velocity loss per inch of barrel

[Blasst]

I put that subject line of this post in google and came up with numerous articles/tests coming to the same conclusion. Loss of velocity is negligible when you shorten a barrel unless you are shooting a really fast round like a magnum. This was a pretty good article on Chuck Hawks site that goes into it ..........

"Velocity loss (or gain)
It is worth noting that the velocity figures published in ammunition brochures and reloading manuals are sometimes taken in barrels different in length from those supplied on many rifles. I have seen various estimates of how much velocity is lost (or gained) when a barrel is not the same length as the test barrel in which a cartridge was chronographed. Here are some of them.
The 2001 Edition of the Shooter's Bible states, in the introduction to the Centerfire Rifle Ballistics section, "Barrel length affects velocity, and at various rates depending on the load. As a rule, figure 50 fps per inch of barrel, plus or minus, if your barrel is longer or shorter than 22 inches." However, they do not say what category of load to which this 50 fps average pertains.
Jack O'Connor wrote in The Rifle Book that, "The barrel shorter than standard has a velocity loss which averages about 25 foot-seconds for every inch cut off the barrel. Likewise, there is a velocity gain with a longer barrel." He went on to illustrate this using a .30-06 rifle shooting 180 grain bullets as an example, so his estimate was obviously for rifles in that general performance class.
Other authorities have tried to take into account the different velocity ranges within which modern cartridges operate. The Remington Catalog 2003 includes a "Centerfire Rifle Velocity Vs. Barrel Length" table that shows the following velocity changes for barrels shorter or longer than the test barrel length:
• MV 2000-2500 fps, the approximate change in MV per 1" change in barrel length is 10 fps.
MV 2500-3000 fps, the approximate change in MV per 1" change in barrel length is 20 fps.
MV 3000-3500 fps, the approximate change in MV per 1" change in barrel length is 30 fps.
MV 3500-4000 fps, the approximate change in MV per 1" change in barrel length is 40 fps.

The 45th Edition of the Lyman Reloading Handbook also has a table showing Center Fire Rifle Velocity Vs. Barrel Length. Their figures apply to barrels between 20 and 26 inches in length and agree with the Remington figures. The Lyman table shows the following approximate velocity changes:
• For rifles with muzzle velocities in the 1000-2000 fps range, the change in velocity for each 1" change in barrel length is 5 fps.
For rifles with muzzle velocities in the 2001-2500 fps range, the change in velocity for each 1" change in barrel length is 10 fps.
For rifles with muzzle velocities in the 2501-3000 fps range, the change in velocity for each 1" change in barrel length is 20 fps.
For rifles with muzzle velocities in the 3001-3500 fps range, the change in velocity for each 1" change in barrel length is 30 fps.
For rifles with muzzle velocities in the 3501-4000 fps range, the change in velocity for each 1" change in barrel length is 40 fps.
The 43rd edition of the Lyman reloading Handbook gave some concrete examples of velocity loss for specific calibers and loads. The Lyman technicians chronographed some high velocity cartridges in rifles with barrels ranging in length from 26 inches down to 22 inches with the following results:
• The average loss for the .243 Win./100 grain bullet was 29 fps per inch.
The average loss for the .264 Win. Mag./140 grain bullet was 32 fps per inch.
The average loss for the .300 H&H Mag./220 grain bullet was 25 fps per inch.
For standard high intensity cartridges in the same test, the Lyman technicians chronographed the cartridges in barrel lengths ranging in length from 24 inches down to 20 inches with the following results:
• The average loss for the .270 Win./130 grain bullet was 37 fps per inch.
The average loss for the .270 Win./150 grain bullet was 32 fps per inch.
The average loss for the .300 Sav./180 grain bullet was 17 fps per inch.
The average loss for the .30-06/180 grain bullet was 15 fps per inch.
The average loss for the .35 Rem./200 grain bullet was 11 fps per inch.
After a bunch of disclaimers, the Lyman people concluded, "The rule of thumb is that high speed, high pressure cartridges shed more speed in short barrels than do the low speed, large bore types." It's funny, but that is what I had suspected all along!"

 

[Packjam]

I randomly found this old post. Planning on doing a 30-06 with an 18" barrel...

 

[Hecouldgoalltheway]

Sweet, good luck with your outdated cartridge poorly suited for a short barrel.

It's like using a corn broom as a boat paddle.

 

[Packjam]

Sweet, good luck with your outdated cartridge poorly suited for a short barrel.

It's like using a corn broom as a boat paddle.

If I wanted to hear from an asshole I'd fart...

 

[axarob44]

No reason to be nasty. Geeze man

 

[Packjam]

No reason to be nasty. Geeze man

30-06 is timeless. It can't be outdated...

 

[Hecouldgoalltheway]

Nothing is timeless. I'm a short barrel guy, shoot everything suppressed. The ol' nazi killer (like all ancient long action cartridges) is very inefficient and therefore poorly suited for a short barrel. Running an '06 in an 18" barrel doesn't make much sense. This isn't about nostalgia, it's physics. Now, if you just want to do something that doesn't make much sense, then get some, because we all do that, but what's the purpose of this post?

But what you did was dug up a post from 11 years ago, and posted a single sentence to tell us what you were going to do. OK, why do we care? Is there a question involved, or are you just talking to yourself? Do you just like telling people when you do nonsensical shit, or were you searching for validation? If you want the people here to make you feel better about your decisions, you've come to the wrong place. This isn't carebear land, this is the jungle. So, is there a question or some point of discussion you'd like to broach, or you really just want the internet to know that you're going to cut a 30-06 down to 18". I will represent the internet here: nobody gives a shit.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

Well, kinda. As fast as an 11yo thread can ramp up I guess.

 

[Packjam]

Nothing is timeless. I'm a short barrel guy, shoot everything suppressed. The ol' nazi killer (like all ancient long action cartridges) is very inefficient and therefore poorly suited for a short barrel. Running an '06 in an 18" barrel doesn't make much sense. This isn't about nostalgia, it's physics. Now, if you just want to do something that doesn't make much sense, then get some, because we all do that, but what's the purpose of this post?

But what you did was dug up a post from 11 years ago, and posted a single sentence to tell us what you were going to do. OK, why do we care? Is there a question involved, or are you just talking to yourself? Do you just like telling people when you do nonsensical shit, or where you searching for validation? If you want the people here to make you feel better about your decisions, you've come to the wrong place. This isn't carebear land, this is the jungle. So, is there a question or some point of discussion you'd like to broach, or you really just want the internet to know that you're going to cut a 30-06 down to 18". I will represent the internet here: nobody gives a shit.

Didn't mean to disturb the delicate genius.

 

[tsavo303]

http://ballisticsbytheinch.com/. Y’all know this. Those generalizations are not accurate

 

[Skeptic1]

I do wonder why one would want a long action shortish barreled rifle.
It'd be like pulling your pants down to your knees to piss in a urinal.

 

[Obi-WanKannoli]

I do wonder why one would want a long action shortish barreled rifle.
It'd be like pulling your pants down to your knees to piss in a urinal.

Suppressor use, tree stand hunting, "brush gun" and that's about it.

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

I randomly found this old post. Planning on doing a 30-06 with an 18" barrel...

H.C.A.R. Package

Weapon Specifications: Caliber: .30-06 Barrel: CMV Barrel Length: 16 or 20 inches Barrel Twist: 1/10 Muzzle Thread: 5/8-24 Finish...

www.oowinc.com

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

Suppressor use, tree stand hunting, "brush gun" and that's about it.

Might as well do a 308 or a different caliber optimized for a shorter barrel. Otherwise you are wasting a bunch of powder and making more noise.

 

[Hecouldgoalltheway]

And for my next trick, I will make these 30-06 cartridges exit my short barrel at 300 blackout velocities.

 

[FredHammer]

And for my next trick, I will make these 30-06 cartridges exit my short barrel at 300 blackout velocities.

Do the 30-06AI in a 16"

 

[Nevada Desert Rat]

There is so much that changes with barrel length. If you look at the miltary specs on the 45acp. Same Ammo in the 1911 it has a higher published velocity than in a Tommygun. Barrel length plus cartridge/load makes a difference. No matter what the length the 30-06 will get more velocity than a 308.
NDR

 

[Packjam]

There is so much that changes with barrel length. If you look at the miltary specs on the 45acp. Same Ammo in the 1911 it has a higher published velocity than in a Tommygun. Barrel length plus cartridge/load makes a difference. No matter what the length the 30-06 will get more velocity than a 308.
NDR

People say things like "efficient" I say 30-06 with an 18" barrel will send rounds 200 fps faster than a 308 with an 18" barrel. Efficiency is a great metric for the military who uses 223 they abandoned 308 rapidly because 223 is far more efficient. The reason I want a short 30-06 is to run it suppressed and I want to get max velocity out of it and I want to be able to use it on large game with heavy for caliber rounds. I also happen to be building it in a Tikka which has one action size regardless of 308 or 30-06. I'm stuck with the medium action. I'll take it because I prefer 30-06 and the Tikka is smooth and reliable and came with a great trigger... My target loads for this build will be 178gr ELD-X, 180 accubond and 220 grain ELD-X. You better sell your pick up truck and start driving a Vespa. Your truck is very inefficient. Not everything is about efficiency. It's exhausting people saying 308 is "better" than 30-06. No it's slower, it uses less powder it's basically different. If you care about the cost to manufacture and transport 1000s of rounds 308 is very efficient. It has less powder so added barrel length as less benefit. Regardless, 308 is slower. It has less powder. This is basic physics.

 

[Hecouldgoalltheway]

People say things like "efficient" I say 30-06 with an 18" barrel will send rounds 200 fps faster than a 308 with an 18" barrel. Efficiency is a great metric for the military who uses 223 they abandoned 308 rapidly because 223 is far more efficient. The reason I want a short 30-06 is to run it suppressed and I want to get max velocity out of it and I want to be able to use it on large game with heavy for caliber rounds. I also happen to be building it in a Tikka which has one action size regardless of 308 or 30-06. I'm stuck with the medium action. I'll take it because I prefer 30-06 and the Tikka is smooth and reliable and came with a great trigger... My target loads for this build will be 178gr ELD-X, 180 accubond and 220 grain ELD-X. You better sell your pick up truck and start driving a Vespa. Your truck is very inefficient. Not everything is about efficiency. It's exhausting people saying 308 is "better" than 30-06. No it's slower, it uses less powder it's basically different. If you care about the cost to manufacture and transport 1000s of rounds 308 is very efficient. It has less powder so added barrel length as less benefit. Regardless, 308 is slower. It has less powder. This is basic physics.

You will not get 200fps additional velocity in an 18" barrel with a 30-06 over a .308. That is absolutely incorrect. You'll be blowing out primers in your dirty 30 trying to get the same velocity from .308 factory ammo in 18" of barrel. That's been my point since you created this post. And, a .308 in an 18" barrel is anemic anyways. There are so many better options out there than either of them anyways for a short barrel on that bolt face to serve either hunting or slapping steel.

That 200fps edge you're giving the 30-06 requires at least 24" of barrel. Every time you take away an inch of barrel, the 30-06 velocity drops exponentially faster than the .308.


What are you going to do with this rifle? Or are you committed to this plan no matter what anyone says, and this entire conversation is mental masturbation like I thought it was? You should know that I'm not trying to beat you up for doing whatever you want to, I will do whatever I want, even if it doesn't make sense, merica. I'm just trying to figure out why we are talking about this.

 

[Packjam]

You will not get 200fps additional velocity in an 18" barrel with a 30-06 over a .308. That is absolutely incorrect. You'll be blowing out primers in your dirty 30 trying to get the same velocity from .308 factory ammo in 18" of barrel. That's been my point since you created this post. And, a .308 in an 18" barrel is anemic anyways. There are so many better options out there than either of them anyways for a short barrel on that bolt face to serve either hunting or slapping steel.

That 200fps edge you're giving the 30-06 requires at least 24" of barrel. Every time you take away an inch of barrel, the 30-06 velocity drops exponentially faster than the .308.


What are you going to do with this rifle? Or are you committed to this plan no matter what anyone says, and this entire conversation is mental masturbation like I thought it was? You should know that I'm not trying to beat you up for doing whatever you want to, I will do whatever I want, even if it doesn't make sense, merica. I'm just trying to figure out why we are talking about this.

Try harder... Name a 30 cal cartridge that will shoot faster than a 30-06 out of 18" barrel and use less powder that is not a magnum.

 

[Hecouldgoalltheway]

Try to do what? I don't give two shits what you do.

This is why I was so harsh out of the gate. This entire thread is a waste of time. You aren't here to discuss this path with people who have been there and know more about this than you do, you're just talking to hear the sound of your own voice.

 

[Packjam]

Do the 30-06AI in a 16"

I would but I do not want to fire form brass or buy that brass. I have piles of 30-06 brass... What would be better is a 300 win sbr 8" barrel 1:7 twist.

 

[Packjam]

Try to do what? I don't give two shits what you do.

This is why I was so harsh out of the gate. This entire thread is a waste of time. You aren't here to discuss this path with people who have been there and know more about this than you do, you're just talking to hear the sound of your own voice.

No I'm not here to discuss. So a guy posted a useful thread on fps loss per inch. I said thanks this helped me with a decision. Now, Id like to speak with your mother. She did a lousy job raising you. You need a good spanking. You've learned bad behavior gets attention. Well it's not good attention. I'm not here to fight some philosophical fight over efficiency and what constitutes a good cartridge. I have a ton of 30-06 brass multiple 30-06 rifles, piles of bullets and primers. I'm bored I want to do something weird like a supressed 18" 30-06. Wasn't asking for your advice. You came right out the gate criticizing me. I like to tinker. I don't always do things because they make perfect sense. Im just going spin on a cheap custom shouldered Prefits and see if I can put down some animals with it... Not looking for your approval or permission. What is your major malfunction? What is your disorder? I think you need to see a doctor. I wasn't talking to you. I feel bad for your wife and your children if you have any and if you don't have any wife or children I know why... No one was talking to you. Now name a 30 cal cartridge that will shoot faster, is more efficient and uses less powder than a 30-06.

 

[Hecouldgoalltheway]

No I'm not here to discuss. So a guy posted a useful thread on fps loss per inch. I said thanks this helped me with a decision. Now, Id like to speak with your mother. She did a lousy job raising you. You need a good spanking. You've learned bad behavior gets attention. Well it's not good attention. I'm not here to fight someone philosophical fight over efficiency and what constitutes a good cartridge. I have a ton of 30-06 brass multiple 30-06 rifles, piles of bullets and primers. I'm bored I want to do something weird like a supressed 18" 30-06. Wasn't asking for your advice. You came right out the gate criticizing me. I like to tinker. I don't always do things because they make perfect sense. Im just going spin on a cheap custom shouldered Prefits and see if I can put down some animals with it... Not looking for your approval or permission. What is your major malfunction? What is your disorder? I think you need to see a doctor. I wasn't talking to you. I feel bad for your wife and your children if you have any and if you don't have any wife or children I know why... No one was talking to you. Now name a 30 cal cartridge that will shoot faster, is more efficient and uses less powder than a 30-30-06

I almost wish I hadn't had you figured out from your first post, but I did.

As far as who I am or what my family consists of and their prospective happiness or my mental/ medical state, and any accusations of attention seeking behavior... You're really grasping at straws. Typical deflections when you've been exposed. We've all seen this before.

I hope your 30-06 makes you happy, and thank God we have the freedom to do stupid shit if we so choose. I have limited myself to labeling no more than one person a day as an "oxygen theif" and I'm not wasting today's allocation on you, so have a good evening sir.

 

[Packjam]

I almost wish I hadn't had you figured out from your first post, but I did.

As far as who I am or what my family consists of and their prospective happiness or my mental/ medical state, and any accusations of attention seeking behavior... You're really grasping at straws. Typical deflections when you've been exposed. We've all seen this before.

I hope your 30-06 makes you happy, and thank God we have the freedom to do stupid shit if we so choose. I have limited myself to labeling no more than one person a day as an "oxygen theif" and I'm not wasting today's allocation on you, so have a good evening sir.

Thank you enlightened master. I've learned so much from you? Name a 30 caliber cartridge that shoots faster than a 30-06 and uses less powder. There's got to be one! At least one! If I want to make my 30-06 mor efficient I can just use less powder! I think when I pop a. Elk with my 18" 30-06 it's going to deflect the bullets because it's not efficient enough lololol

 

[Hecouldgoalltheway]

18” 30/06

Does anyone have any data on one of these. I have a 30/06 Win model 70 stainless boss that has been sitting in the safe for a decade. My plan is to have it cut and shouldered for a direct thread suppressor. This will give me a 26”barreled package with a reasonable weight. Also I will get...

www.snipershide.com

This entire conversation could have been avoided had you simply used the search bar. This has been hashed and re-hashed on this very forum. Here is the real world data for you to disregard.

 

[Packjam]

18” 30/06

Does anyone have any data on one of these. I have a 30/06 Win model 70 stainless boss that has been sitting in the safe for a decade. My plan is to have it cut and shouldered for a direct thread suppressor. This will give me a 26”barreled package with a reasonable weight. Also I will get...

www.snipershide.com

This entire conversation could have been avoided had you simply used the search bar. This has been hashed and re-hashed on this very forum. Here is the real world data for you to disregard.

Wasn't looking for a conversation.

 

[Hecouldgoalltheway]

You revived an 11 year old post on a forum and you weren't looking for a conversation?

You're new to this internet thing aren't you? It's alright, you'll figure it out. Be brave.

 

[msgriff]

I randomly found this old post. Planning on doing a 30-06 with an 18" barrel...

What platform are you intending to build this on? Long action gas operated semi's aren't known to be builder friendly.

 

[Packjam]

What platform are you intending to build this on? Long action gas operated semi's aren't known to be builder friendly.

On a tikka action. Going to use a shouldered prefit. Going to spin it on myself.

 

[Packjam]

You revived an 11 year old post on a forum and you weren't looking for a conversation?

You're new to this internet thing aren't you? It's alright, you'll figure it out. Be brave.

You done?

 

[FredHammer]

I almost wish I hadn't had you figured out from your first post, but I did.

As far as who I am or what my family consists of and their prospective happiness or my mental/ medical state, and any accusations of attention seeking behavior... You're really grasping at straws. Typical deflections when you've been exposed. We've all seen this before.

I hope your 30-06 makes you happy, and thank God we have the freedom to do stupid shit if we so choose. I have limited myself to labeling no more than one person a day as an "oxygen theif" and I'm not wasting today's allocation on you, so have a good evening sir.

So, is there any saving this marriage?

 

[Packjam]

So, is there any saving this marriage?

I don't see any issues here. She acts up from time to time but she's great in bed. Especially after a heated argument like this.

 

[Hecouldgoalltheway]

I was done long ago but I feel like you're on the edge of a meltdown, so.....

 

[msgriff]

On a tikka action. Going to use a shouldered prefit. Going to spin it on myself.

You're in the wrong forum. This is the Semi-Automatic Rifles section, you should be posting in the Bear Pit, that's where you'll get the best responses.

 

[Skeptic1]

Holy hell....... I'd like to politely remove my comment and input from this thread. This has gotten ridiculous.
To the OP....... build what you want to and post some pictures here for us to see when you're finished with it.

 

[FredHammer]

You're in the wrong forum. This is the Semi-Automatic Rifles section, you should be posting in the Bear Pit, that where you'll get the best responses.

Oh uhm, yup that’s the place!

 

[Packjam]

Oh uhm, yup that’s the place!

He could go all the way

 

[FredHammer]

I randomly found this old post. Planning on doing a 30-06 with an 18" barrel...

I really think you should just do it and report back your results.

 

[Packjam]

I really think you should just do it and report back your results.

I don't feel like it. I'm far more interested in this bear pit.

 

[FredHammer]

I don't feel like it. I'm far more interested in this bear pit.

For those about to Bear Pit, we salute you!

 

[supercorndogs]

I do wonder why one would want a long action shortish barreled rifle.
It'd be like pulling your pants down to your knees to piss in a urinal.

Because the increased case capacity makes them have a higher velocity potential than their SA cousins. 30/06-308, 280-7mm-08, 6.5/06- 6.5 Creedmoor.

 

[Packjam]

Because the increased case capacity makes them have a higher velocity potential than their SA cousins. 30/06-308, 280-7mm-08, 6.5/06- 6.5 Creedmoor.

It's kind of funny how people somehow understand "efficiency" but they don't understand something far more basic. More Powder = More Speed. Also in my situation my action length is the same whether I use a short action or long action catridge because this is a Tikka.

 

[FredHammer]

It's kind of funny how people somehow understand "efficiency" but they don't understand something far more basic. More Powder = More Speed. Also in my situation my action length is the same whether I use a short action or long action catridge because this is a Tikka.

More funny is how/why you don't understand you are posting this project in the semi-auto section for a bolt action project...

 

[Packjam]

More funny is how/why you don't understand you are posting this project in the semi-auto section for a bolt action project...

It is pretty funny

 

[Skeptic1]

Because the increased case capacity makes them have a higher velocity potential than their SA cousins. 30/06-308, 280-7mm-08, 6.5/06- 6.5 Creedmoor.

Yes but 308 is short action in a 700. My thoughts are based on this I guess.

 

[Packjam]

Yes but 308 is short action in a 700. My thoughts are based on this I guess.

Yes the 700 is very popular. Unfortunately the triggers on the 700 are not well designed. They do not perform well with dust or freezing conditions. I no longer own any 700s. My preference is now model 70, Tikka t3x, or Sako s20. The after market support for Tikkas is pretty impressive. They also come with phenomenal triggers. Also the barrels are all shouldered Prefits so they can be easily spun on and off for tinkering and building. Sometimes people sell factory take-offs for as little as $30. You can also buy a custom Prefit for as low as $400 not including tax and shipping... You can also buy a Tikka for about $750 which is about $250 cheaper than a budget 700 clone. However the 700 has it's benefits like the long action is really long. The Tikkas action limits you to 3.4" coal. What I've found is good barrels don't need bullets jammed into the lands and unless your itching for 1/4 moa accuracy it's not necessary even then a good barrel will just shoot. A decent barrel there is no reason you can't get 1/2 moa with saami coals. Now there are some bullets that you'll have to hand feed like a 212 ELD-X and 215 vlds... 700 works great if you maintain the trigger. Just got to flush it with lighter fluid in a regular basis and maybe carry a spare with necessary tools. I won't compromise on reliability for a hunting rifle so I just don't own a 700... It's not super common that folks have issues but it's a well known and well documented issue that is part of the platform.

 

[supercorndogs]

Tikka has an ok trigger.

 

[Packjam]

Tikka has an ok trigger.

Id debate that. I guess if you want a 0.5 lb trigger you won't be happy with it. For a hunting rifle I prefer 3lbs. But there is no creep and it's a nice crisp break. Phenomenal is an exaggeration. In my book there is not a need to upgrade and it's far better than any 700 trigger as far as safety and reliability.

 

[Skeptic1]

Certainly your prerogative on which action you'd like to use. Personally I feel like my 700 triggers are really good.