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TRG vs. AI

DeauxJoe

DeauxJoe

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Sep 15, 2011
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#1
Well as the title sayes, I am sure there are a bunch of differences and the people who use them seem to be the logical party to ask about them. I started playing around with the idea about long range shooting just a month or so ago. I had a Rem 700 in .270 I had planned on just shooting and having fun with until I wore the barrel out and then I would move on. Well that plan got shot to sh%$ because I was at the range and someone made me an offer on the package lol. So I sold it. Now What?

P.S. This is not another what should I buy post, I am pretty set on a TRG 42 in .338Lm I just want to be well informed before I pull the trigger.
 
#2
Re: TRG vs. AI

I'm not sure I'd start out with a .338, it's an awful lot of cartridge from a recoil standpoint & also as far as your wallet is concerned... I would be looking for something smaller... everyone should have at least one .308.
 
#3
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: J-Ham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm not sure I'd start out with a .338, it's an awful lot of cartridge from a recoil standpoint & also as far as your wallet is concerned... I would be looking for something smaller... everyone should have at least one .308. </div></div>

+1 I think you need to rethink your priorities. Have you looked at the price for 338 ammo? It costs 6X what 308 does and if your not regularly shooting over 1000 yards it doesn't do anything the 308 won't. A 308 with the right bullet can do 1200 yards no problem.

Going from a 700 in 270 (I'll assume a hunting rifle) is a big jump aswell. What kind of budget have you set aside for optics? If your planning on topping it with a $500 optic then it does no good having a $3K rifle. You are better off with a cheaper rifle and more expensive scope than the other way around.
 
#4
Re: TRG vs. AI

There's a lot to like about both rifles. I was debating between a TRG-22 and an AI AW and opted for the latter. The clincher for me was availability and pricing on spare parts and accessories for the AI. If something breaks on a TRG, you could be down for months. On an AI, Mile High Shooting or AINA can overnight you a replacement.

I can say that I'm thrilled with my purchase having taken the rifle out for its first range trip this past Sunday. The rifle goes about shooting in an utterly businesslike fashion: no bolt binding, misfeeds, or other drama. The folding stock locks up incredibly tightly and eases cleaning. One would need to remove the cheekpiece on a fixed-stock model to remove/insert the bolt.

—Andreas
 
#5
Re: TRG vs. AI

I would go with a .308. You will get to shoot a lot more from a financial standpoint. If you are just starting to get into long range shooting I doubt you have the skills necessary to make the most of the 338 cartridge. Your money would be better spent taking a precision rifle course. Then you will know exactly what you want and how to properly use it. Good luck either way. For the record I have the TRG 22 in .308 and a DTA SRS in .308 and .338.
 
#6
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: redneckbmxer24</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: J-Ham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm not sure I'd start out with a .338, it's an awful lot of cartridge from a recoil standpoint & also as far as your wallet is concerned... I would be looking for something smaller... everyone should have at least one .308. </div></div>

+1 I think you need to rethink your priorities. Have you looked at the price for 338 ammo? It costs 6X what 308 does and if your not regularly shooting over 1000 yards it doesn't do anything the 308 won't. A 308 with the right bullet can do 1200 yards no problem.

Going from a 700 in 270 (I'll assume a hunting rifle) is a big jump aswell. What kind of budget have you set aside for optics? If your planning on topping it with a $500 optic then it does no good having a $3K rifle. You are better off with a cheaper rifle and more expensive scope than the other way around. </div></div>

Very valid point, I have done my homework and the reason I am am leaning on the TRG 42 right now is I found a good deal on a local rifle. Maybe you can help verify that what I think I am getting.

Sako TRG 42 in .338 LM 1 in 10 twist
Sako Bipod
Sako Break
20 MOA rail
Badger Rings
NF 8-30x56 with Zero Stops
2 5 rnd mags
200 Rounds of ammo
The rifle has had exactly zero rounds through it!

Price is 4,000 for everything.

My thought process was to maybe take this package and even if I dont shoot it to part it out and fund another project. I looked into reloading for this round and figured it 3.75 per round for a "good" load. After that go to a TRG 22 or something similar.
 
#7
Re: TRG vs. AI

The TRG is an awesome rifle. The stock fits me much better than an AI. Find someone local that has both, and get behind the gun so you can determine what you like before buying. On the AI stock, you either love it or hate it. I don't care for it. But the AI rifle itself is an awesome gun. The action is silky smooth and built like a tank. It's a very solid weapon system and they shoot very well.

On caliber, I would not go 338. The pricing alone on the ammo will be a limiting factor on how much you shoot it, not to mention the added recoil and muzzle blast. A 308 is good, but a 300 Win Mag is better. I opted for the 300WM TRG 42, and love it. If you reload, it's just a little more expensive than a 308 to shoot. I've got about 1900-2000 rounds down my TRG, and a new barrel is getting mounted on it now. It was still shooting about 1/2 MOA, only with a few fliers mixed in. Either choice in rifle will be a good one. Just try them before you buy them, if possible.
 
#8
Re: TRG vs. AI

TRG22 or AI AW 308

If youre set on buying the TRG then just get it. You won't be dissapointed, unless of course what you really want is the AW. If the latter is true then I'd just save and get the AW.

You also are asking about two rifles that are a big difference in price. $4000 ish for the TRG22 with factory bipod/scope mount/break and $7000 ish for the AI AW. Big difference in what youre spending there.

A better comparison would be a TRG and AI AE mkII.

338 LM is a fun to shoot and yes it hits steel with authority, but as someone posted above it isn't the cheapest ammo even if you reload. That interprets to less shooting VS something in 308, which in some cases means that the 338 stays in the safe more often.
 
#9
Re: TRG vs. AI

I have shot both and my vote is for a TRG in .260, since you can get them from Europtics. I currently have two TRG's one in 7mm08 and one in .308 and love them both. The AI didn't fit me very well.
I have shot the .338LM before and it was fun for a few shots, but the fun wears off pretty quick. I would suspect that is the reason that person is selling it for a good price, and the scope is a bit too much power for long range tactical shooting, for a few reasons.
SScott
 
#10
Re: TRG vs. AI

If you can deal with the recoil and cost - I think the 338 is a good starter rifle. Much less wind worry than more "drifty" rounds and it shoot like a tight rope a loooong way.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: J-Ham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm not sure I'd start out with a .338, it's an awful lot of cartridge from a recoil standpoint & also as far as your wallet is concerned... I would be looking for something smaller... everyone should have at least one .308. </div></div>
 
#11
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sunnyside Scott</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have shot both and my vote is for a TRG in .260, since you can get them from Europtics. I currently have two TRG's one in 7mm08 and one in .308 and love them both. The AI didn't fit me very well.
I have shot the .338LM before and it was fun for a few shots, but the fun wears off pretty quick. I would suspect that is the reason that person is selling it for a good price, and the scope is a bit too much power for long range tactical shooting, for a few reasons.
SScott </div></div>

IYO, would it make a good package to part out and make a few dollars on?
 
#12
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jAXDIALATION</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you can deal with the recoil and cost - I think the 338 is a good starter rifle. Much less wind worry than more "drifty" rounds and it shoot like a tight rope a loooong way.
</div></div>
I cannot deal with the cost... nor do I expect that I will ever be able to justify it. Personally, I will stick to shooting more rounds in a short action... to each his own.

Shit was a lot cooler when Uncle Sam was paying for it all
grin.gif
.
 
#13
Re: TRG vs. AI

DeauxJoe, feel free to give me a call at your convenience and I will be glad to explain the AI systems to you and yes I have owned both systems. I as well would not recommend starting with the .338LM or even the .300WM. I would recommend either the 6.5CM or .308 in either the AE or AW. Cost and recoil are extremely moderate, fun to shoot, accuracy yes, plus ammo availability! Hope to speak with you soon and have a good day gents.
 
#15
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DeauxJoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
IYO, would it make a good package to part out and make a few dollars on? </div></div>
Doing the quick math, you might be trading dollars, but have the chance to shoot up all of the ammo for kicks.
Since the rifle is unfired, it might have value to the right person, but understand that they are on sale right now.
You should PM Stacey and see what he can do for you.
SScott
 
#16
Re: TRG vs. AI

I currently use my .300wsm to blast out to 1000. Once I get my reloading kit I will push that range further. However, the next rifle on my list is a AI AX338 for the realllly long range shooting. But only once I get reloading.
 
#17
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: J-Ham</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jAXDIALATION</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you can deal with the recoil and cost - I think the 338 is a good starter rifle. Much less wind worry than more "drifty" rounds and it shoot like a tight rope a loooong way.
</div></div>
I cannot deal with the cost... nor do I expect that I will ever be able to justify it. Personally, I will stick to shooting more rounds in a short action... to each his own.

Shit was a lot cooler when Uncle Sam was paying for it all
grin.gif
. </div></div>

Lol I could see that...
 
#18
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Stacey @ MHSA</div><div class="ubbcode-body">DeauxJoe, feel free to give me a call at your convenience and I will be glad to explain the AI systems to you and yes I have owned both systems. I as well would not recommend starting with the .338LM or even the .300WM. I would recommend either the 6.5CM or .308 in either the AE or AW. Cost and recoil are extremely moderate, fun to shoot, accuracy yes, plus ammo availability! Hope to speak with you soon and have a good day gents. </div></div>

Tag you're it. Called spoke to Melissa (very nice BTW) and she took a message for me. Look forward to talking with you soon.
 
#19
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sunnyside Scott</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DeauxJoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
IYO, would it make a good package to part out and make a few dollars on? </div></div>
Doing the quick math, you might be trading dollars, but have the chance to shoot up all of the ammo for kicks.
Since the rifle is unfired, it might have value to the right person, but understand that they are on sale right now.
You should PM Stacey and see what he can do for you.
SScott </div></div>

Yeah thats one thing I was afraid of. I was thinking of not even shooting it and just trying to unload the whole package, parted out of course. To be honest to myself though IDK if I could have a .338 LM in my safe and not touch it lol. I have exactly 0 safe queens lol.
 
#20
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: logan1080</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I currently use my .300wsm to blast out to 1000. Once I get my reloading kit I will push that range further. However, the next rifle on my list is a AI AX338 for the realllly long range shooting. But only once I get reloading. </div></div>

I had someone else recommend a .300wsm to me. It is definitely not off the table.
 
#21
Re: TRG vs. AI

For the sake of your wallet(ammo) and shoulder I would think twice about the 338. The .308 in either the AE MKII or TRG22 would be the two I would go for. You won't go wrong with either rifle. I have the AE MKII .308 and absolutely love it!
 
#22
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jeeprider</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For the sake of your wallet(ammo) and shoulder I would think twice about the 338. The .308 in either the AE MKII or TRG22 would be the two I would go for. You won't go wrong with either rifle. I have the AE MKII .308 and absolutely love it! </div></div>

Thanks for the advice, any pics of your rig?
 
#24
Re: TRG vs. AI

.308 for sure.

What can you not do with it?

Its a much less expnesive investment vs .300 wm and esp.338.

I agree with the TRG 22. its the best bang for the buck. I currently have a AW in .308 and think the TRGs I have had were every bit as good and the trigger is better.

buy the TRG 22 and spend the rest on a decent scope and reloading supplies.

With the price amm is at, I dont see how anyonw can shoot the .338. Pricy enough for .308
 
#25
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DeauxJoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well as the title sayes, I am sure there are a bunch of differences and the people who use them seem to be the logical party to ask about them. I started playing around with the idea about long range shooting just a month or so ago. I had a Rem 700 in .270 I had planned on just shooting and having fun with until I wore the barrel out and then I would move on. Well that plan got shot to sh%$ because I was at the range and someone made me an offer on the package lol. So I sold it. Now What?

P.S. This is not another what should I buy post, I am pretty set on a TRG 42 in .338Lm I just want to be well informed before I pull the trigger. </div></div>


If you're the type of guy that goes out shooting every once in a while then it would be a fun gun to shoot but if you plan on going out every week then you might want to consider getting something else. 338L is better suited for longer distances like past 1000Y where the cartridge really shines.

You might be surprised to know that smaller cartridges can get things done at 1000Y and a little farther just fine. Not to mention them being easier on the shoulder and wallet. Choosing a cartridge and caliber combo with decent velocity and ballistic coefficient goes a long way. 6.5 Creedmoor is what I would choose if I didn't reload.

You could probably still sell the TRG/338 for what you'd have into it or trade later for some other cool toy if you wanted to .
 
#27
Re: TRG vs. AI

Don't know it will be a slam dunk money maker but it is possible if you part it out that a few bucks could be made.

That is always one way to fund others. Also lets you pick and choose which pieces you feel you want to keep.

The question is, DO you feel it is a good buy and YOU are able to part it out and make some money. If the answer is YES then don't look for others to tell you to make the deal. JUST DO IT.
 
#28
Re: TRG vs. AI

I also agree that for a long range beginner 338 is a little bit too far away. The only possible way for ordinary shooter to afford it is handload, which will reduced the cost per round to around $2, if you truly know how to use the brass wisely and have a deal on some component, then maybe $1.5
While you can easily get 2 or 3 decent 308win handload at this price. Although we all know 338 is extremely powerful, in a distance less than 1000yd you can find too much cheap substitutes for plinking paper and steel gongs, and at this 'short' distance there is truly no point to use 338 unless you want to take out a watermelon hide behind thick steel plate, or zombie grizzly bear wearing level III bulletproof vest.

Back to the TRG vs. AI issue. So far, I think TRG works better for me. Yes AIAWs are built like tank, clamp on a NF scope and you can even go to Mars to do some secret mission. But as a tea drinking amateur in range and some light use in field. I truly can't see the need of such a ultimate robust design. TRGs are much lighter, while also have the similar concept of AW such as metal chassis in the rifle stock. TRG's bolt operates like a dream. The fully adjustable trigger is so sweet and crisp. And now you have the choice to update the stock (like Ashbury FORSST) to make it truly tacti-cool.
The only 2 true weak points that TRG42 can not match AW, IMHO, are the twist rate and not-so-strong extractor. the 1:12 twist rate make TRG prefer light bullets, which might not be a good news for long range shooting. While the second one bring a potential weakness to the bolt, limit the use of hot loads.
Other than that, TRGs are great, you pay much less, and get a piece of art. TRG accessories are expensivem, but get a whole system of TRG including a wonderful scope might be cheaper than a bare AW. And in weekend tea drinking time at range, TRGs I've tried so far all shoot as good as, if not say better than AWs.

Just my 0.02 cents.
 
#29
Re: TRG vs. AI

PanzerVI:

TRG's became available with 1:10 twist a couple years ago, andI believe they are now ALL 1:10.

That said, a newbie to LR shooting is out of their mind to start with a 338LM.

If you just want to take it out twice a year and zing a couple rounds around, great, get a 338.

If you want to start to learn the art/science of precision marksmanship, start with a reasonable caliber like everyone else.

Also: Someone mentioned the advantage of the 338LM for a newbie, not having to learn/deal with the wind.... I wholeheartedly but respectfully disagree. Great marksmen know how to shoot in the wind. That is what separates the men from the boys....the wheat from the chaffe. Not that I'm any kind of master in the wind, but I know that is what will make me better. That is why I have a .22LR trainer.

EDIT: To give you a point of reference, I train hard. I have been striving for several years to become a great marksman. I've sent well over 5000 rounds of 308 downrange in the last 3 or 4 years. I missed F class high master this year by .02%. I just got a 338LM this year, and I can honestly say I am nowhere near a good enough driver to deserve it. If you can't hit a 10"x10" plate at 1000 yards EVERY time with a 308, you need more time on the "B" team before stepping up to a 338LM.
 
#30
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body">PanzerVI:

If you can't hit a 10"x10" plate at 1000 yards EVERY time with a 308, you need more time on the "B" team before stepping up to a 338LM.</div></div>

I agree with damn near everything you said but this would be a challenge for even the most experienced shooters. "every time" is pretty much impossible, everybody makes mistakes or misses a wind call eventually. otherwise f/tr would be won soley by x counts which damn sure isn't the case.

Again i agree with your point but think that is something to strive for but truly isn't realistic.
 
#33
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DeauxJoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bm11</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I asked a similar question a year and a half ago: https://snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1893887

Both are the correct answer. </div></div>

What did you pick? Lol</div></div>

IIRC I think he got both... haha

He might've ended up selling one however I'm not sure which one (think it was the TRG) in order to buy something else.
 
#34
Re: TRG vs. AI

Bought the AW first. Then a TRG folder. Then sold the TRG folder to buy an AX. Didn't care to shoot anything but the AX so I sold the AX. I really enjoy all of them, and still shoot a TRG regularly (my shooting partner shoots one,) but for me the AX is the ultimate.
 
#35
Re: TRG vs. AI

Life and times of bm.....bought an OBR.....ended up selling the AW and eventually bought an AX. But YES, he was a proud owner of both a TRG folder and an AW so he could compare both of apples to apples himself.
 
#36
Re: TRG vs. AI

turbo54:
I was told that they make short barrel Ver. of TRG 42 in 1:10, while mine seems to be a 1:12, not sure if they have any 27 1/4 inch barrel in 1:10.
May be I'll ask Sako to swap a 1:10 after mine wear out in the future.
 
#37
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TeamSendIt!!!</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body">PanzerVI:

If you can't hit a 10"x10" plate at 1000 yards EVERY time with a 308, you need more time on the "B" team before stepping up to a 338LM.</div></div>

I agree with damn near everything you said but this would be a challenge for even the most experienced shooters. "every time" is pretty much impossible, everybody makes mistakes or misses a wind call eventually. otherwise f/tr would be won soley by x counts which damn sure isn't the case.

Again i agree with your point but think that is something to strive for but truly isn't realistic. </div></div>


I agree with TeamSendIt... Attached is a winning target from the National Long Range Championships...and it is NOT 10x10, and the guy is NOT shooting a .308.
AndersonB2L.jpg


(the X-ring is 1 MOA)...I don't know where all these crazy accuracy claims come from.
 
#38
Re: TRG vs. AI

Y'all are right and my "every time" statement was an exaggeration. Still, I think my underlying point is valid...

I'm not familiar with the competition that target is for. They have scoped rifles shooting 13 round strings at a target with a 1 MOA X ring? I'm more familiar with 1/2 MOA X rings for scoped rifles.
 
#39
Re: TRG vs. AI

To me, the AI is a step above the TRG. I feel like the TRG does not deserve it's reputation of being a "rugged" precision rifle. In reliability, it can't touch the AI. Problematic triggers, weak ejection (on the 22's), and the occasional snapped stock (through the grip) really aren't acceptable at that level. Sure, the problems are few and far between and AI is not perfect either (someone will come through and post the pic of the snapped AW chassis) but in our sample size here on Sniper's Hide it sure seems the AI is much less troublesome.

Realize that I am not saying the TRG's are bad guns, they are excellent. In ergonomics, accuracy, and fit/finish they are up there with the best. But when it comes to reliability their limited issues definitely hurt them compared to the AI's. With that said, I love TRG stocks, triggers, and the accuracy they're capable of; but if I'm running to the hills and taking one rifle with me it would be an AI.
 
#41
Re: TRG vs. AI

TRG 42 ejection is also weak.
I was told that in Finland, army guys and civilians are asked by law to bring ALL fired cases back to some certain government department, otherwise they break the law.
If this is true, it might explain why TRG's have such a weak ejection....
 
#42
Re: TRG vs. AI

To the OP, I was in the same situation last spring. I personally just didn't like the AI stock at the time. I was also thinking I wanted the -42 and after reading multiple threads like this one I changed my mind to the -22 in .308 and am sure glad I did. I does everything I need it to do and for a faction of the cost when I'm at the range or field.

Some day I'll buy that AI as well. I'm just glad I have one that fits well and it's .308.

DSC01693.jpg
 
#43
Re: TRG vs. AI

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Y'all are right and my "every time" statement was an exaggeration. Still, I think my underlying point is valid...

I'm not familiar with the competition that target is for. They have scoped rifles shooting 13 round strings at a target with a 1 MOA X ring? I'm more familiar with 1/2 MOA X rings for scoped rifles.</div></div>

All i meant by it was that i didn't want new guys to have unreasonable expectations of what is possible. everything else you said was spot on, the 308 is an unbelievably great round for training and honing your skills before you step up to the big dogs. plus you typically get any bad habits from the 308 like you might with the 338.
 
#44
Re: TRG vs. AI

The TRG-22 trigger issue that I had was the result of the screw backing out. Other than that I had heard of someone screwing up the trigger group by not following the instructions in the owners manual.
Other than that I have had nothing but great experiences with my Sako! It is comfortable to shoot, the action is phenomenal, the trigger is smooth and crisp. It is a very nice package and I enjoy shooting it. As far as strong ejection goes you do need to pull a little faster to fling out the brass. It doesn't bother me at all since I reload and would rather not go looking through piles of spent brass on the range for my nice Lapua brass. It lands right next to me.

Just my .02
 
#45
Re: TRG vs. AI

I think I have it settled, the TRG is just such a great deal I don't wants to pass on it. So what if I do the TRG package and build a modest rem 700 .308 to learn with and practice more? I have had a couple of people price me out on new TRG 22 packages and AI packages and the best I could do is over 1k more. For that difference I could do the TRG 42 package and a modest rem 700 .308 build. What y'all think?
 
#46
Re: TRG vs. AI

That will work very well if you can afford two rifles and scopes. My brother got into long range shooting with a 338LM. If you are only going to be punching paper might as well get good with something in the 308 class or casing. The 338LM is a very forgiving cartridge to shoot long range with. A person does not have to pay attention as closely to the wind the same way you need to do with a 308 or 300WM.

If you reload the 338LM is not that hard on the pocket book. Brass is high but that turns in to free brass after the first shot. With shipping I pay about a buck a shot for 338LM and about 75 cents for 300WM.
 
#50
Re: TRG vs. AI

The Lyman manual is a good one to figure out where to start as far as loads. The best load data I've found is right here on this forum in the reloading data section. Never start with the loads in there however, you should start near book minimum working up loading a round or two in .5 grain increments to test for pressure signs and if all is well over the suggested load then try it. Never assume because a load is safe in another persons gun that it won't blow yours into pieces even if your shooting the same rifle.
 
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