Soviet Sniper Rifles

[Old Salt]

Just got an email from Mitchell Mauser's about Rare Soviet Sniper Rifles for sale. I've read a lot about their Mauser's being bogus with numbers being stamped to match the rifle etc. Does anyone have any input to this being right and should a person beware of getting one of these rifles. The add below is copied and pasted about the Soviet rifles.

From the Desk of
Don Mitchell
Rare Ex-Military Soviet Sniper Rifle!
We have a small number of super-rare World War II Soviet Model 91/30 Sniper rifles, each complete with its own scope, mount and original accessories. An Historical Gem that you can use right out of the box!


You can buy it Now for only $799 with a Simple Phone Call!

And I'll Pay the Shipping!

Call me at 800-274-4124

Each Sniper Rifle Package Includes All This:

An original Soviet Model 91/30 sniper rifle manufactured in the Soviet Union during WWII at Soviet arms factories. These rifles were specially selected to be sniper rifles during the manufacturing process. They became the most successful sniper rifles in history.
It's original Soviet scope mount is serialized to the rifle.
The Soviet sniper scope is guaranteed bright and clear.
The Soviet sling was made specifically for this model rifle with the correct attachments.
You also get the Original Soviet bayonet that is serialized to the rifle.
We include two Soviet ammo pouches that hold a total of sixty rounds!
An Original Jag and Cleaning Rod Handle are included.
A unique Soviet dual oil can that holds both solvent and oil is also included.
You also get your own copy of "Enemy at the Gates", the dramatic movie on DVD that depicts the sniper battles at Stalingrad where the M91/30 played a major role in the hands of famous Soviet snipers like Vasily Zaitsev.

Normally this Sniper rifle package costs more than $1,500. But, because we have so few, we are making this special offer to people on our Special Contact list.
For a short time, we have a small number for Only $799.
If you order now, you also get Free Shipping!

Call 800-274-4124

These rifles are in marvelous condition. They are incredibly accurate. We found them stored in a former Soviet warehouse, ready to be issued. We believe they are the best, original Soviet sniper rifles available today - the best quality at the best price.

Call 800-274-4124 Today!

 

[Chiller]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

ummmmmm.......

Serious?

 

[Chiller]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

Trying to figure out is this is a legit post......

 

[ArmaHeavy]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

I think what Chiller means is...

Will you adjust your original message so it doesn't look like you're selling for them?

 

[Old Salt]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

I ain't selling nothing for anyone, I just asked a simple question about some issues that I've read on these forums about this company stamping numbers on parts and if they are legit, if some dummy didn't understand that then I'm sorry.

Added to post; this was a simple copy and paste of an email I got today and all I want to know is if this company is for real. I'm probably not the only person on this forum that got this email.

 

[Joop]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

I know this is my first post here, but I'm a long time lurker and am thrilled that you guys finally got a vintage sniper sub-forum up and running. I know you don't know me from Adam, but you can check me out on the sniper rifle forum at Gunboards and you will find that I'm an advanced collector of original M91/30 sniper rifles. I'll make a formal introduction soon enough, but thought that this thread needed an informed response to keep anybody from getting hosed.

First off, if you Google "Mitchell's Mausers", it won't take you long to figure out what kind of company you are dealing with. The negative publicity is well deserved. While they do sell some "pretty" guns (in the eyes of the uninformed), their advertising is actually bordering on (some would say over the line of) FRAUD.

I know of one person, firsthand, that bought one of these "original" Mosin snipers. I think he paid $1800 for it, at the time when they first started advertising them. They also offered him the "accessory pack" for an additional $200. What they sent him was a standard 91/30 rifle that had a reproduction scope and mount put on it. These are the same rifles you see at many of the online vendors and gun shows, in the $350-$400 range. Is the rifle "originally" from Russia? Yes, it is. Was it ever an "original" sniper rifle? No. It was not. Furthermore, the accessory pack that they sell you at this bargain price, for such rare items, is the same accessory pack that comes with every $79 refurb M91/30 rifle, free of charge.

You've heard of P.T. Barnum, right? Don't fall for it. If you want an original PU sniper rifle (albeit a refurbished one), call RGuns. $800 will get you what you want and that's a real bargain, in my opinion.

 

[Old Salt]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

Thank you young or old first poster for a real answer, I thought it was verging on fraudulent advertisement and that is why I posted the email along with a question to get an honest opinion instead of some stupid accusation of advertising for someone. I think I'll pass on the offer of this rifle.

 

[Wolvenhaven]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

Mosin 91/30s that were used as sniper rifles were not kitted out with a bayonet. MM is a fraudulent company which passes off reproductions or fakes as the real thing and charges people more money than an original would cost. "Normally this package costs $1,500" is flat out bullshit. You can get a real mosin sniper for $800ish with the correct paperwork to prove it. All the things listed there are what would come with an $80 mosin, all they did was buy them by the crate load for around $30, raped the receiver, bolted on a fake mount and scope, and are trying to pass them off as real, destroying even more history than they already have.

 

[Joop]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

Wolvenhaven hits it on the head!

I should also mention that ATI out of Rochester, NY has imported some legit PU snipers, as well. You can view them on their website. They usually run a little cheaper than the RGuns rifles. There are pros and cons to these, though. They are from a different source and, from what I've seen, have a different type/level of refurbishment that was most likely done at a different time and place. They also have a higher frequency of features and parts that are from an arsenal other than the one in which they were originally built (Izhevsk mount on a Tula rifle, for example). The plus side is that (at least the last I checked) they have them separated by arsenal and year and you can pick what you want from that list. This is something that RGuns doesn't offer.

Here's one of mine, which is an RGuns import, a '44 Tula with Progress factory scope:

Target from 500 yards using 1968 dated Czech surplus ammo in the rifle pictured above. First round was a spotter, then the last four were on the target. The blotted out holes were from my M1A and the mount holes for the dish (an old DirecTV dish, which is about 18" wide).

Don't let the con-artists discourage you from getting one. Just be sure it's the real deal.

 

[BasraBoy]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

+1.....legit or otherwise, based solely on Mitchell's Mausers "reputation", I'd avoid like the plague!

 

[Old Salt]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

Thanks, I'll check out the companies that Joop mentioned;

Just checked them out and they both look good, I'm in the process of moving so getting one is going on the back burner for right now, but Christmas is coming!

 

[mosin46]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

don't walk,RUN from mitchell's i don't know if they every sold anything legit,but i seriously doubt it. ATI is supposed to have the last real PUs. guns placed in storage in the 50s. mostly refurbs. but,real soviet post war refurbs.

 

[Old Salt]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

Thanks Mike, I fell victim to Mitchell's when I got back from the sand pit in 07 and got what I got. It looks really nice but I'm not sure that it's what they advertised it to be after reading some post on the forums here.

 

[lennyo3034]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

Can someone post a link to ATI? I tried looking for them and only found the company that makes cheap plastic stocks.

 

[Joop]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lennyo3034</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Can someone post a link to ATI? I tried looking for them and only found the company that makes cheap plastic stocks. </div></div>

Twenty seconds with Google = http://www.americantactical.us/9/catalog.html

 

[icerider]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

My first post also in this discussion. I collect Soviet military rifles and have several original snipers. I have an SVD and three original PU snipers and several x-PU and one x-Pem sniper. These are not the made up ones from Mitchels and many other sources. As far as the scope sr numbers on the rifle, I find that my known originals have the mount number on the rifle. This stamped number is the same as the number stamped on the barrel. (This one came from Rguns) The other two have the mount numbers on both the mount and rifle also. You can change scopes all day long but each and every mount assembly cannot be switched. They are hand fitted and adjusted by the arsenal for that exact rifle. Scopes go bad, get fogged and damaged so a new scope is slipped into the mount and zeroed. If you switch the mount to another rifle base you are screwed as it won't align properly. On the back of every PU mount are two thin adjustment rails. These are filed down or welded up as needed to adjust the scopes alignment. Another point is that usless the rifle was picked up in the field, and brought back here, it came from an importer and was refurbed by the arsenal. I would say that 99.9% of all "original" sniper rifles in this country are refurbed by the arsenals. I am not a Vic Thomas, but I have seen a lot of so called original PU sniper rifles and almost all of them are made up right here in the USA by dealers and importers. It is not hard to obtain an original scope and mount, as the decomissioned snipers had the scopes refurbed and packed into storage crates. This is where the importers get their original scopes they put on any old 9130 and advertise as genuine snipers. The scope and mount are genuine but it never came on that rifle. I have, as I am sure many of you have,seen PU snipers, made up on dated 9130's that are completely out of the date ranges for PU snipers. PU snipers did not come about until 1943 and 44. Some PU's may have been built in late 1942 but I have not seen one. If you want a genuine PU sniper you need to contact RGuns. They had original PU snipers right out of the Russian crates of stored, refurbed snipers. Just my thoughts.

 

[samnev]

Re: Soviet Sniper Rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: icerider</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My first post also in this discussion. I collect Soviet military rifles and have several original snipers. I have an SVD and three original PU snipers and several x-PU and one x-Pem sniper. These are not the made up ones from Mitchels and many other sources. As far as the scope sr numbers on the rifle, I find that my known originals have the mount number on the rifle. This stamped number is the same as the number stamped on the barrel. (This one came from Rguns) The other two have the mount numbers on both the mount and rifle also. You can change scopes all day long but each and every mount assembly cannot be switched. They are hand fitted and adjusted by the arsenal for that exact rifle. Scopes go bad, get fogged and damaged so a new scope is slipped into the mount and zeroed. If you switch the mount to another rifle base you are screwed as it won't align properly. On the back of every PU mount are two thin adjustment rails. These are filed down or welded up as needed to adjust the scopes alignment. Another point is that usless the rifle was picked up in the field, and brought back here, it came from an importer and was refurbed by the arsenal. I would say that 99.9% of all "original" sniper rifles in this country are refurbed by the arsenals. I am not a Vic Thomas, but I have seen a lot of so called original PU sniper rifles and almost all of them are made up right here in the USA by dealers and importers. It is not hard to obtain an original scope and mount, as the decomissioned snipers had the scopes refurbed and packed into storage crates. This is where the importers get their original scopes they put on any old 9130 and advertise as genuine snipers. The scope and mount are genuine but it never came on that rifle. I have, as I am sure many of you have,seen PU snipers, made up on dated 9130's that are completely out of the date ranges for PU snipers. PU snipers did not come about until 1943 and 44. Some PU's may have been built in late 1942 but I have not seen one. If you want a genuine PU sniper you need to contact RGuns. They had original PU snipers right out of the Russian crates of stored, refurbed snipers. Just my thoughts. </div></div>

+1 on RGuns snipers. I have heard only good feedback on their PU Snipers.