Rem. Factory 5R barrel internal quality?

[Pusher591]

Was looking over the "break in" barrel question currently posted in this forum and noticed the majority say just shoot it. I have heard of factory barrels having rough spots but do the factory 5R barrels fall in this catagory? I have heard they shoot great but is the internal qulaity of the barrel close to say..a Bartlein,Kriger,Oby, and so on. I know those particular barrels (from my own experience) require little to no break in. Most of those barrels foul for maybe a handful of shots then they are GTG. Just wanted to know what y'all think.

 

[Oddball Six]

Re: Rem. Factory 5R barrel internal quality?

You refer to 'factory 5R barrels'.

Made by whom?

5R is a rifling profile originally developed by obermeyer to mimic the characteristics of a barrel which is fired in a "settled in" slightly worn state.

This profile is available from Remington in several different rifles, as well as from Kreiger, Rock Creek Barrels, etc.

Which manufacturer are you asking about? Off the line barrel quality from a production Remington VTR is going to be very different than a Krieger, for example.

 

[flyboy]

Re: Rem. Factory 5R barrel internal quality?

Wether the barrel is rough or not, shooting it is the only way to hit what your aiming at. Forget the cleaning every shot for the first umpteen rounds and go out and have fun. The rifle will shoot as well as the driver can drive it.

 

[Pusher591]

Re: Rem. Factory 5R barrel internal quality?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Oddball-Six</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You refer to 'factory 5R barrels'.

Made by whom?

5R is a rifling profile originally developed by obermeyer to mimic the characteristics of a barrel which is fired in a "settled in" slightly worn state.

This profile is available from Remington in several different rifles, as well as from Kreiger, Rock Creek Barrels, etc.

Which manufacturer are you asking about? Off the line barrel quality from a production Remington VTR is going to be very different than a Krieger, for example. </div></div>

Sorry, should have been more clear. I'm familiar with the 5R process, I was refering to the Remington 700 5R rifle that they sold for a while. It has the HS stock with the 24" barrel. I was more curious as to the quality of that particular barrel compared to other 5R rifled barrels. I didn't know if the process is exactly the same or if it differed in some ways.

 

[Oddball Six]

Re: Rem. Factory 5R barrel internal quality?

My 700SS 5-R was more accurate than any other production 700 series I have had experience with. I was regularly able to get down to .4MOA with it. I think .35 was the best group I ever saw out of it.

Most folks report in the range of .5-.75. But there was a long thread at sniper central I would reference on this topic of discussion that Oneeyedmac made some great points in. It was more talking about the VTR but we talked about the process in general, etc.

http://www.snipercentral.com/forums/view...bb443fbe2e4a9a7

One thing to keep in mind is that Remington has been slipping quality-wise in the last few years with consumer oriented products. The anecdotal evidence of "crap sticks" making it off the line seems to have a higher incidence lately.

Add to that the consideration that Remington production barrels are button rifled, not cut rifled. Good explanation on why that matters:

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f17/cut-rifling-vs-button-rifling-24342/

and

http://www.riflebarrels.com/articles/barrel_making/making_rifle_barrel.htm

 

[sotexhill]

Re: Rem. Factory 5R barrel internal quality?

Anyone know if the current Remington SS 5R "Milspec" barrels are button or cut rifled?

Also, I haven't seen an answer to the OP's question of the bore surface quality of the current Remington 5R barrels.

Are they lapped?

Has anyone looked at one with a borescope?

Thank you.

 

[Oddball Six]

Re: Rem. Factory 5R barrel internal quality?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SouthTexasHill</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Anyone know if the current Remington SS 5R "Milspec" barrels are button or cut rifled?

Also, I haven't seen an answer to the OP's question of the bore surface quality of the current Remington 5R barrels.

Are they lapped?

Has anyone looked at one with a borescope?
</div></div>

Actually I answer these in my above posts. But to be explicit:

These are production barrels. Even folks like Rock Creek Barrel who offer a great cut rifled product will button rifle barrels intended to be OEM'd for production products.

As for Remington's process, their factory was modernized in 2000 to use a forging process. Since that time, Remington has advertised their barrels as "cold forged" and "button rifled" according to Remington's previous press releases.

I would point out that doesn't necessarily mean that its not a great product. Remington has turned out some great products and as I have noted several times, my 5R was accurate as hell. Some are not as accurate, and reports of barrels and actions which are not up to the expectations which we have come to have of Remington seem to be more frequent in the last year or so as the hedge fund which owns Remington has started making significant changes to cut costs and streamline operations between the multiple companies it owns.

I would say that the surface quality of the Remington 5-R barrel CAN be superb. I would also say that my trust in Remington over the last year has been shaken a bit as consistency appears to be slipping.

And here is a borescoping comparison between a Remington Barrel and Lilja. Full Disclosure: it was published by Lilja.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hf9zZqn00CA

Even if we make the assumption that it wasnt done "fair" and that the barrel pulled to do the video was one which someone had reported as not shooting as well as it "should", some of the evidence you can see for yourself should still raise points to consider about tooling and method and so forth.

 

[marku]

Re: Rem. Factory 5R barrel internal quality?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Add to that the consideration that Remington production barrels are button rifled, not cut rifled. Good explanation on why that matters:</div></div>

Id put money on it that Remington barrels are hammer forged instead of button rifled. Remington barrels can and some like my Sendero were rough inside. I used the Tubb Final Finish system on it and I have little to no copper fouling and thats a 300 RUM pushing a 125gr ballistic tip at 3750fps. Are there better quality barrels? Yes. I know my Sendero shoots very well with that load 2 groups of .590 and one in the lower .6's. For real accuracy test ive got some 210 Bergers that will work perfectly with the 1-11" twist barrel and a load that proven itself 89-92gr Retumbo for accuracy test.

Button rifling is a excellent rifling method used by several top shooting brands. Broughton for example, ive got 2 barrels from them and holy moly they shoot very well.

The Lija barrel video is not what every remington barrel looks like.

A well tuned M700 will outshoot 80% of the shooters out there.

 

[Oddball Six]

Re: Rem. Factory 5R barrel internal quality?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: marku</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Id put money on it that Remington barrels are hammer forged instead of button rifled.
</div></div>

Agreed. Since 2000, anyway when they finished the re-work of the barrel assembly line. Remington however advertises both based on the line you are asking about.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Remington barrels can and some like my Sendero were rough inside. I used the Tubb Final Finish system on it and I have little to no copper fouling and thats a 300 RUM pushing a 125gr ballistic tip at 3750fps.</div></div>

Excellent but it has nothing to do with what the OP's question was. Yes, the barrel can easily be cleaned up. But the factory state is what the answer was for

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The Lija barrel video is not what every remington barrel looks like.

A well tuned M700 will outshoot 80% of the shooters out there.
</div></div>

Agreed again, but the same points apply.

1) I denoted that you were looking at probably an extreme example of a barrel that should not have cleared the QC process. Still you should consider why the barrel was rough and even for barrels which are more reasonable examples, they will still have issues based on the hammer forging method, those marks and grooves simply wont be as detrimental as this example was.

2) We are back to a properly tuned 700. Pre-tuning (including cleaning up the barrel a little bit), the comparison of a Remington production barrel using the 5R profile and the offerings of virtually any aftermarket provider of match equipment will be challenging to find equal footing.