Redding 308 Bushing die problems

[Peter Laurvick]

Hey there.

Having some issues with my Redding competition Neck Die Set. This is my first set of bushing dies and were bought used.

I am getting a flare at the mouth of the case when sizing about 0.003” wider than the rest of the neck (on average).

My setup:
-Hornady Lock n Load AP Progressive.
-Redding Competition Bushing Neck 3-Die Set
-Lee universal decapping die.

Step1:
Stage 1, universal decapping
Stage 2, redding Body Sizing Die.
Stage 3, Redding Bushing Neck sizing die. Bushing size .337”

Step 2: Frankfort case prep station.
-Trim to 2.080”
-Chamfer
-Deburr
-Primer Pocket brush
-Neck Brush

Notes:
-During Body sizing/Should bump, the overall case length grows by an average of 0.001”. No cases get over the max case length of 2.0150” before or after this step.
-After neck sizing, the case overall length grows by an average of 0.005” and made all of the test batch over the max case length of 2.0150”
-measured previously off some loaded ammo I measured 0.338” outside neck diameter so determined to go with the .337 Bushing. Now I’m considering it to be pretty small because my inside diameter of the neck after Bushing neck sizing is 0.3025”, leaving 0.055” Neck tension which seems awful heavy.
-I suspected with the case getting over max length when neck sizing that I might have to trim between body sizing and neck sizing. Didn’t make any difference, the case measured exactly the same as the rest with the same flare.

-What else should I do or fix to stop flaring the end of the case mouth out like this?

-Should I use a different Bushing size?

-Any other advice would be great from your lessons learned.

 

[918v]

Normal. That’s the way brass extrudes through a bushing.

 

[FLIGHT762]

So, have you seated any bullets yet to see if they are hard to seat or if they chamber in your rifle, or is this your OCD measuring, thinking there's an issue before there is an issue? What brass are you using?

I've measured a loaded round ( 308 Federal GMM) @ .338" and use a .337" bushing. Works perfectly. Not too much neck tension. I have bushings in .337", .335", .333", .331" and .329" so I can use nearly any MFG. brass out there.

 

[Peter Laurvick]

So, have you seated any bullets yet to see if they are hard to seat or if they chamber in your rifle, or is this your OCD measuring, thinking there's an issue before there is an issue?

My OCD measurement for sure. I’ve had a lot of problems loading .308 so with these new dies and brass I just don’t want to mess anything up. Everything I’ve read or seen says 0.002” Neck tension so this 0.0055” seems a lot as is. I plan on trying to load Ammo tonight with some cheaper bullets and seeing how it works and going from there.

 

[FLIGHT762]

Just load a few dummy rounds (no primer or powder) and cycle them through the rifle.

 

[Peter Laurvick]

Just load a few dummy rounds (no primer or powder) and cycle them through the rifle.

Few hours and I’ll load a few. I wasn’t really worried about them loading, just being smooth or affecting accuracy. I use the gun for almost exclusively PRS shooting.

 

[Praeger]

Have you annealed the brass? Mouth of brass could be work hardened a bit more than the neck and is springing back more resulting in the slight "bell".

 

[Peter Laurvick]

Have you annealed the brass? Mouth of brass could be work hardened a bit more than the neck and is springing back more resulting in the slight "bell".

No I haven’t. It’s only once fired brass I’m working with right now so I doubt it’s already work hardened.

I did load 25 rounds for testing tomorrow. Seems ok so far but I do think there may be more Neck tension than I need

 

[Anthonyc]

As mentioned above, anneal your brass and definitely use a bigger busing so your neck tension isn’t as tight. .0055 can cause issues and your cases will definably get longer than usually expected since you’re squeezing the neck that much.

 

[Lunchbox27]

Always happened to my 308 when using a bushing. Never caused a single issue. I called Redding and spoke to a tech about it. They had never seen it before. He gave me some recommendations, but I had already tried them all. Again, never saw any issues with this.

 

[918v]

I called Redding and spoke to a tech about it. They had never seen it before.

Liars. They have seen it before.

 

[Peter Laurvick]

They actually mention it when using a Bushing that squeezes in 0.010-0.008” such as “lose chambers”.

Side note: just took some loads to the range today for testing and everything seems great. The loaded ammo doesn’t have the flare anymore. I do think it may have more Neck tension that I need but I did shoot a few sub MOA groups. Without measuring with my calipers yet I did put a 5 round group I can cover completely with a quarter so they shoot fine. Think I’ll just run with it for a while and maybe get a bigger bushing down the road.

 

[VonReich]

So I'm running into this issue with a 300WM using a FLS non-bushing type. I've had it for about 3 firings, I have annealed the last two times and still come across this. I've ran it through a neck sizer to see if I could get rid of it, that didn't work. The FLS didn't work. I believe I may be able to adjust the giraud trimmer slightly and remove the flare some but I'd really like to see if there's a way at stopping the issue rather than treating it. The ES/SDs I've seen were a little higher than I'd like to see and the carbon buildup on the neck varies with the prominence of that flare. I've got to imagine it has some effect on what's being chrono'd. Any insight would be greatly appreciated!

I do have a carbide expander mandrel en route, I was planning to run that prior to a FLS in order to rule out issues with the button.

 

[Peter Laurvick]

So from what I’ve learned the last several hundred .308 Win rounds with multiple firings is I just use the Sinclair Carbide Expanded Mandrel last and that largely fixes everything. I still get the slightest of flares on the external measurement but when I seat the bullet (with exactly 0.001” Neck Tension) it makes it even up and I get exactly what I should get. Out of my .308 Win I’m now getting ES numbers of 10 so outstanding in my book. I have changed my method for 300 Win Mag as well to take advantage of this and with a regular die I honestly just take the sizing ball out entirely or just run it through the expander mandrel again because pretty much every expander ball is going to be tighter (more neck tension) than 0.001” neck tension. Hope this helps

 

[plinkin]

@Peter Laurvick

What is you fired outside neck diameter?

 

[VonReich]

Thanks for sharing Peter,

I'll have the Sinclair expander die in tomorrow. I'm going to grab a Redding type-S FLS bushing die this afternoon as well and give it a go. Most all of the powders I use for the 300 are out of stock everywhere so I have time to fire these a couple times and re-establish a baseline. I've been told to remove the ball from my sizer once before so I think I'll give it a shot and see how it works out. Hope I can report back with good news.

 

[Peter Laurvick]

@Peter Laurvick

What is you fired outside neck diameter?

Geez, I’d have to dig that out of my book. I know it’ll be different depending on type of brass and individual chamber though so my measurement won’t help a ton. But I’ll try and remember to dig it out for you.

 

[plinkin]

Geez, I’d have to dig that out of my book. I know it’ll be different depending on type of brass and individual chamber though so my measurement won’t help a ton. But I’ll try and remember to dig it out for you.

Ok just curious if it could've been connected.

 

[VonReich]

So I just wanted to circle back...

I ditched the Forster FLS for a Redding Bushing FLS.

I fed it through the bushing die, once finished I ran it over the expander and then adjusted the Giraud trimmer slightly to remove that flare, the deburr and chamfer came out perfect.