Night Vision Vortex Impact 4000 Rifle/Rail mounted Range finder???

[HemiPowrd]

First range trip, worked flawlessly. No issues with recoil.

First 5 shots on the orange at 500 yards. Vortex solution given was 2.06 Mils up so dialed in 2.1. First shot was a little high. Dialed down to 2.0 and it started hammering. Wind was fairly high at 20 - 25 MPH so not too shabby!

 

[cake5150]

First range trip, worked flawlessly. No issues with recoil.

Thanks for mentioning that. I've been wondering how everyone's Impacts are holding zero with recoil and time. Can anyone else comment on whether or not your Impact has held zero and what caliber(s) it has been used on with approximate round count? If any are shifting, are we talking large or small shifts? My Radius LRFs I've had over the years usually did fine with recoil but it did not want to stay perfectly zeroed on a 6.5 Creedmoor gas gun. I'm guessing that was the vibration coupled with the odd mount on the Radius. I'd love to hear what you guys can share on the matter.

 

[Jgunner]

Took 5th in a match when i am usually mid pack. The calculations are a a little slow, it times out too quickly which cost me time, but other than that it works killer. I have very little time behind it, maybe 20 minutes before the match. So not well versed.

 

[Scott_at_Vortex]

Took 5th in a match when i am usually mid pack. The calculations are a a little slow, it times out too quickly which cost me time, but other than that it works killer. I have very little time behind it, maybe 20 minutes before the match. So not well versed.

There are multiple timeout settings in the menu including no timeout at all. In that setting you have to manually turn it off or it won't turn off until the power dies. As far as calculation time goes, I'm wondering if you might have had the impact in ELR mode. That will increase time to solution, but otherwise I have found the solution is waiting for me as soon as I come out of the scope to look.

Anyhow, hope this helps and thank you for the post!

Best Regards
Scott

 

[rlsmith1]

Took 5th in a match when i am usually mid pack. The calculations are a a little slow, it times out too quickly which cost me time, but other than that it works killer. I have very little time behind it, maybe 20 minutes before the match. So not well versed.

Somewhere in the settings you can disable the auto-off feature (that’s what I did with mine)

 

[Jgunner]

Somewhere in the settings you can disable the auto-off feature (that’s what I did with mine)

Sweet! Like i said, i havnt played with it much. I work too damn much, sigh....

 

[Jgunner]

There are multiple timeout settings in the menu including no timeout at all. In that setting you have to manually turn it off or it won't turn off until the power dies. As far as calculation time goes, I'm wondering if you might have had the impact in ELR mode. That will increase time to solution, but otherwise I have found the solution is waiting for me as soon as I come out of the scope to look.

Anyhow, hope this helps and thank you for the post!

Best Regards
Scott

Oh, ok! Ill check that out! I have not messed with settings much, if at all. Appreciate the info!

 

[sethrrows]

Finally getting my Impact setup. I think this is how I’m gonna use it. Seems pretty handy with this 8-40 LMSS2. Mounted on the side you don’t have to come off glass to see the display. With 90% of the use I’ll have with it, having it paired with the spotter makes the most sense vs running on the rifle. Especially, where I haven’t really found a solid solution for mounting the remote to my Vision chassis.

 

[sethrrows]

Here’s a few pictures of Badger Ord’s new lower CLIF mount with a 4-20 ATACR.

 

[taliv]

Need higher mounts not lower mounts.

 

[HemiPowrd]

When does the wind and weather info get updated when paired with a Kestrel weather station? I have the Kestrel 5500 with a vane setup to feed wind and weather info into GeoBallistics. From the manual I see where you can update the wind info from within the GB app. Is there a way to pull updated wind data in by hitting the wind bearing button on the Impact itself or is that only able to be updated using the GB app which then feeds into the Impact?

 

[RogueTanker]

Worked well at mammoth. Didn't lose zero and was definitely a huge help on UKD stages. I saw a lot of them there and you could see the difference it made with scoring hits.

 

[Jgunner]

Need higher mounts not lower mounts.

Get a nightforce then. I need lower, but this does make it stupid easy to see

 

[tanders11]

Is anyone moving one of these around different setups? It seems like the laser would be off if they didn’t share the same height over bore. Is my understanding correct?

 

[TheOE800]

Is anyone moving one of these around different setups? It seems like the laser would be off if they didn’t share the same height over bore. Is my understanding correct?

Yea the laser would be “off”, but I don’t think the impact of vertical is practically important regardless of zero type (convergent vs parallel). Windage differences from system to system though could be an issue.

My understanding could be wrong, but the laser optical center is a fixed (not angular) distance from the scope’s optical center in a parallel zero. In a convergent zero, assuming a zero many hundreds of yards out, the optical center between the scope and laser decreases until your zero distance then increases in a directly opposite angle. So for instance in one system you might be 3” over scope center and diving boards can vary about ~1” between low and high. So long as your scope isn’t dialed up or down, what’s 1” at 8,9,1000 yards?

 

[Glassaholic]

Yea the laser would be “off”, but I don’t think the impact of vertical is practically important regardless of zero type (convergent vs parallel). Windage differences from system to system though could be an issue.

My understanding could be wrong, but the laser optical center is a fixed (not angular) distance from the scope’s optical center in a parallel zero. In a convergent zero, assuming a zero many hundreds of yards out, the optical center between the scope and laser decreases until your zero distance then increases in a directly opposite angle. So for instance in one system you might be 3” over scope center and diving boards can vary about ~1” between low and high. So long as your scope isn’t dialed up or down, what’s 1” at 8,9,1000 yards?

I think I would agree with TheOE here, is the difference enough to make a difference? What would be good is to use NV to confirm actual zero of the LRF unit at distance, then swap to different platforms using different height - so one scope/mount is setup at 1.5" from center of scope to center LRF, the other is 2" from center scope to center LRF and so forth. Sadly I sold all my cool NV gear a few years ago and haven't replenished yet, but I'm assuming plenty of night junkies out there could do this (@wigwamitus I'm thinking of you brother), and maybe already have done this...

 

[Scott_at_Vortex]

Is anyone moving one of these around different setups? It seems like the laser would be off if they didn’t share the same height over bore. Is my understanding correct?

Hello,
The short answer is yes, you will need to align the Impact to every different rifle/scope set up you put it on before using. This is for the same reasons you need to rezero your scope when you move it to a different rifle.
Since the riflescope reticle becomes your lrf aiming point you have to align the laser and reticle.

Hopefully I understood the question correctly and hope this helps.

V/R
Scott

 

[Glassaholic]

Hello,
The short answer is yes, you will need to align the Impact to every different rifle/scope set up you put it on before using. This is for the same reasons you need to rezero your scope when you move it to a different rifle.
Since the riflescope reticle becomes your lrf aiming point you have to align the laser and reticle.

Hopefully I understood the question correctly and hope this helps.

V/R
Scott

Just out of curiosity Scott, I've setup my Impact 4000 during the day and could not see the visible laser on paper targets for the life of me, so I've used the reflector, when using the reflector I noticed that there was quite a bit of tolerance (with up/down and left/right adjustments) where I would see the bright reflection as this big blob of light before it would begin to fade, how accurate is this method and should I instead wait until light levels get low to use the visible laser on paper as a better/more accurate method to zero my I4000? In using this method, if I find the I4000 is close to the measured dot (distance from center of scope to laser) between multiple platforms then wouldn't this indicate I am GTG? I also use my Fix it Sticks torque wrench when mounting the I4000 to the diving boards to obtain as repeatable mount as possible.

 

[wigwamitus]

... I've setup my Impact 4000 during the day and could not see the visible laser on paper targets ...

Try it at night with a 14, you'll be able to see out to 400yds easy, and beyond. That's how I do it !

(I work during the day, so most of my shootin is a night )

 

[Scott_at_Vortex]

Just out of curiosity Scott, I've setup my Impact 4000 during the day and could not see the visible laser on paper targets for the life of me, so I've used the reflector, when using the reflector I noticed that there was quite a bit of tolerance (with up/down and left/right adjustments) where I would see the bright reflection as this big blob of light before it would begin to fade, how accurate is this method and should I instead wait until light levels get low to use the visible laser on paper as a better/more accurate method to zero my I4000? In using this method, if I find the I4000 is close to the measured dot (distance from center of scope to laser) between multiple platforms then wouldn't this indicate I am GTG? I also use my Fix it Sticks torque wrench when mounting the I4000 to the diving boards to obtain as repeatable mount as possible.

It'll get the job done, but I prefer to align out at 1k or beyond. In low light(just after dusk) you can see the vis laser well beyond 1k on white targets.

As far as switching the impact to different platforms goes. You will need to realign the impacts laser to the new scope/rifle zero. The diving board to scope offset has very little to do with this.

Hope that helps.

 

[96C]

I also zero my impact' at dusk on a distant tree (something fairly flat that you can make as measurement off).

Am much more confident in field measurement results having zero'd the visible laser at night 300-500m away than using the reflective dot on a target at 100m. The visible laser is quite large at 500m so, be mindful of that.

 

[Glassaholic]

It'll get the job done, but I prefer to align out at 1k or beyond. In low light(just after dusk) you can see the vis laser well beyond 1k on white targets.

Really? Well, might have to check that out. Unfortunately where I live the only place to even see 1000 yards is at a range, and my range closes at 5pm well before dusk so I may need to get creative. How large is the laser "dot" at 1000 yards? If my scope offset from LRF is 2", is the dot larger than 2" at 1000 yards and if so how can you accurate adjust if that is the case? Seems like the smaller laser dot at 100 yards 2" above scope scope would be more "accurate", what am I missing?

As far as switching the impact to different platforms goes. You will need to realign the impacts laser to the new scope/rifle zero. The diving board to scope offset has very little to do with this.

I will have to see how far "off" it is between different platforms...

 

[Glassaholic]

I also zero my impact' at dusk on a distant tree (something fairly flat that you can make as measurement off).

Am much more confident in field measurement results having zero'd the visible laser at night 300-500m away than using the reflective dot on a target at 100m. The visible laser is quite large at 500m so, be mindful of that.

We are supposed to calibrate the visible laser at the same distance from center of scope to center of laser right, so is the dot at 500m larger than this differential or are you able to identify the dot at the distance above scope center at 500m?

 

[Jnull]

I sighted mine in from my measured offset at 100 yards, impact is left side mounted so I accurately measured the down and left offsets, placed a reflective dot on the target at the same offsets and zeroed the “hotspot” of the visible laser to the dot. Looking through my simrad at night the IR laser appears to be dead on at 560 yards. I don’t know how anyone could have an issue with this unless the rifle isn’t held steady while moving the laser around on target.

 

[96C]

We are supposed to calibrate the visible laser at the same distance from center of scope to center of laser right, so is the dot at 500m larger than this differential or are you able to identify the dot at the distance above scope center at 500m?

I was out in the field not long ago, having not zero'd my Impact at 100m for a while and adjusting the rifle / scope zero also with a different load. Turning the visible laser on, things should line up at approximately 0.8 mil high (being the mechanical offset from centre of optic to centre of LRF).

There was a discrepancy from the 0.8 (which is parallel so distance should not be an issue regardless) so, I zero'd the visible laser on a bush at approx. 500m to the 0.8 mil high point in the reticle. The visible laser is quite large at distance.

Perhaps the unit had been bumped or shifted, unsure but once I'd done the field zero it was 100% reliable again.

So, in future, I will probably continue to do that - using the visible laser on an object at the approximate distance I am intending to use it.

 

[sethrrows]

I was out in the field not long ago, having not zero'd my Impact at 100m for a while and adjusting the rifle / scope zero also with a different load. Turning the visible laser on, things should line up at approximately 0.8 mil high (being the mechanical offset from centre of optic to centre of LRF).

There was a discrepancy from the 0.8 (which is parallel so distance should not be an issue regardless) so, I zero'd the visible laser on a bush at approx. 500m to the 0.8 mil high point in the reticle. The visible laser is quite large at distance.

Perhaps the unit had been bumped or shifted, unsure but once I'd done the field zero it was 100% reliable again.

So, in future, I will probably continue to do that - using the visible laser on an object at the approximate distance I am intending to use it.

But shouldn’t that mechanical offset with a parallel zero be around .2 @ 500yds not .8?

I had myself turned around with this after playing with mine for the first time. OE’s post was a bit of a light bulb moment for me. With my LMSS2 the offset is 3” or roughly .8mil @ 100yds. Now I was initially thinking, for some reason, that it’d be zero’d on .8 all the way out to distance, when its actually a 3” offset so it’s roughly .2 @ 500yds and so on.

I think that’s what OE was saying. Given the size of the beam at distance, a small height difference over center from mount to mount is most likely inconsequential at distance as long as it remains parallel. Maybe I’m overthinking it, and I’ll delete this if I’m backwards on it.

 

[96C]

Parallel is parallel, I guess the limiting factor is the beam divergence. A laser would be more likely to gather a return and provide a reading from the lower half that is skimming the ground, than going high and collecting no data from any object.

If the centre of the beam is 0.8 high at 100m with a paralell zero / mount setup, in theory that should remain as 0.8 mil high to the centre of the beam at whatever distance.

What I need to do is zero the beam at 500 meters and then check that at 100 meters to see if there is in fact a difference.

Will report back

 

[Scott_at_Vortex]

Hello All,
I think there is some confusion here and I am part of the problem as i left a few key points out in my earlier posts. If you are co aligning close range then absolutely you should be offsetting the vis laser to your scopes 100yd zero.
Now, on to what I mentioned earlier about aligning the impact at long range. If you are aligning at the farthest distance you will be shooting then align the laser exactly to your reticle. No need for offset. For example- If I align at 1000yds the absolute most my laser will be off inside 1000yds is at the muzzle.
If this doesn't make sense I will attempt to post some graphics soon.

Respectfully
Scott

 

[Glassaholic]

Hello All,
I think there is some confusion here and I am part of the problem as i left a few key points out in my earlier posts. If you are co aligning close range then absolutely you should be offsetting the vis laser to your scopes 100yd zero.
Now, on to what I mentioned earlier about aligning the impact at long range. If you are aligning at the farthest distance you will be shooting then align the laser exactly to your reticle. No need for offset. For example- If I align at 1000yds the absolute most my laser will be off inside 1000yds is at the muzzle.
If this doesn't make sense I will attempt to post some graphics soon.

Respectfully
Scott

This makes a lot of sense.

 

[Scott_at_Vortex]

I was out in the field not long ago, having not zero'd my Impact at 100m for a while and adjusting the rifle / scope zero also with a different load. Turning the visible laser on, things should line up at approximately 0.8 mil high (being the mechanical offset from centre of optic to centre of LRF).

There was a discrepancy from the 0.8 (which is parallel so distance should not be an issue regardless) so, I zero'd the visible laser on a bush at approx. 500m to the 0.8 mil high point in the reticle. The visible laser is quite large at distance.

Perhaps the unit had been bumped or shifted, unsure but once I'd done the field zero it was 100% reliable again.

So, in future, I will probably continue to do that - using the visible laser on an object at the approximate distance I am intending to use it.

If im understanding you correctly, you adjusted your zero when playing with different loads, is this correct? If so, this would account for your laser no longer being aligned with your reticle. Does that make sense?

Respectfully
Scott

 

[96C]

If im understanding you correctly, you adjusted your zero when playing with different loads, is this correct? If so, this would account for your laser no longer being aligned with your reticle. Does that make sense?

Respectfully
Scott

There were a few things going on with that rifle.... It had been beaten up in transit, using a new load, zero'd the scope to this new load and had not adjusted the laser to suit, then lastly checked the vis laser - This wasn't an Impact4000 driven issue, just a small cog in a larger machine.

We appreciate how active you are in the thread man

 

[sethrrows]

Hello All,
I think there is some confusion here and I am part of the problem as i left a few key points out in my earlier posts. If you are co aligning close range then absolutely you should be offsetting the vis laser to your scopes 100yd zero.
Now, on to what I mentioned earlier about aligning the impact at long range. If you are aligning at the farthest distance you will be shooting then align the laser exactly to your reticle. No need for offset. For example- If I align at 1000yds the absolute most my laser will be off inside 1000yds is at the muzzle.
If this doesn't make sense I will attempt to post some graphics soon.

Respectfully
Scott

Thanks Scott! This is exactly how I'm thinking about it after using it more from that first trip out.

 

[wigwamitus]

... We are supposed to calibrate the visible laser at the same distance from center of scope to center of laser right, so is the dot at 500m larger than this differential or are you able to identify the dot at the distance above scope center at 500m? ...

No, both of these methods are attempting the same thing though. Both are attempting what is sometimes called a "parallel" zero or an "infinity" zero.
By zeroing to an offset, you are literally trying to achieve a parallel zero. By zeroing to the reticle at some distance farther out like 400yds, 500yds etc. you are approximating an infinity zero.
Mathematically a parallel zero and an infinity zero are the same thing.

Besides a parallel or infinity zero there's also a "convergent" zero which would be if we zeroed exactly to the center of our day scope reticle at 100yds. Depending on how far out you are typically ranging, this could work. As has been mentioned, if you have a 1.5" offset between the center of the reticle and the center of the ranging laser aperature on the gun, and you use a convergent zero at some distance, then your offset on the gun is 1.5" your offset at 100yds is 0" and your offset at 200yds is 1.5" and your offset at 300yds is 3.0" etc.

So while zeroing your reticle to the laser at 500m is attempting to approximate an infinity zero, its actually, in theory a convergent zero (as has been mentioned). That said, for distances inside 1000m the error (in theory) never exceeds the offset on the gun at the starting point.

And no you can't see the offset at 400yds or 500m or 1000yds from the gun. BUT, I have done this by sending one team member down to the target, he can see the offset, since he's right there and radio back to the gun to direct the adjustments to the LRF. This of course requires safe-ing the gun ... but we've done this several times. If you believe you will be ranging small objects beyond 1000yds, then I'd say this is worth doing and we once did this at 1000yds with a guy down there at the target, but this is not always (usually) worth doing IMHO.
For most critter control activities, which take place inside 500yds/meters, there's practically no difference between a convergent zero at 500yds/meters and a parallel zero at 500yds/meters.
I zero the vis laser to the reticle at 415yds at night with 14, because that's the distance I have a mineral feeder I can see from right outside the house and that's plenty accurate enuff for what I do. I've been able to range and kill a yote at 509yds with a radius zeroed to the reticle at 415yds and that's good enuff for me.

So now you're either totally unconfused - or even more CON fused !!!

 

[badgerfan]

Parallel is parallel, I guess the limiting factor is the beam divergence. A laser would be more likely to gather a return and provide a reading from the lower half that is skimming the ground, than going high and collecting no data from any object.

If the centre of the beam is 0.8 high at 100m with a paralell zero / mount setup, in theory that should remain as 0.8 mil high to the centre of the beam at whatever distance.

What I need to do is zero the beam at 500 meters and then check that at 100 meters to see if there is in fact a difference.

Will report back

This is not right, if your Impact is 3" above the center of your reticle at 100 yards that is going to be 0.8 mils, however at 500 yards 0.8 mils is 14.4 inches. If your offset is 3" at 100 yards and that is parallel with your reticle, then at every distance it should be 3" higher than your reticle, and that is not going to be 0.8 mils at all distances.

 

[Scott_at_Vortex]

No, both of these methods are attempting the same thing though. Both are attempting what is sometimes called a "parallel" zero or an "infinity" zero.
By zeroing to an offset, you are literally trying to achieve a parallel zero. By zeroing to the reticle at some distance farther out like 400yds, 500yds etc. you are approximating an infinity zero.
Mathematically a parallel zero and an infinity zero are the same thing.

Besides a parallel or infinity zero there's also a "convergent" zero which would be if we zeroed exactly to the center of our day scope reticle at 100yds. Depending on how far out you are typically ranging, this could work. As has been mentioned, if you have a 1.5" offset between the center of the reticle and the center of the ranging laser aperature on the gun, and you use a convergent zero at some distance, then your offset on the gun is 1.5" your offset at 100yds is 0" and your offset at 200yds is 1.5" and your offset at 300yds is 3.0" etc.

So while zeroing your reticle to the laser at 500m is attempting to approximate an infinity zero, its actually, in theory a convergent zero (as has been mentioned). That said, for distances inside 1000m the error (in theory) never exceeds the offset on the gun at the starting point.

And no you can't see the offset at 400yds or 500m or 1000yds from the gun. BUT, I have done this by sending one team member down to the target, he can see the offset, since he's right there and radio back to the gun to direct the adjustments to the LRF. This of course requires safe-ing the gun ... but we've done this several times. If you believe you will be ranging small objects beyond 1000yds, then I'd say this is worth doing and we once did this at 1000yds with a guy down there at the target, but this is not always (usually) worth doing IMHO.
For most critter control activities, which take place inside 500yds/meters, there's practically no difference between a convergent zero at 500yds/meters and a parallel zero at 500yds/meters.
I zero the vis laser to the reticle at 415yds at night with 14, because that's the distance I have a mineral feeder I can see from right outside the house and that's plenty accurate enuff for what I do. I've been able to range and kill a yote at 509yds with a radius zeroed to the reticle at 415yds and that's good enuff for me.

So now you're either totally unconfused - or even more CON fused !!!

Spot on, great description!

 

[rlsmith1]

This whole discussion is why I love using a PVS30 or similar device to zero the laser. I didn't think I would love the 905nm laser for certain reasons, but it is super helpful to have the laser visibly range under night vision. That way I know if I have an accurate range or not.

Personally, I zero as far away as I can. That is typically the window of a barn 1400 yds from my back door at night

 

[MikeMiller]

I zero mine at 300 yards at night because that’s what I have to work at home. Keeping the rifles scope optic on it’s 100 yard zero That’s on my main rifle. Then I go to secondary rifle and see difference which when using the laser on that rifle. I record the difference if any so I don’t have to zero when I switch to the secondary weapon system

 

[taliv]

Hello All,
I think there is some confusion here and I am part of the problem as i left a few key points out in my earlier posts. If you are co aligning close range then absolutely you should be offsetting the vis laser to your scopes 100yd zero.
Now, on to what I mentioned earlier about aligning the impact at long range. If you are aligning at the farthest distance you will be shooting then align the laser exactly to your reticle. No need for offset. For example- If I align at 1000yds the absolute most my laser will be off inside 1000yds is at the muzzle.
If this doesn't make sense I will attempt to post some graphics soon.

Respectfully
Scott

i think part of the question was around the beam divergence of the viz laser. at 1000 yards, is it still a little red dot like it is at 100? or does it cover the whole target? practically, there's prob not a lot of difference in a converging zero at 1000 yards and a parallel one, but is it possible to even tell what you have? i mean, if the red dot is 3' wide at that distance, it's not going to be easy to measure to find the center so you can converge it or offset it.
i haven't tried past 400, and even there, i was just watching for the reflective tape to flare because i was doing it during the day

 

[HemiPowrd]

I've only done the laser alignment at 100 yards, but it seems like the adjustments were fairly large. Adjusting the elevation at 100 I was in between clicks to get a parallel alignment. What does it look like at 1000 yards? I'd think you'd see quite a large laser movement per click when adjusting.