semi auto vs bolt action

onemanmafia99

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Nov 15, 2011
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So ive been looking into getting a new rifle. I've got a PTr 91 GI and an AK 47 now, I've never had an optic on my guns; but i shot my teammates 30-06 yesterday that had a scope on it... it was 100 times more fun than shooting with iron sights. So i want to get a scoped rifle, and ive heard bolt action is more accurate than semi auto. this rifle would be just for target shooting and SHTF, for practice i dont shoot more than 200 yards but for SHTF i could be over 1000 (although i probably wouldnt take the shot that anything over 350.)

My question is, Could i just scope my PTR 91 since i dont shoot that far? or would it be worth it too invest in a bolt action rifle in 308 or 300 winchester? I feel like my PTR could be very accurate, but id need a trigger job on it and i need to practice more. I've been looking into getting an FAL, because i really want to get all black rifles i can before the next election when there will probably be another rush for them, but im really thinking about a bolt action now.

Also would a scope get in the way of a charging handle on the PTR 91?

Thanks for the help
Matt
 

KillShot

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May 25, 2010
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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

First things first...forget the "SHTF" stuff and/or zombie invasion if you want people to take you seriously on here.

Yes, a bolt action is inherently more accurate than a semi-auto because there are fewer moving parts, amongst other things.

If you already have an AK and a PTR91, why not ditch the PTR and get a good bolt gun? The AK can be used for CQB and the bolt could be used for precision long range. My choice for caliber would be a 308.

Oh...and before you start talking about making 1000yd shots, there's a lot to learn before you get to that point.
 

onemanmafia99

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Nov 15, 2011
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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

I like the PTR a lot, i tend to buy my guns to keep. It took me a while to save up for that one, so id prefer to keep it; but would it make much of a difference at 200 yards between a semi auto rifle vs a bolt action rifle?
 

Beef82

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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

The difference is not as clear cut as semi vs bolt. Some semi autos will shoot sub moa, some shoot much worse, most rack grade domestically produced ones will shoot somewhere from 1-2.5MOA. Many quality brand bolt actions of late manufacture in reasonably accurate chamberings will shoot MOA or slightly under to considerable distance.
The only way to know what your PTR is capable of would be to scope it and shoot a variety of loads with it from a good stable supported position and honestly consider your own abilities so you can determine if the gun or you are the limiting factor.
 

BadDudes4Hire

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Dec 22, 2011
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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

Well, where to start. PTR 91 - Good gun. Do you have a muzzle break on that bad boy? Get one. Or weigh it down. They Kick Hard. I have LR308 and have buttstock weight, and 2 lb scope. No worries there. PTR can be pretty accurate. But, You have to realize that the 1000 yard shot is not easy with any rifle. If you had an SSG 04, or equiv. you may be able to make those shots easier, but those shotsare way better suited for the 300 win. mag. Optics and trigger mech. are way more important in accuracy than semi auto vs bolt. I dont do SHTF stuff, but if I did, get a Saiga Shotgun and some heavy shot, with a high cap. mag. Bolt guns operate differently than the semi, and in your case, You can get pretty accurate with PTR just dont buy the $150 Leapers scope and think it is AWESOME. You really need clear glass, and a reliable zero with turrets... What I mean is if you zero your scope at 150 or 200 yards, and take it up to 600 yard shot for 30 rounds, can you bring it back down to 150 or 200 yards and be on target.

Oversized scope mounts if you are worried about C. Handle issue and you shouldnt have any problems. No worries there.
Suggestions
1 - Get good glass - Dont discount Millet. They make a very nice scope for the price, and you can shake the shit out of that scope. Make sure what ever scope you get can handle PTR kick. I prefer Leupold.
2 - no worries about semi vs bolt.
3 - get that trigger job you already know you need. Only one other job feels better than a trigger job.
4 - start at 200 yards and get very comfortable at that distance, and start taking it out. I would say at about 600 yards you could hit MOA with that thing. Anything beond that and you really have to be a good marksman.
 

Prairie Dog Dundee

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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

Scope and shoot what you own until you are as good as the rifle. You'll appreciate your rifles more. I went from a HK-91 thirty years ago to a Springfield M1A NM then to an LMT MWS. On a good day I can shoot close to the potential of the M1A but have a long way to go on the LMT. If you want to start at the top for semi autos you could not have picked a better time. There are many excellent choices.
 

Scouter19D

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May 28, 2011
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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

One more "1000 yard SHTF" question. That term needs to be erased from human memory. Honestly how many countries lately have ERUPTED, and i never once saw some queer with a bug-out bag and a scoped rifle scrollin' a road with his lone surviving buddy to find food. How far does America, of all countries, have to go before any of us would hit that point?
 

onemanmafia99

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Nov 15, 2011
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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

I dont have a muzzle break on it.. but it does kick pretty hard. I've developed a flinch from it so i need to work on that too. I was considering a Leupold if i scoped it. the problem is that i dont have a place i can shoot regularly thats much over a 100 yards. The public ranges around here arent very big, once in a while i get to go to my friends farm which i could probably go about 400 at the most. I'll just have to look around for more ranges i guess
 

BadDudes4Hire

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Dec 22, 2011
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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

Developing a flinch on one rifle is a BAD habbit. It travels to others. Many different muzzle brakes out there. Normal 308 threading is 5/8 - 24 threading and this will fit most muzzle brakes. Try this,

Troy Industries Claymore Muzzle Brake AR-10, LR-308 - - not expensive

Really makes a difference in recoil. Also, the weight of a Leupy is usually heavier than other scopes and that alone will help. The eye relief on Leupys are usually good. You are really talking about all of the proper things you need to do to get this rifle "Right"

Anyway. Try this when you get the scope mounted. It seems strange, but will really help get rid of bad habbits. I use dummie rounds in my rifles so that not to distress the F pin. MAKE SURE THE RIFLE IS NOT LOADED. MAKE SURE THE RIFLE IS NOT LOADED. But anyway, Hold your rifle as you were to shoot. Pretend it is a big strand of laughy taffy, and try to pull it apart from muzzle to stock using your hands pulling in opposite directions. Use a good amount of force, but not so much you are trembling, or shaking the FOV in scope. Now fire. If your scope moves, maybe right, then you need to practice trigger pulling. Or, as you suggested New Trigger. What you are doing is preparing for that moderate recoil, and not flinching when pulling the trigger. You are gripping, forearm, tightly as you shoot. Recoil Felt is lessened, and then after some practice, you will find a great balance of pulling gun for recoil, and it doesnt affect your shot. 100 Yards is a good practice distance, and 200 is really good too. If you can go 1 MOA at 100 and 200, you will probably be pretty good out a few hundred more. 600 yds starts to get tricky, and always keep a data book of your rounds and turret revolutions. Be careful not to forget how many turns you do on elev. It sucks to forget where you were zeroed in at and then lose it.
Muzzle Brake - $50 to $80
Trigger - $160 to $250
Scope - $600 to $1200

It sucks to spend just as much on a rifle as it costs just to get it to be TFA. But when you do, there is no better feeling. Dont discount Millet scopes. They zero very well and are great for the price. For a little more, though, you can get a Leupy. Lots of scopes on here for sale - some are good deals.
 

BittenbytheBug

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Dec 14, 2011
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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

I'm not sure I would be looking at .308 or 300 if you've developed a flinch.

I own a couple of firearms (FN Herstal, 3 AR15's of various calibers and configurations)so I'm no great expert. The AR platform has a couple of different options such as muzzle break, recoil spring and buffer comb as well as limbsavr (that last one is totally unnecessary) to mitigate recoil - but that doesn't appear to be your real issue.

I think you need to nail down what you want your next purchase to do first, before you even choose between BR or semi-auto. Then, not meant to denigrate in anyway, look at your current fundamentals with regards to shooting and work out the issues you're having.
 

j.c.

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Jul 22, 2011
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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

PTR threading is 15x1 RH. The PWS HK muzzle brake is the way to go. I've had a PTR for a couple years and ultimately it is going to frustrate it you if you are wanting a precision rifle. That is not what it is, and few of them will reliably shoot below 2 MOA.

Honestly you won't want to hear it but what you really need to learn to shoot is not a .308 but a .22. Then when you have mastered 50 yards get a bolt gun in .308. Get some training and experience before you spend a whole lot of money on guns.
 

onemanmafia99

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Nov 15, 2011
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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

That trick helped some, i noticed i didnt move as much when i pulled the trigger so its already a little better, its just going to take more practice. I'm actually pretty excited to get into more precise shooting... i can do more than just blast away and burn through money. Can you recommend any ammo that could be good, thats affordable? I mostly have been shooting winchester white box, russian steel cased, and some surplus but none of which seems good enough to be accurate. Except maybe the winchester stuff.
 

onemanmafia99

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Nov 15, 2011
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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

That's pretty good advice, And ive needed to get myself a 22 but just haven't gotten around to it; it will be pretty nice to go shoot and not spend a fortune on ammo, although i will admit im a little reluctant to go spend money on a scope for a 22.
 

BadDudes4Hire

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Dec 22, 2011
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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

I love my .22lr. I dont think I will ever put it away. Best is that $20 shoots it all day long. I agree, what would you put on a 22.lr that you would want to put on it. CenterPoint - LOL. You are only going 50 to 100 yards with it. But some people do, I guess.

But for the 308 - Depends on how much you will shoot. If a lot, 100 rounds per month or more, look into hand loading, and get a progressive press. If not that much, look on here and other sites for deals. Right now, somebody is selling something like 300 rounds for $90 to your door, all various types of match grade ammo. I beleive on here. Really good deal, and you can pick and choose what works best in your rifle. Keep a book of what works when you shoot. Safe bet - Sierra Match 168 grains. Thats what mine likes. Try a fast moving round, then work to a slower round or heavier, and find what it likes.
 

BigJoe29

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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

There are people on here with Schmidt and benders on 22's some people want to train with exactly what they have on their big guns
 

BadDudes4Hire

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Dec 22, 2011
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Re: semi auto vs bolt action

Very good point. I have always shot a 22 like it is a 50 or 100 yard gun, and have only hunted small game with that intent with the 22lr. I saw that some guy on longrangehunting.com actually hit (I think it was a 20 inch) circular saw blade from 500 yards with his 22lr. And the bullets were as flat as a nail head. Totally not knocking anyone who uses scopes on any rifle.