Thought some of you might find this interesting, a survey done by the Precision Rifle
Blog
http://precisionrifleblog.com/2017/04
Blog
http://precisionrifleblog.com/2017/04
- Thread starter Fursniper
- Start date
Although interesting, I've come to learn that these "top 100" PRS lists don't really mean much. The equipment with the most representation on these lists simply sponsor the most shooters. These shooters switch equipment like leaves in the wind, depending on who sponsors them.
Amen. If you based your opinions on this Vortex would be the best scope out there. Rob01 in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1.........
Yeah, the ones where they independently test are the most interesting to me like the scope one. I am guessing this is hard to set up because most posts are tallies of use rather than actual tests.
Interested to see what suggestions come out of this post when taking into account some guys are sponsored by brand-x as mentioned above. Not to completely discount their option or results but would like to see some no BS after action reviews from guys. Trying to spec out a PRS type rifle currently so this stuff interests me for sure.
Is it not at its price point, or even a little bit higher?
Look at it this way: you can get a hit on target all the same with any of the actions listed there. They are all good actions. They all cycle fine. They all extract fine. They all are built fairly well, all things considered. Have a good smith spin up a good barrel blank and screw it onto any of those actions and you'll have a rifle that shoots. Is a Surgeon gonna be more accurate than a Defiance? Is the Mausingfield going to chamber a round any better than a Big Horn? How much chambered can a round be chambered? How much more extracted can a round be extracted? Sure, there are pros and cons to various types of extraction or feed. Some actions have different features like two vs three lugs or one can use AW mags and another can't, or one has a trigger hanger and another doesn't. But in terms of what's gonna facilitate your bullet getting to where you want it to go better? Nah. I'd be happy with any of them.
You say they are all equally good but I'm not so sure. Some actions are picky when it comes to binding and must be run a certain way, not acceptable in my eyes.
Examples sure...Now before anybody get's defensive I agree there are lots of Defiance and whatever else that work fine, all I can say is the two I had did not. First was a Defiance Mutant in an Elesio Tube Gun, all work done by PR, that thing would bind almost every cycle, sent it back with no change after, ended up getting refund on that rifle. It shot great but fed and cycled like crap.
Second is a BAT-Tac, not near as picky on bolt cycle as that Mutant was but still if you are not carefull in completely straight bolt manipulation it will hang up. That Bat-Tac is still new so I think it will smooth out but my argument is the damn thing should work whether it's got 1rd or 1000 through it. Now the other side of this is a DLC Coated Mausinfield and a trued and cerakoted Tikka T3, those two actions just WANT to feed! They don't care if dry, run slow, fast, dirty, doesn't matter they just work every time!
I see videos of guys cycling an action at SHOT or whatever and the classic "that's smooth as glass" comes out. Might be but that test means nothing to me until you feed it ammo from a mag in field conditions. If you still can say "that's smooth as glass" over and over again then you have a winner in my book.
Second is a BAT-Tac, not near as picky on bolt cycle as that Mutant was but still if you are not carefull in completely straight bolt manipulation it will hang up. That Bat-Tac is still new so I think it will smooth out but my argument is the damn thing should work whether it's got 1rd or 1000 through it. Now the other side of this is a DLC Coated Mausinfield and a trued and cerakoted Tikka T3, those two actions just WANT to feed! They don't care if dry, run slow, fast, dirty, doesn't matter they just work every time!
I see videos of guys cycling an action at SHOT or whatever and the classic "that's smooth as glass" comes out. Might be but that test means nothing to me until you feed it ammo from a mag in field conditions. If you still can say "that's smooth as glass" over and over again then you have a winner in my book.
Almost forgot about that blog. Good source of info!
I know when the Deviant first came out, two of my friends got one each, both bound up horribly, you couldn't cycle the bolt unless you pushed on the back of the bolt with your thumb. One of those guys sat in front of the TV with a fine paste abrasive and cycled the bolt thousands of times and now it cycles normal and is incredibly slick. He's brave, I would have rejected the action myself. Seems like Defiant got complaints and made adjustments shortly afterwards, must have right???
The two actions I like better than the rest are #1 ARC then Bighorn. Although I can't find much fault in Surgeon. Being it's a shorter case/6x47l, I had to shorten the lips on my AI mag to smooth out the feeding on the Mausingfield, other than that it's been my favorite action so far. But it's a tad harder to open the bolt than some of the other actions, best doing it hard and fast, very easy on closing though.
The DLC Mausingfield at Shot Show was stellar smooth!
This has been my experience with older defiance actions. Very small sample size though, so that could mean nothing. They seem to be outselling everything by a pretty wide margin, so it must be fixed, no? Interesting that SAC actually mods the tang area of the bolt bore to correct this somewhat. I asked defiance about it at shot, and they were unaware of the process SAC was doing. I also felt that DLC's Mausingfield at SHOT. Wonder if thats available yet? Just got a TL3, and that thing rocks!
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why dont you see or read more about stillers Spectre action? looks like a nice piece. Lee
Yep I am a big fan of my current DLC Mausingfield, doesn't care how sloppy you are on the bolt manipulation, just does what it's supposed to without any drama! I like to try new setups so that's why I am in the shopping phase for a new rifle, if I can't find an action that works like that DLC ARC then I will just get another one of those. Maybe that's Impact 737R or something else, don't know yet need more real world feedback.
While you shouldn't take those lists as Gospel, there is a reason that the same companies end up at the top of those lists. Sponsorship is obviously a big part of that 'most used,' but I don't believe many guys would run Deviant actions or Vortex scopes or whatever if they weren't proven products.
Exactly. If someone handed me a free action and it didn't work, I wouldn't use it. I don't care if it's free. I need it to function when it counts.
When I ordered my Alpha 11 about six months ago, Mark advised me that he now orders his actions with slightly more clearance between bolt/action and the relief cuts you are referring to are no longer necessary. I don't know if all Defiance actions have changed, but my understanding is the ones used by SAC have.
I second this, I've heard the same thing from SAC, they've switched from what they called the "Lower Bolt Clearance Mod" to now just using a slightly smaller diameter bolt. Same effect, less work required, though it doesn't feel quite as tight, but that's the point.
most anyone on that list could take anything on that list and wax the vast majority of people out there...if the gear is on that list, for the most part, it WORKS and is reliable
the bolt binding issues, like mentioned above, has to do with how the actions are spec'd and coated/finished...but u can still bind up most 2 lugs with very little effort, even really slick ones, ive played with most all of them (havent messed with any of the other 3 lug actions enough to get a feel for them)...ive never had my AI bolt bind up or feel sticky
the bolt binding issues, like mentioned above, has to do with how the actions are spec'd and coated/finished...but u can still bind up most 2 lugs with very little effort, even really slick ones, ive played with most all of them (havent messed with any of the other 3 lug actions enough to get a feel for them)...ive never had my AI bolt bind up or feel sticky
Yeah, you shouldn't Cerakote the bolt on a Defiance action UNLESS your smith turns the bolt diameter down. or you order it from Defiance spec'd for Cerakote (they machine the bolt slightly smaller), or your smith masks off the inside of the action. That said, mine is a regular off-the-shelf Deviant, my bolt is parkerized, and it runs just fine. Never had a binding issue. If you give a Deviant to your smith and tell him to Cerkakote it with a color like tan or FDE or coyote brown... and your smith doesn't turn the bolt down... you're gonna think something's wrong with the action. When in reality your smith might have messed up. Some colors go on thicker than others. So then you hear people complain that something is wrong with Defiance actions. But that's not the case. It's just an example of not knowing where the real cause of the problem lies.
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I had narrowed down my choice for a new build to the Bighorn TL3 and Mausingfield because I wanted something I could use prefits, and checked both out at SHOT this year. The Big Horn was nice, but the DLC'd Mausingfield was by far the more forgiving action. I found it pretty easy to bind/slow up the Big Horn versus the Mausingfield and that the Big Horn is a little over-hyped on this forum (other than the ease of changing out the bolt head).
agree, the MF is tougher to bind...bolt lift on both are very smooth and similar, i like the large claw on the MF better, as well...Big Horn has the advantage of getting the action+all bolt heads for around the same price as the MF by itself
The CZ SA also had this same issue for a number of models....time & cycling seems to sort it out though. Dunno if it was a casting issue or bolt race design perhaps?
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