The mass of a tree

[hermosabeach]

My friends daughter asked the parents a question last week at Taco Tuesday

A big tree- It weights a lot- Where does the weight come from?

Multiple Choice

The Soil
The Air
The Water

Whats your guess?

 

[Rocketvapor]

I dropped a pine that I estimated at about 18,000 lbs after Katrina.
A monster.
It had cracked and was within about 90 feet of the house.
My guess is ground water. But it's probably air

 

[Maggot]

I said the soil but it could equally be the water. Really a combination of the two.

 

[corey4]

Are you asking about when the tree grows where it gets it's nutrients from? Or just the mass in general?

 

[Inifinty]

minerals from the soil for the bulk of solid woods

animals are mostly water but formed from minerals too

Good kids science project.. weigh a piece of freshly cut wood, then weigh it again after it dries out.

 

[Rocketvapor]

Look up water content (%) of freshly cut wood.

Burn the wood, what's left over?

 

[Sean the Nailer]

I said the soil but it could equally be the water. Really a combination of the two.

My opinion, "the soil" as that is where the individual nutrients are. The water is the 'carrier medium' that allows/gets the nutrients to the tree. The 'air' carries the sunlight (figuratively speaking) and it is the sunlight that metabolizes the nutrients into a 'tree'.

Pretty much the same for any plant. Or, I'm completely wrong, off my nut, and out in left field.

 

[Hobo Hilton]

The mass of a tree is primarily carbon. The carbon comes from carbon dioxide used during photosynthesis. During photosynthesis, plants convert the sun's energy into chemical energy which is captured within the bonds of carbon molecules built from atmospheric carbon dioxide and water.

 

[Rocketvapor]

The soil provides the vitamins so the little photosynthesis motors run.
The whole tree is made of

Cellulose - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

and excess Water as a transport medium.

 

[Buckley]

Wood burns because of carbon content. CO2 peeps. Carbon from air it is! A dry chuck of wood still weighs quite a bit.

 

[alpine44]

The biomass of a tree comes from the air through the photosynthesis of CO2. Only water and minerals come from the soil.

 

[DarnYankeeUSMC]

Gravity. If it weren't for gravity the tree wouldn't have any mass.

 

[timesublime]

the tree wouldn't have any mass.

Weight

 

[E. Bryant]

Gravity. If it weren't for gravity the tree wouldn't have any mass.

Mass is an intrinsic property - it exists regardless of gravitational field. Weight only exists if gravity is present.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

D: All of the above.

 

[E. Bryant]

The mass of a tree is primarily carbon. The carbon comes from carbon dioxide used during photosynthesis. During photosynthesis, plants convert the sun's energy into chemical energy which is captured within the bonds of carbon molecules built from atmospheric carbon dioxide and water.

Thank you.

The mass of a tree which comes from soil is largely demonstrated by the ash (mineral content) that remains after combustion. This of course varies widely by specie and geographical location. It's not trivial, but it's also not the majority of the mass.

 

[hermosabeach]

We inhale Air-
mainly 78% nitrogen & 21% oxygen

We exhale 78% nitrogen and oxygen and CO2.


Plants take in C02, and release O2. Plants are built from Carbon out of the Air...

yes plants need Water to deliver some minerals and to allow photosynthesis to occur...



If Trees were built from the soil, Trees would dig a hole... they would convert the soil into the tree thus leaving a hole where the consumed soil once was located....

Trees hold water, H2O, but the mass of the tree is Carbon.... as Star Trek always said- Carbon based life forms.....

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Lmao, trees eating dirt and makeing a hole.

Dont almost all plants obsorb nutrients from the ground?

 

[alpine44]

My friends daughter asked the parents a question last week at Taco Tuesday

A big tree- It weights a lot- Where does the weight come from?

Multiple Choice

The Soil
The Air
The Water

Whats your guess?

Your friend's daughter should take the fact that trees grow out of the atmosphere a little further in school.

1) Trees grow from CO2 in the atmosphere.
Coal is ancient trees that were folded underground and subjected to high pressure and temperature. No CO2 was added during this process.
Therefore, all the solid carbon (i.e. coal) that exists on this planet came from CO2 in the atmosphere. Nothing was imported from Mars.

2) Similar to plants on land, plankton grows in the ocean by photosynthesis fed from CO2 that is dissolved in water due to the interaction with the atmosphere.
Oil and natural gas was created by ancient plankton subjected underground to high pressure and heat.
Therefore, all the carbon atoms in oil and gas that exists on this planet also came from CO2 in the atmosphere.

3) If we could magically burn every ounce of coal, oil, and gas on this planet, we would simply create atmospheric conditions that existed when life exploded in both quantity and diversity on this planet.

There is no evidence in Earth's history that there is a 'critical' CO2 content in the atmosphere that would create a runaway condition detrimental to life in general. To the contrary, an atmosphere very rich in CO2 (much higher than we could create by burning the stuff we can get our hands on) was the very reason that we have carbon-based life on this planet.

Are we releasing CO2 by burning fossil fuel? YES.
Is CO2 a greenhouse gas? YES, one of several and not the most potent one.
Is there a chance that the Earth will get warmer in the next 100 years. YES, partially because of CO2 and largely because of other factors we do not fully understand. Like how the sun cycle influences formation of clouds and the amount of water vapor (a potent green house gas) in the atmosphere.
Is everyone going to die? NO
Is "climate change" a good scare to make more government control and wealth distribution palatable? YES

 

[hlee]

Back when I was in college I remember hearing about an experiment. A scientist weighed big pot of soil and them planted a tree seed. He allowed the tree to grow for a number of years. The tree was weighed as was the soil. There was essentially no loss of soil mass. A plant converts air into building blocks. That is where its mass comes from.

 

[Buckley]

My mass comes from my wife’s good cooking and beer. Maybe if beer wasn’t carbonated? ?

 

[jbailey]

awesome stuff. I'm going to ask this question around the dinner table tonight and then discuss it w/ the kids. Great stuff. thanks for all the excellent analysis.

 

[eca7891]

Usually anywhere from 30% to over 50% of fresh cut lumber is water.
Example: fresh cut red oak 5/4 weights about 8 lbs per board foot. After drying to 6%-8% moisture content it weights about 5lbs per board foot.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

If the they get everything they need from air then why do different plants need different soils?

Or why does a hdroponics System need nutients in the water?

 

[Maggot]

Usually anywhere from 30% to over 50% of fresh cut lumber is water.
Example: fresh cut red oak 5/4 weights about 8 lbs per board foot. After drying to 6%-8% moisture content it weights about 5lbs per board foot.

Can you evaluate White Oak which when burned leaves far less ash yet produces comparable btu.

 

[Srgt. Hulka]

Cellulose and water.

 

[OldSalty]

Usually anywhere from 30% to over 50% of fresh cut lumber is water.
Example: fresh cut red oak 5/4 weights about 8 lbs per board foot. After drying to 6%-8% moisture content it weights about 5lbs per board foot.

This.

BTW, unverified but...

I have ton of hedge and Locust around my property. Stuff burns like magic when its properly dried.

Wood Species	Pounds / cord	1,000 BTU’s per cord
Osage Orange (Hedge)	4,728	32.9
Hickory, Shagbark	4,327	27.7
Eastern Hornbeam	4,267	27.3
Ironwood	4,016	27.1
Beech, Blue	3,890	26.8
Birch, Black	3,890	26.8
Locust, Black	3,890	26.8
Hickory, Butternut	3,832	26.7
Locust, Honey	3,832	26.7
Apple	4,100	26.5
Mulberry	3,712	25.8
Oak, White	4,012	25.7
Beech, High	3,757	24
Maple, Sugar	3,757	24
Oak, Red	3,757	24
Ash, White	3,689	23.6
Birch, Yellow	3,689	23.6
Juniper, Rocky Mtn	3,150	21.8
Elm, Red	3,112	21.6
Coffeetree, Kentucky	3,112	21.6
Hackberry	3,247	20.8
Tamarack	3,247	20.8
Birch, Gray	3,179	20.3
Birch, Paper	3,179	20.3
Birch, White	3,179	20.3
Walnut, Black	3,192	20.2
Cherry	3,120	20
Ash, Green	2,880	19.9
Cherry, Black	2,880	19.9
Elm, American	3,052	19.5
Elm, White(Russian, Siberian)	3,052	19.5
Sycamore	2,808	19.5
Ash, Black	2,992	19.1
Maple, Red	2,924	18.7
.	.	.
Softwoods	.	.
.	.	.
Fir, Douglas	2,900	18.1
Boxelder	2,797	17.9
Alder, Red	2,710	17.2
Pine, Jack	2,669	17.1
Pine, Norway	2,669	17.1
Pine, Pitch	2,669	17.1
Catalpa	2,360	16.4
Hemlock	2,482	15.9
Spruce, Black	2,482	15.9
Pine, Ponderosa	2,380	15.2
Aspen	2,290	14.7
Butternut	2,100	14.5
Spruce	2,100	14.5
Willow	2,100	14.5
Fir, Balsam	2,236	14.3
Pine, White (Eastern, Western)	2,236	14.3
Fir, Concolor (White)	2,104	14.1
Basswood	2,108	13.8
Buckeye, Ohio	1,984	13.8
Cottonwood	2,108	13.5
Cedar, White	1,913	12.2

 

[hlee]

If the they get everything they need from air then why do different plants need different soils?

Or why does a hdroponics System need nutients in the water?

There are nutrients in the soil that plants need- but they are VERY minor component of the total mass of a plant. However, soil mostly serves anchor a plant in place. Different soil requirements have as much to do with water retention of the soil as they do with nutrient availability. Take the examples of ball and spanish moss. Both are plants. Neither are parasites (they do not steal nutrients from the trees upon which they grow), nor do they require soil to grow. Plants convert Co2 into sugars which form the building blocks of their form.

Orchids are another example of plants that do not require soil as they grow on trees.

 

[Alphatreedog]

I would say soil . Trees that I have worked in soil are much large than trees in sand
That's my story n um stickin to it .

 

[hermosabeach]

345 people have read .... but only a few voted....


Science is fun

 

[Rthur]

This is General Sherman:

Have stood at the base.
Has to be seen first hand to be believed.
Biggest tree in the World.
How it got this big mysteries are interesting but not doing the math.

R

 

[Waorani]

Biology 101.

 

[carbonbased]

This is General Sherman:
View attachment 7253203
Have stood at the base.
Has to be seen first hand to be believed.
Biggest tree in the World.
How it got this big mysteries are interesting but not doing the math.

R

That’s a lot of air.

 

[OldSalty]

345 people have read .... but only a few voted....


Science is fun

Whats next, fast fourier transform analysis?

 

[hlee]

This is General Sherman:
View attachment 7253203
Have stood at the base.
Has to be seen first hand to be believed.
Biggest tree in the World.
How it got this big mysteries are interesting but not doing the math.

R

Now, imagine if that tree had consumed the soil in which it was planted in order to grow to its size. It would be sitting in a giant hole. Not to mention that if plants consumed the soil they were planted in, they would be continually undermining their foundation.

 

[DarnYankeeUSMC]

My friends daughter asked the parents a question last week at Taco Tuesday

A big tree- It weights a lot- Where does the weight come from?

Multiple Choice

The Soil
The Air
The Water

Whats your guess?

Weight

Mass is an intrinsic property - it exists regardless of gravitational field. Weight only exists if gravity is present.

The question in the OP was.
"A big tree -weighs a lot- where does the weight come from?"

"What's your guess?"

My guess was Gravity.

And mass is directly proportional to weight.

 

[OldSalty]

The question in the OP was.
"A big tree -weighs a lot- where does the weight come from?"

"What's your guess?"

My guess was Gravity.

And mass is directly proportional to weight.

Was there a write-in option?

 

[Rocketvapor]

Trick question.
Title says;
The mass of a tree

Poll asks;
POLL: Where does the mass of a tree originate? ( Roots, trunk, leaves, bark, etc)

First post asks;
My friends daughter asked the parents a question last week at Taco Tuesday
A big tree- It weights a lot- Where does the weight come from?

 

[DarnYankeeUSMC]

Was there a write-in option?

"What's your guess"
I took that as an option for write in.

In the poll I clicked on soil.
But all of the options are required for the tree to grow which would give it mass.

 

[DarnYankeeUSMC]

Trick question.
Title says;
The mass of a tree

Poll asks;
POLL: Where does the mass of a tree originate? ( Roots, trunk, leaves, bark, etc)

First post asks;
My friends daughter asked the parents a question last week at Taco Tuesday
A big tree- It weights a lot- Where does the weight come from?

R I F
Reading Is Fundamental

 

[OldSalty]

Well, law of conservation.

Mass isnt created or destroyed by chemical reaction or physical transformation...and the product of such reactions must equal the reactants.

Weight, as many have pointed out is different.

The poll stated mass, the question in OPs post stated weight.

Maybe OP got them mixed up?

 

[little_scrapper]

At rest mass or invariant mass? Relative to an object at rest or an object moving at a velicity relative to the mass (of the tree)? Relative to the density of the gravimetric field it is in?

Need more information before I can compute the solution to your problem.

However, I can tell you with certainty the tree has the mass of a tree that is similar in size and composition to itself. Without a doubt. The mass of your tree in question is some what equal to 1T (one tree).

Like rechargeable batteries; each unique battery has a specific maximum charge/discharge rate and we call that rate 1C. If differs by battery type and internal structure. However, 1C is a constant. That constant differs (is different) dependent on battery type. Much like the "mass" (LOL) of your "tree"?

The answer: Its all relative.

 

[Redmanss]

Feynman talked about this back in '83 on BBC. Skip to 8:00 for the part about trees. Watch the rest for an hour spent on something much better than what most of us may be doing on the internet.

 

[Sniperwannabee]

My friends daughter asked the parents a question last week at Taco Tuesday

A big tree- It weights a lot- Where does the weight come from?

Multiple Choice

The Soil
The Air
The Water

Whats your guess?

the Sun, plants make food by photosynthesis

 

[TheGerman]

Yes.

 

[acudaowner]

darn those Keebler cookie elf's are getting fat in them there trees

 

[E. Bryant]

Like rechargeable batteries; each unique battery has a specific maximum charge/discharge rate and we call that rate 1C. If differs by battery type and internal structure. However, 1C is a constant. That constant differs (is different) dependent on battery type. Much like the "mass" (LOL) of your "tree"?

Ah shit, this is what happens when you try to get a bit too fancy.

"1C" does not refer to the maximum charge/discharge rate, and is not dependant upon battery type. It simply refers to a charge/discharge rate that would drain/fill the battery's rated capacity in 1 hour. For example, if you have a cell rated at 3000mAh, then a 1C charge/discharge rate would be 3A (3000mA). Some batteries can be charged and discharged at a rate many times higher than 1C; some cannot tolerate even that modest rate.

 

[little_scrapper]

"1C" does not refer to the maximum charge/discharge rate, and is not dependant upon battery type. It simply refers to a charge/discharge rate that would drain/fill the battery's rated capacity in 1 hour. For example, if you have a cell rated at 3000mAh, then a 1C charge/discharge rate would be 3A (3000mA). Some batteries can be charged and discharged at a rate many times higher than 1C; some cannot tolerate even that modest rate.

Shhhh. Quiet you. Your giving away all the secrets.

 

[Fig]

You guys are crazy! You're saying trees are made of carbon? Trees use carbon dioxide? I've been watching some...TV...and Carbon is a horrible pollutant that is completely destroying our planet and rendering it completely toxic to all life!

 

[little_scrapper]

CO2 is about 400ppm. If we doubled that level we would have bumper crops every year. Climate alarmists are promoting lowering CO2 which would cause world wide famine, as the lower the CO2 is the worse off the plants will be. Get below about 200ppm and plants quit growing and the whole world dies.

Ask any indoor crop grower, like a pot farmer, what level they keep the CO2 at. I bet its over 1000ppm CO2. Why? Because BIG BUDS bro!

Those same globalist climate alarmists are promoting lower CO2 as a way to sell Carbon Credits to countries like China. Guess who owns the made up currency called Carbon Credits? Thats right the same group of globalist elitists. Why? Because those elitists stand to make BILLIONS off the sale of a made up currency called Carbon Credits. What will selling these Carbon Credits to countries like China et. al. do to lower the CO2 levels? NOTHING!!

In America it is nothing less than a scheme to embezzle OUR tax dollars into THEIR coffers.