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Deleted member 113831
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You can pick up a"shitty" SPS, or Varmint model that will still shoot right around moa.
To cut that in half will cost you another $2k or more.
To cut that in half will cost you another $2k or more.
- Thread starter jbuck88
- Start date
That much? I’d imagine getting the action trued even half-assed and barrel nutting a good barrel on it, then shooting good ammo would get you there.
It's a lottery. You may get a good one, you may get a bad one. For what I do, I wouldn't play those games. A bergara is just plain better unless you're trying to build a Remage setup.
Im not, I know for sure because Ive tried it four times
You can also spend $6K on a custom and it still shoot like shit.
You are so full of shit. (respectfully)
rem 700 ADL - 380.00
Tier one blueprinting from LRI + side bolt release + time and tig bolt handle - 465
bolt knob install - 65
Total 910 dollars
if you want M16 extractor - 175 for $1085.
Since, according to you, this is TWICE the price of a custom action, please point me in the direction of custom actions that cost 450-550 dollars.
$910 and you still have a Remington action that you will spend another $400 in labor, plus $350 for a barrel blank. Plus coatings of some kind.
It makes no sense when I can get a shouldered pre-fit from Proof or PVA for around $500 and pair it with a Defiance, ARC or Bighorn action for less.
Buy a Remington 5R. They can be found for under $800 online. Remington throws rebates out every now and again as well. The 5R in .308 are shooters for sure as is. Thats the Remington I would buy again.
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Deleted member 113831
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This is how I was figuring it:
$400 for a barrel
$400 for thread and chamber
$300-$400 for truing
$100+ for trigger
$100 for muzzle break
$500-$1000+ for a chassis
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That's overdoing it a bit.
$400 Barrel (Criterion Prefit)
$100 Tools (Headspace gauges, barrel nut and wrench etc.)
$300 Truing
$110 Timney
$100 Muzzle brake
$300 KRG Bravo
So you’re going to spend $800, the top three items on your list to replace/spec parts that you didn’t need to buy in the first place... that’s the cost of an action. Even if you were to just buy a 700 action and true the action and get the tools on your list, you are just shy of a budget custom action and not far off from a high end
I’m much too crude to be able to quote Shakespeare
So your saying if The Hide had a Farting contest you would win ?
Mike R.
So your saying if The Hide had a Farting contest you would win ?
Mike R.
That entire list is to replace the items you bought pretty much, which is why I don't generally recommend a 700. That being said, the only thing you can compare when looking at a custom action is action related costs. The barrel, trigger, tools, and all other parts will have to be bought with any action you go with. So you're got the cost of the action/rifle plus $300 in it which is about $600 if you consider $300 for a stock action.
10 years from now, if you have a custom proprietary action part that fucks up, will you be able to find a replacement part?
How many of these actions use bolt parts that are available at midway or brownells? That's something I like to consider when looking at anything other than a 700.
How many of these actions use bolt parts that are available at midway or brownells? That's something I like to consider when looking at anything other than a 700.
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Considering most are basically 700's with fancy ejectors and tight tolerances... yes. If you can't find a part then it would not be too hard to make one. The only things I've ever seen fail on custom actions are older bolt knob designs before they all went to separate internal threads, and triggers that are 700 footprint anyway. Many of them have tens of thousands of rounds on them and still going strong so I think this is a non issue.
It might be a minimal concern, but something I like to consider with certain designs.
Sounds to me that if the Remington 700 didnt leave a path for all these "custom" actions to Clone it and make upgrades to it when being cloned, with no disrespect but they wouldnt know their palm from the back of there hand...good thing the majority of these actions,including the Bergara have alot of dues to pay imho to the 700 being developed in the first place and Thank Remington for giving these "custom" action manufacturer's something to follow and more than enough consumers something to start out with...if the 700 wasn't made and used by the majority of shooters out there for over 50 years, there would be no need to use its "foot print", its style triggers, etc...So why dont these "custom" action manufacturers make there own "foot print" and trigger design and just improve on it all together, make them multilug(more than 2), give it a firing pin blocked safety, a flat bottom instead of round with integral lug ,etc...the best you can? Some custom actions have more improvements than others, but for the most part they are just that, improvements. Engineering wise, go all out, and not screw on just improving on the 700's design and str8 make it obsolete all together dont you think? Oh..but then all that money-making 700 aftermarket support would mean nothing when it means "the World" to a big firearms manufacturer trying to sell to the masses...even the "custom" action manufacturers would rather sell to the masses than jus a few, hence why they use the 700 "foot-print" and with in the last few years made "lower" cost versions of their Custom actions...Money makes this world go round'....im not saying the 700 is this or that,Im saying "it is what it is"... Im saying its being "Cloned" for reasons we Shouldnt be paying for...But we do, because we all want the best, but the Best is basically an Improved Remington 700 action...Splenda is cool but it'll never be Sugar. Buy what makes you Happy. Bash what Doesnt. Take a school trained long-range marksman with a stock 700P and have him go against the "average joe" with the Best machined, hand fitted, and most accurate rifle he can find, same calibers and throw the same scope on both rifles and see who shoots what at any distance more accurately under any time restrictions..now the rifle becomes irrelevant because training is worth more than any custom anything...buy what you can afford and fk the nay-sayers...if a 700 is all you can get, go for it. If a Custom action floats your boat, ride off into the sunset...i own both and they each have their own place in my safe..
PS: id like to Add to my novela that Accuracy International did there own thing and thats why they are, who they are, in the "rifle world"...but they also had to make a chassis to use the 700 action, remember, money to be made,lmao...goodshooting'
-Reagan
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I agree for the most part. Current Remington just sucks. As for the whole bit about Remington built it, you're right, but they also piggybacked off Mauser. That's generally the way progress works. You could easily trace pretty much all guns back to bow and arrows with that logic. Does that mean I want to be stuck with it? No.
It's a similar situation to Leupold. Neither company had actually made anything new while other companies were innovating. At some point, there were just better options out there for your money. Remington just came along with some unsafe triggers and really crappy QC.
Older 700's are great and are still a great value. The design is the tipping point of diminishing returns which is why its pretty much standard. Not bashing the legacy at all, but the current state of the company just doesn't put out a good product reliably.
Appreciate your opinion and I get you, but piggy back off Mauser?, idk about that one. They both were making hunting rifles from the get go. Mauser imho became infamous for their controlled round feed M98 action through "old timers" that had used it in war, hunters and sportsman using it for recreational shooting after the fact and if Remington had to pick its "legend" action it would be the 700 imho, which is altogether different, its push fed not controlled, no claw extractor, way different trigger design, etc...now maybe Ruger's M77/Hawkeye or Kimbers 84 actions' were piggybacked off of Mauser but the 700...? Not in my book. Also to address the Current Remington as a company is crap, QC sucks, etc I cant speak on that and I do know thats a valid point to many that encountered that, but personally I never had to use their cs or their warranty because the 700s I bought(last one in 2011) always shot decent from the factory, did what they were supposed to do...though I rebarreled them for my own preference...after owning some a while.
-Reagan
The line is fairly indirect. They took from Enfield p14/17 and early push feed Mauser designs (1871 and 88 commission rifle)and tried to make them much more machinable and cheaper bearing the 721, which is where the 700 came from.
Yes you are correct, but Mauser was never "known" for their push feed actions reguardless of making them earlier, most notibly as mentioned earlier, their M98 CRF action is what is talked about typically when the word "Mauser" comes up between fellow rifle shooters. When Remington comes up in a rifle convo its always, 700 this or 700 that, but I cant recall ever hearing, "oh yeah, the 700 was cloned off a Mauser push feed that derives off an Enfield..."...when your more likely going to hear," there are more "clones" of a 700 now than ever"...I respect your view though @winklche and appreciate your insight reguardless.
-Reagan
I see all these prices for doing a 700 action are including a 130-250$ trigger why would you include that you have to buy a trigger for a custom action as well!! Lol. As for my opinion I think Remington rifles out of the box are about a C+ to B- but the action is something fantastic to build off of.. its cheap to get your hands on one and if you get a couple hundred bucks you can have it trued. If you get a couple hundred more later on you can have a billy bad ass ejector put in it, if you get a couple hundred more later.. ah fuck you get the point the point is you don’t have to come up with 1200 bucks right off the bat. But if you have the means buy the custom action!
Someone else already broke down another budget for the accuracy cost so I won’t repeat it. All the costs are completely subjective so the arguing is strictly that, just arguing. I get that going from a stock action to a real shooter is going to cost $$, I just don’t think it’s that dramatic.
Another question would be, what’s the cost to take another factory action from stone stock to laser? And what is the price difference between those actions and a 700?
I’m not saying I would win but...pull my finger. No, the one below my belly button
Jon Jones reference was a little weird, and I don't really see it.
Mack brothers SSevo action supposed to be coming out in a couple months for around $575. I want to hear how people like these.
As someone who bought a 700 that would shoot at best 1.5 moa. Then bought a bergara, which is a big upgrade. Now finishing up a nucleus 1.1 build. I wish I would have just saved and built the custom rifle I wanted from the beginning.
My 700 was bad, but I know not all are. Probably mostly the barrel, but I'm not even sure it's worth truing and rebarreling over selling it and trying a Mack bros action out.
Mack brothers SSevo action supposed to be coming out in a couple months for around $575. I want to hear how people like these.
As someone who bought a 700 that would shoot at best 1.5 moa. Then bought a bergara, which is a big upgrade. Now finishing up a nucleus 1.1 build. I wish I would have just saved and built the custom rifle I wanted from the beginning.
My 700 was bad, but I know not all are. Probably mostly the barrel, but I'm not even sure it's worth truing and rebarreling over selling it and trying a Mack bros action out.
Probably alot more than a 700 in general. Because the 700 is so typically accurized and blue printed its more of a generic process because so many gunsmiths have experience doing it. A good properly trained gunsmith can work on any firearm and do "magic" to accurize it but imho because they most likely havent done as many as say( the hypothetical "other brand" action) itll probably cost more. I bet if you called around and asked different gunsmiths what they charge for accurizing, its the same regurdless of what action, while others probably charge depending on their comfort level and depending on how many they do regularly and know the best gets the lowest cost typically...
-Reagan
Where are all the junk 700's? With everyone saying they are junk why is the px not full of $200 rifles?
Well if your a "casual" fan in the MMA world yeah, you prob dont get it and noprob there it was just a simile..sounds like you got some nice rigs in the works' The Mackbros actions look promising but we as consumers are still on a time wait on them being manufactured, when they will release, then wait on the guinea pigs to report and review..like anything,I hope for the best & expect the worst but thats just me personally...only time will tell.
-Reagan
Because everybody dumped another $1k into them, haven't you been reading along?
So they all went and dumped 1k into crappy 700 actions, hmmmm...interesting. So are they now 1k crappy actions or 1k accurized and blueprinted non crappy actions? Are we turning shit into chocolate over here??????Probably...
-Reagan
I was thinking of a stock tikka, that’s the only other factory action I think I’d buy. And using the parts breakdown in skookum’s post as a blueprint, what is the price difference to take both a tikka and a 700 from stock to laser? I know tikka’s are pretty awesome from the factory so do they “need” to be trued? I’ve seen/heard that they don’t really need it. It seems like the action truing and trigger are the only things on that list that are more expensive to get a 700 on par with a tikka from my example. The other things on the list are items that will also be upgraded no matter what the setup is
But, skookum also was only talking about going from moa to 1/2moa, and wasn’t comparing any other actions. So let’s talk about a hypothetical situation. Someone has a stone stock 700 and wants to get more accuracy for cheap. How much more accurate do you think you could get by: 1) replacing trigger 2) bedding the action to a factory stock 3) not truing the action but replacing the factory barrel with a superior aftermarket barrel/nut setup? What does everyone think that would cost to diy and what would it cost to have just those things done by a smith?
I hope that isn’t too incoherent
@The D I think each manufacturer of actions/rifles is different. Speaking of Tikkas, people say the Tikkas dont need trueing, thats what I hear and if not, then thats a good chunk of coin saved that could be put elsewhere. Many Tikka owners claim they are pretty good and accurate right out of the box, barrel included. I have yet to own a Tikka or built one and thatll prob change this year at some point, but I have shot a few of my friends Tikkas, and they were smooth, consistant shooting rifles in all.
-Reagan
-Reagan
On here it seems like the consensus is the 5r is a good rifle that consistently out performs the other models.
I would assume it's the same action as every other remington, with only a different barrel. So would it only take a mediocre barrel barrel, as I'm sure the just about any of the upper end button rifled barrels would be better then what Remington can mass produce?
I would assume it's the same action as every other remington, with only a different barrel. So would it only take a mediocre barrel barrel, as I'm sure the just about any of the upper end button rifled barrels would be better then what Remington can mass produce?
When those Mack Bros actions hit the street its gonna be hard to justify the R700 for any reason.
D
Deleted member 113831
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All my Remingtons are from the 90's, and though they have been trued, they really didn't need much truing. The truth is, if you get a Remington that at least has straight threads, and the receiver face is within a couple thou of being square (which isn't a lot to expect), then the rifle will likely shoot 3/4 moa or better with just a quality barrel and chamber.
The largest contributing factor that makes Remingtons suck sometimes is thier barrels. Thier barrels are often quite shitty, and the reamers they use are shitty, and the ape running the lathe is often quite shitty.
The other thing with Remingtons is whatever motherfucker that happens to drill the scope mounting holes and the other motherfucker polishing the fuck out of the rail mouting surfaces. I've had to bed every single one of my scope bases, and fix the screw holes on 2 out of 4 rifles. Luckily, since I convert all to 8-40 anyway, they have all cleaned up.
Nice thing about Remmy's is that I literally have a drawer of parts for my rifles. I have spare bolts, bolt bodies, triggers, pins, springs, bolt stops...etc.
If I go to a class, or on a hunt, or anywhere I need some insurance, I just pull some parts out of the drawer. If primers leak and cut pinholes or circular grooves into my bolt face, I get another off ebay or from a local smith for $100-$150. No big deal.... it doesn't work that way with a custom.
The largest contributing factor that makes Remingtons suck sometimes is thier barrels. Thier barrels are often quite shitty, and the reamers they use are shitty, and the ape running the lathe is often quite shitty.
The other thing with Remingtons is whatever motherfucker that happens to drill the scope mounting holes and the other motherfucker polishing the fuck out of the rail mouting surfaces. I've had to bed every single one of my scope bases, and fix the screw holes on 2 out of 4 rifles. Luckily, since I convert all to 8-40 anyway, they have all cleaned up.
Nice thing about Remmy's is that I literally have a drawer of parts for my rifles. I have spare bolts, bolt bodies, triggers, pins, springs, bolt stops...etc.
If I go to a class, or on a hunt, or anywhere I need some insurance, I just pull some parts out of the drawer. If primers leak and cut pinholes or circular grooves into my bolt face, I get another off ebay or from a local smith for $100-$150. No big deal.... it doesn't work that way with a custom.
Depends on what you want. They aren’t bad but IMO I can’t find a reason to buy one at this point.
if I wanted an affordable factory rifle I’d buy a tikka, if I wanted a custom rig I would have a true custom built off an action designed for the use I have.
So I guess boring?
if I wanted an affordable factory rifle I’d buy a tikka, if I wanted a custom rig I would have a true custom built off an action designed for the use I have.
So I guess boring?
I am not a casual, but I am a newer ufc fan. Just for the past couple years. I guess I just do consider bones Jones one of the best ever.
Because of pandemic buying right now I threw my 700 on Armslist to see what I can get for it locally. Accuracy wasn't to my standard but it would be fine for a PA hunter or some new to shooting who isn't worried about long range. Just being honest about it.
If it sells I might be a guinea pig on a Mack Bros.
Because of pandemic buying right now I threw my 700 on Armslist to see what I can get for it locally. Accuracy wasn't to my standard but it would be fine for a PA hunter or some new to shooting who isn't worried about long range. Just being honest about it.
If it sells I might be a guinea pig on a Mack Bros.
I’m not saying I would win but...pull my finger. No, the one below my belly button
You got to be very careful pulling the one below the belly button Frank pulled the last OP in the last contest and the guy shit his 511’s. It was a freaking mess and smelled like shit…
The bottom line… He got Disqualified from the contest didn't win that rifle with the suppressor got a red Ryder BB gun Instead and got sent home.
Don’t think you couldn’t win I believe you can...
My 2 cents... buy what ever the fk you want and enjoy it
But what would I know...
Mike R.
You got to be very careful pulling the one below the belly button Frank pulled the last OP in the last contest and the guy shit his 511’s. It was a freaking mess and smelled like shit…
The bottom line… He got Disqualified from the contest didn't win that rifle with the suppressor got a red Ryder BB gun Instead and got sent home.
Don’t think you couldn’t win I believe you can...
My 2 cents... buy what ever the fk you want and enjoy it
But what would I know...
Mike R.
Exactly.
That's the concensious. Don't throw money at a factory rifle. Start with a known action and have a competent Smith spin you up a barrel or order a pre-fit and save even more money.
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"Barrel price is barrel price". Really? Lol.
A shouldered steel barrel from Proof Research is $545 MSRP. You'll pay close to that in just labor to most gunsmiths.
Impact Precision 737R & 787R Pre-Fit
proofresearch.com But in reality most gunsmiths will cost around $300 to chamber and install a barrel. Some less, some more. So add that to the cost of a premium barrel and you are a little higher.
Prefits have their place, but when you start talking about stacking tolerances they make less sense if all out accuracy is your goal.
Prefits have their place, but when you start talking about stacking tolerances they make less sense if all out accuracy is your goal.
No you won't"Barrel price is barrel price". Really? Lol.
A shouldered steel barrel from Proof Research is $545 MSRP. You'll pay close to that in just labor to most gunsmiths.
Impact Precision 737R & 787R Pre-Fit
Yeah, thats the first 90%. The next 10% is down the rabbit hole.
I’m well aware of the rabbit hole...
