Remington 700 Next Step in "Build"?

[varano14]

Hi everyone, I have been lurking around this forum for well over a year and finally felt like a had a question worth asking. First some back round on myself and the rifle, I'll try to keep it short.

So about a year ago i decided I wanted to step up to a larger caliber (from 22lr) and try my hand at "longer" range precision shooting. After copious amounts of research I settled on a Rem 700 SPS Tac in 223. I choose this caliber because at the moment the longest range I have access to is 300 yards, I can send a lot of rounds down range for less money, and also in the future if I have access to a longer range 223 seems like a great trainer caliber.

For the first year I shot mostly cheap factory ammo to get used to the trigger as well as the recoil. I shot a few Sub MOA groups with match ammo but the price of it drove me away. I knew I wanted to reload eventually so I saved all my brass. Well over the last few weeks I have been doing some load development and I have really been rather amazed by the results. My hope was to find a load that was mechanically sub .5 MOA. Meaning in a led sled or similar device where I couldn't screw it up it would shoot that. This way I would have a goal to aim for when shooting in more traditional positions like prone. I was not sure this was possible as it was still a factory rifle with no work done to it. I will try to post pictures of the groupings below. I choose to do 3 shot groups for the initial testing to pick loads I wanted to further test with larger group sizes, so I'd rather not get into the 3v5 discussion.

Rifle-Remington 700 SPS TAC 223
Scope-Athlon Argos 6-24
69gr SMK BTHP and Varget

Range Day 1:
No wind all shots take off front and rear bags from 100 Yards
First 4 pictures.
I was surprised that all of the groups where so small. I assumed 1 might really stand out and the rest be all over the place. I did think that the 23.6 one showed promise because I thought there was a good chance I pulled the shot so I loaded up 6 rounds of that to see.

I can't seem to get more the 4 pictures on one post so if someone has a better way to post pics that'd be great. I will post details of the second day in a new post but one to my questions.

1. After seeing the results am I right to pursue 23.6gr or am I missing something?
2.I had been planing to upgrade my stock and had just been eyeing the Greyboe stocks. Will changing stocks throw off accuracy? I know POI will likely shift but will it change the load the gun likes?

If you are still around thanks for reading I will post the rest of my load results below

23.4gr
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23.6gr
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23.8gr
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24gr

 

[supercorndogs]

I can't see your pictures, too small. i think 23.6 was right about where I was at with the 69smk. The 223 is not very finicky to load for in my experience. I would ditch the led sled.

 

[varano14]

Range Day 2.
All shots taken off led sled type rest with slight breeze
The first picture is of the first 23.6 group I shot. It measured out to be .11MOA. The second group with 23.6gr was just like the group from the first day two in one hole and a flyer likely caused by me.
Now I would like to go one record and say I know I have not done nearly the testing required to say my gun can shoot that sort of group with any regularity nor that I am skilled enough to do it. However it made me wonder if it id in fact possible. Could I have gotten that lucky with a factory rifle or was this some sort of stars aligning coincidence that will not happen for another 100 years. I'm just not sure how to interpret this group.

Again I am sorry about the tiny pictures as soon as I figure out how to make them bigger I will.

 

[varano14]

I can't see your pictures, too small. i think 23.6 was right about where I was at with the 69smk. The 223 is not very finicky to load for in my experience. I would ditch the led sled.

Working on the pictures resizing them to make the bigger seems to be having the opposite effect. As far as the led sled I think I actually liked the bags better so I probably wont use it much more.

 

[spife7980]

If you have the tac that means you have the hogue stock (?) and while I don't think it would shift much that is a flimsy stock and something rigid could potentially alter the harmonics I suppose. It would be prudent to verify once you swap. I never bothered loading for mine when it was in that stage so I fail to offer a before and after comparison but it does like a minichassis and 69cc over 23.6 xbr. The bulk ammo I wore the barrel in with shoots equally as bad now so there's that.

 

[varano14]

If you have the tac that means you have the hogue stock (?) and while I don't think it would shift much that is a flimsy stock and something rigid could potentially alter the harmonics I suppose. It would be prudent to verify once you swap. I never bothered loading for mine when it was in that stage so I fail to offer a before and after comparison but it does like a minichassis and 69cc over 23.6 xbr. The bulk ammo I wore the barrel in with shoots equally as bad now so there's that.

Yes hogue stock, which is very flimsy. When using a bipod it makes contact with the barrel. Shooting of bags with the front bag just infront of trigger guard seems to help

 

[MarkLeupold]

Changing the stock may change accuracy. In my case, going from the factory SPS stock to a B&C M40 improved mine, and that's mostly the way I've seen it go. That being said, your accuracy is looking pretty great right now. I would still get the stock (the Greyboes have been getting good reviews) because the Houge will limit you shooting off of bipods, which is what most of us here are doing/plan to do.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk

 

[supercorndogs]

Working on the pictures resizing them to make the bigger seems to be having the opposite effect. As far as the led sled I think I actually liked the bags better so I probably wont use it much more.

Looking good. I would run with it. For 100-300 I would run some of the cheaper 55g bullets. It will give you a chance to work up another load, and get more familiar with the process. With 100-300 at your disposal you could choose from a couple different kinds of tests people run. I like the OCW and ladder testing methods over shooting groups.

 

[varano14]

Looking good. I would run with it. For 100-300 I would run some of the cheaper 55g bullets. It will give you a chance to work up another load, and get more familiar with the process. With 100-300 at your disposal you could choose from a couple different kinds of tests people run. I like the OCW and ladder testing methods over shooting groups.

I actually have some 55gr hornady bullets to try next. I started with the 69gr because they did the best from factory ammo. Being new to reloading the load workup process is fun so I'll likely try several. Hornadys factory 75gr showed positive results so I may have that a go as well incase I every have a opportunity to shoot further out.

Also I have been reading about ladder tests and will likely try running one and see how results compare.

Thanks for advice guys hoping to be purchasing the stock during Fourth of July sale so we may have more progress soon

 

[varano14]

Pulled the trigger on a new stock and DBM setup this morning. Now the waiting game begins.

 

[varano14]

Just thought I would update everyone on how this turned out. I was away on vacation for a week so after putting everything together I never got a chance to get to the range and shoot. The final build was as follows:
-Remington 700 SPS Tac in 223
-Greyboe Renagade Stock inlet for M5 bottom metal
-PTG bottom metal
-Athlon Argos 6-24 Mil/Mil FFP


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These are my two rifles, Remington on the right and its smaller 22lr brother on the left.
The steel targets visible at the top left are at 200 yards and the 300 yards line is at the trees directly above the muzzle on the right gun.

After switching stocks I wanted to retest for accuracy as I was nervous I somehow messed up the great thing I had going

These were the first five shots I took using my hand loads, I had previously shot 5 rounds of cheap factory ammo to check that the mag fed. Needless to say I was thrilled the accuracy hadn't been affected by switching stocks.


That was the only group I shot at 100 yards I then moved at to the 300 yard line and shot a string of 5 shots. I extrapolated the come up using the drop from 100 to 200 and was only just a bit high on my estimate. The first picture is only using the first 5 shots then the second is using all 10 shots at 300 yards. After the first 5 I adjusted my scope down 2 clicks which accounted for a good part of the group getting larger.


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In closing I want to thank everyone on this site that insists that people start with as accurate of a system as possible right of the bat. I started shooting factory ammo and the groups I did shoot landed between just under MOA and 1.5MOA. I was regularly frustrated because I felt often I had not pulled a shot but it didn't land where I aimed. After developing a load my groups shrank to under .5MOA. In fact of the 10+ charge weights I tested the largest 3 shot group was .6MOA. I'm not saying everyone should expect this after only a year behind the trigger because while I only recently starting shooting this gun I spent 2 years in college shooting olympic style 22lr. I put about 500 rounds down range a week. Because of that I knew I could shoot better then factory ammo was letting me. So I will end saying what I read over and over again get a rifle that is capable of this sort of accuracy because now if a round doesn't land where I aim I know exactly who to blame.