Range Report Thoughts on the .223 AI?

[D.A.T]

I am working on a .223 bolt gun (Savage PC)

I want to shoot the heavy bullets and had some thoughts about making it an AI chamber

From what I can tell fireforming brass is easy, I would need new dies, Also the extras speed might help me stablizie heavier bullets better.

Anyone else have experience with this caliber?

Is it worth it or should I just stick to the factory chamber?

 

[7mmRM]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

Love the 223AI. Simply an awesome chambering. 75 AMAXs @ 3050-3100 while burning 25-26grns of powder! NO recoil! Whats not to like?

FForming is nothing more than shooting standard 223 in the improved chamber- goes in standard 223 comes out AIed. FForming loads generally shoot excellent as well.

You will get a bump in velocity, as well as basically never having to trim the cases again.

I say go for it.

 

[turbo54]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

A 24" barrel can get 2850fps or better from an 80amax, which are cheap, and a helluva bullet.

I believe the 223AI can do 100fps better.

If it were me, I'd be all over that like a bum on a baloney sandwich.

 

[shoot4fun]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

I am a bum on a baloney sandwich.
Go 223 AI. Your Savage is likely a 1 in 9 twist and I don't know that you will be able to stabilize the really heavy bullets.

 

[turbo54]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am a bum on a baloney sandwich.
Go 223 AI. Your Savage is likely a 1 in 9 twist and I don't know that you will be able to stabilize the really heavy bullets. </div></div>

1:9 is a bummer. Why aren't the manufacturers making 1:7.5 bolt guns???

Still, the 80amax @ 2950-3000 might just work out of 1:9. The 75amax@3000+ certainly will.

 

[shoot4fun]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

Savage did offer a 1 in 7 at one time but only in the LR gun that was left port.
My son has a 10FPC and it is 1 in 9.

 

[D.A.T]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

This will be a 20", think it will still be worth the AI pushing 75 A-Max?

I did see their 1/7 twist but don't want to spend the money on a gun that I dont like the stock or that it is SS or that long of barrel.

 

[turbo54]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: D.A.T.</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This will be a 20", think it will still be worth the AI pushing 75 A-Max?</div></div>

I think so. My 20" service rifle gets 2800-2850 from the 80amax...non AI of course!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: D.A.T.</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I did see their 1/7 twist but don't want to spend the money on a gun that I dont like the stock or that it is SS or that long of barrel. </div></div>

Yeah, that's the FT/R 223 rifle. Damn fine for its purpose, but pretty specific.

Not sure on your intents, and how far out you want to reach... CBI makes both 1:7 and 1:8 223AI prefit barrels for Savages. $285, and they shoot great. Just a thought.

 

[ridge]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

Try running the 75 gr amax now and see how it goes in your 9 twist ( I have a 26" 9 twist ai and it loves the 75gramax). Also run a 8 twist 22" and all I use in it is also the 75gr amax. I was on the fence at 1st with both mine, but now I want to do another ( will be a 8 twist).

 

[D.A.T]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: D.A.T.</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This will be a 20", think it will still be worth the AI pushing 75 A-Max?</div></div>

I think so. My 20" service rifle gets 2800-2850 from the 80amax...non AI of course!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: D.A.T.</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I did see their 1/7 twist but don't want to spend the money on a gun that I dont like the stock or that it is SS or that long of barrel. </div></div>

I want the PC since it is threaded....I figured I would have a smith just rechamber the barrel I have now if it shoots the 75 gr well

Yeah, that's the FT/R 223 rifle. Damn fine for its purpose, but pretty specific.

Not sure on your intents, and how far out you want to reach... CBI makes both 1:7 and 1:8 223AI prefit barrels for Savages. $285, and they shoot great. Just a thought. </div></div>

 

[D.A.T]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

I have some 75 gr Amax and 68 gr match both Hornady to run though it. I also got 100 Lapua brass.

 

[skep_tic1]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

I don't think tha "AI" is worth it in .223. I built a .223 with a 7 twist 26" schnieder barrel and was able to push a 75 grain AMAX up to 3200 fps with minimal pressure signs but I backed it off to 2850 fps to prolong the barrel life. At 2850fps I'm still supersonic at 1k meters with that specific bullet. So I ask you.... why add the extra step to the reloading process by making it an "AI"????????

Here is what it looks like.....

 

[BoilerUP]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

I asked the same question a few months ago.

My Savage 223 wears a 26" 1:9 factory barrel, and I get excellent accuracy with the 75gr HPBT @ 2860fps and the 75gr A-Max is stable (500' ASL, 80°F) and half-MOA accurate to at least 200yd @ 2915fps. I could probably eek more velocity from this barrel, but these loads are accurate and very easy on brass.

I've got a 22" 1:7 223AI Criterion barrel on order, and given the many reports I've seen of 20" 223 barrels pushing 80gr bullets @ 2800fps, I hope to launch the 80gr A-Max @ 2900fps or more.

What eventually drove me to choose the AI was getting 26" performance from a 22" barrel without beating up brass too bad. The cost is a set of Lee AI dies and a 223AI go-gage, and the gain is ballistic performance that equals or beats a 308/175 combo in the wind.

 

[D.A.T]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

I might just wait untill I need a new barrel. I already have everything I need to reload .223 match ammo. I would need new dies, gunsmith charges to get a new chamber or buy a new barrel to get the AI. If there was a factory option .223 AI like the Savage 10 PC I would have probbly bought it. We will see what kind of performance I can get out of this rifle first.

 

[Bruiser_Joe]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

all you AI haters, i honestly don't see the downside. there is no "extra" step just shoot regular ammo and when you reload it again its better then last time. almost every AI chambered gun i saw built by a reputable smith shot the factory stuff excellent as well. this pushed me to build a 223ai and a 22-250ai, plus you get better throat life out of barrel burners like 243 and 22-250, 260, etc.

i shot a friends stiller 260ai and it would do .4's with factory 260... i don't see why this is a bad thing.

 

[turbo54]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BigJoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">all you AI haters, i honestly don't see the downside. there is no "extra" step just shoot regular ammo and when you reload it again its better then last time. almost every AI chambered gun i saw built by a reputable smith shot the factory stuff excellent as well. this pushed me to build a 223ai and a 22-250ai, plus you get better throat life out of barrel burners like 243 and 22-250, 260, etc.

i shot a friends stiller 260ai and it would do .4's with factory 260... i don't see why this is a bad thing. </div></div>

Agree.

The AI is nice for UKD and matches where it provides an edge of forgiveness.

...but, most of us play at the square range at KD informally. THAT'S when you fireform! Informal group shooting, or dot drills or whatever have you, the dope doesn't matter for shit, so you get zeroed and let it rip.

Once you've got 50-100 cases formed, you develop the AI load. Every time you have a range day that allows you the chance to "get dope", shoot AI loads. Don't bother doping non-AI loads.

F class is another great time to fireform.

 

[223ai]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

Love a 223ai, I have 2 of them. My go to hunting rifle is a 223ai at 22", and it hits hard and accurate...75 amax at 3050, 80gr JLK at 2950, and 75 SS2 at 3000.

I also have a straight 223 with a longer barrel (Brux 26") that is sending 82 bergers at 2900, and it's a freaking hammer...better than my 308 with 175's and/or 155's by quite a margin. Damn near my 260 with 140 amaxes. I'm about 95% sure that I'm running it in the 2013 PRS, with the NTRP Fall match and GAP grind being my proving grounds.

At the end of the day, the 223ai is the go to for a shorter barrel, as you'll get the same speed as a longer barreled straight 223. Take your pick. I love them both, but I freaking hate fireforming because I loathe reloading, and it's another step in the process.

 

[shoot4fun]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

My 80 gr Berger load in 223 hits 2960 from a 26" Kreiger 1 in 8 twist. My 223 AI load is 77 SMK at 3050 from a 22" Brux 1 in 8 twist. Both are just flat out fun to shoot. But both are at their absolute hottest. I just wish I lived where all the velocity is

.

 

[BoilerUP]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

Seems like many folks sling 80gr bullets @ 2950fps from their 22" 223AIs, so a 77gr @ 3050 seems right on the money...?

 

[shoot4fun]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

Yup. Most guys are right in that speed zone. Just a couple seem to be hitting some galactic numbers with the straight 223 (3200 FPS with the 80 gr).

 

[my human host]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

I ran a 7 twist 223 ai for a time. My 26 inch Hart maxed out at 3025 with a 75 grain amax. It shot so well that I never did get around to trying any other bullets.

I'll have another some day. I still have 650pcs of fireformed brass.

 

[JWV]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

I have a 260AI and the fireforming loads were in .1s to .3s. I recently went on a prairie dog hunting trip to South Dakota and a buddy brought his brand new 223 AI barreled savage. He had loaded up 500 pieces of virgin winchester brass. By the end of the trip he had around 450+ pieces of formed brass. He absolutely terrorized the furry creatures while forming.

 

[Smokin99]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

LMFAO

Form a Brass Stop a Heart is my motto!

No extra step in reloading pull the trigger on factory brass, brass doesnt need trimmed as often, gain FPS, what not to like. I Ackley most everything.

 

[Lazuris]

Re: Thoughts on the .223 AI?

I built one for cheaper training and also my girl friend wanted to shoot with me so it was the perfect choise. I love my 223AI. Im running the 75amax with 26g varget. I've only taken it out to 900yds but it did the job all the way. My favorite thing about it is that it has zero recoil a major plus for my girl friend. I love being to see the bullet flight and impact with no movement of the glass. Since I've built it I've had three of my friends build one.

However since it was my first AI i did have a bit of a learning curve. I learned early on that the only way to form brass was a full powered load. Lighter loads or carbine loads did not fully form the brass. I am using LC once fired.

Also I used a krieger 1:7 but the reamer my smith had did not fit the barrel. I had to order a custom reamer from pacific tool that was slightly smaller pilot to fit the inside of the krieger.