Fieldcraft The Stalk & Recon

[Shooter21]

I have managed to hook up with a former Army sniper and he is setting up as a spotter (in random locations) and when I am on the stalk to him, wherever he is, he usually spots me not long after I get to moving. Keep in mind I wear a ghillie suit and he is wearing a red or orange shirt. He will not tell me anything short of get better. I know that I can't move faster than the bushes around me nor the opposite direction nor should i turkey neck. Please show me some of the places I may be screwing up.

 

[Insayn]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

Are you veg'd up with the veg pointing forward? Do you stalk to obvious locations like the base of larger bushes or trees? Scanning the hard lines for the unusual is where you'll get picked off at, aside from turkey peeking.

 

[Shooter21]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

I try to stay in and behind tall bushes and tall grass scattered with bushes. something that will break up and scatter my natural shape. I use what veg I'm in and what is in my "background" if you will. The major target indicator is not my rifle/scope as it is well hidden and camo'd with a birds nest in the scope or some 100 mile-an-hour tape over the objective lense to minimize the TI signature. Thanks

 

[Insayn]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

Well for him, he knows one would tend to go to or behind the tall grass and tall bushes so that is where he will focus his attention. Just like scanning the hard lines of a tree or watching the low areas. You don't necessarily have to have a clear line of sight to shoot. You burn through the vegetation in front of you to make the shot.

 

[cavscout1983]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

get a good idea of a route that provides maximum concealment before you start out. Then break that down into little bits and reconsider specifics as you go. Go one section at a time. stop. stay still. observe, think, execute. repeat.

What distance are you trying to stalk in from? how close are you wanting to get? whats the veg like? how fast are you moving? how are you moving?

I'm not a Sniper but as a Scout we did have to do stalking like movements (without a ghillie) and slow dismounted recon upon advancement to the objective and the biggest thing I learned was move slower than you think you need to, stop often and reconsider your route, maintain your bearing on things. Don't be afraid to hunker down for a few minutes or even 10 minutes. You're either going to meet your objective or lose the target. Being spotted and possibly gaining contact aint gonna change that, its just gonna fuck your world up.

 

[HH4]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

Cavscout is right, in that you always need to plan your movement, just as if you were in a firefight you would select your next covered position before moving when stalking you select your next concealed position before moving. One of the most important things to remember when stalking is to always keep something in between yourself and your target. When stalking you should also have a wrist compass to avoid becoming disoriented and moving in the wrong direction, before you begin your movement determine your direction to the target and check your compass frequently to stay on course. Also when putting vegetation on your ghillie remember you want to make yourself blend in with what is behind you not what is in front of you.

 

[Crazy Dog ll]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

Slow is key. Didn't Carlos Hancock in Veitnam was said to took him 3 days to stalk 1200 yards or something along those lines? But slow is key and pick a route that is unexpected.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

If you go where you can be expected to go, you can expect to get spotted.

Back in the 1970's, after I got back from 'Nam, I used to take my Scouts for an Easter vacation every year; and we'd do a day of 'War Games'.

One year, I decided to do a very slow, low crawl right down a trail right in the open, wearing basic military camo.

Wouldn't you know it, one of the kids came running right down that trail and stepped right in top of me.

He kept right on going about 3 or 4 paces before it registered on him that he'd stepped on something odd...

Scared heck out of him... That kid will <span style="font-style: italic">never</span> look at a trail that same way again...

When I hunt deer, I sit in the open along the tree/brush line. I remain stiil, <span style="font-style: italic">except</span> that when the wind blows and the bushes sway, I sway in concert with them... I have had deer walk up and stop right next to me, to check out the field before entering it. If the woods/bushes are moving and you're not, you stand out.

Most important, never stare with wide eyes. The game animals know to look for the 'predator eye'. Keep your eyes closed down to slits, and when you're not doing a (very slow) sweep, keep your face down. Do nothing fast.

Greg

 

[earthquake]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

Wait, you're getting stalk training from an Army sniper (or so he says) and he won't give you any tips, advice or help but to "get better"?!?! Sounds fishy to me. How is he finding you? Is he just yelling out "I see you!", and then you stand up, or do you have a walker out there that he is guiding to your location?

When you stand up and he's looking through bino's 45 degrees in the wrong direction, that would be a strong indicator that he's BS'ing you.

You'll need to make sure your jute is light colored and closely matches the terrain. Use local veg as well and watch for any dark spots. We used boonie hats for our veils but cut the brim off above our foreheads so as not to cast a shadow on our faces. Is he busting you before you get to your FFP? Study the terrain well, and change your crawling mode to fit. i.e.- high vs. low vs. sniper depending on topography and cover. Stalking is tough!

 

[Shooter21]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

I understand why he was saying to get better now, it was because my TIs were unnatural movements. We sometimes have a walker when we can recruit one and when we can't we have radios where he will call out my position and surroundings (mostly in front of me because I will not move around to look behind) yesterday I finally got to my FFP and got a shot off at my target. He was only about 60m from the target and almost shit on himself when I sent the round as he was not expecting me to get past him

It was comical as hell. I start the stalk at about 1300m at a tree line and move down a ditch to a grassy/bushy feild, however, I did something completely different yesterday. I studied the feild and voids in between. I uprooted a clump of weeds like those that grow in the feild. after bedding them into the jute I sniper crawled out to the front of the tall grass line (I had a ton of it tied into the jute, still trying to get it out) and up on one of the bushes/weed clumps. He said it looked like a bush belonged there and he dismissed it as such. I know one sucessful stalk means nothing so any more advice is still appreciated. Thanks to everyone helping

 

[short_bus_sniper]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

The only thing I would add is that beware of going through the bushes and thick veg, or getting to close to it. It might not have been you on that first try that gave your position away but the overhead movement of the surrounding vegetation. Especially if you are in an area with dense growth of wait-a-minute vines and scrub brush. You could be doing everything perfect, one movement technique lower than necessary, natural veg looks amazing, but that little bit of inconsistent movement where there shouldn't be any could give you away.

Also if it's a windy day, try moving while the wind is gusting. That will help to cover your movement through the thick stuff. And just remember to keep changing your veg to match your surroundings. German Snipers motto during WWII was "camouflage 10 times, shoot once". One stalk I did in school, I changed my veg 3 times to because I went through Pine trees to hardwoods and back on my way to the FFP.

+1 on the watching the shadows around the face too. sometimes all it takes is a huge dark spot surrounded by light stuff to give you away as well. Sounds like you've got the right Idea though!

 

[Shooter21]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

thanks. also figured out that the shadow areas are my friends as definition will not be as prevelent as sunlit areas. we are moving to a new feild tonight and tomorrow to stir it up more. he has arial photos and some satellite photos to let me study beforehand. i was busted after the shot too mainly because I was laughing like a jackass. thanks

 

[Canis Latrans]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

Hey shooter thats pretty cool. It would be awesome if you could videotape the stalk, but I know that's probably too much work to ask for. I'd love to see some pics of your ghillie though. Also, you said you stalked 1300m, how long did it take you until you got your shot off? How long do you spend vegging up? Thanks, good luck.

 

[Shooter21]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

It took about 5hrs to get to my FFP but I could also high crawl a lot down a small dry creek. It took about 30 mins or so to veg up every time I changed. I was hid so I could work faster. the initial veg up took about 2hrs though. let me get better at stalking then I will try to video. thanks

 

[Canis Latrans]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

5 hours?!? Wow. you're lucky you have found someone that will wait around that long just to help you out. Thanks.

 

[Shooter21]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

yeah I was. He`s retired and doesn`t have much else to do, besides he likes the cat and mouse game. we were set up to do it again to day but we got rained out.

 

[i_Adam_i18]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

"snow nor rain nor heat nor gloom of night stays these couriers from the swift completion of their appointed rounds"

Isn't that the snipers creed?.......

 

[Shooter21]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

My spotter split on me after I was out there all night, which was actually kinda cool aside from freezing my ass off. But yes I believe this is.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: WASP7067</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"snow nor rain nor heat nor gloom of night stays these couriers from the swift completion of their appointed rounds"

Isn't that the snipers creed?....... </div></div>

Good catching that though. Did the Stalk Sunday morning and I managed to get the rounds off but got busted on egress by a youpon bush as suggested I avoid by Short_Bus_Sniper.

 

[i_Adam_i18]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

I'm just kiddin man, it's actually the postmans creed, I thought it fit pretty well though... I would rather not lay out in the rain for hours if I didn't have to, not my idea of fun. If it was out of necessity....sure.

 

[Shooter21]

Re: The Stalk & Recon

Yeah it takes 2 to play and I already enjoyed the night out there. Its amazing what you hear when you don't move nor make any noise.
postmans creed? sounds like it works for snipers too except for the COURIOR part. now I know why it threw me off the first time... LMAO