I'm looking for a scope to go on a Rem.700 SPS Varmint .308. I've pretty much narrowed it to 2 (maybe 3) options...Vortex Viper 6.5-20x44 mildot or a SWFA SS 20x, the maybe is a Bushnell Elite 3200 7-21x40. Opinions...
Rifle Scopes Which one would YOU pick and why?
- Thread starter freedomfighter
- Start date
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
What are your plans for the rifle? (i.e. - at what ranges do you plan on shooting it, what target types, do you plan to use it on the range only or also for hunting, comps, etc.).
There are no one-size-fits-all scopes, so it is difficult for anyone to "pick" from your list of options without knowing what you are expecting to do with your rifle.
What are your plans for the rifle? (i.e. - at what ranges do you plan on shooting it, what target types, do you plan to use it on the range only or also for hunting, comps, etc.).
There are no one-size-fits-all scopes, so it is difficult for anyone to "pick" from your list of options without knowing what you are expecting to do with your rifle.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
Forget the 20x Super Sniper. That's way too much magnification for a 42mm objective. Your images will appear dark, the mirage will suck on hot days, and the scope's image will black-out all the time if your cheek weld isn't absolutely perfect. You'll hate it.
Forget the 20x Super Sniper. That's way too much magnification for a 42mm objective. Your images will appear dark, the mirage will suck on hot days, and the scope's image will black-out all the time if your cheek weld isn't absolutely perfect. You'll hate it.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: glock24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Forget the 20x Super Sniper. That's way too much magnification for a 42mm objective. Your images will appear dark, the mirage will suck on hot days, and the scope's image will black-out all the time if your cheek weld isn't absolutely perfect. You'll hate it.
</div></div>
ive made this mistake myself
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: glock24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Forget the 20x Super Sniper. That's way too much magnification for a 42mm objective. Your images will appear dark, the mirage will suck on hot days, and the scope's image will black-out all the time if your cheek weld isn't absolutely perfect. You'll hate it.
</div></div>
ive made this mistake myself
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: freedomfighter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm looking for a scope to go on a Rem.700 SPS Varmint .308. I've pretty much narrowed it to 2 (maybe 3) options...Vortex Viper 6.5-20x44 mildot or a SWFA SS 20x, the maybe is a Bushnell Elite 3200 7-21x40. Opinions... </div></div>
THE Viper 6-20x for varmint or long range target. For big game or predator you want less magnification. A scope somewhere in between 1-12x. I like the Viper PST 2.5-10x44 The scope you want is going to depend on your intended use.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: freedomfighter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm looking for a scope to go on a Rem.700 SPS Varmint .308. I've pretty much narrowed it to 2 (maybe 3) options...Vortex Viper 6.5-20x44 mildot or a SWFA SS 20x, the maybe is a Bushnell Elite 3200 7-21x40. Opinions... </div></div>
THE Viper 6-20x for varmint or long range target. For big game or predator you want less magnification. A scope somewhere in between 1-12x. I like the Viper PST 2.5-10x44 The scope you want is going to depend on your intended use.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
I run that Viper in 50mm. It has good glass, durability is perfect so far, adjustments are repeatable. It is good until about 16x when the image starts to darken, eye relief shrinks and needs to be just perfect for a full image. I never run it past 14x anyway due to mirage. I have run 3200 series before although not the 7-21 and it is a very good scope for the money. I used them on hunting rigs so I didn't really play with adjustments after getting it dialed in. It held up fine banging around while hunting and being on a light weight 300 win mag. I feel the Viper is "crisper" than the 3200 meaning that edge detail is better, if that makes sense. Have never viewed a SS but a straight 20x is too much mag. especially with mirage. Scott at Liberty Optics sells the 3200 and Vipers and could give you some good info on both.
I run that Viper in 50mm. It has good glass, durability is perfect so far, adjustments are repeatable. It is good until about 16x when the image starts to darken, eye relief shrinks and needs to be just perfect for a full image. I never run it past 14x anyway due to mirage. I have run 3200 series before although not the 7-21 and it is a very good scope for the money. I used them on hunting rigs so I didn't really play with adjustments after getting it dialed in. It held up fine banging around while hunting and being on a light weight 300 win mag. I feel the Viper is "crisper" than the 3200 meaning that edge detail is better, if that makes sense. Have never viewed a SS but a straight 20x is too much mag. especially with mirage. Scott at Liberty Optics sells the 3200 and Vipers and could give you some good info on both.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
my plans for this rifle are basically 100-1000 yds. Granted, most of my shooting will be 1-400, I want something that can perform at distance too for those special occasions.
my plans for this rifle are basically 100-1000 yds. Granted, most of my shooting will be 1-400, I want something that can perform at distance too for those special occasions.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
For all of you "buy once, cry once" folks, if you look at his selections, the OP is on a RESTRICTED budget, not an unlimited budget.
Holy crap, believe me, I understand, good optics are great to have.
Let me clue some of you in to something.
NOT EVERYONE CAN, OR IS WILLING, TO SPEND 1800 - 2500 DOLLARS ON A SCOPE!!!!
This concept may be foreign to you.
Apparently the OP is looking in the 300 - 500 dollar range.
To the OP,
depending on your target size, you can shoot out to 1000 with a 10x scope. What is critical is the quality of glass, accurate repeatable adjustments and sufficient internal travel.
For the money, the viper with a 50mm objective has a strong following, as does the Falcon 5.5-25.
What the other posters said IS true, if you can afford better quality, buy it.
If you want to shoot right away, but not break the bank with an eye on upgrading later you have several good options.
Millet TRS-1 4-16x
Weaver Grand Slam tactical from midwayusa
Nikon Buckmaster (although elevation travel is limited)
Super Sniper 10x
WOTAC
All these can be had around 300 bucks.
A Bushnell 10x Elite 3200 mil/mil can be had for 220 bucks.
I started with a Millet TRS-1 and a Falcon Menace 4-14x, still have them, they are good scopes, but I did upgrade to the IOR 3-18 FFP.
If you start with a decent scope like I have listed (there are others out there) you can upgrade in 6 months or so to the PST line, it should be out and available in quantity by then.
I will tell you this, if my rifle was strictly a range rifle, with an occasional hunting trip, I would have no problem sticking with the TRS-1 or the Falcon.
For all of you "buy once, cry once" folks, if you look at his selections, the OP is on a RESTRICTED budget, not an unlimited budget.
Holy crap, believe me, I understand, good optics are great to have.
Let me clue some of you in to something.
NOT EVERYONE CAN, OR IS WILLING, TO SPEND 1800 - 2500 DOLLARS ON A SCOPE!!!!
This concept may be foreign to you.
Apparently the OP is looking in the 300 - 500 dollar range.
To the OP,
depending on your target size, you can shoot out to 1000 with a 10x scope. What is critical is the quality of glass, accurate repeatable adjustments and sufficient internal travel.
For the money, the viper with a 50mm objective has a strong following, as does the Falcon 5.5-25.
What the other posters said IS true, if you can afford better quality, buy it.
If you want to shoot right away, but not break the bank with an eye on upgrading later you have several good options.
Millet TRS-1 4-16x
Weaver Grand Slam tactical from midwayusa
Nikon Buckmaster (although elevation travel is limited)
Super Sniper 10x
WOTAC
All these can be had around 300 bucks.
A Bushnell 10x Elite 3200 mil/mil can be had for 220 bucks.
I started with a Millet TRS-1 and a Falcon Menace 4-14x, still have them, they are good scopes, but I did upgrade to the IOR 3-18 FFP.
If you start with a decent scope like I have listed (there are others out there) you can upgrade in 6 months or so to the PST line, it should be out and available in quantity by then.
I will tell you this, if my rifle was strictly a range rifle, with an occasional hunting trip, I would have no problem sticking with the TRS-1 or the Falcon.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
NO WAY in hell I would want a fixed 20X on anything.
Based on my experiences with all those companies, I would get the Vortex.
A- Every product I have owned with Vortex written on it, was not only a great value that seemed to be worth double its cost, but they have all just been great products, period, regardless of the fact that they cost less.
B- Their warranty and apparent dedication to making not only great products for great prices, but also to grow their business through superior CS.
NO WAY in hell I would want a fixed 20X on anything.
Based on my experiences with all those companies, I would get the Vortex.
A- Every product I have owned with Vortex written on it, was not only a great value that seemed to be worth double its cost, but they have all just been great products, period, regardless of the fact that they cost less.
B- Their warranty and apparent dedication to making not only great products for great prices, but also to grow their business through superior CS.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: freedomfighter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm looking for a scope to go on a Rem.700 SPS Varmint .308. I've pretty much narrowed it to 2 (maybe 3) options...Vortex Viper 6.5-20x44 mildot or a SWFA SS 20x, the maybe is a Bushnell Elite 3200 7-21x40. Opinions... </div></div>
Neither.. I just got a Zeiss Conquest 4.5-14x44mm AO MC with target turrets and mil-dot ret for 800.00 including tax and shipping..
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: freedomfighter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm looking for a scope to go on a Rem.700 SPS Varmint .308. I've pretty much narrowed it to 2 (maybe 3) options...Vortex Viper 6.5-20x44 mildot or a SWFA SS 20x, the maybe is a Bushnell Elite 3200 7-21x40. Opinions... </div></div>
Neither.. I just got a Zeiss Conquest 4.5-14x44mm AO MC with target turrets and mil-dot ret for 800.00 including tax and shipping..
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
My choice for a budget scope would be
#1 SS10X42 or 42M Mil/Moa 30mm tube
#2 Bushnell 10X40 Mil/Mil Mil/Mil 1" tube
#3 Leupold 4-12x40 Mark AR Mil/Moa 1" tube
I have not tried Weaver Mil/Mil but it is something to read up on.
I have not tried Vortex so I cant say on that one either.
I would stay away from the SS20X, If you have a special use for it that is one thing but I don’t think you are going to like it for waht you want.
My choice for a budget scope would be
#1 SS10X42 or 42M Mil/Moa 30mm tube
#2 Bushnell 10X40 Mil/Mil Mil/Mil 1" tube
#3 Leupold 4-12x40 Mark AR Mil/Moa 1" tube
I have not tried Weaver Mil/Mil but it is something to read up on.
I have not tried Vortex so I cant say on that one either.
I would stay away from the SS20X, If you have a special use for it that is one thing but I don’t think you are going to like it for waht you want.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
I would get the Vortex, I have one and am very happy with it. Life time warranty. Good product. Scott at Liberty Optics will offer you good advice based on your needs and not what he wants to sell.
I would get the Vortex, I have one and am very happy with it. Life time warranty. Good product. Scott at Liberty Optics will offer you good advice based on your needs and not what he wants to sell.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
I own a few Vortex 6.5-20X50's. Not NF by any means, but damn good scope for the money. There are many good scopes in the $500.00 range, but don't expect NF quality. If I only shot one rifle, I would own a higher end scope, but I like to shoot and have not been able to spread the wealth around with two kids in college. Someday.......
I own a few Vortex 6.5-20X50's. Not NF by any means, but damn good scope for the money. There are many good scopes in the $500.00 range, but don't expect NF quality. If I only shot one rifle, I would own a higher end scope, but I like to shoot and have not been able to spread the wealth around with two kids in college. Someday.......
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
Mmmmm never used a Vortex, but would be willing to try one.
I would try that or the bushnell.
I would try and get a reticle that would allow quick aquisition at longer ranges if i didnt have the budget for tactical turrets.
Mmmmm never used a Vortex, but would be willing to try one.
I would try that or the bushnell.
I would try and get a reticle that would allow quick aquisition at longer ranges if i didnt have the budget for tactical turrets.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
Of the scopes you listed I would suggest you try the Vortex.
I have never owned the other 2, but did own a Bushnell 3200 5-15.
The Bushnell was nice, but not in the same league as the Vortex Viper.
The Viper has proven to be repeatable if you like to dial. The reticle is sharp and sized appropriately for both low light use and target work.
On the 3 scopes I have used, the mil-dots are accurate at close to 14X as indicated on the power ring. 2 of the 3 scopes needed a minor adjustment in the power setting for accurate ranging.
The scopes are bright and clear and I have never noticed an issue when using them in the upper power ranges.
My wife has 1 of the Vipers on her rifle, she shoots it to 1000 on a regular basis and has never had an issue with the glass or reticle size. She can easily quarter a 1.25 to 2 moa target at those ranges. She has used the scope in 2 unknown distance matches and has dialed all the elevations and the scope's adjustments have been repeatable. The scope on my wife's rifle has over 1200 rounds under since this spring. It has been bounced, bang and used hard and not a single issue. If there were an issue with the scope, I am sure Vortex would take care of you without a long wait!
The scope has also been used to hunt antelope and deer from very short ranges to over 400 yards. The power range is very usable and the size doesn't overwhelm most rifles. The 44mm Obj allows low rings to be used even with heavy contour barrels.
Good Luck and enjoy whichever scope you choose.
Of the scopes you listed I would suggest you try the Vortex.
I have never owned the other 2, but did own a Bushnell 3200 5-15.
The Bushnell was nice, but not in the same league as the Vortex Viper.
The Viper has proven to be repeatable if you like to dial. The reticle is sharp and sized appropriately for both low light use and target work.
On the 3 scopes I have used, the mil-dots are accurate at close to 14X as indicated on the power ring. 2 of the 3 scopes needed a minor adjustment in the power setting for accurate ranging.
The scopes are bright and clear and I have never noticed an issue when using them in the upper power ranges.
My wife has 1 of the Vipers on her rifle, she shoots it to 1000 on a regular basis and has never had an issue with the glass or reticle size. She can easily quarter a 1.25 to 2 moa target at those ranges. She has used the scope in 2 unknown distance matches and has dialed all the elevations and the scope's adjustments have been repeatable. The scope on my wife's rifle has over 1200 rounds under since this spring. It has been bounced, bang and used hard and not a single issue. If there were an issue with the scope, I am sure Vortex would take care of you without a long wait!
The scope has also been used to hunt antelope and deer from very short ranges to over 400 yards. The power range is very usable and the size doesn't overwhelm most rifles. The 44mm Obj allows low rings to be used even with heavy contour barrels.
Good Luck and enjoy whichever scope you choose.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
Good info above, but also, if you're planning to shoot moving targets, Id stay away form those scopes that start over 5 magnification. Id say go with a 3-12 or 4-16 regardless of brand
Good info above, but also, if you're planning to shoot moving targets, Id stay away form those scopes that start over 5 magnification. Id say go with a 3-12 or 4-16 regardless of brand
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
I have the Vortex Viper 6.5~20x50 with the target dot reticle. $280 delivered from Camera Land: http://www.cameralandny.com/ The 6.5~20x44 is $250 with the target dot reticle.
Unless you absolutely need the mil-dot reticle, why spend the extra money?
I'm more than pleased with my Viper and I've not had a problem with eye relief or darkening. I have it mounted on my .308 700 SPS-V rifle. I'd buy another one if I could afford it.
I have the Vortex Viper 6.5~20x50 with the target dot reticle. $280 delivered from Camera Land: http://www.cameralandny.com/ The 6.5~20x44 is $250 with the target dot reticle.
Unless you absolutely need the mil-dot reticle, why spend the extra money?
I'm more than pleased with my Viper and I've not had a problem with eye relief or darkening. I have it mounted on my .308 700 SPS-V rifle. I'd buy another one if I could afford it.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
I'd take a look at the Konus 6.5-25X scope that SWFA offers @ $300. My brother had one on his SPS and loves it.
I'd take a look at the Konus 6.5-25X scope that SWFA offers @ $300. My brother had one on his SPS and loves it.
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: glock24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Forget the 20x Super Sniper. That's way too much magnification for a 42mm objective. Your images will appear dark, the mirage will suck on hot days, and the scope's image will black-out all the time if your cheek weld isn't absolutely perfect. You'll hate it.
ya,enough said for that scope
</div></div>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: glock24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Forget the 20x Super Sniper. That's way too much magnification for a 42mm objective. Your images will appear dark, the mirage will suck on hot days, and the scope's image will black-out all the time if your cheek weld isn't absolutely perfect. You'll hate it.
ya,enough said for that scope
</div></div>
Re: Which one would YOU pick and why?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fdkay</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For all of you "buy once, cry once" folks, if you look at his selections, the OP is on a RESTRICTED budget, not an unlimited budget.
Holy crap, believe me, I understand, good optics are great to have.
Let me clue some of you in to something.
NOT EVERYONE CAN, OR IS WILLING, TO SPEND 1800 - 2500 DOLLARS ON A SCOPE!!!!
This concept may be foreign to you...</div></div>
Was this tirade really necessary? You assume he is on a restricted budget based on the three choices he puts forth for consideration, but, he never says I only have X$$$ to spend. Maybe those were three scopes he liked and he’s leaning toward a certain price bracket. Again, he didn’t specifically say that. In optics, more than any other piece of equipment, you tend to get what you pay for. I think that’s why some posters are urging him to stretch his optics budget if at all possible. If you can’t see it, you can’t hit it. If your scope won’t reliably adjust, it’s better served as a trot-line weight than as an optic. There are a lot of sound arguments that can be made regarding cutting the shooting budget somewhere other than in the optical category.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fdkay</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For all of you "buy once, cry once" folks, if you look at his selections, the OP is on a RESTRICTED budget, not an unlimited budget.
Holy crap, believe me, I understand, good optics are great to have.
Let me clue some of you in to something.
NOT EVERYONE CAN, OR IS WILLING, TO SPEND 1800 - 2500 DOLLARS ON A SCOPE!!!!
This concept may be foreign to you...</div></div>
Was this tirade really necessary? You assume he is on a restricted budget based on the three choices he puts forth for consideration, but, he never says I only have X$$$ to spend. Maybe those were three scopes he liked and he’s leaning toward a certain price bracket. Again, he didn’t specifically say that. In optics, more than any other piece of equipment, you tend to get what you pay for. I think that’s why some posters are urging him to stretch his optics budget if at all possible. If you can’t see it, you can’t hit it. If your scope won’t reliably adjust, it’s better served as a trot-line weight than as an optic. There are a lot of sound arguments that can be made regarding cutting the shooting budget somewhere other than in the optical category.
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