UPDATE, 40X @ 100yd.

[Mike_in_FL]

I finally found my missing 20 moa base and mounted it on my 40X today. I have a cheap Mueller mildot, 8.5-25X I believe. I had not shot this rifle at 100 yd. before. I'd like to know if the group sizes I'm getting are typical with the ammo I'm using.

My avg. 10 shot group w/ Wolf MT was 2.24. The avg. 10 shot group w/ Eley Club Xtra was 1.87. The group sizes were greater vertically. The horizontal avg. was probably 1.25 - 1.5. There really wasn't much if any wind, can't blame the conditions today.

I thought I'd be more around an inch as I started at 50 yd. because of the new base and shot a .330 5 shot group once I got settled in on the sandbags. I had a 10 shot group that wasn't that good but was still about .670.

To test if it was me, I also shot my Mk. II BV at 100 for the first time. The Eley avg. was about 2.75 and the Wolf avg. was 1.92. The scope on this rifle is a variable Redfield, nothing fancy, but maxes out at 16X. That's not as much as I'd have liked to have at that distance generally.

So again, are these groups typical to what you've seen? Or do I just need more practice? I know from what I've read here that most are using HV when they get out to 200. That's where I ultimately want to end up (if not further) but am asking if I should spend more time at 100 before I make the leap to 200. That's also going to require an 1 1/2 hr. drive to shoot that distance and further. Thanks in advance for your help, experience, and opinions.

 

[AlabamaShooter]

Re: Question for 40X trainer folks, shooting at 100 yd

My 40X is capable of great groups provided I do my part. I use Wolf Match Target, and it shoots really well. But being a .22 any wind can mess with your groups. I spent the rest of that range session chasing the wind.
This is one of the first 10 shot groups I had with my rifle.

 

[beenjammin]

Re: Question for 40X trainer folks, shooting at 100 yd

You would be surprised. My old 40x would make clover leaves at 100 with the el-cheapo sub sonics and my AAC pilot. I sold it to buy a sako finnfire range which is also very accurate, but just not as accurate as my 40x was.

 

[RicosRevenge]

Re: Question for 40X trainer folks, shooting at 100 yd

The Eley Club Extra (EPS Orange Box) does about 1.5" average at 100 out of mine. The Match EPS averages about an inch.

Of course that means nothing as my barrel may like/not like what yours does.

I would say keep shooting for now. Maybe try a box or two of Match and see if that tightens things up.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Question for 40X trainer folks, shooting at 100 yd

I would make certain my cheekweld was effective and consistent, and confirm that my optics' parallax compensation was correct. Very often, when MOA differs significantly with distance, and conditions are not in question, the solution will involve parallax compensation.

Check your parallax by doing some limited 'yes/no' motions with your eye behind the eyepiece lens. If the reticle and target (at the chosen distance) are not 'stuck' together, and relative motion occurs between them with eye movement, parallax is contributing to groups size enlargement. If an objective lens adjustment is possible, adjust it until that relative motion disappears. The relative motion literally means that as the relationship changes, the shooter is not aiming precisely to the same POA for each shot.

Many scope designs combine focus and parallax adjustment, and unless it's done with care, they will not properly correspond to the same distances. It is one of the most commonly prevalent, yet most commonly unnoticed scope problems, and is one of the things that getting right makes expensive scopes cost as much as they do. For the shooter who understands the relationship, good results can be coaxed out of less pricey optics.

For the rest of us, improperly compensated parallax is usually lurking inside our scopes. Often, proper parallax compensation will require adjusting the objective to a less-than-perfect focus. Where parallax adjustment is not available, it is adjusted at factory for an arbitrary distance, more often somewhere around 200yd.

When parallax adjustment cannot be guaranteed perfect, quartering the image (centering the eye in the image field for every shot) can minimize the negative effects of improperly compensated parallax.

Greg

 

[tansinator]

Re: Question for 40X trainer folks, shooting at 100 yd

Light trigger helps alot with 22lr as well. Groups will shrink with light trigger.

 

[CSS]

Re: Question for 40X trainer folks, shooting at 100 yd

With my 40x it would only shoot the high $$ Eley and Lapua ammo. Wolf and other low end target ammo was in the 2"+ at 100.
I have a few other 22's that will shoot the wolf into 3/4 or less at 100 so mine went off for a new barrel.
For what a case of Eley EPS or Lapua Center X cost I can buy a case of Wolf and have it rebarreled and still have a few dollars left over.

 

[rich56]

Re: Question for 40X trainer folks, shooting at 100 yd

I'm around 1moa@100 with Aguilla match or similar qualitywith my std brl 40x. Its quite hard judging the wind @ 100. I guess that is what makes it a good training thing for centerfire shooting. I too go 1+ hr to do my shooting.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Question for 40X trainer folks, shooting at 100 yd

I use 4' stakes and Surveyor's tape for wind flags. For C/F, every 50yd, for R/F every 25. Don't foget to plant those ones up close.

 

[Mike_in_FL]

Re: Question for 40X trainer folks, shooting at 100 yd

To catch up some things:

The 40X has a Canjar trigger, it is adjusted pretty light. Greg, thanks for your help, it may very well be a parallax issue but your other points were taken well too. Cheek weld may not have been as consistent as it should have been. I want to say I fired somewhere in the neighborhood of 150 rd. (or more) in 2 hours or so, including cease fires, new targets, moving from 50 to 100.

I have gotten into the habit of stapling a piece of engineer's tape to the target, not sure they'd like me staking up the place, lol. The only wind I was aware of was an occasional tailwind. Even as rapidly as I was shooting, I would wait until I felt no wind and saw no movement down at the target.

I'm using a Hoppes adjustable front rest and I really can't get it low enough for me to use and then use only 1 sandbag in the rear. I completely forgot that I sometimes put a few sandbags in the chair to raise myself using this rest. I couldn't really ever get comfortable on Sunday.

css, I would draw a similar conclusion about my barrel but I had equal results with my Savage. Not saying it's as good of a factory barrel but it's the only rifle I own to put 5 through the same hole, granted only at 25 yd. w/ Wolf MT. I've had the rifle for going on 35 years but haven't shot it much since way back in matches w/ irons.

It was a loaner thrown at me back then that I ended up buying. You have to pull the stock to remove the bolt with the Canjar and when I first had it at 13 y/o I remember cleaning it from the muzzle at least once, not sure if I or someone else damaged the crown. I don't see any obvious damage but??? It's still wearing the original 28" HB and it's a four digit serial number.

Does the BLACKPOWDERX, etc. give the date of manufacture on these rifles? Thanks to everyone who has replied.

EDIT: Looks like the the info for date is correct, mine is KG for May of '60

 

[dieselten]

Re: Question for 40X trainer folks, shooting at 100 yd

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fngmike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">To catch up some things:

The 40X has a Canjar trigger, it is adjusted pretty light. Greg, thanks for your help, it may very well be a parallax issue but your other points were taken well too. Cheek weld may not have been as consistent as it should have been. I want to say I fired somewhere in the neighborhood of 150 rd. (or more) in 2 hours or so, including cease fires, new targets, moving from 50 to 100.

I have gotten into the habit of stapling a piece of engineer's tape to the target, not sure they'd like me staking up the place, lol. The only wind I was aware of was an occasional tailwind. Even as rapidly as I was shooting, I would wait until I felt no wind and saw no movement down at the target.

I'm using a Hoppes adjustable front rest and I really can't get it low enough for me to use and then use only 1 sandbag in the rear. I completely forgot that I sometimes put a few sandbags in the chair to raise myself using this rest. I couldn't really ever get comfortable on Sunday.

css, I would draw a similar conclusion about my barrel but I had equal results with my Savage. Not saying it's as good of a factory barrel but it's the only rifle I own to put 5 through the same hole, granted only at 25 yd. w/ Wolf MT. I've had the rifle for going on 35 years but haven't shot it much since way back in matches w/ irons.

It was a loaner thrown at me back then that I ended up buying. You have to pull the stock to remove the bolt with the Canjar and when I first had it at 13 y/o I remember cleaning it from the muzzle at least once, not sure if I or someone else damaged the crown. I don't see any obvious damage but??? It's still wearing the original 28" HB and it's a four digit serial number.

Does the BLACKPOWDERX, etc. give the date of manufacture on these rifles? Thanks to everyone who has replied.

EDIT: Looks like the the info for date is correct, mine is KG for May of '60 </div></div>

If it was cleaned from the muzzle over the years you need more than just a new crown. It needs to be cut back to where there is no land damage, maybe .5" up to 2". You will definately see an improvement all else being equal.

 

[9H_Cracka]

Re: Question for 40X trainer folks, shooting at 100 yd

As long as the barrel is not completely fubared, off a rest with with a scope the rifle is capable of MOA or less, even at 100 yards, with ammo that is matched up to the rifle.

Mine bug holes with sling/coat/irons at 50 yards.

Mine should get a workout on a 50 meter range, F-Class style, next week. We'll see what it does.

The rifle already did 52 of 60 shots inside MOA at 50 meters using sling/coat/irons, posting a 592/600 on the International smallbore target which has a 1 MOA 10 ring.

 

[Mike_in_FL]

Re: Question for 40X trainer folks, shooting at 100 yd

This was the best I could do today with Eley Tenex. I did manage to get some inch groups with the Club Xtra and Wolf MT. This is about as good as my eyes can do. Again thank you to Greg. Paid much more attention to cheek weld today and the Mueller AO was around 200 when I got rid of the parallax.

Weird thing about this scope, knobs are marked 1/4" per click. Website says 1/8 MOA. They seem to be 1/8, it took about a full rotation, 64 clicks, to come up to 100 from 50.

Forgot to ask: Where do you buy Eley from? All my ammo is OLD, like at least 3 years. The Club Xtra, which is now under a different name, sometimes took 3 separate smacks from the firing pin to light off. My T22 which I bought from Sports Unlimited at least 10 or more years ago had no problems.