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Ranges leading up to deer season....

S

serevince

Private
Full Member
Minuteman
Oct 20, 2011
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Spokane
I'm sure it's been beaten to death, but it never ceases to lower my faith in the human race than to spend a little time at the range before deer season. This year it's hitting a little closer to home as my new co-worker is prepping for deer season and I want to facepalm myself unconscious daily. I'm trying to be very patient and explain everything I can to include diagrams. I offered some grid targets and advice, but he's sticking with the tried and true "missing the paper plates at 100yds from a rest" technique. I did make some headway in getting him to sight in and shoot a single bullet weight, design and manufacture of ammo rather than a hodgepodge. I thank my lucky stars that I don't work at a range, just for the 30 days a year before deer season. I don't consider myself an expert by any means and I'm still learning. I take my responsibility to make a clean kill very seriously. I shoot all year, to include field positions, and have passed on animals when the shot wasn't right for me . I planned to hunt archery for the first time this fall, and bought a bow last year and practiced a metric ton of feces all summer. From my blind, from the top of my motorhome, from kneeling, etc. before I ever bought a tag.

My new mantra, hold hands in a circle and say it with me...

Please god grant me the strength to help the once a year paper plate shooters I can, and the serenity to ignore all the rest. May their gut shot animals feed the predators and give me bountiful targets this winter.


I'm sure someone can do a better job with the meme comedy, but for some reason I had this stuck in my head.
9a4y54jpg_zps07a917c7.jpg


Headed to the range tomorrow for final prep for a backcountry mule deer/ black bear hunt. Wish me luck!

Cheers

Vince
 
Just watched the same thing happen last Saturday. Two guys and a kid shot about 40-50 rounds through a 30-30 and a 3006 for about 2 hours at 50yds trying to zero both of them. Every now and then I would hear one say, "I got it on the edge of the target, so I think about 10 clicks up and 8 to the right since they are 1/4" clicks." I started to tell them that was at 100, but every time the other guy would say, "My scopes not marked and it doesn't click," so I didn't bother. The kid seemed to be the smartest one, he checked out my walther and asked me about it while I was at the 50. They were still trying to zero after I moved to the 100 lanes and left about the same time I did (I bet they ran out of ammo). There were quite of few once-a-year-zero'ers there last weekend.
 
Guy next to us the other day shot 60 rounds in a lead sled to zero his rifle. Meanwhile i took a scope off my ar, put it on my buddies so he could try the scope on his gun and had it basically re-zero'd after 6 shots.

One of my other buddies is a rezero his rifle every year guy mostly because he can't remember what ammo he shot last year. I helped him last year and told him buy 10 boxes of this ammo(i think it was corlokt) and never fuck with your gun again. I'm guessing he didn't heed my advice since he asked me to go to the range next week but i mysteriously will be busy smashing my balls with a hammer all day that day.
 
Well my sister and brother in laws went out in preparation for deer season. Shot 2 rounds each and left. Wonder why neither have every shot a deer yet.
 
I was at my outdoor range a couple of weeks ago doing load development on my 300 blackout on the pistol range. I have a 1-4x20 Leupold VX-R Patrol with the SPR firedot reticle on my 300BLK and I like to do load development at 50 yeards with that scope. Our rifle range does not have a 50 yard line so they let people use 22's and AR's on the pistol range for closer ranges. There are berms located in different spots and the pistol range and it goes out to 80 yards. I was set up on the 50 yard line and 3 guys walk up and start setting up just to the left of me, three feet away with their AR's to shoot at the 25 yard berm. After the first blast from the first Jack-Wad's AR, I cleared my weapon, got up and went three feet to the left of him and did a mag dump. He got up and went to the far side of the benches and didn't bother me again...
 
rjacobs said:
Guy next to us the other day shot 60 rounds in a lead sled to zero his rifle. Meanwhile i took a scope off my ar, put it on my buddies so he could try the scope on his gun and had it basically re-zero'd after 6 shots.

One of my other buddies is a rezero his rifle every year guy mostly because he can't remember what ammo he shot last year. I helped him last year and told him buy 10 boxes of this ammo(i think it was corlokt) and never fuck with your gun again. I'm guessing he didn't heed my advice since he asked me to go to the range next week but i mysteriously will be busy smashing my balls with a hammer all day that day.
Click to expand...


Lol. I like it! you could also masturbate with a cheese grater. You know it mostly painful but mildly amusing.

I had a friend who would do the same thing. Took years to convince him to get the components to allow me to reload for him.
 
If you need prep to shoot a goddamn giant deer sized target at under 300 yards you really have no reason to be handling a firearm where other people are possibly near by.
 
rpk762 said:
Lol. I like it! you could also masturbate with a cheese grater. You know it mostly painful but mildly amusing.

I had a friend who would do the same thing. Took years to convince him to get the components to allow me to reload for him.
Click to expand...

Thats the thing, my buddy reloads(well he has all the equipment and has loaded at least 2000 rounds of .40), but for some reason wont buy the damn dies to load for his 30-06. I even offered to help him or let him use my equipment if he would buy the dies. He also says he has at least 200 pieces of 30-06 brass, most 30cal bullets are easy to find right now, and I have a pile of Reloder 17 and Reloder 19 is also really easy to find(maybe not THE best powder for 30-06, but has pretty decent reviews). What he really wants is to use his 30-06 to come shoot long range precision with us, but I said not to waste his time since its a sporter barrel. It took me forever to zero his rifle because I was only getting about 1 three shot group off every 15 minute shooting sequence at the range we go to. Anything faster than a shot ever 5 minutes was leading to HORRIBLE vertical stringing. His solution "I bought a Timney trigger", uh, that wont fix your shitty skinny barrel in a crappy stock. I got his gun zero'd last year in about 15 shots(his scope is crap and doesnt have sub-tensions so you cant really just measure, adjust and shoot again) over the course of almost 2 hours. Now for his hunting, that gun will work fine and he gets multiple deer every year with it(he shot one in the hips 2 years ago and had to finish it with a shot from his Glock at close range, thats when he asked me to help him re-zero it).
 
rjacobs said:
Thats the thing, my buddy reloads(well he has all the equipment and has loaded at least 2000 rounds of .40), but for some reason wont buy the damn dies to load for his 30-06. I even offered to help him or let him use my equipment if he would buy the dies. He also says he has at least 200 pieces of 30-06 brass, most 30cal bullets are easy to find right now, and I have a pile of Reloder 17 and Reloder 19 is also really easy to find(maybe not THE best powder for 30-06, but has pretty decent reviews). What he really wants is to use his 30-06 to come shoot long range precision with us, but I said not to waste his time since its a sporter barrel. It took me forever to zero his rifle because I was only getting about 1 three shot group off every 15 minute shooting sequence at the range we go to. Anything faster than a shot ever 5 minutes was leading to HORRIBLE vertical stringing. His solution "I bought a Timney trigger", uh, that wont fix your shitty skinny barrel in a crappy stock. I got his gun zero'd last year in about 15 shots(his scope is crap and doesnt have sub-tensions so you cant really just measure, adjust and shoot again) over the course of almost 2 hours. Now for his hunting, that gun will work fine and he gets multiple deer every year with it(he shot one in the hips 2 years ago and had to finish it with a shot from his Glock at close range, thats when he asked me to help him re-zero it).
Click to expand...
Your buddy bought a lemon. I've got a sporter contuor rem 700 30-06 that i use as my hunting rig that'll shoot a little over moa (all day long if I do my part lol) out to 300 yards. Granted, I bought it new In the mid-nineties back when Remington had a QC department.Groups will open up a little but I get no vertical stringing.

If he's a good buddy, buy him a set of dies for his birthday.

Matt
 
-=boone=- said:
Or you could have to job of sighting in everyone's rifle for them. Been there done that.
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And this is why I have earned the rank of "recoil sponge".

Got a 300 WM needs sighting in?
Give it to Mikee.

Got a 338 WSM you need sighted in? Don't laugh, there is such a beast,
Give it to Mikee.

Got a 375 H&H needs sighting in?
Give it to Mikee.

Got anything that begins with a 4 or 5, needs sighting in?
Give it to Mikee.

Got to the ranch one afternoon, looking for a quiet alone weekend. Tim (ranch owner and lessor, also does a lot of stuff for training and manufactors), asks me if I can do him a favor. SURE, of course Tim!.

" buddy, OK! We got this pile of rifles, needs jury testing. Five, five round groups, per rifle, three kinds of ammo." Thanks so much!

Thought - OK cool, lots of shooting, there were nine rifles, and a PALLET of ammo. Only four scopes....... ah.... so sighting in also, and finding out favorite of the scopes was dicked up, and had to work with just three scopes.

Worked my ass off! but did get it done.
 
You might or might not be shocked by the number of guys I have seen buy a license and a box of bullets and a new scope. Then ask to have the scope mounted on their rifle and bore sighted. All this after 8pm the night before rifle season opens. I asked several when then planned on hunting they all responded "In the Morning." I told them that bore sighting is not the same as zeroing. "AH, close enough" was the usual response. I don't even ask any more. I do ask where they will be hunting so I can warn others to stay clear of that area.
 
My new AI is coming in 2 days and i'll be heading to the range to sling some lead. I'm really dreading all the once a year members that show up this time of year. Last year there was this old timer with a sled sighting in his 30.06 that would call for a cold range every other fucking minute so he could walk out to the 100yd line to see where he hit........on his paper plate! everyone else was starting to get pissed, I finally offered to spot his shots with my scope for him. He was in aw over the fact that I could see his bullet holes with my rifle scope. Guy was shooting with a fucking Tasco on his rifle.
 
I worked at a range one weekend a couple years ago the weekend before opening rifle.

It is very scary. Saw a guy put 40 rounds if 30-06 downrange before giving up.

Another guy ran through 50 or 60 rounds of 300 win at 100 yards and was flinching so bad he'd miss te 2'x2' paper targe at 100.

Fun stuff.
 
I really don't get it. I do believe we all have the right to have a gun. My first time ever shooting a rifle was to zero it in. it was a 7 mm wsm. It did have a kick. (for me at least)
I had the scope pretty close and it took 3 shots to zero.
I believe that's where you begin...
I guess either people "believe" it to be part of "American" culture and the need to go out and attempt to shoot a deer or they get "pressured" into it by friends or family.
I like to pretend that people just don't "get it." unless they are not "into it."
 
No joke, it happened last year. Guy shows up, stands up the target at 100 yards, and x rings the bullseye while shooting free handed. Makes the comment "good enough" and leaves. I'm just sitting there wondering why I paid what I did for my custom rifle, I shoulda just got an 1894 Winchester and been happy.
 
coach4christ said:
No joke, it happened last year. Guy shows up, stands up the target at 100 yards, and x rings the bullseye while shooting free handed. Makes the comment "good enough" and leaves. I'm just sitting there wondering why I paid what I did for my custom rifle, I shoulda just got an 1894 Winchester and been happy. ��
Click to expand...

Every once in a while, even a blind squirrel finds a nut.
 
I find it amazing that nobody said anything about the atrociously dangerous gunhandling and line etiquette that you see. I tend to stay away from the range for two to three weeks prior to rifle season. It just isn't worth it to wind up with a toe tag because some clan with a single eyebrow can't do the 180 degree math.
 
Veer_G said:
I find it amazing that nobody said anything about the atrociously dangerous gunhandling and line etiquette that you see. I tend to stay away from the range for two to three weeks prior to rifle season. It just isn't worth it to wind up with a toe tag because some clan with a single eyebrow can't do the 180 degree math.
Click to expand...

A further note on that:

Years ago at a fishing and hunting expo I had talked to a guy who was from Canada selling his deal for bear hunting. I noticed in all the pictures he had two arms.
In real life, he had one. The pictures looked fairly recent.

Years later I had seen him at another expo and he was peddling his new business: fishing.

Not only we need to be careful of our guns, but the animals we dare to hunt. :eek:
 
I was reading about the shooting test that is part of the British 'Deer Stalking Certificate Level 1' (this is not, as yet, a mandatory qualification, but many landowners will not lease their land to hunters who don't have it).

4. Shooting. This has 2 parts. First, the candidate must put 3 shots inside a 4 inch circle on a zero target from 100 yards. Three attempts at this are allowed in any one day. When that has been achieved, the candidate can then have 3 attempts (in any one day) to put:
(a) 2 shots into the killing area of a deer target from 100 yards (in any position using normal stalking aids such as rucksack or bipod);
(b) 2 shots into the killing area of a deer target from 70 yards sitting or kneeling (again normal aids such as bipod or sticks may be used);
(c) 2 shots into the killing area of a deer target from 40 yards standing (sticks may be used).
Click to expand...

DMQ - Assessment for DSC1

Sounds like a test like this would keep the ranges busy for months before the season.
 
I hunt within 15 miles of my home. No range within miles, everybody shoots in the back yard or a friend or Kin's back 40. Opening morning it'll sound like a war zone, hearing shots close and far in a full 360, mostly singles with an occasional 2-3 shot string. About 9:30-10:00 you start hearing continuous Bang-----Bang------Bang, often 20+ rounds from all over. Folks who missed that one shot earlier, back on the tailgate checking zero for the first time since they last shot at a deer.

Bob
 
tt123 said:
I was reading about the shooting test that is part of the British 'Deer Stalking Certificate Level 1' (this is not, as yet, a mandatory qualification, but many landowners will not lease their land to hunters who don't have it).

4. Shooting. This has 2 parts. First, the candidate must put 3 shots inside a 4 inch circle on a zero target from 100 yards. Three attempts at this are allowed in any one day. When that has been achieved, the candidate can then have 3 attempts (in any one day) to put:
(a) 2 shots into the killing area of a deer target from 100 yards (in any position using normal stalking aids such as rucksack or bipod);
(b) 2 shots into the killing area of a deer target from 70 yards sitting or kneeling (again normal aids such as bipod or sticks may be used);
(c) 2 shots into the killing area of a deer target from 40 yards standing (sticks may be used).
Click to expand...

DMQ - Assessment for DSC1

Sounds like a test like this would keep the ranges busy for months before the season.
Click to expand...

Pretty easy test, and I bet at least 50% of all US hunters would fail it.
 
I enjoy the deer hunters at the range... it's a great time to show off some positional skills and drop the importance of "training how you hunt" as well as "year long practice" with your hunting equipment in there lap. But, I am not at a public range so most of the folks are of a little higher caliber and welcome little tips and tricks... and its awesome to watch them improve, for those so motivated.
 
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I no longer bother trying to help anyone improve with a handgun or rifle.

The few that have actually welcomed any help end up not doing the work, and it is work, to really be proficient.

IDPA is about a simple and easy to enter pistol competition as there ever has been. I cannot get anyone I know who owns handguns motivated enough to shoot it on a regular basis. I'm not even going to bother trying to expose them to USPSA.......

I once engaged a couple of guys at work during lunch re long range rifle. One thought he was shit hot and ready to go to Thunder Valley with me when I asked a simple question: do you know your dope out to 1000 yards? He didn't know what dope meant so I gave him the benefit of the dobt and said " your drop and windage corrections". Still no idea of what I was talking about.

The overwhelming majority of American gun owners positively suck ass when it comes to any kind of measurable marksmanship.
 
This year, the past three weeks have each included several hours at the range, getting my hunting rifles zeroed one per day for 200yd, and practicing shots starting from a standing position, back to the target.

So far, my M70 .30-'06, my scoped Mosin-Nagant 91/30, and my Mossberg MVP 5.56 Predator have each been sighted in with commercial hunting ammo. The MVP is set up to use Federal Fusion 62gr MSR Deer Loads, but initial attempts will exclude larger deer. My son-in-Law's scoped Mosin-Nagant 91/30 and Ruger 77 MKI .30-'06 are also confirmed in the same manner, buy him, alongside me.

Our .50 cal Muzzleloaders are also confirmed, his is a modern scoped rifle, mine is a traditional sidelock percussion rifle. Crossbow has just been enabled this year, and we are both considering it.

I have tried to avoid the near-season rush.

Greg
 
AMEN to the OP!

We shoot year round, and at distances that I would not shoot at game, making shots of 400-700 yards seem like a chip shot.

I start avoiding the public range at the beginning of October, because I just picture all the gut shot game lying in the mountains from the yahoos who can't hit an 8" target at 100 yards, but won't hesitate to take a shot at a game animal at unknown distances by just holding over it's back. Although it does provide a few laughs from time to time.

I went out last weekend and tried several "cold bore" shots at distance. I waited about 30-40 minutes between each shot (as "cold bore" as I could get), and had 1st round good center hits at 565, 646, 717, 818, and 989 with my .25-06 Ackley. Then put 3 in a sub 2" group at 363 yards. Had a great time while spotting for others in between too. In 8 shots, I have confirmed dope...yet again....and fell I am ready for deer season. Still going shooting before deer opener on Oct. 24th though.
 
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In the valley where I live, I'm kind of the go-to guy for sighting in. The people that come over want to do it right and take instruction well. Two people have been over in the last week both with rifles that we sighted in last year. Both guys had taken a header hunting last year and wanted to confirm zeros. One had also switched ammo and remembered that I told him he had resight with an ammo change. One guy was shooting an 30-06 at under 8#s and the other a 7mmm Rem. Mag. at a little over 8#s. We started at 25yds. with the 06 and at 50yds. with the 7mm. For both guys it went the same. First two rounds on top of each other, scope adjustment, next two close and confirm the adjustment. Back to 100yds, and three rounds to confirm POI, adjust to zero scope and then three round to confirm zero but now things are starting to fall apart. The 7mm is close enough but in no way comparable to his earlier shooting. I told him to keep his shots to 200yds. max. The 06 was much worse. Bad enough that I asked the guy if he wanted me to finish up. The answer was yes and the next two rounds were under an inch, scope was adjusted and its impacting on the one inch aiming dot. The point is not that they can't shoot. The point is that they can shoot but that after 7-10 rounds of good size cartridges in sporter weight rifles they start to flinch. A guy that isn't diligent about his shooting has no chance after 5-15 fifteen rounds. He can shoot one box, two boxes or more and all that will happen is his performance will get worse.
 
The funniest Fudd I've ever seen at the range was a guy who made a life-sized cardboard cutout of a deer. After setting it up at fifty yards he walked back to the benches wearing a smirk on his face as if he had hit upon something really clever and had the inside track on training techniques. He peppered the target with about twenty gut shots and no doubt left very satisfied.
 
it could be worse... i went yote hunting with a guy, had a 22-250 and i asked what he typically zeroed at he said 200 yards. I said nice he said yea i zeroed it last night in my backyard. Ranged a house pulled the bolt and bore sighted it at 200..... I was somewhat dumbfounded at the thought.....
 
07yzryder said:
it could be worse... i went yote hunting with a guy, had a 22-250 and i asked what he typically zeroed at he said 200 yards. I said nice he said yea i zeroed it last night in my backyard. Ranged a house pulled the bolt and bore sighted it at 200..... I was somewhat dumbfounded at the thought.....
Click to expand...
Wait, that's not how you do it? I guess it's back to the drawing board for me.
 
All you can do is help those that you think need and deserve it (old timers having trouble, dads with kids failing to find a mark on target and planning on said kid hunting with that rifle, young adults trying to learn that actually listen for 3 good examples). The rest ignore, or if safety issues make that hair on the back of your neck stand out, its time to go somewhere else, quickly.
 
The range I used to be a member of was like a Fudd haven and I probably have enough stories to fill up a book on what not to do at a range. I watched one guy set up his lever action on the 100 yard bench and use a roll of paper towels and a tool box from the back of his truck as a front rest. It was an awesome sight to behold, much like watching the guy with his rifle strapped into shooting vise taking over an hour to zero and still wasn't done when I left.
 
Trigger Monkey said:
The range I used to be a member of was like a Fudd haven and I probably have enough stories to fill up a book on what not to do at a range. I watched one guy set up his lever action on the 100 yard bench and use a roll of paper towels and a tool box from the back of his truck as a front rest. It was an awesome sight to behold, much like watching the guy with his rifle strapped into shooting vise taking over an hour to zero and still wasn't done when I left.
Click to expand...
Ohhhh no . Whats even better than that is when they have a giant 3 in strap and strap the gun AND the lead sled to the bench. Now that is a sight to behold !!!!
 
Woodlanddude said:
All you can do is help those that you think need and deserve it (old timers having trouble, dads with kids failing to find a mark on target and planning on said kid hunting with that rifle, young adults trying to learn that actually listen for 3 good examples).
Click to expand...

No thanks. I've tried that in the past but once bitten, twice shy. They can wallow in their mediocrity and ignorance and I will mind my own business.

With a like minded group of shooters in a private venue (TVP for instance), hell yeah. I will both give and accept help. Public places? Fuck that.
 
Tough time of the year for hunters and shooters who do truly, do it properly.

Watched a guy last year shooting his deer rifle over a car, jack stand. Chewed up the forend on the steel , didn't seem to care.

Or the guy shooting a .300 Rem Ultra Mag off a lead sled, and STILL flinching. Flinching like he just got bitten by a snake.

I feel sorry for the game animals.
 
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