Talk me into or out of an auto trickler v3

Sokam101

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I'm just getting into prs shooting. I'm a little ocd with wanting things to be pretty accurate. My current charge master can be +-.1 grains and I don't love it. I don't even feel like I can do ladder or OCW tests accurately because my charge could be off. If I have the money and want the peace of mind that my charges are pretty close. Is it worth it over the chargemaster? Have any of you switched from a charge master?
 

rtB

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Funny you should ask. Just now finished loading 100 rounds on my V3. Goes about as fast as I can seat bullets, and over 100 rounds it was +/- .02gr.

And it's super easy to do load workups with the app and bluetooth. Can increment charge weight by just tapping a button on the app and throwing another charge.

One of the best purchases for precision reloading.
 

Sokam101

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Funny you should ask. Just now finished loading 100 rounds on my V3. Goes about as fast as I can seat bullets, and over 100 rounds it was +/- .02gr.

And it's super easy to do load workups with the app and bluetooth. Can increment charge weight by just tapping a button on the app and throwing another charge.

One of the best purchases for precision reloading.
What did you use before? Did your SD's improve?
 

canezach

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    I've had one for a few years, so obviously not a v3, but still an Auto Trickler. Before that, I was using a Chargemaster, and before that, an old RCBS beam scale.

    The AutoTrickler will throw about as fast as you can seat, which is why i bought one. Well, that and I have GAS (Gear Acquisition Syndrome). The good is they're very accurate, very repeatable, very little drift, and very fast. The bad; don't use your scale in any drafty area or you'll see quite a bit of fluctuation from throw to throw, and that even includes an indie room where the AC will cause a slight current of air to mess with the scale. You might not even feel it, but the scale does.

    With all that said, I saw very, VERY minimal difference between loads thrown on the Auto Trickler setup and my old Chargemaster. My SD and ES as far as I can tell are identical. My groups didn't magically shrink. In reality, it does nothing the Chargemaster doesn't do. It just does it a tad faster and with more resolution, which can actually work against you if you have OCD. Trust me, chasing that little 0.02 grain is a real thing lol. If you're trying to get your SD and ES down, the Auto Trickler won't do it. But if you have good numbers to begin with and you're looking to throw charges as quickly as possible, the Auto Trickler will do what you're looking for
     

    Sokam101

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    I've had one for a few years, so obviously not a v3, but still an Auto Trickler. Before that, I was using a Chargemaster, and before that, an old RCBS beam scale.

    The AutoTrickler will throw about as fast as you can seat, which is why i bought one. Well, that and I have GAS (Gear Acquisition Syndrome). The good is they're very accurate, very repeatable, very little drift, and very fast. The bad; don't use your scale in any drafty area or you'll see quite a bit of fluctuation from throw to throw, and that even includes an indie room where the AC will cause a slight current of air to mess with the scale. You might not even feel it, but the scale does.

    With all that said, I saw very, VERY minimal difference between loads thrown on the Auto Trickler setup and my old Chargemaster. My SD and ES as far as I can tell are identical. My groups didn't magically shrink. In reality, it does nothing the Chargemaster doesn't do. It just does it a tad faster and with more resolution, which can actually work against you if you have OCD. Trust me, chasing that little 0.02 grain is a real thing lol. If you're trying to get your SD and ES down, the Auto Trickler won't do it. But if you have good numbers to begin with and you're looking to throw charges as quickly as possible, the Auto Trickler will do what you're looking for
    Thank you for the reply. I just started using Lapua brass and that helped my SD's a ton over the crap Hornady brass I was using. from 10-12 down to 4SD. The time savings is going to be huge for me as I have a kid coming so the faster I can do stuff the better. My basement doesn't have any drafts but that's good to know.
     

    salks

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    I use a charge master lite with good results. I would love to have a V3 for the speed but I also know it would not make me that much better at PRS style shooting. Building a solid position, fundamentals, reading wind, ect... I shoot 1/2 MOA for the most part when I believe I'm missing shots in PRS because my load is .02 of a grain off maybe I will upgrade.
     

    mbeavers1

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    May be the single best reloading investment you can make. More accurate and fastest charging system available. It will throw charges as fast as you can seat. You can prob charge and seat almost 100 rds in an hour.

    Order it...
     

    Sokam101

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    I use a charge master lite with good results. I would love to have a V3 for the speed but I also know it would not make me that much better at PRS style shooting. Building a solid position, fundamentals, reading wind, ect... I shoot 1/2 MOA for the most part when I believe I'm missing shots in PRS because my load is .02 of a grain off maybe I will upgrade.
    Good thoughts It might not matter much if it doesn't help bring down your sds. I'm not sure how it doesn't if +-.1 vs +-.02 that seems huge to me.
     

    Sokam101

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    May be the single best reloading investment you can make. More accurate and fastest charging system available. It will throw charges as fast as you can seat. You can prob charge and seat almost 100 rds in an hour.

    Order it...
    I'm definitely excited about the time saving aspect. I run a progressive and the charge master im waiting on.
     

    mbeavers1

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    I use a charge master lite with good results. I would love to have a V3 for the speed but I also know it would not make me that much better at PRS style shooting. Building a solid position, fundamentals, reading wind, ect... I shoot 1/2 MOA for the most part when I believe I'm missing shots in PRS because my load is .02 of a grain off maybe I will upgrade.
    This is also true, but for me its as much of a time efficiency thing. I had the CM1500 and it took like 30s to throw 1 charge (assuming no overthrow) where the V3 is like 10s and rarely any overthrows.
     

    canezach

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    A scale isn't going to shrink your SD numbers. A scale isn't going to make your ammo more accurate. There's nothing the scale does that takes the place of A) quality brass, and B) quality reloading practices. The difference between the Auto Trickler and the Chargemaster on the chrono is ZERO, as long as your reloading practices are solid
     

    Sokam101

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    A scale isn't going to shrink your SD numbers. A scale isn't going to make your ammo more accurate. There's nothing the scale does that takes the place of A) quality brass, and B) quality reloading practices. The difference between the Auto Trickler and the Chargemaster on the chrono is ZERO, as long as your reloading practices are solid
    Really? I swear I remember seeing a kennel of powder was like 1.4 fps.
     

    Sokam101

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    This is also true, but for me its as much of a time efficiency thing. I had the CM1500 and it took like 30s to throw 1 charge (assuming no overthrow) where the V3 is like 10s and rarely any overthrows.
    That's a huge time savings and a scale you can trust. I'm definitely leaning towards doing it.
     

    salks

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    This is also true, but for me its as much of a time efficiency thing. I had the CM1500 and it took like 30s to throw 1 charge (assuming no overthrow) where the V3 is like 10s and rarely any overthrows.
    Don't get me wrong I would love to have one just not in the cards right now but alot of people invest in high end equipment thinking it will make them better PRS shooters. Put that 1.4 fps in ballistic calculator see what the difference in drop is or windage.
     

    Sokam101

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    Don't get me wrong I would love to have one just not in the cards right now but alot of people invest in high end equipment thinking it will make them better PRS shooters. Put that 1.4 fps in ballistic calculator see what the difference in drop is or windage.
    I agree. I'm trying to figure out what I should upgrade next. I'm new. I'm using a Tikka ctr. Going to get a chassis for it and burn it up because going a custom gun. I was signed up for a mpa class tomorrow but it got cancelled so now I need to figure out what to do next. Any thoughts? Tripod is one thing I'm considering also.
     

    SourGrapes

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    My v3 is going to be here tomorrow, however I went a tripod before the new v3 kit. Lots of posts about tripods. I wouldn’t hesitate to get a tripod again before a new scale/trickler 🤷‍♂️. The stuff you use while shooting is just more fun than stuff that sits on a bench at home.
     

    Sokam101

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    My v3 is going to be here tomorrow, however I went a tripod before the new v3 kit. Lots of posts about tripods. I wouldn’t hesitate to get a tripod again before a new scale/trickler 🤷‍♂️. The stuff you use while shooting is just more fun than stuff that sits on a bench at home.
    What tripod did you go with? Ill consider getting the tripod for sure!
     

    SourGrapes

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    First was a pig0311 with a sunway foto ballhead, I think it was 300ish. Worked just fine. Then went with RRS w/anvil. Probably one of my favorite purchases for sure.
     
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    Sokam101

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    First was a pig0311 with a sunway foto ballhead, I think it was 300ish. Worked just fine. Then went with RRS w/anvil. Probably one of my favorite purchases for sure.
    Get a good deal on your RRS at all? Is anyone on the hide a dealer?
     

    SourGrapes

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    Full price, I think that’s the going rate unless you find them in the for sale section here. I got mine from Mile High. You can call and talk to them about it.
     

    canezach

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    Really? I swear I remember seeing a kennel of powder was like 1.4 fps.
    I don't think that's necessarily true. I'm not saying it's completely false, but let's use my 6.5 Creedmoor load in Alpha brass as an example. When i was looking for my nodes, 39.1 to either 39.5 or 39.6 have me almost matching velocities in the 2840 range. I ended up testing about 10 rounds of each charge weight and all 30 rounds gave me an ES of about 20 and an SD of 9. One kernel may or may not increase your velocity slightly, but it's certainly within your standard deviation.

    I've posted this a few times when people ask about getting their SD/ES down, but I found my greatest reduction in SD/ES came from using better brass. If you really want to go down that rabbit hole, you'll sort your brass by internal capacity, or at least by weight.

    My second greatest reduction came from consistently setting my neck tension with a mandrel. I found the 0.001" neck tension from my expander mandrel was slightly better than the 0.002" tension from the turning mandrel, but YMMV
     

    cast1

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    It’s smaller numbers on an LCD display but can you really trust it? I have a V2 with the V3 upgrade and mine will drift under the right circumstance. I honestly have more faith in my balance beam which weighs down to the kernel and is repeatable to the limits of my testing.
     

    Lunchbox27

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    Charge master can easily make competitive loads for PRS.

    I have a V3 on order because it’s faster and I do a lot of ELR.
    This! I used a chargemaster for years. It works, and it will work well if you tune it. Where it fails is the speed. Throwing 200 charges in under 30 minutes is what I want and for that it's the V3.
     

    chevy_man

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    Thank you for the reply. I just started using Lapua brass and that helped my SD's a ton over the crap Hornady brass I was using. from 10-12 down to 4SD. The time savings is going to be huge for me as I have a kid coming so the faster I can do stuff the better. My basement doesn't have any drafts but that's good to know.
    In Hornady or prime/Norma brass, it brought my SD's down from 20-30 to 5-8 with h4350. Was using a Hornady electronic thrower.


    Loading 6.5 sta-ball I can throw faster and keep the 5-8 SD's with a Redding comp thrower.


    I don't bother with the ball powder, but I won't throw stick powders with anything but an auto-trickler.
     

    Jumper

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    I've been wanting the V3 for awhile now. It's a better mouse trap, no denying that. But I just can't justify the price tag. I have a CM and I have a Mettler-Toledo milligram analytical balance. The CM varies too much for my OCD. So my poor man workaround for not having the Autotrickler is to use my RCBS Uniflo powder measure set up to throw slightly under weight charges and verify the weight on the Mettler. Sometimes it's spot on. When it's under, I just tap the pan under the CM tube and drop in a few kernels (PP2000MR powder). I can get +/- .o3gr precision this way without too much trouble or time spent. A better method would be to purchase Hornadys extended tube manual powder trickler and not even set up the CM. So my method is just like the AutoTrickler, it's just completely manual, not automatic. I don't shoot competitively so this meets my needs for now.
     

    Sokam101

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    I don't think that's necessarily true. I'm not saying it's completely false, but let's use my 6.5 Creedmoor load in Alpha brass as an example. When i was looking for my nodes, 39.1 to either 39.5 or 39.6 have me almost matching velocities in the 2840 range. I ended up testing about 10 rounds of each charge weight and all 30 rounds gave me an ES of about 20 and an SD of 9. One kernel may or may not increase your velocity slightly, but it's certainly within your standard deviation.

    I've posted this a few times when people ask about getting their SD/ES down, but I found my greatest reduction in SD/ES came from using better brass. If you really want to go down that rabbit hole, you'll sort your brass by internal capacity, or at least by weight.

    My second greatest reduction came from consistently setting my neck tension with a mandrel. I found the 0.001" neck tension from my expander mandrel was slightly better than the 0.002" tension from the turning mandrel, but YMMV
    Were you doing load devolvement with a good balance or charge master? I've yet to have my charge master duplicate it's results. So I'm not sure I can get load devolvement done accuracy. I 💯 agree with you on better brass and neck tension.
     

    OLD308

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    "I'll give you my V3 when you pry it from my cold dead hands"
    Charlton Heston quote, sorta, but ya get the point.
     

    Dave62677

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    Everytime I look at my AutoTrickler, I smile :)

    I let my buddy borrow my Setup for a week, he bought one the week after.
     

    Steel head

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    In Hornady or prime/Norma brass, it brought my SD's down from 20-30 to 5-8 with h4350. Was using a Hornady electronic thrower.


    Loading 6.5 sta-ball I can throw faster and keep the 5-8 SD's with a Redding comp thrower.


    I don't bother with the ball powder, but I won't throw stick powders with anything but an auto-trickler.
    I regularly get 6-7 10 shot SD’s with my Hornandy.
     
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    Sokam101

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    I regularly get 6-7 10 shot SD’s with my Hornandy.
    I wish I could say the same man. My Hornady brass sucked. I was using some bought brass and some once fired factory Hornady. The best sd I could get was 10 or 11 usually 12 to 16. I switched to lapua and I'm down to 5 or 6 sd same methods. When checking the weight of my Hornady it's all over the place. My lapua is pretty much the same.
     

    Steel head

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    I wish I could say the same man. My Hornady brass sucked. I was using some bought brass and some once fired factory Hornady. The best sd I could get was 10 or 11 usually 12 to 16. I switched to lapua and I'm down to 5 or 6 sd same methods. When checking the weight of my Hornady it's all over the place. My lapua is pretty much the same.
    I’d suspect your load development more than your brass because I can get excellent SD’s using my Hornady auto throw and Winchester brass as well.
     
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    rtB

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    As many have mentioned, you can get low SDs with just about any setup. I used a 505 beam scale for years and 6 was a norm.

    But with a V3 you can pretty much eliminate powder charge as a cause for high SDs.

    It's both the speed and precision that make it a great addition to a loading bench.
     

    sodakhunter

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    Im always pressed for time and the V3 has been the best piece of reloading gear i have bought. Only downside is the price but well worth it. Henderson trimmer and Primal Rights CPS have also been good investments. Since i always seem to be rushed these tools remove variables and chances for errors to be made. The interface with a device mist be easy to use as ive had zero issues. Almost no risk on the purchase as these things sell like hotcakes to most anyone who relods and sees it work.
     

    Dthomas3523

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    I don't think that's necessarily true. I'm not saying it's completely false, but let's use my 6.5 Creedmoor load in Alpha brass as an example. When i was looking for my nodes, 39.1 to either 39.5 or 39.6 have me almost matching velocities in the 2840 range. I ended up testing about 10 rounds of each charge weight and all 30 rounds gave me an ES of about 20 and an SD of 9. One kernel may or may not increase your velocity slightly, but it's certainly within your standard deviation.

    I've posted this a few times when people ask about getting their SD/ES down, but I found my greatest reduction in SD/ES came from using better brass. If you really want to go down that rabbit hole, you'll sort your brass by internal capacity, or at least by weight.

    My second greatest reduction came from consistently setting my neck tension with a mandrel. I found the 0.001" neck tension from my expander mandrel was slightly better than the 0.002" tension from the turning mandrel, but YMMV
    As long as you’re using high quality brass, no sorting is necessary. The top shooters in other disciplines have figured this and others are slowing coming along.

    No weighing, capacity sorting, flash hole or primer pocket shenanigans.

    Just mandrel and some are neck turning. Nothing else.
     
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    chevy_man

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    I regularly get 6-7 10 shot SD’s with my Hornandy.

    You got lucky.

    According to the fx-120 mine was +/- .4 grn when it said it was spot on.

    I trust the fx as my SD's dropped when I gave up on the Hornady.
     

    Steel head

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    You got lucky.

    According to the fx-120 mine was +/- .4 grn when it said it was spot on.

    I trust the fx as my SD's dropped when I gave up on the Hornady.
    My Hornandy was about the same compared to the fX-120.
    My SD dropped as well but then a 6 SD never held me back.
    Out to a mile I see absolutely no difference.
    Past 2000 yards I think I might but then the crazy fires and fishing for kings put a halt to my ELR for while.
    How many 1000 f class competitions were won with RCBS and even some Hornandy’s?
    I can tell you,,,,a buttload!
    The V3 is more a luxury than a necessity for 99.99% of shooters.
    I ordered mine for the luxury of being significantly faster.
     
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    Milo 2.5

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    If it is in your head that you Need or severely want, by all means buy. Any coin dumped on a CM at this point is a waste.
    I fought buying a V3, and have yet to see really any gains by having one. I think your load dev method would dictate how effective one may be. Though I did get a new 6BRA and all loads have been from the V3, and it is one accurate rifle, but honestly, I doubt I can attribute that accuracy to one thing, such as the V3.

    I just returned from ND and getting my brother in law into LR shooting, brought him one of my CM's along with his rifle. We had a load in 15 rds to fire all his brass once, added .1gr of powder for the final load. It holds 1/2" of vertical at 550 yards, farthest he can really shoot w/o building his own day ranges.
     

    canezach

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    As long as you’re using high quality brass, no sorting is necessary. The top shooters in other disciplines have figured this and others are slowing coming along.

    No weighing, capacity sorting, flash hole or primer pocket shenanigans.

    Just mandrel and some are neck turning. Nothing else.
    Which is why i said, "If you really want to go down the rabbit hole". I never said it was necessary or recommended, just an option since OP was focused on reducing his SD/ES as much as possible
     

    OneMoreNoMore

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    Not a necessity by any means but if time is money they are really fast. I’ve thrown with a harrells and had great results too.
    I think Cambridge is the cheapest site I’ve seen. Can buy the whole setup and save a couple bucks rather than separate too.
     

    Stevo86

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    Just buy it, saves time and when u save time.... u get to shoot more, also by a giraurd trimmer.
     
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    AllenOne1

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    I bought mine for the safety aspect. I was using a Gempro 250 which is a pretty good scale but after loading several rounds and your mind starts to drift a bit I started to wonder did I just load 42.1 or 41.2. The Auto Trickler is twice the speed, gives me peace of mind and it did lower my SD numbers.
     

    Sokam101

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    I bought mine for the safety aspect. I was using a Gempro 250 which is a pretty good scale but after loading several rounds and your mind starts to drift a bit I started to wonder did I just load 42.1 or 41.2. The Auto Trickler is twice the speed, gives me peace of mind and it did lower my SD numbers.
    Thank you for the advice. I think the time and peace of mind are the biggest things.
     

    Sokam101

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    I got one ordered! I got the scale shipped first so I can at least trickle out some loads. Im going to do a test on new lapua brass. 5 loaded with chargemaster and 5 with auto trickler and see what numbers I can get. From what im seeing on other videos they are going to be close but hopefully a little better for the auto trickler.
     

    OneMoreNoMore

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    Anyone that is thinking about ordering one check out this link.


    Use promo code CAMBRIDGE.
    scale is $475 and the whole kit is $960 with free shipping.
     

    svthuh

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    Lost in Idaho...
    I just flat out cant afford an Auto Trickler.. Yet.. I would love to get one someday, but until then I use a poor mans version..

    Accurized Lyman M5 beam scale, powder dropper and an Omega trickler.. I have a webcam pointed right at the beam indicator thats hooked up to a 43" TV. I get kernel of powder resolution and it didnt break the bank. It is a painfully slow solution though.

    Until then, Ill be jealous of all you guys that must have way better jobs than me (Im currently a sewer collections technician (turd herder) with a local municipality).

    In case anyone is wondering about my setup, some people on a facebook group Im in asked about it, so I recorded this for them.