What to build? Opinions wanted

[Break Bad]

I'm looking to build a 223 rem (affordability) gas fun gun to shoot along side my bolt. I'd like to practice positional shooting, windows, barricades at targets from 200-700 yards...and it would be nice to do some prone shooting (lobbing & praying) to 800-1000 for fun.

My experience building an AR is limited to slapping on an upper and installing a lower parts kits. From the reading and shopping around I've done I'm thinking: 1-7/1-8 twist 20-24" barrel with some 80 vlds. The platform I liking best so far is the Seekins SP3G, mainly because the rail system looks solid and great for working barricades.

The other part of me wants to enjoy building from scratch, on a less proprietary platform (if this SP3G is even considered so)...but the options get overwhelming.

Other than building an AR10 (in which case I'd rather build another bolt)....what would you do with this goal and a similar budget?

edit: would consider 6.5gren or 6mmAR...but know little about those, component availability, barrel life, etc.. Will probably get a matching upper later with one of these calibers.

 

[Temp9]

Re: What to build? Opinions wanted

My vote is to build it yourself. This way you know exactly what components are going into it. Everything you need and nothing you don't. Plus it's just that much more personal.

80gr VLD's will have to be single fed since they don't fit in a magazine, but a good 80gr load should get you out to 1000 yards without too much issue. Standard magazine capable loads will be very difficult past 800 yards.

When planning the build, just write down all the necessary components and figure out specifically which component you'll need one at a time. Off the top of my head, you'll need:
-receivers
-trigger
-barrel
-stock
-pistol grip
-handguard/rail system
-lower parts kit
-upper parts kit
-buffer assembly
-muzzle device
-gas block and tube



Downsides to building:

-if you aren't good at troubleshooting and have a problem, you can't just send it off to the manufacturer.

-lower resale value

-takes longer to get everything together

-when people ask you what AR you have, it takes longer to explain (although I gave up going into specifics with people)



6.5 Grendel and 6mmAR will do much better at range. Price of components goes up compared to a .223 Rem, though.

 

[Break Bad]

Re: What to build? Opinions wanted

@Temp9 - thanks, good advice. I'm just looking for cheap training, but eventually will dive into a better caliber. With that said: Off the top of you head, what upper/lower/barrel/trigger/parts kits/break etc.. would you put together for this application?

I was considering a mega upper/lower (maybe mono if I can find one), 24" dpms/whiteoak, SSA trigger (maybe gold match). Already have a PRS stock. I have no idea about gas block/tube or remaining parts kits, buffer...as far as what is good for this application and what to avoid. The rail system I would prefer something similar to the SP3G if possible rather than your typical free float tube or quad rail.

 

[KR24]

Re: What to build? Opinions wanted

If you are really wanting a 20-24 inch barrel I would do a 6.5 gren. If you are going 5.56 I would make it more light weight. Just my opinion...

My current 5.56 build is almost complete. Parts list as follows.

Seekins Upper/Lower set (controlled chaos arms)
Noveske NSR 13.5
Geissele SDE trigger
WMD Guns nickel boron BCG
14.5 inch Daniel Daniel lightweight Barrel w/ low profile gas block
Slash Heavy Buffers- HSS Tungsten Buffer
Rainier Arms Raptor Charging Handle
BAD Selector
Palmetto State Armory LPK
Tango down battle grip
WMD guns gas tube and nickle boron buffer tube
Magpul STR

Still needing optics and waiting on the new BCM comp to be released. Good luck. I had a lot of fun picking my parts for the build. Build something you will enjoy!

 

[ryoxf]

Re: What to build? Opinions wanted

if keeping costs low is one of your main priorities, then it is always cheaper to build from scratch. as much as everyone hates on arfcom on here; the stickies in the build it yourself section are very helpful and makes builds from scratch very doable for most. Check it out and see if your up for it.

 

[KR24]

Re: What to build? Opinions wanted

Don't think he is referring to build cost but cost of ammo. Could be wrong.... Mega makes a great set. I have a maten monolithic for my .308 and I love it. However for a 5.56 I have to say my Seekins is a work of art and I like the finish better than the Mega. That's saying a lot. Either way you can't go wrong. Some don't care for the Seekins design.

 

[Break Bad]

Re: What to build? Opinions wanted

Correct, I am not as concerned about build cost as I am with consumables. I already load 223 on my progressive (for plinking), so its also convenient.

@Kr24 - I would choose a longer barrel because I read that there are still significant velocity gains from 20-24". Would be nice for those 900yd attempts...but that is a low priority for this. I'd actually be happy if this build was on the heavy side. And thanks for the list, gives me more options to research.

 

[KR24]

Re: What to build? Opinions wanted

I suggested the 6.5 Gren because it will reach 1000 yds much easier and is a better long range choice. Especially if you reload this would be the way i would go. That would be a cool route to take too. For that I would get a barrel and bolt made from a custom maker. I believe all of the other ar parts will work fine but I'm new to this as well so don't take my word for it.

 

[Temp9]

Re: What to build? Opinions wanted

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BreakBad</div><div class="ubbcode-body">@Temp9 - thanks, good advice. I'm just looking for cheap training, but eventually will dive into a better caliber. With that said: Off the top of you head, what upper/lower/barrel/trigger/parts kits/break etc.. would you put together for this application?

I was considering a mega upper/lower (maybe mono if I can find one), 24" dpms/whiteoak, SSA trigger (maybe gold match). Already have a PRS stock. I have no idea about gas block/tube or remaining parts kits, buffer...as far as what is good for this application and what to avoid. The rail system I would prefer something similar to the SP3G if possible rather than your typical free float tube or quad rail.</div></div>

Well, let's see...

-receivers
If you want a billet set, Mega is great choice. If you want to save some money here, go with a forged set, like the Rainier set. For what it's worth, my AR shoots great with forged receivers, but I've got a Rainier billet upper on the way, just for the helluvit. If you like the looks, go with billet, if not, go with forged.

-trigger
Geissele is obviously the way to go if you have the cash. If you can spring the cash, I think the Hi-Speed Match/DMR trigger is worlds above the SSA/SSA-E. Not bashing the SSA, I just think the Hi-Speed triggers are phenomenal. Group buy here: http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3692724#Post3692724

-barrel
Best barrels I've shot are the Rainier Ultramatch barrels, but I hear the WOA barrels are very nice as well. WOA does chambering, contouring, and threading for Rainier. I would pick WOA over DPMS. I'm using a 16", but if I were to start over, I would go to 18". I tend to push my loads pretty hot to get to the upper accuracy node in the shorter barrel. The biggest useful jump in velocities seems to be from 16" to 18".

-stock
Personal preference. I'm using a Magpul CTR, but might switch to a PRS later. I guess you already have a PRS, so that's not a concern.

-pistol grip
Again, personal preference. The only grip I've really liked has been the Magpul MIAD. YMMV.

-handguard/rail system
Lot's of options here. The SP3R rail (used in the SP3G) is actually very reasonably priced. I prefer the Troy Alpha rails, myself. The Centurion quad rails are also quite nice, but you mentioned you didn't want a standard tube or quad rail.

-lower parts kit
Ordered a JP kit minus trigger for my upcoming build. Not much that can go wrong here.

-upper parts kit
Most uppers come complete now.

-buffer assembly
You'll need a rifle length extension and rifle length buffer and spring for the PRS. All my builds have used carbine buffer tubes, but stick to good companies and you should be fine.

-muzzle device
Brake, comp, or flash hider? Your choice. There are tons of muzzle devices on the market now, but take a look at Griffin Armament's selection. They have good stuff. Also might be a good time to get a suppressor. *wink wink*

-gas block and tube
Pretty much comes down to clamp or set-screw, and adjustable or not. I had problems with the clamp style contacting my handguards, so I switched to a set screw style. I haven't used an adjustable gas block, but may in the future. It might be worth going with an adjustable to begin with, but obviously, I have no experience in the area. Used BCM and YHM low pro gas blocks with good results.

-BCG
I forgot this earlier, you'll need a bolt carrier group. It may be a good idea to order the bolt with the barrel and have them check headspace for you. Good luck finding a BCG in stock. They're there, just gotta look. Try to stick with brand names you trust.



Hope this gives you some ideas. There's really no limit to what you can do with an AR.

 

[Break Bad]

Re: What to build? Opinions wanted

Thanks, finally got some parts on order. Can't wait to see what expensive mistakes I've made when I start putting it all together.

Mega Forged upper/lower
Kreiger 24" 1:8 threaded Wylde from Compass Lake, with low profile gas block, rifle length tube, matching bolt.
Rainer Compensator
Seekins SP3G rail
PRS stock
Timney SSM
JP Lower parts kit w/o trigger
KNS anti-rotation pins and retainer pin
BCM charging handle

I think all that is left is the bolt container, firing pin, cam, anti-seize, and optics/rings/sights.

Going to work up a load with some berger 80 & 82's and CFE223. Should be interesting. I am aware of the COAL and that I'll have to modify the magazines. The mega lower does have the groove machined out to accommodate.