I agree with you. The problem *I* think would be people would start expecting the match fees to start dropping in kind then. I think one thing people use the prize tables is to off set those costs. Either via selling off the item they pick up off the table, or buy picking up something they needed so they don't have to buy it down the line.
Honestly I don't care, but then again I'm lucky in job security...etc that I can afford to shoot any match I can get into.
SniperCJ, I agree with you. The problem *I* think would be people would start expecting the match fees to start dropping in kind then. I think one thing people use the prize tables is to off set those costs. Either via selling off the item they pick up off the table, or buy picking up something they needed so they don't have to buy it down the line.
Honestly I don't care, but then again I'm lucky in job security...etc that I can afford to shoot any match I can get into.
Re: Prize format
I'm really old fashioned. And if I competed, I'd do so to test my skill. See where I measure up. Assess areas I need to improve.
But I am not yet a competitor. Until that time, I do enjoy attending matches and being in awe of the prizes. Several shooters have admitted to me that they fund their annual competition expenses via the prizes.
If the market becomes more saturated with competition venues, how can anyone know which is the "reputable" competition to attend? Will it be based on the sponsorship? I would imagine it aught to be based on the level of difficulty and the field of competition. But to draw the top shooters, you got to make it worth their while...and that means prizes.
Personally, I think competitions should be about getting a high score, trophy and bragging rights.
But I ain't gonna lie, when I left a competition with some swag from the vendors for having volunteered as an RO- I was very surprised and deeply grateful for the gesture. I would imagine that is how a less then stellar shooter feels when he's finished at the bottom but still takes home a prize.
I'm really old fashioned. And if I competed, I'd do so to test my skill. See where I measure up. Assess areas I need to improve.
But I am not yet a competitor. Until that time, I do enjoy attending matches and being in awe of the prizes. Several shooters have admitted to me that they fund their annual competition expenses via the prizes.
If the market becomes more saturated with competition venues, how can anyone know which is the "reputable" competition to attend? Will it be based on the sponsorship? I would imagine it aught to be based on the level of difficulty and the field of competition. But to draw the top shooters, you got to make it worth their while...and that means prizes.
Personally, I think competitions should be about getting a high score, trophy and bragging rights.
But I ain't gonna lie, when I left a competition with some swag from the vendors for having volunteered as an RO- I was very surprised and deeply grateful for the gesture. I would imagine that is how a less then stellar shooter feels when he's finished at the bottom but still takes home a prize.
Re: Prize format
I shoot for the free T-shirts.
I shoot for the free T-shirts.
Re: Prize format
Or the free knife ... along with the T Shirt.
Or the free knife ...
Re: Prize format
Nah Frank, that would mean me actually finishing well.....the T-Shirt is a given...
Nah Frank, that would mean me actually finishing well.....the T-Shirt is a given...
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