Looks like the moral of the story is to hand deliver everything that you need to send to someone...
- Thread starter Michael W
- Start date
I was editing as you quoted. go back and read my edits. It did turn up, eventually but it took getting some big players involved. Like anything there is bad apples out there in every group. I have to believe that by and large tho most people are still good people.
I find when your insurance stuff for the original value of what it would cost to replace the item, staff has a tendency to not disappear as easily.
For example, I sent aSkeetIrX to someone and insured it for $15k. They got it directly delivered to a locker at UPS where they locked it up...
same for firearms and other stuff, if I have to replace my shotgun that’s $15,000 so I put that on there.
It appears that UPS deals with high valued items in a different way
For example, I sent aSkeetIrX to someone and insured it for $15k. They got it directly delivered to a locker at UPS where they locked it up...
same for firearms and other stuff, if I have to replace my shotgun that’s $15,000 so I put that on there.
It appears that UPS deals with high valued items in a different way
You can also mail a long gun to a resident of another state so long as you mail the firearm to a federally licensed dealer in the purchaser's state of residence.
It's right there in your quote.
I never said you couldn't, I am fully aware, my comment about from resident to resident was to further prove the point the previous poster was wrong in his statement about the post office.
Fed Ex, years ago, lost an AK74 I had shipped. They were not very helpful until I got the ATF involved. Rifle was located within a couple hours once that happened.
Three year-old data but even Registered Mail is only as good as your average USPS employee.
Evidently you have no real life experiences with trying to make a claim against your demand for shipping with insurance. You are chastising someone for making an extremely smart decision by not being a fool and paying extra for insurance.
You can claim a high value on something without having to pay extra for the insurance...
Whatever it is you think is going to take place when you try to make a claim is not going to happen I assure you. It’s an absolute nightmare! First of all you have to give them a extended amount of time to locate the item in case it shows up in the future. It’s been a while since I read but I believe it was six months. Then they’re not just going to cut you a check for the declared value anyway. You’re going to have to provide proof blah blah and then they’re only going to pay you the value of the item used, not what you paid for it anyway!
In short it’s a complete and utter joke. Don’t accuse someone of being too cheap, compliment them on being very smart!!!
I just went through a “possible” theft experience with the UPS store last week and it’s too long of a story to explain but bottom line I contacted the buyer as soon as I walked out and told him the story and asked him if he agreed with me that it seemed suspicious and told him I thought they were planning on stealing the thermal scope!!! I wanted him to be involved in the loop immediately as this was his decision as well!
Both the buyer and I had previously agreed not to waste money on the insurance since we were splitting the cost as we were both aware what a joke it is!
After hearing the story, he agreed that something didn’t sound right and so I marched back in and had him open the hard case so it could be verified what was inside of it, which we didn’t do before.
Then, I took a video and audio of the conversation so everyone could hear that they were FULLY aware there was a expensive thermal scope inside the box they were getting ready to wrap. If I hadn’t of done that I can almost absolutely guarantee you they were going to steal the scope out of the hard case and just ship an empty case!!!
Anyone who heard the story of what took place would agree with me. It was extremely bizarre but my first suspicion started when they offered to wrap it and box it for free... This is the only way they really make their money is in packing it for you so the offer to do it for free and not in front of me like they normally do was with got my alert antenna up and then I paid close attention to everything else they did and it reaffirmed my suspicions!
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Only worked in distance selling of high value items for 25 years, dealing directly with UPS, FedEx, DHL, USPS, Bulk Freight Carriers, not little franchise stores.
Dealt with claims for losses ranging from a couple dollars to 80k at a go. So yep I have no idea about what I'm talking about.
Your story is great and all. BUT if somewhere along the way after that scope went into the system, it got lost or damaged you would have simply had no chance for any compensation outside of $100 and your shipping fees, instead of a slim chance at the lesser of provable replacement/purchase value. Perhaps your buyer was one in a million, but based on all the bitching over the years in the PX here, I've never seen any buyer all fine with being out the money and not getting the product because the carrier lost or damaged it...
In fact in the post I was replying to, the poster specifically stated they didn't want to pay extra for insurance but if they didn't get it, they were going to instantly call up their credit card company and demand the seller loose all the money instantly.
I fully agree that insurance is a rip off, almost all insurance is.
The issue is, are you doing this enough for you to just write off the loss against the savings from not purchasing insurance on all the rest of your shipments?
I'll bet most sellers on the PX don't ship enough unless they are commercial entities to make that worth it.
I looked at it like this. Let’s say the buyer never got it and it was stolen somewhere along the line. He is going to be out a scope he just paid for.
He is NOT going to be the least bit interested after sending a strange man $3000 in cold hard cash hearing how “it’s all going to be OK, calm down my friend, it’s all good, because thank GOD I had insurance..”
He wants his merchandise NOW! He doesn’t want to hear about filing a claim and all that crap. Yeah, maybe, just maybe a miracle will happen and the skies will open up and his scope will drop down from heaven but until that time he’s going to be raising hell and he’s going to be very very upset!
He’s going to post a thread about how he got ripped off and all those other good things. In short, Insurance would have given nobody peace of mind. So why bother?
Honestly I’m not sure what would’ve happened in such a case. I’m glad it didn’t happen but let’s say hypothetically I did sell him the item and I shipped it and it disappeared. I personally wouldn’t feel liable and I wouldn’t feel bad that I did anything wrong. It would just be one of those misfortunes of life I guess!
But as a rule of thumb, I am curious what would’ve happened???
The seller would have a small chance to get some / all of their money back eventually, if insurance was purchased & everything was done correctly.
Generally speaking regardless of if your buyer agreed on the risk and agreed on no insurance, from lots of experience and also watching the endless bitching threads about the PX on the forum here. The buyer would do anything possible to renege on the agreement and attempt by all means possible to force you to take all the loss yourself and still go on badmouthing you and demanding the mods ban you etc. even if they got their money back.
The insurance is basically there to offer the seller the possibility of some compensation if things are lost or damaged.
In addition to that, at certain levels of insurance coverage (If you are dealing with the actual carriers), there is more verified handling and specific accounting of who got what package.
If you ship enough stuff, you'll probably start running the numbers on just keeping the money aside and using that to pay yourself out against losses.
As a one time deal, it's a bit hard for most to get told, yep you are out $3k, buyer doesn't care what they agreed to, they are screwing you over just like everybody else in the deal. So being firm on must ship with insurance gives you a bit of hope.
Also just as a note, most of the carriers will let you ship directly with them & arrange for a pickup at your home or office.
I really suggest NOT going to the branded franchise stores. Pack it very well yourself with plenty of documentation and then do the shipping label online with the carrier directly & schedule a pickup.
One tip if you want, from the guys that self insure high value packages:
Ship via an overnight morning delivery service Monday through Thursday, to an address with an Adult Signature required.
Only directly with the carrier, either at their hub, or at your daily scheduled pickup, or by scheduling a pickup.
That offers the least amount of opportunity for theft, damage or loss.
DON'T ship on a Friday if it's high value and you are self insuring.
^^This right there ^^
I've been having them pick up at my residence for years,simple,secure fast.
And you usually know the driver
I was trying to ascertain, as a general rule of thumb, who is liable? Insurance or no insurance, leaving that out for the moment, if seller sends a package UPS and it comes up lost or missing and the buyer never received it, who is ultimately liable for that?
Of course we are talking it’s verifiable and not just the seller saying he sent it with no record or proof. Assuming UPS actually says this package is lost, who eats it???
As a seller you did what you were supposed to do and if it got stolen somewhere down the line I would think the buyer would be the one to assume any risk involved???? Heck I don’t know! But trust me I thought about it one heck of a lot because of what happened and I just couldn’t come up with a good answer for myself.
I mean we are not Amazon and can’t afford to lose I a $3,000 deal. Neither the buyer or the seller!
Of course we are talking it’s verifiable and not just the seller saying he sent it with no record or proof. Assuming UPS actually says this package is lost, who eats it???
As a seller you did what you were supposed to do and if it got stolen somewhere down the line I would think the buyer would be the one to assume any risk involved???? Heck I don’t know! But trust me I thought about it one heck of a lot because of what happened and I just couldn’t come up with a good answer for myself.
I mean we are not Amazon and can’t afford to lose I a $3,000 deal. Neither the buyer or the seller!
I guess you are saying TLDR to the previous explanation.
Simple answer then:
If it gets lost or damaged in transit,
OR the "buyer" claims they didn't get it despite showing delivered, and you don't have an adult signature for it:
Right or wrong, agreement or no agreement
Regardless of what the buyer swore up and down to.
Regardless of if the buyer sent you in writing their agreement to have no insurance and be fine with the loss.
The buyer is going to do everything they possibly can, to make you be the one that takes the full hit.
That's how it works in real life.
Sellers take it in the shorts and buyers rarely have any conscience about it.
As a seller, decide how to protect your own interests and don't be bullied, go to the backup buyer if the first buyer is an ass.
LMAO!!!! No I didn’t see your response when I wrote that. But I see it now!!!! LOL!
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