question for the "7 teeners"

[TOP PREDATOR]

i have a birthday coming up, and thought i may treat myself to a .17hmr.

if i get a .17, it's going to replace my .22 mag as my under deer sized primary hunting rifle, mostly for groundhogs, turkey, coyote, squirrel, etc. since i learned here on the hide that they make a FMJ round for it, it just may be the thing for turkeys.

for those of you shooting 200+ yards, are you finding that you need to use a canted / MOA base to get out there with the optic, or are your .17's flat enough to not need one (my .22 mag is good to 200 without one)?

anyone use the fmj ammo, especially on turkeys? results?

obviously in field conditions, that .17 fmj 20 grains is going to get pushed around more than the .22 mag fmj 40 gr ammo, does anyone have experience with both on turkeys and coyotes in real world conditions?

thanks for any responses, i'm itching to get a .17, just want to see if it's worth ditching my .22 mag for one. as i have my ducks in a row with the .22 mag, i'd hate to make a mistake by selling it to help pay for the .17.

 

[clmayfield]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

I have no experience with the 22 mag. I think you can get away with going to 200 without a canted base. According to JBM, you have about 7.6 MOA of drop to 200 yards with the 17. That is very flat in comparison to a 22 (which is, what, 36 MOA of drop?).

I haven't done any side-by-side comparisons with a 22 mag, but I am thinking that the 17hmr will be more accurate just because the bullets are so much better and designed for higher velocities.

Some people report better accuracy with FMJ's than with V-Maxes. That has not been my experience, but it is worth pointing out. I need to part with my Marlin... I could probably be coaxed into letting it go.

 

[tansinator]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

Carter,

Just to answer "which is what?" We shot out to 200 yards yesterday with 40x and wolf target. 28 moa up for me. I think my partner was up about 29 or so, with a Ruger 10/22. Both from a 50 yrd zero. I can't help you with your 22 mag questions.

Eddie

 

[hilbillee]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

I didn't know, or rather haven't seen any FMJ for the 17. Who makes them? I might have to try some in the Savage 93 Classic I just got.

 

[Longguns]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

T.P. I have a .17 and I like it. It shoots really good. I got rid of my Ruger 77 in a .22 mag and have regreted it ever since. If I were to do it again I would stay with the .22 mag. Any wind at all and the .17 is all over. It just don't like wind. The .22 mag has heavier bullets which I like. I was shooting Speer TNT's and really liked them out of the .22 Mag. My .17 shoots both the 17 gr and the 20 gr XTP very well. If you get one you will like it but you will get pissed off shooting in the wind. Luck to You. I would keep the .22 mag. Just my .02

 

[Longguns]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

Also the .17 is flat enough to shoot 200 yds without a canted base.

 

[TOP PREDATOR]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

the fmjs are made by cci -
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/15824-5.html

http://www.cci-ammunition.com/products/detail.aspx?use=2&loadNo=0055

looks like they have soft point too -
http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=73746

http://www.cci-ammunition.com/products/detail.aspx?use=2&loadNo=0052

VTR - that's why i went with the .22 mag originally, the wind during hunting season spoiling a shot. i could piece together a wind chart for the .17, just as i do for the .22lr and mag., but i think the adjustments would be really extreme even in a 5-7 mph wind.

after seeing some of the groups you guys get in the rf comps, i really wanted to take a go at the hmr. eventually i know i'll get one, but above shooting paper, hunting ranks supreme. i don't want to get hung up on the whole the wind spoiled my day with the hmr.

plus like you, having the heavier heads in the 22mag is nice to have. i took my first turkey with it in the fall a couple years ago on my first try, put it right down at 93 yards with hardly any wasted meat using 40 fmj.

i guess the wind would negate any gains in distance with the .17 against the .22 mag.

thanks for the real world hunting advice guys, every now and then i need a reality check before i reach for my wallet. but i'll still keep my eyes open, and if there's an offer i can't refuse, i'll grab a .17

it's also good to know i don't have to invest in the base when the time comes.

 

[spartan67]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

stick to the 22 mag. Its a hunting round and seems to hit harder than the.17. I have a 22/77 and love it! I get 1-1.5" groups with it at 100yds. I find that plenty accurate for me. These are not 200yd rounds in my opion.

 

[Jayne]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DFOOSKING</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm running a cheap $200 new plastic stock heavy barrel Savage and a $80 Centerpoint from wallyworld.</div></div>

Hey, I have that same rifle! Only I paid $24.99 for my wallyworld scope. It just use hold-over off my 100 yard zero for 200 yard shots and it works fine, no canted base and I'm sure the scope could dial to 200 if I wanted to risk trying to actually dial a $24.99 mil-dot scope.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The hollowpoints on jackrabbits never seemed to open up so I only run the vmax.</div></div>

I'm in CA so I have to use the lead-free ammo for the most part and it never opens up on anything. Somewhere I've got a picture of the 3gr fragment I recovered from a cottontail, looked like the 'jacket' came off the bullet and stuck in the meat. No idea what the construction of the lead-free stuff is like inside so I don't know what the 'jacket' would be around or what it's made of. I just make sure I walk close to the rabbits (20-30 yards) and pop 'em in the head so I don't ruin the meat and don't have to worry about expansion of the bullet.

 

[Longguns]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TOP PREDATOR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">the fmjs are made by cci -
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/15824-5.html

http://www.cci-ammunition.com/products/detail.aspx?use=2&loadNo=0055

looks like they have soft point too -
http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=73746

http://www.cci-ammunition.com/products/detail.aspx?use=2&loadNo=0052

VTR - that's why i went with the .22 mag originally, the wind during hunting season spoiling a shot. i could piece together a wind chart for the .17, just as i do for the .22lr and mag., but i think the adjustments would be really extreme even in a 5-7 mph wind.

after seeing some of the groups you guys get in the rf comps, i really wanted to take a go at the hmr. eventually i know i'll get one, but above shooting paper, hunting ranks supreme. i don't want to get hung up on the whole the wind spoiled my day with the hmr.

plus like you, having the heavier heads in the 22mag is nice to have. i took my first turkey with it in the fall a couple years ago on my first try, put it right down at 93 yards with hardly any wasted meat using 40 fmj.

i guess the wind would negate any gains in distance with the .17 against the .22 mag.

thanks for the real world hunting advice guys, every now and then i need a reality check before i reach for my wallet. but i'll still keep my eyes open, and if there's an offer i can't refuse, i'll grab a .17

it's also good to know i don't have to invest in the base when the time comes.

</div></div>T.P. I think you did the right thing staying with the .22 mag. The .17 really sucks in the wind. I am considering trading mine for the .22 mag or just rebarrel it.

 

[TOP PREDATOR]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

i'll definately get one (eventually), i just needed some advise on hunting use to keep me from, or going full bore, .17 hmr for my hunting needs. i like what i see on paper and on the ballistics of it, but i'd rather go with the more "stable" platform of .22 mag in windier conditions.

i wish savage or marlin or cz or someone would come out with the 5mm mag in a bolt, with a few new offering of ammo. i think that would put the end to the .22 or .17 question, as i think it would bridge the gap between a decent hitting and flatter trajectory rimfire round.

every couple weeks it seems i get a few bucks saved up and get a hankering for a new toy, with the b-day coming up i can justify it more.

thanks for the tips.

 

[shaman]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

I say keep the 22mag, and get a .17hm2, you lose 400 fps and about 60 yards on the hmr, with about 40-50% of the price. There is only v-max, and new leadfree coming out, but they are accurate, and can be used in a semi more reliably than then hmr. They are the perfect squirrel round, and have taken up to coyotes at close range. Really only two manufacturers of ammo, so shoot what you can find, and then buy a few bricks. That way you don't have to worry about the "it's a dying round" propaganda. Been told by several it works for up to badger size varmints, although your results may vary.

 

[KIDGLOCK]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

I had/sold a 77/17 5 years ago . Only had it 1 summer or rat season . It is a JUNK ROUND . Does not have the power a 22Mag does . Hits like a girl after 40 yrds .

Now I'm back with a 77/22 Mag , my 3rd . It hits harder and in MHO , is a better round .

Winchester Supreme shoots the best in my gun and is an explosive round on rats .

 

[David300]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

I have a 77-17 and there is no way I would use it on anything larger than a groundhog.
Mine drops 6-7" at 200 yards with 17g vmax ammo,but I have not tried it in the wind.

 

[silver78]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

I have been considering a 22 mag or a 17hmr. I want something with a bit more power than my 22lr but not all the way to my 223. After reading through this thread, it's clear to me that a 22 mag will work better for what I want to do. For those of you who have owned both calibers, thanks for sharing your experiences.

One thing puzzles me a bit. When I talked to one of the larger local gun dealers in my area, he said the 17hmr rifles outsell the 22 mag rifles by a big margin. If you look at the larger on-line gun dealers, you will find more 17hmr models than 22 mag. Why is the 17hmr selling so much better than the 22 mag?

 

[Searcher]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

I love my .17. I have high end rifles in .22lr and they loose to much steam past 100 yards. My .17 allows me to reliably take ground squirrel out to 150 yards and using some kentucky windage, out to 200 yards. The Vmax bullets turn the squirrels inside out very nicely. I sold my Kimber SVT to fund the build of my second 17 and I am very pleased with it.

My $0.02

 

[Longguns]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: silver78</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have been considering a 22 mag or a 17hmr. I want something with a bit more power than my 22lr but not all the way to my 223. After reading through this thread, it's clear to me that a 22 mag will work better for what I want to do. For those of you who have owned both calibers, thanks for sharing your experiences.

One thing puzzles me a bit. When I talked to one of the larger local gun dealers in my area, he said the 17hmr rifles outsell the 22 mag rifles by a big margin. If you look at the larger on-line gun dealers, you will find more 17hmr models than 22 mag. Why is the 17hmr selling so much better than the 22 mag? </div></div>
Speed. Just like bowhunting. Everyone wants a faster bow for flatter trajectory. Don't always work that way though. Shoot the .17 in the wind and you'll be cussing it. It is an accurate round and expolsive but in wind it just plain ass sucks...

 

[SmallBoreSnipers]

Re: question for the "7 teeners"

All I can say is that I've owned both a .22 mag and the Marlin 917VR .17 I have now. To me, the .17 is far superior in every way for distances 200 yards or less. On a very calm day, I have shot mine out to 300 yards. The wind does make it fall flat on it's face around 200 yards. But up to that point, it's a 200 yard monster (fmj or not). For me, centerfire or rimfire, this is my most favorite rifle I have ever owned. The cost/fun/benefit ratio is just great. As far as which rifle, I love the Marlin 917v, and have also heard nothing but good about the Savage 93. The Marlin will need a Rifle Basix trigger. The factory one is just too heavy. But you can take either one out of the box, slap good glass on it, and be ready to go. Just my $.02.

By the way, here's some good data on .17's...

http://varmintal.com/17hmr.htm