What's more important...Calories or Protein?

[TLong]

If you were going to be out in the field for 5 days, exerting yourself by walking/hiking/climbing/packing, what type of food would you recommend...ones that are high in calories or high in protein? I know very little about how the body breaks food down, but I would think that both are equally important, due to the stress and fatigue you are putting your body through. If you would be backpacking/camping for 5 days, what would you take? Would you take foods that are easily consumed, or ones that are dehydrated/freeze dried to save on weight, but require some cooking? What about snacks? What about "energy" bars? I like Cliff bars, but have been interested in ProBar lately. Does anyone have any experience with them?
What else should you consider or bring along?
Given that the weather and temperature is cooperating and comfortable.

 

[cstmwrks]

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[SeanRT]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

First off, protein provides calories; so no worries there.

Second, if you're going to be hiking a lot I would suggest peanut butter, nuts, Cliff Bars, and unsweetened chocolate (quick energy). You still need carbs, no doubt about it. However, carbs are in nearly EVERY foodstuff that you eat, so getting carbs the proper amount of carbs shouldn't be a problem.

 

[Jeff Given]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

Fats are good because you can pack a lot of Calories in a little bit of fat.

Protein, same deal, not quite as many calories as fat (oz for oz)

Carbs- Simple is garbage (1 candy bar has the same amount of calories as a chicken breast) <---okay I made that up, but I bet you would be VERY surprised to how accurate that MIGHT be...

Complex carbs...different story altogether. It takes your body time to break down oats and grains...hence, the feeling of being full longer with more energy for a longer period of time. Again, oatmeal vs candy bar. You get a lot more oatmeal for the same amount of calories from a candy bar.

Having said that...Carbs are going to be the most important for sustained energy.

Don't believe me? Ask some diabetics what happens when their blood sugar gets too low

Jeff Given

 

[Martin Taylor]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TLong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Given that the weather and temperature is cooperating and comfortable.</div></div>

Haha, right, in my experience THAT NEVER HAPPENS.

From a bodybuilding perspective Protein helps you build lean muscle and Calories give you mass.

When I used to work at a tripping camp and we packed kids out for 14 day hikes we aimed at a balanced diet, high in carbs. Why are you trying to boost your protein or your calorie intake if you're hiking? Build a 2500-3000 a day diet and pack for an extra day at least. We aimed to be able to feed 1 to 2 hot meals a day, you can live off of cliff bars in a pinch (I have, for about 3 days,there's also an article in a "Runner's World" about 4 years ago about a guy who lived off nothing but energy bars and diet supplements for 30 days, he said it works really well but it messes with your mind and your digestive system) but you would be amazed what that 1 hot meal will do for moral, also, if you're a coffee or a tea drinker, bring it. fruit is good, for those snacks where you want to power ahead to your camp site apples are great, bananas are high calorie and help keep you from cramping. PB sandwiches are good, eggs will keep for about a week if you get them fresh and unrefrigerated. If you're packing light and trying to cover ground, I would suggest cliff bars and getting to know eatable vegetation really well. When we're packing light (personal trips, not with the camp), my buddies usually run a mix of hunting and foraging as we go, not sure if this is an option where you are? Not sure if this answers your question but the only time I've ever looked specifically at calories vs protein was in weightlifting.

 

[Jeff Given]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

Completely agree with the above, but will disagreeon the coffee. Caffeine is a stimulant and will stimulate your metabolism. Faster metabolism, faster your calories (energy) is consumed, thus the sooner you need to refuel (eat).

I might be going a little too far into a survivalist mentality on limited to no food, so this might not be the intended discussion you desired.

Still, my final answer is complex carbohydrates.

JG

 

[Martin Taylor]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

Good point about the coffee, never thought about it that way, I just remember all of the guides (self included) always brought coffee and damn that tastes good on a cold morning, esp if you've got to drag 14 year old boys around all day

Yeah, if I had to pick something for arguments sake you're right with the complex carbs.

 

[Jeff Given]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Caeli</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Good point about the coffee, never thought about it that way, I just remember all of the guides (self included) always brought coffee and damn that tastes good on a cold morning, esp if you've got to drag 14 year old boys around all day

Yeah, if I had to pick something for arguments sake you're right with the complex carbs.</div></div>

Enjoying my coffee now. Thank God I am not in survivalist training... Then again, I've got enough fat on me these days to survive a Russian winter

 

[TLong]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

Thanks guys. Im not interested in weightlifting/muscle building, but more about sustained energy and having the ability to haul extra weight when needed. Im not wanting to live off cliff bars or whatever, and would like to be able to cook a "meal" in the evenings but with packable stuff, (ie pastas, cornbread, stuffing, rice and tuna or chicken or something to compliment). During the day, I usually eat beef jerky and/or nuts.

 

[JJones75]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

it all depends

the body runs on glucose mostly the brain HAS to have glucose glucose come from carbs (mostly) , now if you eat nothing but protein and fat your body will realize what's happening with not getting any carbs and start converting protein into glucose via glycogenesis. When the body does this it's important to have an excess of dietary protein for the body to use or it will eat away muscle "catabolism"

now a diet very high in fat the body will use the fat for energy by converting them to keytones "ketogenic diet" this is a very uneffecient way for the body to get energy

you best best would be to have a semi balanced food base say 33% macro balance

nuts , dried fruit , and dried meat are great choices a small hand full of each a coue times a day will keep you alive for months , double that and you can function reasonable well for a week

 

[Jeff Given]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

Have you ever ate an MRE? Light weight, pretty damn good for what they are, and they "cook" with only water via chemical reaction.

I think they are 2000 calories er pack


JG

 

[TLong]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

I have had an MRE or 2 lol. They are good for a few days...then I cant seem to shit right for a day or two then it's bad news.

 

[Jeff Given]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

That's when you eat the dehydrated prunes lol

 

[E. Bryant]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

There isn't really a single "right" answer. For moderate exertion, I like a mix of carb/fat/protein in roughly the classic 40/30/30 ratio. As my exertion levels increase, I'll increase the proportion of carbs. Hydration is more critical than diet, and you need to maintain your electrolyte levels for the water to do any good.

Caffeine is awesome for increasing output during short-duration/high-exertion efforts, but I would avoid it for all-day hikes unless you are already nursing a caffeine addiction (as many are).

 

[AznDragon533]

Re: What's more important...Calories or Protein?

really depends on your body type, calories and fat is mostly for endurance

 

[M1Amen]

it all depends

the body runs on glucose mostly the brain HAS to have glucose glucose come from carbs (mostly) , now if you eat nothing but protein and fat your body will realize what's happening with not getting any carbs and start converting protein into glucose via glycogenesis. When the body does this it's important to have an excess of dietary protein for the body to use or it will eat away muscle "catabolism"

now a diet very high in fat the body will use the fat for energy by converting them to keytones "ketogenic diet" this is a very uneffecient way for the body to get energy

you best best would be to have a semi balanced food base say 33% macro balance

nuts , dried fruit , and dried meat are great choices a small hand full of each a coue times a day will keep you alive for months , double that and you can function reasonable well for a week

JJones,

You are partially correct in the metabolic pathway you describe; however, you are not correct in the assessment of efficiency or the point at which the different pathways activate.

I believe beyond any doubt that the human body is meant to run primarily on fat and protein. The only fuel that the human body can run on is glucose. This glucose requirement is not restricted to the brain's needs; it is necessary for the entire body. How we get this glucose varies depending on our diet. If we eat sugars, our blood sugar spikes and insulin converts excess sugar into glycogen. Once the glycogen reserves are full, then insulin converts the sugar into adipose tissue.

Ketosis is the breakdown of adipose tissue to convert the lipids into glucose. This process does not begin until the body depletes its glycogen reserves. Catosis is the breakdown of muscle tissue to convert amino acids into glucose. You will not enter catosis until your body has exhausted its fat reserves.

Carbohydrates are the one fuel source that can be completely excluded from your diet.

M1Amen

 

[M1Amen]

If I were going on this trip with you, I would pack a lot of high quality fat and protein.

Many people like peanut butter, but I much prefer sunflower seed butter. Better taste if you ask me. I would also pack some coconut oil for a high quality fat source. And then there's beef jerky, which you can make at home without all the preservatives if you plan ahead a little. If you have a cooler, bacon without nitrates is a huge plus, as are eggs. You are going to find that you will need a lot less fat and protein to keep you running well than if you tried to pollute your diet with a bunch of carbohydrates, which are a lousy energy source.

M1Amen