Hunting & Fishing Which Gun?

[Pigman]

Hey everyone, I just found out a few days ago that my cousin and I are gonna get to get paid killing hogs on my deer lease next summer and I need some help deciding on a new gun to buy for hogs. My cousin has a Benelli M2 and he just got a bolt action Remington .308 the other day. I have an AR-15 and it's fun and all, but it's just not practical for killing hogs, so I'm in the process of selling it right now for about $1900. I'm only 16 years old so my budget is going to be right around $4000. I've narrowed down the options to either a bolt action .308 or an AR-10. For the AR-10's, I've been looking into the GA Precision GAP-10, Sig Sauer 716, and LWRC REPR. I don't have a lot of experience with any of these but I've heard really good things about GA Precision and LWRC. I've seen a lot of people say that Sig's quality has been going downhill for a while, but I've been a Sig fan ever since I shot a 556 SWAT so I'm gonna leave the 716 as an option for now. Now for the bolt actions, I guess I'd probably consider a Remington 700, Accuracy Int., or a custom GAP rifle, but Accuracy International's and GAP's can get pretty expensive pretty fast, so I don't know if they'll work with my budget.

Since my cousin already has a bolt action .308, should I go with an AR-10 so we can have multiple follow up shots and hopefully drop more hogs, or should I get a bolt action .308 and we can pick our targets and synchronize our shots?

And does a bolt action .308 have any advantages over an AR-10 as far as stopping power goes? We HAVE to drop the hogs so we can cut the tails off to prove we killed them.

What other rifles should I look into that I didn't already list and does anyone have any experience with any of the rifles that I listed?

 

[krw]

Re: Which Gun?

Well, for 16yrs old I'd say you have right nice taste in rifles. For your purpose, I'd just probly get a nice 308 in a hunting rifle configuration and go kill hogs! Good Luck!

 

[jeepguy242]

Re: Which Gun?

if it is just for hunting, then keep your ar-15, and get a rem 700 from wal-mart, last i looked they were around 450.00 with a scope. not the most precision set up, but perfect for hogs..

 

[smcfarland]

Re: Which Gun?

AR-15 is just fine for pigs given proper hunting bullets and good shot placement. If the pigs have been hunted at all, I would recommend using your money for a Night Vision set up. Doesn't have to be too fancy, but if they are like ours in West Texas, the hunting pressure has made them very nocturnal. They also don't stick around when any kind of spotlight comes on them.

 

[kraigWY]

Re: Which Gun?

I have never hunted hogs so don't really know what I'm talking about, but I'll chime in anyway.

If I got tied in with a project like you're talking about, I'd load some '06s in my truck and get after it. Not any '06 but my As issued M1, 1903a1, and 1917 Enfield. What a perfect oppertunity to play with these old rifles. ( softe point ammo of course).

I don't know that this would be the prefect set up, but I know it would be a heck of a lot of fun.

 

[spaniel]

Re: Which Gun?

Get a Stevens or Savage in .308, perhaps splurge on an aftermarket trigger, and pocket around $3400 of that budget for something more important at your age like an education or nest egg for a house later on.

 

[liaisons]

Re: Which Gun?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: smcfarland</div><div class="ubbcode-body">AR-15 is just fine for pigs given proper hunting bullets and good shot placement. If the pigs have been hunted at all, I would recommend using your money for a Night Vision set up. Doesn't have to be too fancy, but if they are like ours in West Texas, the hunting pressure has made them very nocturnal. They also don't stick around when any kind of spotlight comes on them. </div></div>

I'd agree - the AR15 is adequate with the proper bullets and shot placement. They also tend to go nocturnal once they're shot at and pressured.

I'd recommend the 62gr or 70gr Barnes TSX.. and the Winchester 64gr PP is a good alternative - at a lower price.

Be sure to come back with some pictures

 

[ArmaHeavy]

Re: Which Gun?

If you're only going to be selective about what you kill in the herd, i.e. a large sow, or boar, then go with a bolt action for precision, but the disclaimer to this is that you will at the most be able to hit maybe two or possibly more before they are gone.

<span style="text-decoration: underline">DO NOT</span> dismiss the .223/5.56 as inferior. I've been able to take out hogs with 55 gr, and 62 gr. so it's a dead subject on whether the round can kill.

Buy a AR15. If you have one then invest the rest in a good optic. Red dots work wonders.

 

[battlestick]

Re: Which Gun?

Use your AR with Barnes TSX, or Win Power Points. If your lease is in the Piney Woods, get a Red Dot. If you are South or West, get a Regular Scope.

Keep the rest of your money in your pocket.

 

[hermnrob]

Re: Which Gun?

Put your money into night vision or hog traps it will save alot of time an produce a better killing rate. The hole key is your getting paid for killing them.

 

[Pigman]

Re: Which Gun?

Thanks for the replies everyone! My setup right now is:
RRA CAR-15
EOTech 512
Magpul UBR
VLTOR CASV-M
TangoDown VFG

I agree that a 5.56 round can definitely kill a hog, I've been able to drop a 250+ pound boar with a headshot, but I'd just like to have something alot more accurate with alot more stopping power than an AR-15, that's why I want a larger caliber. And .308 ammo is very common so it's less expensive and easier to find than uncommon ammo, leaving more room for profit. And if it helps, our property is right in the middle of Seguin and Gonzales, TX. And my cousin and I are also investing our money in traps, as well as the 5 or 6 traps that we already have. Thanks for the help everyone!

 

[ArmaHeavy]

Re: Which Gun?

You can work on different ammo types. The 5.56 is accurate too. Keep an open mind about reloading and handloading too.

Look into shooting as many different types of factory ammo that you can until you enter that realm. Even rifles that were next to each other on the assembly line, work best with different types of ammo.

Also if you're stalk hunting then you might want to look at subtracting some weight off your rifle. Pounds equal pain.

In this case a K.I.S.S. rifle can compete with a Next-Generation cheese grater.

 

[Pigman]

Re: Which Gun?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ArmaHeavy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can work on different ammo types. The 5.56 is accurate too. Keep an open mind about reloading and handloading too.

Look into shooting as many different types of factory ammo that you can until you enter that realm. Even rifles that were next to each other on the assembly line, work best with different types of ammo.

Also if you're stalk hunting then you might want to look at subtracting some weight off your rifle. Pounds equal pain.

In this case a K.I.S.S. rifle can compete with a Next-Generation cheese grater. </div></div>

Yeah that's the mistake I made with my AR. I bought it when I was in 8th grade and I didn't really care about performance, all I cared about was making it look cool so I bought a bunch of crap for it just for looks and it ended up being incredibly heavy for an AR. Whether I decide to go with a bolt action or semi auto .308, all I'm going to do is add a bipod and a scope.

And we're probably not going to be doing much stalking. We usually just sit on a pond with bait set out so weight isn't really an issue but I'd like to keep it as lightweight as possible anyways. As for the ammo, I'll probably try to find a good deal on .308 hollow points in bulk. I'm probably gonna learn how to reload as well.

If I ordered a custom GAP-10 and didn't get all the add-ons for it (fluted barrel, custom paint, etc...), is there anyway that I could send it back to them in the future to get that stuff done when I have the money for it? I'm kinda leaning towards the AR-10 and I've been reading the testimonials and stuff on their website and I think if I did go with an AR-10, then I'd probably go with the GAP-10. GAP seems to have ALOT of diehard fans and a good reputation.

 

[FALex]

Re: Which Gun?

an AR is inadequate for hogs? Huh, must've missed that part of about a few hundred thousand of them being issued to our folks in the military. I've seen hogs put down with .17 hmr, but if you're that concerned about it, re-barrel you AR with a 1:8 or 1:7 twist and start railing 90 gr at em'! I'm sure your AR is more than adequate...unless you're just searching for an excuse...I've driven that boat too.

 

[UKDslayer]

Re: Which Gun?

Sixteen is young to be a GAP ho...

 

[Pigman]

Re: Which Gun?

I never said an AR is inadequate for hogs, I said an AR just isn't "practical" for hogs. I know from experience that an AR is fully capable of taking down a hog, a .22 is even capable of taking down a hog. When you shoot the first hog in the group you know it's going down, but when you pull the trigger on the follow up shots on the rest of the group, you're not 100% sure that it's going to drop them. I'd just like to upgrade to a .308 so I know for sure that pretty much every hog I shoot is gonna go down. And honestly, I'm just kinda tired of my AR. It's fun to shoot and fun to drool over, but I just feel like it's time for an upgrade. And I've actually been considering selling it for a while now, even before I got offered to kill hogs for hire next summer, but the new offer just sealed the deal.

 

[FALex]

Re: Which Gun?

yeah, I feel that way too. I actually started this gun deal with AR's, and though I enjoy shooting them, I have really grown to love the bolt guns. I have no idea as to why this is, but it is. I am completely jealous of your summer job, by the way. I would do that for free, but from these hog shows, primarily the Pigman and American Hoggers, it sounds like it is no longer fun for you Texas folks. Good luck with your purchase.

 

[MikeeBooshay]

Re: Which Gun?

Hmmmmm AR works very good for hogs, these were all shot with varmint ( 55 grain Vmax ) boolets. They messed up, ran towards me not away.

If you've got $4k to spend, buy the NV for your AR, maybe a light 6.8 upper, and shoot some Barnes thru it. I have a GAP AI, but.... not my first choice for piggies. AR15, not my OBR or AR10's. AR15, light, easy and plenty of pop.

I like all the other rifles, they just aren't as good a tool for the work.

 

[NUTT]

Re: Which Gun?

With that kind of cash I'd be looking at suppressor for hogs. 300 AAC Blackout, subsonic .308, full power 6.8 or 5.56.

With a suppressed .308 shooting subsonics you might be able to knock them down all day. Someone will either confirm or correct me I'm sure.

 

[Pigman]

Re: Which Gun?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: FALex</div><div class="ubbcode-body">yeah, I feel that way too. I actually started this gun deal with AR's, and though I enjoy shooting them, I have really grown to love the bolt guns. I have no idea as to why this is, but it is. I am completely jealous of your summer job, by the way. I would do that for free, but from these hog shows, primarily the Pigman and American Hoggers, it sounds like it is no longer fun for you Texas folks. Good luck with your purchase. </div></div>

Yeah I love bolt actions too, and I've been wanting to get into long range shooting for a while now. If it weren't for the new summer job I'd definitely be saving up for a GA bolt action .308, but I'm leaning more towards a semi-auto just because of the quick follow up shots so I can kill more hogs which means more $$! And yeah me and my cousin have probably killed over 400-500 hogs in the last year or so for free. A few of the lease members (there's 10 lease members including us) have noticed how much better we are at killing hogs than they are and offered us the job. I think me and my cousin are probably gonna stay at the lease for a week or two at a time and come back for a week so I can work at my job that I have right now, just so I can keep a steady income on the side. I think we're gonna be getting $5-$7 per hog so this is definitely gonna be my primary job next summer. As the Joker said, "If you're good at something, never do it for free".

And by the way, Pigman > Every other show. Just thought I'd throw that out there.

 

[Night Hunter]

Re: Which Gun?

AR's are fine for hogs. IMHO you have a great set up. While in college doing hog research, we used everything from a 22lr up to a .300 win.

More pigs died with the 22 lr and a 17 hmr than prolly all the others combined. These were ear shots tho...

The more rounds you have at your disposal the better. Stay down wind and get close, I mean close before your first shot. Then take the runners from there.

It was not uncommon for my partner and I to kill 8-10 per stand. One AR platform and 1 bolt gun will provide for a lot of fun and dead pigs.

Also, I might negotiate my price per hog a little. We got anywhere form $25-$100 per hog in the past.

 

[Pigman]

Re: Which Gun?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Night Hunter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">AR's are fine for hogs. IMHO you have a great set up. While in college doing hog research, we used everything from a 22lr up to a .300 win.

More pigs died with the 22 lr and a 17 hmr than prolly all the others combined. These were ear shots tho...

The more rounds you have at your disposal the better. Stay down wind and get close, I mean close before your first shot. Then take the runners from there.

It was not uncommon for my partner and I to kill 8-10 per stand. One AR platform and 1 bolt gun will provide for a lot of fun and dead pigs.

Also, I might negotiate my price per hog a little. We got anywhere form $25-$100 per hog in the past. </div></div>

Did you get $25-$100 per hog dead or alive?

 

[hrwilliams22]

Re: Which Gun?

Get a decent ar-10... that'll work just fine if your sick of your ar15. But if you really wanna make some money, get some angle iron, regular hog panels, and design some kind of spring loaded swing gate, weld it all up into a trap, maybe make 2 or three, then sour a bunch of corn, and you'll have a shitload of hogs in no time. I know that area your in is overrun by hogs, so good luck and i hope you make some money

 

[Pigman]

Re: Which Gun?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Heeler22</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Get a decent ar-10... that'll work just fine if your sick of your ar15. But if you really wanna make some money, get some angle iron, regular hog panels, and design some kind of spring loaded swing gate, weld it all up into a trap, maybe make 2 or three, then sour a bunch of corn, and you'll have a shitload of hogs in no time. I know that area your in is overrun by hogs, so good luck and i hope you make some money </div></div>

Yeah we already have two 40 ft. traps but we only have one gate (we move it between traps every few months) and we have six 4 x 8? traps. Me and my cousin are each gonna buy a few more smaller traps and hopefully a few bigger ones too. What works really well for bait is corn, protein, and beer or soda and just keep filling it up with water and let it sit out in the sun all day. After about 8 or 9 hours it's good to go. And by the way, last year on our annual helicopter survey we counted 1200 hogs (that's how many we counted, there's definitely alot more) on our 5000 acres. How much does one of the larger hog traps cost?

 

[hermnrob]

Re: Which Gun?

Cheapest way to build one is to look online find the size you wont get the plan, buy the materials and have a local welding shop put it together for you. It will cost alot more if buy one already built an you save shipping fee if you would have to order one. By building it you get the size an gate mechanism you wont.

 

[hrwilliams22]

Re: Which Gun?

That's a lot of freakin hogs for 5k acres! And you probably didn't even see half of em'! Our Gov't trapper comes out twice a year on helicopter hunts, and usually gets around 200/day on our 21 sections of land. We've got a lot of brush though, so they can disappear easily. Not sure how much the prefabricated large traps run. Are y'all near Victoria or Gonzalez? I've got some buddies that ranch down there and the hogs are really taking a toll on their land. And like snowtop said, buy the materials and if you don't have a welder or someone who knows how to weld, take it to a shop and pay them to do it. It'll be much cheaper that way. But I can imagine the extra large prefabbed traps running upwards of 750$

 

[Pigman]

Re: Which Gun?

I told you wrong. Last year they counted 800 on the helicopter survey, but thats still alot. My dad averages about 200-300 hogs per helicopter shoot but we only do it once a year because it's so expensive. And yes, our property is near a town called Nixon. It's like right between Seguin and Gonzales. My next door neighbor is a welder and has a barn between our houses that he uses specifically for welding, so I'm probably gonna buy the materials for 8' x 4' traps and have him weld them together for me. How much would the hog panels and angle iron cost for one trap?

 

[hrwilliams22]

Re: Which Gun?

For 16 foot panels, you'll usually pay between 18-22$/panel, and those are 52" tall. For 1"x1"x1/8" angle iron, it'll run you about .90-1.00$/foot. It might run you as much as $150 for the whole trap, but you could probably do it for less.

 

[bachelorjack]

Re: Which Gun?

I have access to more NV, suppressors, custom rigs, and property to use it than most people. I've also met some interesting folks, helping with similar jobs to the one you've just taken up. My experience is based on that. You also must keep in mind these hogs are every bit as smart as the smartest dog you've ever met. In order to get repeatable results you need to be careful not to educate the survivors.

Every time the shooting starts, the hogs scatter. You can try to shoot them as they run, but the more the gunfire and chaos the harder similar stunts will be in the future. The best option is subsonic projectile and well aimed headshots. This way you can take a few before they book out. And then they come back often times very soon after because they aren't really sure what happened. My preferred rig is a suppressed 22lr with an aimpoint and NV.

The most successful individual I've ever met used a Thompson Center Contender with a barrel chambered in 22short. The 22shorts were quieter than my suppressed 10/22 due to the long barrel and little cartridge. This made it possible for him to not use a suppressor and run into issues with uneducated landowners. The .22 short was accurate, cheap and had no trouble penetrating large boar skulls. He had a cheapo red dot mounted, and used a few pole lights with colored filters running off a crappy generator setup over the bait. The lights came on at dusk and ran all night unless the gas ran out. The animals never gave it even a second thought.

By utilizing efficient silent kills he was able to drop sometimes half the animals before the group even spooked. He told me the most important thing was holding perfectly still for a 20 count following the shot as that was when the pack was on high alert before forgetting about it having happened. Hold your breath and count it down slowly before reloading for your next shot. The bait used corn, non-lite beer, strawberry jello mix, and diesel to keep other animals out of it. The diesel didn't deter the hogs at all. Set it up in a snail pen trap with a one way gate. Then you start shooting the hogs outside the pen before going after the ones that can't escape.

He charges $20 a hog plus $10/ea if he has to dispose of them, in addition to $100 upfront to cover expenses. Has more work than he wants and makes a pretty good income. Was the first time I had seen a winch mounted inside a pickup bed with a gaff hook to load carcases.

I'd go similarly if I was trying to make money doing it.

 

[Pigman]

Re: Which Gun?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BachelorJack</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The most successful individual I've ever met used a Thompson Center Contender with a barrel chambered in 22short. The 22shorts were quieter than my suppressed 10/22 due to the long barrel and little cartridge. This made it possible for him to not use a suppressor and run into issues with uneducated landowners. The .22 short was accurate, cheap and had no trouble penetrating large boar skulls. </div></div>

I have a Thompson Center Encore in .25-06 and I found a barrel for it chambered in 22lr. Would this setup also be that quiet?

 

[Nebraska123]

Re: Which Gun?

Just mount a flashlight on an open sight 45-70 gov. and sit patiently.

 

[steppenwolf]

Re: Which Gun?

Which gun?

Guess it depends on the size of the hog. But even a big hog won't necessarily stop guys from trying out this or that weapon.

The guy in this YouTuber vid below used a .50cal Deagle to take down a <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">HUGE</span></span> mega-hog (alleged 800lbs), and it wasn't exactly a quick-n-clean kill either. Took about 7-rds to get it done. Also, this looked like some type of controlled-"hunt" on a hog they knew was there, not one they just stumbled across in the wild. (Could be wrong, but just sayin' ...)

(Vid was new to me, saw it a few days back. Maybe most here have seen it already.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BknKR5mOF3U

 

[jakel]

Re: Which Gun?

i would try to keep your ar(or at least the lower) and go with an upper for a subsonice round. the 300aac or the the 338 spectre. then spend the rest of your $ on NV and a can. i believe your results will be significantly greater this way. its worked unbelievably well for me on crop damage whitetails...

 

[shaman]

Re: Which Gun?

Keep your lower, or buy another lower. 6.5 Grendel or subsonic if you want. Spend the rest on night vision, a suppressor, and ammo, etc.

 

[thewileyone]

Re: Which Gun?

I agree, keep the ar and just add something to your collection. The 223 would work great on hogs, 243 or 308 would be a good addition. You could get an ar10 or a bolt gun either one for under $2k. Some guys use shotguns because they are inexpensive but effective. You will probably not be shooting too long of range anyways. I would also build a trap and use a 22lr to put them out.

Personally, I would keep the 223 and buy a couple thousand rounds of decent ammo and just enjoy. It will get the job done and you will not be out any more $$.

 

[Pigman]

Re: Which Gun?

After thinking about it I think I'm gonna get alot of Barnes TSX 70 grain hollow point .223 ammo and just get a 6.8 upper with a 3-9x scope. That way I don't have to worry about selling the AR and I don't have to spend the extra money for a whole new gun.

 

[tsavo303]

Re: Which Gun?

buy $4000 worth of tails at the butcher, then buy all the GAP you want!

just kidding

I think a clean 6.8 upper is a good choice

 

[3hundredWM]

Re: Which Gun?

6.8 upper with dedicated optics sounds like a good plan.

 

[Graham]

Re: Which Gun?

Either keep your AR, if it will handle 77gr ammo, or get a .308 bolt gun with good match ammo and use it for everything. If your AR won't handle the heavies get an AE and shoot it, and only it, for a few years.

 

[Pigman]

Re: Which Gun?

Mailed the check to Scott at Specialized Dynamics today for a 6.8 upper w/ a 16 inch SS barrel, 12 inch DD Lite rail, and an SJC Titan muzzle brake. I'm also getting a Harris 6-9" swivel bipod, Magpul AFG, and a LaRue SPR LT-139 scope mount for it. Now I just have to find a good scope for it. Any suggestions?