Suppressors Supressor accuracy for long range?
- Thread starter 2500yards
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Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
i have a slightly different POI with my suppressor, but its constant and shoots the same out to 600. If you site it in for 100 without a suppressor, obviously at 600 with a suppressor the variation in POI will appear to be more significant.
So if you want to shoot long range with a suppressor, site in with it and you'll never have to worry about it.
As long as you get consistent velocities there's no real reason why there should be any decrease in accuracy.
I'm no expert, just never seen any difference.
i have a slightly different POI with my suppressor, but its constant and shoots the same out to 600. If you site it in for 100 without a suppressor, obviously at 600 with a suppressor the variation in POI will appear to be more significant.
So if you want to shoot long range with a suppressor, site in with it and you'll never have to worry about it.
As long as you get consistent velocities there's no real reason why there should be any decrease in accuracy.
I'm no expert, just never seen any difference.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2500yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just got off the phone with a guy who said using a supressor for long range is bad for accuracy. Is this true? I always was told they helped.</div></div>
get him back on the phone and tell him Boltripper said he's a jackass......
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2500yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just got off the phone with a guy who said using a supressor for long range is bad for accuracy. Is this true? I always was told they helped.</div></div>
get him back on the phone and tell him Boltripper said he's a jackass......
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
I am more accurate when using a suppressor on my long-range rifles for several reasons:
1) Reduced barrel whip. If you hang a weight, like a suppressor, on the end of your muzzle the barrel will "whip" less as the bullet travels.
2) Reduced recoil. What can I say; I have a flinching problem if I shoot the bigger calibers w/o a suppressor. So, I shoot better with a can on my rifles than without one.
3) Reduced muzzle blast. See #2.
I am more accurate when using a suppressor on my long-range rifles for several reasons:
1) Reduced barrel whip. If you hang a weight, like a suppressor, on the end of your muzzle the barrel will "whip" less as the bullet travels.
2) Reduced recoil. What can I say; I have a flinching problem if I shoot the bigger calibers w/o a suppressor. So, I shoot better with a can on my rifles than without one.
3) Reduced muzzle blast. See #2.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BOLTRIPPER</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
get him back on the phone and tell him Boltripper said he's a jackass......</div></div>
I should post who told me that. The guy basically laughed at me when I told him I shot with a supressor long range. Said he has been shooting competitions for a long time and never seen any competitive shooters using supressors.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BOLTRIPPER</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
get him back on the phone and tell him Boltripper said he's a jackass......</div></div>
I should post who told me that. The guy basically laughed at me when I told him I shot with a supressor long range. Said he has been shooting competitions for a long time and never seen any competitive shooters using supressors.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2500yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BOLTRIPPER</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
get him back on the phone and tell him Boltripper said he's a jackass......</div></div>
I should post who told me that. The guy basically laughed at me when I told him I shot with a supressor long range. Said he has been shooting competitions for a long time and never seen any competitive shooters using supressors. </div></div>
Because most (if not all) don't allow them as they would create an unfair advantage!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2500yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BOLTRIPPER</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
get him back on the phone and tell him Boltripper said he's a jackass......</div></div>
I should post who told me that. The guy basically laughed at me when I told him I shot with a supressor long range. Said he has been shooting competitions for a long time and never seen any competitive shooters using supressors. </div></div>
Because most (if not all) don't allow them as they would create an unfair advantage!
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
We use suppressors in every demo, training class, etc. We shoot them in front of cameras at 2500 yards with pretty good results. My thought is, if you have one shoot it...all the time. Of course, I don't shoot a 60#+ rifle made for a concrete bench and chambered for a PPC cartridge either! The guys above also have good explanations, especially how it effects the operator.
djd
We use suppressors in every demo, training class, etc. We shoot them in front of cameras at 2500 yards with pretty good results. My thought is, if you have one shoot it...all the time. Of course, I don't shoot a 60#+ rifle made for a concrete bench and chambered for a PPC cartridge either! The guys above also have good explanations, especially how it effects the operator.
djd
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
Im going to post who told me this. After reading in another post about how someones suppressor got damaged from being threaded wrong, more than likely I am in no way gonna risk buying a barrel from these guys. With thier ignorant comments and lack on knowledge. They can enjoy the negative feedback.
WHITE OAK ARMAMENT is who said this to me on the phone today.
http://www.whiteoakarmament.com/index.htm
Im going to post who told me this. After reading in another post about how someones suppressor got damaged from being threaded wrong, more than likely I am in no way gonna risk buying a barrel from these guys. With thier ignorant comments and lack on knowledge. They can enjoy the negative feedback.
WHITE OAK ARMAMENT is who said this to me on the phone today.
http://www.whiteoakarmament.com/index.htm
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
I wouldn't call it ignorant, White Oak is in different game, a game where muzzle brakes, and suppressors are not allowed, in this game they are, and I see alot of people using them to great effect, a nice square crown, concentric threads, and a quaility suppressor will do small groups all day long with a good driver, POI shiifts are just part of the deal, as long as there cocnsistent its no big deal
I wouldn't call it ignorant, White Oak is in different game, a game where muzzle brakes, and suppressors are not allowed, in this game they are, and I see alot of people using them to great effect, a nice square crown, concentric threads, and a quaility suppressor will do small groups all day long with a good driver, POI shiifts are just part of the deal, as long as there cocnsistent its no big deal
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
The ignorant part was how they treated me on the phone. I was the idiot on the other side of the phone line that has no idea about anything and on top of that, a laughing matter to them.
The ignorant part was how they treated me on the phone. I was the idiot on the other side of the phone line that has no idea about anything and on top of that, a laughing matter to them.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
I am sure I will be a jackass for saying this, but I have an M40 A1 cloan that Mike Lau made up for me. It shoots about 0 at 100 yards. Some 3 shot groups will actully hold a 30 cal bullet and I cannot measure difference between the group and a single shot fired next to it. The hole just looks a bit darker around the edge. With the can on the groups open to about .25 moa. Just my expirence. I think they are just another variable. Cool gas inside as opposed to hot, can moves during firing string etc. I do think most people shoot better with a can, due to recoil, blast etc. I have not seen any benchrest shooters playing with them. May be aginst the rules. I have never seen a group better than .5 moa at 1000 yd with a can. I am sure some of you have some but not me.
I am sure I will be a jackass for saying this, but I have an M40 A1 cloan that Mike Lau made up for me. It shoots about 0 at 100 yards. Some 3 shot groups will actully hold a 30 cal bullet and I cannot measure difference between the group and a single shot fired next to it. The hole just looks a bit darker around the edge. With the can on the groups open to about .25 moa. Just my expirence. I think they are just another variable. Cool gas inside as opposed to hot, can moves during firing string etc. I do think most people shoot better with a can, due to recoil, blast etc. I have not seen any benchrest shooters playing with them. May be aginst the rules. I have never seen a group better than .5 moa at 1000 yd with a can. I am sure some of you have some but not me.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2500yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Im going to post who told me this. After reading in another post about how someones suppressor got damaged from being threaded wrong, more than likely I am in no way gonna risk buying a barrel from these guys. With thier ignorant comments and lack on knowledge. They can enjoy the negative feedback.
WHITE OAK ARMAMENT is who said this to me on the phone today.
http://www.whiteoakarmament.com/index.htm</div></div>
I have to ask...Is this post about how a suppressor effects accuracy at distance or about your opinion of J. Hollinger and White Oak Precision?
As stated above, J. Hollinger builds some of the finest Service Rifle and Match rifles around. I am sure if you requested a 1/2x28 thread for a suppressor, they could do it and it would be correct.
Mr. Hollinger built my Service Rifle upper several years ago and it is a hammer. I would strongly recommend their products to anyone in the HP game.
Are they the first people I would ask about suppressors...No.
Not part of what they do. There are many other companies and individuals who post here that will provide a tremendous about of usable info where long range and suppressors are concerned.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2500yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Im going to post who told me this. After reading in another post about how someones suppressor got damaged from being threaded wrong, more than likely I am in no way gonna risk buying a barrel from these guys. With thier ignorant comments and lack on knowledge. They can enjoy the negative feedback.
WHITE OAK ARMAMENT is who said this to me on the phone today.
http://www.whiteoakarmament.com/index.htm</div></div>
I have to ask...Is this post about how a suppressor effects accuracy at distance or about your opinion of J. Hollinger and White Oak Precision?
As stated above, J. Hollinger builds some of the finest Service Rifle and Match rifles around. I am sure if you requested a 1/2x28 thread for a suppressor, they could do it and it would be correct.
Mr. Hollinger built my Service Rifle upper several years ago and it is a hammer. I would strongly recommend their products to anyone in the HP game.
Are they the first people I would ask about suppressors...No.
Not part of what they do. There are many other companies and individuals who post here that will provide a tremendous about of usable info where long range and suppressors are concerned.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
the one that was damaged probably came un threaded..We have shot my can out to 1950 yards and it hit a 10 inch target....several times..Pretty dam accurate!!
the one that was damaged probably came un threaded..We have shot my can out to 1950 yards and it hit a 10 inch target....several times..Pretty dam accurate!!
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MTETM</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2500yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Im going to post who told me this. After reading in another post about how someones suppressor got damaged from being threaded wrong, more than likely I am in no way gonna risk buying a barrel from these guys. With thier ignorant comments and lack on knowledge. They can enjoy the negative feedback.
WHITE OAK ARMAMENT is who said this to me on the phone today.
http://www.whiteoakarmament.com/index.htm</div></div>
I have to ask...Is this post about how a suppressor effects accuracy at distance or about your opinion of J. Hollinger and White Oak Precision?
As stated above, J. Hollinger builds some of the finest Service Rifle and Match rifles around. I am sure if you requested a 1/2x28 thread for a suppressor, they could do it and it would be correct.
Mr. Hollinger built my Service Rifle upper several years ago and it is a hammer. I would strongly recommend their products to anyone in the HP game.
Are they the first people I would ask about suppressors...No.
Not part of what they do. There are many other companies and individuals who post here that will provide a tremendous about of usable info where long range and suppressors are concerned.
</div></div>
Honestly, It started as an honest question about accuracy with suppressors based on what they said when I called there. I wanted to know if they were correct or not. I wanted to know if what I was always told was incorrect. This topic could of gone either way. Im not proud of putting them out there like this, but if the guy on the other end of the phoneline would of been more friendly and helpful rather than cocky and arrogant I would of kept it to myself.
A friend of mine is an incredible shooter. he has a rifle like mine and shoots a little less than 1 MOA at 400 yards with his. He told me to look into a 26 inch barrel, so thats why I called. I simply asked if they could thread it for my suppressor and he thought it was a joke I would want my suppressor on there.
Thats the story.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MTETM</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2500yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Im going to post who told me this. After reading in another post about how someones suppressor got damaged from being threaded wrong, more than likely I am in no way gonna risk buying a barrel from these guys. With thier ignorant comments and lack on knowledge. They can enjoy the negative feedback.
WHITE OAK ARMAMENT is who said this to me on the phone today.
http://www.whiteoakarmament.com/index.htm</div></div>
I have to ask...Is this post about how a suppressor effects accuracy at distance or about your opinion of J. Hollinger and White Oak Precision?
As stated above, J. Hollinger builds some of the finest Service Rifle and Match rifles around. I am sure if you requested a 1/2x28 thread for a suppressor, they could do it and it would be correct.
Mr. Hollinger built my Service Rifle upper several years ago and it is a hammer. I would strongly recommend their products to anyone in the HP game.
Are they the first people I would ask about suppressors...No.
Not part of what they do. There are many other companies and individuals who post here that will provide a tremendous about of usable info where long range and suppressors are concerned.
</div></div>
Honestly, It started as an honest question about accuracy with suppressors based on what they said when I called there. I wanted to know if they were correct or not. I wanted to know if what I was always told was incorrect. This topic could of gone either way. Im not proud of putting them out there like this, but if the guy on the other end of the phoneline would of been more friendly and helpful rather than cocky and arrogant I would of kept it to myself.
A friend of mine is an incredible shooter. he has a rifle like mine and shoots a little less than 1 MOA at 400 yards with his. He told me to look into a 26 inch barrel, so thats why I called. I simply asked if they could thread it for my suppressor and he thought it was a joke I would want my suppressor on there.
Thats the story.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
Some of the best IBS 600yd shooters in the country use muzzle brakes on their rifles and i view a suppressor as just a longer enclosed muzzle break. 6mmbr.com posted a very good article on muzzle brakes and accuracy wich I view as applying to a suppressor as well.
my limited testing on my long range guns proved no ill affects on accuracy long or short with a can on. I have only tested the SRT XL Ti so don't know if other cans would affect accuracy. Being a 600yd competitor myself, i know that a gun has to do it at a 100 to do it at 600 and of course optics, stock, bullet, and basic gun set-up will aid in long range accuracy but I do not beleive the statement of a suppressor absolutely hurting long range accuracy,,, at least I haven't seen that.
I guess every man is entiltled to his opinion but he should voice it as such,,, an opinion...
Some of the best IBS 600yd shooters in the country use muzzle brakes on their rifles and i view a suppressor as just a longer enclosed muzzle break. 6mmbr.com posted a very good article on muzzle brakes and accuracy wich I view as applying to a suppressor as well.
my limited testing on my long range guns proved no ill affects on accuracy long or short with a can on. I have only tested the SRT XL Ti so don't know if other cans would affect accuracy. Being a 600yd competitor myself, i know that a gun has to do it at a 100 to do it at 600 and of course optics, stock, bullet, and basic gun set-up will aid in long range accuracy but I do not beleive the statement of a suppressor absolutely hurting long range accuracy,,, at least I haven't seen that.
I guess every man is entiltled to his opinion but he should voice it as such,,, an opinion...
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
............... Larger version of above photo.
Suppressed rifles have won over half the practical long-range matches in the last 4 years around here. "Team Thunder Beast" usually has one or two in the top 3. I won the '06 Steel Safari overall and got 1st Unlimited in '07 with a suppressed 26" .260. Who cares about barrel whip when it's consistent and can print sub-half groups at 1000?
............... Larger version of above photo.
Suppressed rifles have won over half the practical long-range matches in the last 4 years around here. "Team Thunder Beast" usually has one or two in the top 3. I won the '06 Steel Safari overall and got 1st Unlimited in '07 with a suppressed 26" .260. Who cares about barrel whip when it's consistent and can print sub-half groups at 1000?
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
When we first started shooting our SR25's, and the MK 11's that followed we noticed no major gain/loss in accuracy, just a shift in point of impact, even at longer ranges(up to 1K)
I think, and this is just my opinion, that if you are an well trained shooter, who is making the most of the rifle/optics and ammo, then the suppressor is the last piece of the puzzle that can make you an outstanding shot. Having no muzzle blast and less noise allows you to shoot, follow thru perfectly and reset the trigger all while watching your round impact the target. Which quickly becomes something you take for granted until you jump behind something like a Barrett and try and engage a target with out a spotter...
If I lived in a state that allowed me to actually use one, I would own one no questions asked.
When we first started shooting our SR25's, and the MK 11's that followed we noticed no major gain/loss in accuracy, just a shift in point of impact, even at longer ranges(up to 1K)
I think, and this is just my opinion, that if you are an well trained shooter, who is making the most of the rifle/optics and ammo, then the suppressor is the last piece of the puzzle that can make you an outstanding shot. Having no muzzle blast and less noise allows you to shoot, follow thru perfectly and reset the trigger all while watching your round impact the target. Which quickly becomes something you take for granted until you jump behind something like a Barrett and try and engage a target with out a spotter...
If I lived in a state that allowed me to actually use one, I would own one no questions asked.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
I think comparing a muzzle break to a suppressor might be a bit different. The MB, I am sure is really "fixed" into place. The suppressor will always have a bit of movement to it and also contains gasses, at varying temps. I hope you guys are right about acc. improvment, I just have not seen it with the 5 cans I have expirence with.
I also think that less than .5 moa at 1000 is good enough for most anything. I use suppressors a great deal, I just have not seen them improve true accuracy. I do see many shooters improve when they have one on a gun, but that is a human factor, not an accuracy factor. They are not pushing the edge of the rifle. JMO
I think comparing a muzzle break to a suppressor might be a bit different. The MB, I am sure is really "fixed" into place. The suppressor will always have a bit of movement to it and also contains gasses, at varying temps. I hope you guys are right about acc. improvment, I just have not seen it with the 5 cans I have expirence with.
I also think that less than .5 moa at 1000 is good enough for most anything. I use suppressors a great deal, I just have not seen them improve true accuracy. I do see many shooters improve when they have one on a gun, but that is a human factor, not an accuracy factor. They are not pushing the edge of the rifle. JMO
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
As stated above, J. Hollinger builds some of the finest Service Rifle and Match rifles around. I am sure if you requested a 1/2x28 thread for a suppressor, they could do it and it would be correct.
Mr. Hollinger built my Service Rifle upper several years ago and it is a hammer. I would strongly recommend their products to anyone in the HP game.
I have found this to be true also. John did a 6 mm barrel for an AR project and threaded it 5/8 X 24 for an AAC suppressor. Works great and he didn't have any comments about it either. Great people to work with!!
As stated above, J. Hollinger builds some of the finest Service Rifle and Match rifles around. I am sure if you requested a 1/2x28 thread for a suppressor, they could do it and it would be correct.
Mr. Hollinger built my Service Rifle upper several years ago and it is a hammer. I would strongly recommend their products to anyone in the HP game.
I have found this to be true also. John did a 6 mm barrel for an AR project and threaded it 5/8 X 24 for an AAC suppressor. Works great and he didn't have any comments about it either. Great people to work with!!
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEZJ_C4LwzA
Here I am shooting my 408 at 2700 yards with a suppressor. It's not a problem.........
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEZJ_C4LwzA
Here I am shooting my 408 at 2700 yards with a suppressor. It's not a problem.........
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
I think the OP was not how accurate is a suppressed rifle, as we all know they are quite accurate. It was more about Do suppressors help or hurt accuracy? My point is, I have never seen an accurate rifle that was helped by a suppressor. Most of mine have gone slightly down hill.
I think the OP was not how accurate is a suppressed rifle, as we all know they are quite accurate. It was more about Do suppressors help or hurt accuracy? My point is, I have never seen an accurate rifle that was helped by a suppressor. Most of mine have gone slightly down hill.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rth1800</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think the OP was not how accurate is a suppressed rifle, as we all know they are quite accurate. It was more about Do suppressors help or hurt accuracy? My point is, I have never seen an accurate rifle that was helped by a suppressor. Most of mine have gone slightly down hill. </div></div>
If you're saying suppressors are hurting the accuracy of your rifles I think everyone would probably like some more details if you could provide them.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rth1800</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think the OP was not how accurate is a suppressed rifle, as we all know they are quite accurate. It was more about Do suppressors help or hurt accuracy? My point is, I have never seen an accurate rifle that was helped by a suppressor. Most of mine have gone slightly down hill. </div></div>
If you're saying suppressors are hurting the accuracy of your rifles I think everyone would probably like some more details if you could provide them.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
Couragewolf,
Look at my OP on this subject, I can do more or look at old notes, but that pretty much sums it up. On a very accurate rifle, a slight, consistant degradation of accuracy. Do not take this wrong, I shoot suppressed all the time and prefer it, but I tend to think some of the improved accuracy claims are advertising hype, and some more of it is people shooting better with less recoil and muzzle blast.
I also have a Les Baer AR. Shot about .25 moa at 200 without suppressor and about .5 moa with suppressor. I have never seen it otherwise. Won't keep me from using one, just not falling for the hype.
Couragewolf,
Look at my OP on this subject, I can do more or look at old notes, but that pretty much sums it up. On a very accurate rifle, a slight, consistant degradation of accuracy. Do not take this wrong, I shoot suppressed all the time and prefer it, but I tend to think some of the improved accuracy claims are advertising hype, and some more of it is people shooting better with less recoil and muzzle blast.
I also have a Les Baer AR. Shot about .25 moa at 200 without suppressor and about .5 moa with suppressor. I have never seen it otherwise. Won't keep me from using one, just not falling for the hype.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
Read through your posts makes sense.
Sorry didn't look through all your previous posts before looking at clarification.
I haven't gotten my can yet but I'm not shooting .25 moa either so I am guessing all of this will probably not mean much to me either way
I can appreciate the hypothesis that the can is not fixed, moving and changing temperatures though.
I think some scientific quality validation would really be needed for anyone to make a certain claim on this issue one way or another.
I mean, howabout a threaded can? Those really shouldn't be moving around should they?
I suppose I am a little out of depth here I was just looking for somewhat of more validating evidence than anectdotal.
I'd set out to do this for myself, but I'm not that good of a shooter
Maybe someon can call up those Houston warehouse shooting in a vacuum guys and get them to do something for us
Read through your posts makes sense.
Sorry didn't look through all your previous posts before looking at clarification.
I haven't gotten my can yet but I'm not shooting .25 moa either so I am guessing all of this will probably not mean much to me either way
I can appreciate the hypothesis that the can is not fixed, moving and changing temperatures though.
I think some scientific quality validation would really be needed for anyone to make a certain claim on this issue one way or another.
I mean, howabout a threaded can? Those really shouldn't be moving around should they?
I suppose I am a little out of depth here I was just looking for somewhat of more validating evidence than anectdotal.
I'd set out to do this for myself, but I'm not that good of a shooter
Maybe someon can call up those Houston warehouse shooting in a vacuum guys and get them to do something for us
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
oh for FUCK SAKES ...........
in regard to bolt gun barrels,
...if the barrel is shooting well , and you get a perfect thread-job, and you put a well made suppressor on said barrel....there will be no loss in accuracy, there will be some small velocity boost.....All the suppressor do is....turn noise into heat.....
oh for FUCK SAKES ...........
in regard to bolt gun barrels,
...if the barrel is shooting well , and you get a perfect thread-job, and you put a well made suppressor on said barrel....there will be no loss in accuracy, there will be some small velocity boost.....All the suppressor do is....turn noise into heat.....
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2500yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Lets call up Myth Busters.
</div></div>
You know they gotta be lookin for new show ideas who know's maybe they'd bite
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2500yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Lets call up Myth Busters.
You know they gotta be lookin for new show ideas who know's maybe they'd bite
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
C/W,
I am not an expert, but I have a long distance range at my house. I shoot several days a week and get quite a bit of trigger time. Have some cool toys. I approached cans like I do with every new thing I try. Positive attitude, but must see proof. I also have many people come and shoot with me and set up rifles etc. So I get to see the results of not just me. Most shoot better with a suppressor. Most are not pushing the envelope of accuracy within the rifle. Practicaly, it is not a factor. I just think making the statement that suppressors improve accuracy is misleading, at least. If they did, Tony Boyer would figure a way to shoot one in matches.
I used to hear people say," I can kill a pheasant just as far with a 20 ga as a 12 ga." My reply was "Yes, I am sure you can, but you cannot kill a pheasant with a 20ga as far as I can kill one with a 12 ga." I think it is the same thing, a suppressor may help a person shoot better, but not by improving the actual accuracy of the rifle. Just making it more shootable.
I am a huge promoter of suppressors, on their true merits, but I do not think they are the key to pure accuracy. JMO
C/W,
I am not an expert, but I have a long distance range at my house. I shoot several days a week and get quite a bit of trigger time. Have some cool toys. I approached cans like I do with every new thing I try. Positive attitude, but must see proof. I also have many people come and shoot with me and set up rifles etc. So I get to see the results of not just me. Most shoot better with a suppressor. Most are not pushing the envelope of accuracy within the rifle. Practicaly, it is not a factor. I just think making the statement that suppressors improve accuracy is misleading, at least. If they did, Tony Boyer would figure a way to shoot one in matches.
I used to hear people say," I can kill a pheasant just as far with a 20 ga as a 12 ga." My reply was "Yes, I am sure you can, but you cannot kill a pheasant with a 20ga as far as I can kill one with a 12 ga." I think it is the same thing, a suppressor may help a person shoot better, but not by improving the actual accuracy of the rifle. Just making it more shootable.
I am a huge promoter of suppressors, on their true merits, but I do not think they are the key to pure accuracy. JMO
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
Boltripper,
Your reply gives a sense that you are exasperated with the subject. I do not disagree that suppressors are benificial, but have not seen evidence that they improve the accuracy of an otherwise accurate rifle. Have you? If so, can you give details.
I never find the details of precision shooting exasperating. For me accuracy is an absolute, and I have not acheived it yet. Can you show me a rifle that shoots .25 moa and improves with a can? QD or thread on? I just have not seen one. Can you say why there are no BR shooters playing with them and trying to get the rules changed? Or shooting non formal matches with them?
Boltripper,
Your reply gives a sense that you are exasperated with the subject. I do not disagree that suppressors are benificial, but have not seen evidence that they improve the accuracy of an otherwise accurate rifle. Have you? If so, can you give details.
I never find the details of precision shooting exasperating. For me accuracy is an absolute, and I have not acheived it yet. Can you show me a rifle that shoots .25 moa and improves with a can? QD or thread on? I just have not seen one. Can you say why there are no BR shooters playing with them and trying to get the rules changed? Or shooting non formal matches with them?
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rth1800</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Boltripper,
Your reply gives a sense that you are exasperated with the subject. I do not disagree that suppressors are benificial, but have not seen evidence that they improve the accuracy of an otherwise accurate rifle. Have you? If so, can you give details.
I never find the details of precision shooting exasperating. For me accuracy is an absolute, and I have not acheived it yet. Can you show me a rifle that shoots .25 moa and improves with a can? QD or thread on? I just have not seen one. Can you say why there are no BR shooters playing with them and trying to get the rules changed? Or shooting non formal matches with them? </div></div>
rth....no...you are right and correct in your musing on this subject...cans ,at least in my experience do not add any magic....all they are, are a tool
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rth1800</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Boltripper,
Your reply gives a sense that you are exasperated with the subject. I do not disagree that suppressors are benificial, but have not seen evidence that they improve the accuracy of an otherwise accurate rifle. Have you? If so, can you give details.
I never find the details of precision shooting exasperating. For me accuracy is an absolute, and I have not acheived it yet. Can you show me a rifle that shoots .25 moa and improves with a can? QD or thread on? I just have not seen one. Can you say why there are no BR shooters playing with them and trying to get the rules changed? Or shooting non formal matches with them? </div></div>
rth....no...you are right and correct in your musing on this subject...cans ,at least in my experience do not add any magic....all they are, are a tool
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
FWIW, my best groups ever were in the hi .1's, low .2's, and they were shot with the suppressor. I could not reproduce it with the suppressor off, but this - as others have noted - is strictly inconclusive with regard to the effect of the suppressor.
Results from NR and NRAHP are irrelevant since their rules strictly forbid suppressors.
-z
FWIW, my best groups ever were in the hi .1's, low .2's, and they were shot with the suppressor. I could not reproduce it with the suppressor off, but this - as others have noted - is strictly inconclusive with regard to the effect of the suppressor.
Results from NR and NRAHP are irrelevant since their rules strictly forbid suppressors.
-z
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rth1800</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am sure I will be a jackass for saying this, but I have an M40 A1 cloan that Mike Lau made up for me. It shoots about 0 at 100 yards. Some 3 shot groups will actully hold a 30 cal bullet and I cannot measure difference between the group and a single shot fired next to it. The hole just looks a bit darker around the edge. With the can on the groups open to about .25 moa. Just my expirence. I think they are just another variable. Cool gas inside as opposed to hot, can moves during firing string etc. I do think most people shoot better with a can, due to recoil, blast etc. I have not seen any benchrest shooters playing with them. May be aginst the rules. I have never seen a group better than .5 moa at 1000 yd with a can. I am sure some of you have some but not me. </div></div>
What kind of can do you have?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rth1800</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am sure I will be a jackass for saying this, but I have an M40 A1 cloan that Mike Lau made up for me. It shoots about 0 at 100 yards. Some 3 shot groups will actully hold a 30 cal bullet and I cannot measure difference between the group and a single shot fired next to it. The hole just looks a bit darker around the edge. With the can on the groups open to about .25 moa. Just my expirence. I think they are just another variable. Cool gas inside as opposed to hot, can moves during firing string etc. I do think most people shoot better with a can, due to recoil, blast etc. I have not seen any benchrest shooters playing with them. May be aginst the rules. I have never seen a group better than .5 moa at 1000 yd with a can. I am sure some of you have some but not me. </div></div>
What kind of can do you have?
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
rth1800, how can you compare a group size at 100yards and the group size at 1000yards? Just because your rifle shoots .1's at 100 doesnt mean that it will shoot the same at 1000, so I dont see how that could be a viable comparison.
rth1800, how can you compare a group size at 100yards and the group size at 1000yards? Just because your rifle shoots .1's at 100 doesnt mean that it will shoot the same at 1000, so I dont see how that could be a viable comparison.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
One of our customers, upon taking delivery, shot something like 50 groups using our 30P, the regular brake, and a base muzzle. Taking group averages, the best results were with our can. I believe it was a TRG-22, but I could be remembering wrong.
One of our customers, upon taking delivery, shot something like 50 groups using our 30P, the regular brake, and a base muzzle. Taking group averages, the best results were with our can. I believe it was a TRG-22, but I could be remembering wrong.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
RESPONSE from someone on the mythbusters site.
================
Adam has stated that they won't be doing any suppressor myths.
Pick up a copy of the September/October 2009 Rifle Magazine.
There is an article about suppressors, and yes, they can make a rifle shoot tighter groups.
Here is a site that talks about accuracy:
http://www.surefire.com/suppre...ticles_science_intro
It seems the concensus there at sniper's hide is that they do help accuracy, or at least don't harm accuracy,with only the one guy saying that his group sizes went up.
As I said, the team won't do any supressor myths, production OR homemade.
http://community.discovery.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/9741919888/m/16819369201
RESPONSE from someone on the mythbusters site.
================
Adam has stated that they won't be doing any suppressor myths.
Pick up a copy of the September/October 2009 Rifle Magazine.
There is an article about suppressors, and yes, they can make a rifle shoot tighter groups.
Here is a site that talks about accuracy:
http://www.surefire.com/suppre...ticles_science_intro
It seems the concensus there at sniper's hide is that they do help accuracy, or at least don't harm accuracy,with only the one guy saying that his group sizes went up.
As I said, the team won't do any supressor myths, production OR homemade.
http://community.discovery.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/9741919888/m/16819369201
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
I am not comparing the groups. When I say 100, that is all. When I say 1000 that is all. I shoot mostly from 100 to 800. I can do that at my house. To shoot further I need to go to another farm about 20 min away. I shoot at 800 a lot and 1000 a little. The groups I am speaking of are mostly 3 shot and 5 shot. Might not be a good sample. I also think that the installation of he break itself might be a bit of a problem. I am now having my new barrels counter bored in the thread area to prevent stress in the critical muzzle/crown area. I am mostly using Surefire cans on the CF rifles. I have used some a thread on cans as well.
What is a "base muzzle"
I would like to say again, I am not against suppressors, I am just not convinced they improve true accuracy. Shootability yes.
Also, about the BR game, I realize they are prohibited, but if they were the answer, don't you think someone would be doing some expirementation, or setting up matches that did not comply. Those boys are gong to do whatever it takes to get all those bullets in one hole, and change the rules as needed, to reach that goal.
I am not comparing the groups. When I say 100, that is all. When I say 1000 that is all. I shoot mostly from 100 to 800. I can do that at my house. To shoot further I need to go to another farm about 20 min away. I shoot at 800 a lot and 1000 a little. The groups I am speaking of are mostly 3 shot and 5 shot. Might not be a good sample. I also think that the installation of he break itself might be a bit of a problem. I am now having my new barrels counter bored in the thread area to prevent stress in the critical muzzle/crown area. I am mostly using Surefire cans on the CF rifles. I have used some a thread on cans as well.
What is a "base muzzle"
I would like to say again, I am not against suppressors, I am just not convinced they improve true accuracy. Shootability yes.
Also, about the BR game, I realize they are prohibited, but if they were the answer, don't you think someone would be doing some expirementation, or setting up matches that did not comply. Those boys are gong to do whatever it takes to get all those bullets in one hole, and change the rules as needed, to reach that goal.
Re: Supressor accuracy for long range?
It was accurate enough today... I'm on the left and put these down on one set. Ranges - 120, 388, 250... Love my can..
It was accurate enough today... I'm on the left and put these down on one set. Ranges - 120, 388, 250... Love my can..
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