Rifle Scopes USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

[YAOG]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dustin1984</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Paper or steel targets out to 1000 yards on a custom-built Lilja barrelled .308 throated for 175gr SMK.
Yes, I'm sure magnification range is appropriate. Was going to go with a fixed 10x, but last time I was out shooting, I was acutely aware of how hard it is to see where you hit with even a 12x scope. Though I can hit 2moa at 780 yards with the rifle, the scope that's on it right now is severely limiting, as I can't make more minute corrections.
and as to why these three brands, they're available in Canada with a minimum of hassle. Remember we don't have the options you do in the US. </div></div>


Dustin, shooting paper or steel at 1K yards with a .308Win is a fine challenge which we shoot frequently. To shoot for score well at 1K yards you will need more magnification and a finer reticle. To simply shoot steel at these ranges I was very happily using an IOR 3-18x42 FFP with the modified MP8 reticle but this is a rather coarse tactical reticle which is good for what it is designed for but poor for truly precision shooting. We are usually shooting at 0.2mil targets at 1K yards.

But to do this with a 25x FFP scope you need scope with a fine reticle like a Gen2XR or P4Fine. This limits your options in scopes. I like Premier and S&B which happen to be some of the only options outside of USO with these finer reticles suitable for tactical and paper punching. Look into the higher mag range USO and save your pennies it will be worth the wait if you get a good one. If not it may be frustrating sending it back and forth to California.

Hope this helps!

 

[banshee sws]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

+1 on the Razor, they are very impressive for the price

huge amount of internal mil-rad adjustment, clear glass, crisp clicks, built well, good power range, nice reticle (mine is the ebr-2b)

pushed mine to 1920yds last year at a class, and have got no complaints.

take another look , they are nice - little overkill for a .308
IMHO

 

[banshee sws]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

again, lots of advice, decide where you want to end up for your application, and see what fits your usage, 90% of the time,

narrow it down even more to two or three from after that

if i was punching paper, at long ranges, i would go high power, fine reticle

if i was ringing steel or wanted a more 'real world' rig, i would do variable power, 2,3 to 16,18 range with a heavier reticle, that doesn't get 'lost' on dull/drab type targets. again the IOR mp8 is ideal , but hey that's probably m y favorite optic,

 

[banshee sws]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

this is one thing, you don't hear mentioned often, is alot of reticles on front focal plane scopes, when dialed down to low power, are small and close to unusable on a target that is camo'd, drab, black, dark, basically anything other than a white target that offers contrast to the reticle

i guess some folks never dial down but shoot at high power alot. if this is your only game, no worries, but if you are covering an entry team , and need field of view, or are making close shots, or are shooting comp's that use obscure/hidden targets like camo'd steel, lol it gets interesting fast

 

[Dustin1984]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

Whatever I do end up buying, chances are I'll be buying a matched pair for my future .338 lapua as well.... Or at least very similar
For anyone curious, this rifle was built with one of the USMC m40a1 take-off stocks, and I'd like to hear from anyone else that built a rifle with one, but in a private message

 

[Bearwalk]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dustin1984</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I'd need proof about Vortex being in the same league and I can't see that one happening. Having sold many Bushnells and Leupolds for Hunting scopes... if anything came back, it was guaranteed to be a bushnell. I know you get what you pay for. </div></div>

You need proof, yet you are solicitng internet opinions for your $2000+ scope purchase. chuckle. Sorry, man, couldn't let that one go.

As for opinions, I can assure you that the Razor's performance exceeds that of my NFs in every way except weight and overall size. Currently, I own 4 NF FFPs and 4 Razors. BTW. I've written up a couple of comparisons over on LongRange Hunting if you care to google.

 

[Zebra644]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

[url=hahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=7pc-aov6G7g#t=1sd][url=hahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=7pc-aov6G7g#t=1sd]hahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=7pc-aov6G7g#t=1sd[/url][/url]


Well I tried to link the Video of Lowlight Testing the Vortex Razor HD and it didnt work well, long story short, Its a heck of a scope to have been submerged, dropped, and exposed to tannerite and still be on zero and have no issues. Ive seen another video where a gunshop owner takes a Regular Vortex scope, submerged it for 24 hrs. in a fish tank, wiped the lense off to see if any water had gotten through, then froze it for 24 hrs. He then cleaned off the lens again, bore sighted it, mounted it on a 300 Win Mag and it still heald its zero. I am not saying they are the answer but worth a look at.

 

[Dustin1984]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

Not soliciting opinions, soliciting experiences, there's a big difference.

A friend of mine up here has a buddy who was asked to try a Vortex. He found it wouldn't track and returned it the next day.

 

[EricCartmann]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

My Leupold Mark-4 is a great scope and has served me well for over 7 years.

I have 3 NF NXS's and to me they do not offer much over Leupold other than the positive feel of the turrets. 20 MOA per rotation, and MOA reticle.

Glass for both the NF and Leupold is on par with each other.

I really love the Leupold TMR reticle, wish it came in MOA but I have no problem ranging in mils and dialing in MOA, been doing it for so long that it is natural, though I do prefer MOA reticle, and Leupold does not have MOA reticles, hence the reason why I own 3 NF's and only 1 Leupold.

If you price a scope feature for feature, I find NF to be the better value over Leupold.

As for USO (as well as S&B and Premier), I would love to own one, but they are too pricey for me don't see myself ever owning these scopes.

 

[Zebra644]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dustin1984</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not soliciting opinions, soliciting experiences, there's a big difference.

A friend of mine up here has a buddy who was asked to try a Vortex. He found it wouldn't track and returned it the next day. </div></div>

Did you watch the video? It is experience not opinion. As per the Hide's ROE's and your new, I will refrain from giving you an opinion. I was trying to show you an option and help.

 

[YAOG]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: banshee sws</div><div class="ubbcode-body">again, lots of advice, decide where you want to end up for your application, and see what fits your usage, 90% of the time,

narrow it down even more to two or three from after that

if i was punching paper, at long ranges, i would go high power, fine reticle

if i was ringing steel or wanted a more 'real world' rig, i would do variable power, 2,3 to 16,18 range with a heavier reticle, that doesn't get 'lost' on dull/drab type targets. again the IOR mp8 is ideal , but hey that's probably m y favorite optic, </div></div>


I LOVED my IOR 3-18x42 FFP! German Schott glass honed and polished with craftsmanship you have to spend half again as much to get from any other maker and a reticle that is great for tactical use. After I sold my IOR 3-18x42 FFP as I was packing it up to ship out to its new home I really was having second thoughts about having let it go. Maybe I'll buy another one down the road...

 

[YAOG]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: banshee sws</div><div class="ubbcode-body">this is one thing, you don't hear mentioned often, is alot of reticles on front focal plane scopes, when dialed down to low power, are small and close to unusable on a target that is camo'd, drab, black, dark, basically anything other than a white target that offers contrast to the reticle

i guess some folks never dial down but shoot at high power alot. if this is your only game, no worries, but if you are covering an entry team , and need field of view, or are making close shots, or are shooting comp's that use obscure/hidden targets like camo'd steel, lol it gets interesting fast </div></div>

Of course the trick is to buy the correct reticle for the scope magnification range and scope use. A lot of people bought the S&B PMII 3-12x50 with the P4 fine reticle only to find that the reticle is just about invisible at 3X.

 

[5RWill]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Zebra308</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> [url=hahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=7pc-aov6G7g#t=1sd][url=hahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=7pc-aov6G7g#t=1sd]hahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=7pc-aov6G7g#t=1sd[/url][/url]


Well I tried to link the Video of Lowlight Testing the Vortex Razor HD and it didnt work well, long story short, Its a heck of a scope to have been submerged, dropped, and exposed to tannerite and still be on zero and have no issues. Ive seen another video where a gunshop owner takes a Regular Vortex scope, submerged it for 24 hrs. in a fish tank, wiped the lense off to see if any water had gotten through, then froze it for 24 hrs. He then cleaned off the lens again, bore sighted it, mounted it on a 300 Win Mag and it still heald its zero. I am not saying they are the answer but worth a look at.


</div></div>

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Fixed

 

[Bearwalk]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dustin1984</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not soliciting opinions, soliciting experiences, there's a big difference.

A friend of mine up here has a buddy who was asked to try a Vortex. He found it wouldn't track and returned it the next day. </div></div>

Well, if you want to trade semantics, Rob, others and I have given you our experience, so now you have your proof.

And, you buddy has a friend???? C'MON MAN!! LOL

Was it even a Razor? I'm pretty sure I've got friends of buddies who have returned every brand of scope on the planet.

 

[stefan73]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

I own a Leupold M3A, MRT, LRT and ERT as well as a Nightforce NXS and a USO SN3 T-PAL 5.5-25X58 with a 35mm tube (been playing with it for a couple of days now while on leave from Afghanistan, I'll put some rounds downrange with it this weekend). The USO to me is like stepping up from a Nikon D50 Camera to a Nikon D700 pro series camera. It is an awesom piece of kit!! Either way with any of these optics you really can't go wrong here IMO.

 

[Dustin1984]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

I don't know the guy personally, may have met him in the gunsmith's shop once... it was his reamer that was used to chamber my barrel. Both guys however I know are very reliable. Neither has to make choices of bang for buck variety, so they will give honest feedback.

At this point I'm pretty sure I'll be going USO unless I get a really killer deal on a nightforce or the upcoming mark 6 really impresses me

 

[Muskett]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

Now I know the rifle you might want to make it up to look like an original and so you may as well go for the original fitted scope???? whatever that was. Or not.

I consider the 308 a 600m tack driver and a 800 hit master rather than a 1000m system. Unlike the 338 or 300 WinMag which are only just getting going at 500m.
USO do the former, 308, nicely but other makes have some advantages for the later. Robust tracking target turrets are a must. Second if you want little groups over 800m then you need both small clicks and very fine reticule. Your dilemma is getting both as a lot don't do them fine enough. Getting them very fine is less useful for hunting at normal ranges. You might be better getting dedicated scopes for each calibre. Whatever make you go for do double check you are getting the reticule and clicks that you want for what you are going to shoot it for.

Leupold, Swaro, Zeiss, and NF do fine reticules if you order the right one. You might have to special order the clicks you want. At the end of the day its your call and every bit of research pays dividends. I just say double check you are getting exactly what you want and aren't making a compromise because you have fallen for the hype.

Good luck.

 

[dvajda]

Re: USO vs Leupold vs. Nightforce

I own two IORs, in 2-12x and a 4-14x, and a NightForce 3.5-15x56. The NF cost about $500 more than the comparable IOR in 4-14x. I think both scopes are about equal in glass, with perhaps the NF taking a slight slight edge. But is that worth $500? I dunno. Plus maybe the edge might be due to the extra 1x I get with the NF? Who knows. The thing is, I'm not sure it justifies the extra cost that I paid. Also, the NF annoys me in that the rear scope cap always interferes with my bolt, because the whole rear eyepiece of the NF rotates when you adjust magnification. This to me is a terrible feature, because I can only cycle the bolt at one magnification, everywhere else either the bolt hits it, or the open cap hits my stock. Completely dumb feature, yet I paid $500 more for the scope?!

If not for the rear rotation of the eyepiece, I would buy another NF, but due to that feature alone, I would go IOR next time, and also save $$$$. I think the IORs are amazing, and they are priced amazing too. I have never had any trouble with mine in over 5 years of heavy use. USO just seems to have too many hit or miss quality issues, so that scares me. And S&B will cost you an arm and a leg, but that might be worth it. You have to decide. I will be buying a new scope soon, and it will be either IOR or S&B.