Ok maybe someone here can help me out with this issue i have i can hit 500 yards all day long with factory federal gold match but when i reload to the same spec im either all over the place other than the target or i have no idea were there going its like they are vaporizing in air. .308 imr 4895 started at 41 gr and i just put 44 gr in there becuase the 41 gr was comming up short keep in mind i worked up to this load. Help becuase im about ready to say the hell with it and stick to factory ammo for my long range stuff.
Advanced Marksmanship reloading for 500 yards
- Thread starter lukeb
- Start date
Re: reloading for 500 yards
What are the complete specs on your reloads? (i.e. C.O.L./bullet manufacture and weight/ are you full length or neck sizing/ how are you prepping your brass/ primer/ etc.) Might want to try this "recipe"
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...820#Post3032820
(compliments of .300 AT&T)
What are the complete specs on your reloads? (i.e. C.O.L./bullet manufacture and weight/ are you full length or neck sizing/ how are you prepping your brass/ primer/ etc.) Might want to try this "recipe"
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...820#Post3032820
(compliments of .300 AT&T)
Re: reloading for 500 yards
What increments were you working up in? If you were doing too big of increments you could have missed your accuracy nodes.
What increments were you working up in? If you were doing too big of increments you could have missed your accuracy nodes.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
Sorry man, as long as the nut behind the trigger is tight- I'm kinda at a loss. Should have found something that would have worked as a starting point for L/D. Other than to play around with different powders/COAL/bullets/etc.
Just a thought- your crown didn't happen to get damaged did it?
Sorry man, as long as the nut behind the trigger is tight- I'm kinda at a loss. Should have found something that would have worked as a starting point for L/D. Other than to play around with different powders/COAL/bullets/etc.
Just a thought- your crown didn't happen to get damaged did it?
Re: reloading for 500 yards
nope crown is good.
Well i just dissembled a factory round and took the powder and put in one of my cases and put one of my bullets on it.
Also took one of my bullets and put it on a factory casing with the factory powder ill try it tomorrow since its dark out now.
nope crown is good.
Well i just dissembled a factory round and took the powder and put in one of my cases and put one of my bullets on it.
Also took one of my bullets and put it on a factory casing with the factory powder ill try it tomorrow since its dark out now.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
I am no expert. I have shot .308 some LR. 168's 155's to 400-1100 yds.
are you testing your reloads at 100 yds to get an idea of accuracy?
are you a beginner or advanced reloader? Are you F/L bushing sizing, how are you seating bullets? Using FGM brass from good 500 yards shots? They are not vaporizing. Do you have a spotter, can you spot your hits yourself? cleaning brass, reaming primer pockets, chamfering necks? all the "fun" stuff? I'd say move in closer, and see what ya got. once you figure it out, it will be worth it, and bet you can shoot better groups than factory-fwiw, I use RL-15 45.0 g 168 smk's at 2.805" - i know that may not help, but it's a start.
I am no expert. I have shot .308 some LR. 168's 155's to 400-1100 yds.
are you testing your reloads at 100 yds to get an idea of accuracy?
are you a beginner or advanced reloader? Are you F/L bushing sizing, how are you seating bullets? Using FGM brass from good 500 yards shots? They are not vaporizing. Do you have a spotter, can you spot your hits yourself? cleaning brass, reaming primer pockets, chamfering necks? all the "fun" stuff? I'd say move in closer, and see what ya got. once you figure it out, it will be worth it, and bet you can shoot better groups than factory-fwiw, I use RL-15 45.0 g 168 smk's at 2.805" - i know that may not help, but it's a start.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
ill move in to 300 yards tomarrow.
im kinda new to reloading but been shooting a long time, normally if im not hitting the same hole at 100 yards im not happy.
my cases are done up with all the goodies as in i do everything to them.
f/l length sizing
i can see my dust around the gong at 500 yds
its just weird becuase ill zero perfect at 100 yds and i get nothing at 500.
ill move in to 300 yards tomarrow.
im kinda new to reloading but been shooting a long time, normally if im not hitting the same hole at 100 yards im not happy.
my cases are done up with all the goodies as in i do everything to them.
f/l length sizing
i can see my dust around the gong at 500 yds
its just weird becuase ill zero perfect at 100 yds and i get nothing at 500.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
grab a spotter buddy, may take a beer or two to convince. I usually can shoot well at my 400 yd "range" with naked 155's scenars, bought 155 molys by mistake and couldn't hit s**t, something had changed, and like you saw debris all around gong-shooting alone. I put up 3X3' paper and saw I was 24"
low. gong is 6x6" - wasted a lot of nice ammo. walked em right up there on paper.
grab a spotter buddy, may take a beer or two to convince. I usually can shoot well at my 400 yd "range" with naked 155's scenars, bought 155 molys by mistake and couldn't hit s**t, something had changed, and like you saw debris all around gong-shooting alone. I put up 3X3' paper and saw I was 24"
low. gong is 6x6" - wasted a lot of nice ammo. walked em right up there on paper.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
I don't know a lot, but first .308 loads - I shot horrible groups with 42.0g RL-15 and tiny little holes with 45.0g...fwiw.
Also, different brass has different neck thicknesses, and that makes for different tension, which changes pressure, etc. For instance ww brass is thinner than Lapua, etc. - makes an pressure + accuracy difference. end of sermon.
I don't know a lot, but first .308 loads - I shot horrible groups with 42.0g RL-15 and tiny little holes with 45.0g...fwiw.
Also, different brass has different neck thicknesses, and that makes for different tension, which changes pressure, etc. For instance ww brass is thinner than Lapua, etc. - makes an pressure + accuracy difference. end of sermon.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
well i pulled them apart and put 44 grs since it was giving me really good results earlier at 100 yds owell if this dosent work tomorrow im not sure were to go from there. maybe ill have to get a chrony and match the speed up with the factory rounds i was using and maybe itl give me better results.
well i pulled them apart and put 44 grs since it was giving me really good results earlier at 100 yds owell if this dosent work tomorrow im not sure were to go from there. maybe ill have to get a chrony and match the speed up with the factory rounds i was using and maybe itl give me better results.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1713419&gonew=1#UNREAD
Might try this for working up your load, the "ladder test" seems to be the best method for me...and lots of others. Good luck.
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1713419&gonew=1#UNREAD
Might try this for working up your load, the "ladder test" seems to be the best method for me...and lots of others. Good luck.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
ok so i got on target seems i was about 20 inches high ?
i ran everything through bullet flight and something is wrong not sure what it is but for 500 yards it was telling me that it was like 13 moa WAY HIGH. i brought it down to 8 moa and put in 3000 feet a sec and gong . What gives? seems as if everything is lining up when i push the speed up on the program but the bullet cant be going that fast even the factory ammo i was using said that it was producing 2600. someone please help me out because i have no idea whats going on and ive been shooting for a long time. Maybe Ive got something punched in wrong on the program ?
ok so i got on target seems i was about 20 inches high ?
i ran everything through bullet flight and something is wrong not sure what it is but for 500 yards it was telling me that it was like 13 moa WAY HIGH. i brought it down to 8 moa and put in 3000 feet a sec and gong . What gives? seems as if everything is lining up when i push the speed up on the program but the bullet cant be going that fast even the factory ammo i was using said that it was producing 2600. someone please help me out because i have no idea whats going on and ive been shooting for a long time. Maybe Ive got something punched in wrong on the program ?
Re: reloading for 500 yards
I think your about to hurt yourself because you Don't seem to know what the hell your doing. Get a reloading book and a chrono stat
I think your about to hurt yourself because you Don't seem to know what the hell your doing. Get a reloading book and a chrono stat
Re: reloading for 500 yards
rem5rmil, Experts may chime in... They will want to know more :
bullet / manufacturer/ weight
powder & grains
OAL+ distance to lands, etc.
Primer
case manf'r.
sizing info
twist
jump or jammed or
In looking over the suggestions for you, the "ladder" post info seems really useful.
For what it's worth, SHOT show is on and the lucky ones ( some of whom may have reload suggestions) are in NV.
rem5rmil, Experts may chime in... They will want to know more :
bullet / manufacturer/ weight
powder & grains
OAL+ distance to lands, etc.
Primer
case manf'r.
sizing info
twist
jump or jammed or
In looking over the suggestions for you, the "ladder" post info seems really useful.
For what it's worth, SHOT show is on and the lucky ones ( some of whom may have reload suggestions) are in NV.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
rem5,
The load that you have posted is a reproduction of M-852 which depending on your stick should net about 2600 fps. FGMM is slightly faster than that in the 168 configuration but via a different powder.
You should not be seeing as much vertical as you are even at 500. Id be interested to see FGMM and your handloads on the same target at 100 yards.
Cheers,
Doc
rem5,
The load that you have posted is a reproduction of M-852 which depending on your stick should net about 2600 fps. FGMM is slightly faster than that in the 168 configuration but via a different powder.
You should not be seeing as much vertical as you are even at 500. Id be interested to see FGMM and your handloads on the same target at 100 yards.
Cheers,
Doc
Re: reloading for 500 yards
Suggest a purchase. There is more in this book than is needed for most. Really helpful, tho. Sorry, saw that you posted your reload info earlier.
http://www.zediker.com/books/handloading/hlmain.html
Suggest a purchase. There is more in this book than is needed for most. Really helpful, tho. Sorry, saw that you posted your reload info earlier.
http://www.zediker.com/books/handloading/hlmain.html
Re: reloading for 500 yards
That is correct it is a copy.
the factory ammo im using is pretty close to the hand loads. My hand loads at 100 yards are producing same hole shot after shot.
I agree with your 2600 fps ill find out tomorrow for sure.
I have a buddy that has been reloading for a very long time and he cant figure it out in fact he made the same loads up for me at his house with his equipment. Same results. He also thinks that there is something not set up right with the program but not sure what it could be.
Forgot to mention my barrel is a 1/12
That is correct it is a copy.
the factory ammo im using is pretty close to the hand loads. My hand loads at 100 yards are producing same hole shot after shot.
I agree with your 2600 fps ill find out tomorrow for sure.
I have a buddy that has been reloading for a very long time and he cant figure it out in fact he made the same loads up for me at his house with his equipment. Same results. He also thinks that there is something not set up right with the program but not sure what it could be.
Forgot to mention my barrel is a 1/12
Re: reloading for 500 yards
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rem5rmil</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Then what am i doing?
i did order a chrono today should be here tomorrow.
LC brass
coal 2.81
42 gr imr 4895
brass shaved to 2.005
What am i missing ?
And i do have a reloading book
</div></div>
Add a note book to the list. Start making notes on all your loads, conditions at the time of shot testing, and results. When shooting out beyond 100 yards record the MOA correction for each range. While the ballistic programs can be very accurate they should not be solely relied on. There is a misconception that you buy a gun, build some loads, go out range a target, plug some numbers into a ballistic program and put rounds on target. It's not that easy.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rem5rmil</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Then what am i doing?
i did order a chrono today should be here tomorrow.
LC brass
coal 2.81
42 gr imr 4895
brass shaved to 2.005
What am i missing ?
And i do have a reloading book
</div></div>
Add a note book to the list. Start making notes on all your loads, conditions at the time of shot testing, and results. When shooting out beyond 100 yards record the MOA correction for each range. While the ballistic programs can be very accurate they should not be solely relied on. There is a misconception that you buy a gun, build some loads, go out range a target, plug some numbers into a ballistic program and put rounds on target. It's not that easy.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
I understand that and that isent what i was implying im sorry if thats the way it came out. This isent my first rodeo per say.
But the note book is a good idea of which i have been doing with pictures even.
But maybe my math is wrong but how am i getting 8 MOA on my scope for 500 yards ? Keep in mind im shooting a 18 inch gong ar500 steel
I think i may have an idea but will have to test it out.
I understand that and that isent what i was implying im sorry if thats the way it came out. This isent my first rodeo per say.
But the note book is a good idea of which i have been doing with pictures even.
But maybe my math is wrong but how am i getting 8 MOA on my scope for 500 yards ? Keep in mind im shooting a 18 inch gong ar500 steel
I think i may have an idea but will have to test it out.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rem5rmil</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok ive got an idea maybe there isent anything wrong with my loads maybe its my scope. Ill get one of my other .308's tomorrow and see what happens. </div></div>
Have you shot to 500 with factory?
Are your reloads hitting higher or lower than factory AT 100 yds?
Might be the scope.
If you are hitting lower at 100 yards w/ your reloads you are shooting FASTER than factory. Hence dialing on factory dope will net a higher impact at 500. That being said 8 MOA is a bunch.
Cheers,
Doc
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rem5rmil</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok ive got an idea maybe there isent anything wrong with my loads maybe its my scope. Ill get one of my other .308's tomorrow and see what happens. </div></div>
Have you shot to 500 with factory?
Are your reloads hitting higher or lower than factory AT 100 yds?
Might be the scope.
If you are hitting lower at 100 yards w/ your reloads you are shooting FASTER than factory. Hence dialing on factory dope will net a higher impact at 500. That being said 8 MOA is a bunch.
Cheers,
Doc
Re: reloading for 500 yards
You'll need about 12 3/4 MOA of up to get to 500 with that load.
If that was your ES you have some very good loading techniques.
Cheers,
Doc
You'll need about 12 3/4 MOA of up to get to 500 with that load.
If that was your ES you have some very good loading techniques.
Cheers,
Doc
Re: reloading for 500 yards
either work your way out in 100yrd increments, or shoot at larger targets - 4x8 sheet plywood should do.
if you were hitting with factory rds to 500 I'd say it's not the scope, but I'd still check to see if everything is tight on the rifle.
I'm not sure how well you shoot but perhaps it's you? 500 is not that far though.
either work your way out in 100yrd increments, or shoot at larger targets - 4x8 sheet plywood should do.
if you were hitting with factory rds to 500 I'd say it's not the scope, but I'd still check to see if everything is tight on the rifle.
I'm not sure how well you shoot but perhaps it's you? 500 is not that far though.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
Chronograph your load and compare/contrast ES/SD to factory load. Unless you are sorting brass by lot and loadings, as well as massaging brass, merely using the same loading and components of factory ammo will not produce results as good as factory.
Chronograph your load and compare/contrast ES/SD to factory load. Unless you are sorting brass by lot and loadings, as well as massaging brass, merely using the same loading and components of factory ammo will not produce results as good as factory.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
Sorry guys been real busy but I did get out there and worked it in I'm getting around 3 inch groups at 500 and I'm sitting at 11 moa on the scope. I figured out what was going on is the bullets were bouncing in to the berm they were falling about 10 feet short . But 11 moa puts me perfect in the center. And with the working of brass I dunno I clean size give tem all the fixings and load powder and bullet o wait I also take a steel brush to the inside of the necks just to make sure the bullet has a clean bed to lay in. O and I do sort by loadings and year of LC brass. Also I won't be able to chrono my factory loads this weekend got to go fly to many aircraft getting done at the same time.
Sorry guys been real busy but I did get out there and worked it in I'm getting around 3 inch groups at 500 and I'm sitting at 11 moa on the scope. I figured out what was going on is the bullets were bouncing in to the berm they were falling about 10 feet short . But 11 moa puts me perfect in the center. And with the working of brass I dunno I clean size give tem all the fixings and load powder and bullet o wait I also take a steel brush to the inside of the necks just to make sure the bullet has a clean bed to lay in. O and I do sort by loadings and year of LC brass. Also I won't be able to chrono my factory loads this weekend got to go fly to many aircraft getting done at the same time.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
rem5rmil, so what changed. Sounds like you were good all the time, hitting short & just needed a come-up to 11 MOA? Guess you are sticking with reloading?
rem5rmil, so what changed. Sounds like you were good all the time, hitting short & just needed a come-up to 11 MOA? Guess you are sticking with reloading?
Re: reloading for 500 yards
Actually I think what was going on is the fact that I was hitting the berm and thought I was high and what was really going on was it was just bouncing high it was deception by a bullet .lol o well shi? Happens. I'm just flat things worked out cuase I was driving my self nuts.
Actually I think what was going on is the fact that I was hitting the berm and thought I was high and what was really going on was it was just bouncing high it was deception by a bullet .lol o well shi? Happens. I'm just flat things worked out cuase I was driving my self nuts.
Re: reloading for 500 yards
Chronograph your load, know your velocity. Know your B.C.
Do you have a smart phone, Iphone? I like bullet drop. It is spot on for me. Put in all your inputs, B.C. Velocity, sight in height, Zero in yards,, wind, and it will give you your come ups.
Just because your hitting with one ammo, and you go to reload, that is going to be totally different. If you are going to reload, and going to shoot distances know your velocity.
I use varget. I use Lapua brass 175 SMK and CCI BR primers. I load 44.0g of varget and seat to length to fit in my Mag. I have a Kreiger barrel at 26" and im pushing 2800fps.
This is something you are going to have to work at to get it right when you reload.
Chronograph your load, know your velocity. Know your B.C.
Do you have a smart phone, Iphone? I like bullet drop. It is spot on for me. Put in all your inputs, B.C. Velocity, sight in height, Zero in yards,, wind, and it will give you your come ups.
Just because your hitting with one ammo, and you go to reload, that is going to be totally different. If you are going to reload, and going to shoot distances know your velocity.
I use varget. I use Lapua brass 175 SMK and CCI BR primers. I load 44.0g of varget and seat to length to fit in my Mag. I have a Kreiger barrel at 26" and im pushing 2800fps.
This is something you are going to have to work at to get it right when you reload.
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