Why is the AI AXMC shooting this bad.

wolfy

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Jan 31, 2021
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The worst is this is at 50 meters.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
The barrel has been removed and refitted. We got lock down due to covid so not tested after barrel refitted. Will test this weekend.
 

SuperBoot

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Need way more info man.

Make sure your barrel is shouldered properly. Check torque on your quickloc screw.
Check ring/scope mount torque.

What optic are you using? Ammo?
What does barrel refitted mean? just removed and reinstalled?
 

wolfy

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Ok sorry guys I should know better.
It is an AI axmc 338 lapua magnum.
It has a atacr 7 7-32 ×56.
It is on a nightforce one piece unimount. 4 screw rings so that is 8 all up.
The first shots the scope did move so that got tightened to spec 24inch Lds.
The scope mount on to rifle tightened to 68 inch Lds as spec.
We used hornady match 250 grain, used 300grain fiocchi.
I will be going to a private property hopefully this weekend to test with the gunshop(accuracy international dealer).
The shots that are in the picture are Winchester ballistic tip.

The barrel on the axmc you just tighten by hand and then 49 inch Lds the one screw for the barrel.
So I took the barrel off and cleaned the contacts and refitted.
 
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jbell

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    For that rifle to shoot any ammo that bad and assuming the barrel is on correct as is the NF scope and your not shooting offhand the first thing that pops in my mind would be a problem with a muzzle device. Do you have anything on the muzzle and if so remove it and try again.
     
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    96C

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    Some other variables:


    Are YOU generally a capable and 'accurate' shooter?

    How many rounds does the barrel have through it?

    How long has it been since it was last fired? Is the bore in good condition?

    Is the muzzle brake on correctly? (not moving).

    Are you shooting off a support? bipod / bag / rest / sled etc.

    How windy was it?

    What is the extreme spread in velocity for the ammunition you're shooting?
     
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    wolfy

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    Ok sorry guys I should know better.
    It is an AI axmc 338 lapua magnum.
    It has a atacr 7 7-32 ×56.
    It is on a nightforce one piece unimount. 4 screw rings so that is 8 all up.
    The first shots the scope did move so that got tightened to spec 24inch Lds.
    The scope mount on to rifle tightened to 68 inch Lds as spec.
    We used hornady match 250 grain, used 300grain fiocchi.
    I will be going to a private property hopefully this weekend to test with the gunshop(accuracy international dealer).
    The shots that are in the picture are Winchester ballistic tip.

    The barrel on the axmc you just tighten by hand and then 49 inch Lds the one screw for the barrel.
    So I took the barrel off and cleaned the contacts and refitted.

    Judging by the amount of weight your lifting I suspect you may have physical issues shooting 338LM.
    Of a bench at the moment. So should be ok.
     

    wolfy

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    Some other variables:


    Are YOU generally a capable and 'accurate' shooter?

    How many rounds does the barrel have through it?

    How long has it been since it was last fired? Is the bore in good condition?

    Is the muzzle brake on correctly? (not moving).

    Are you shooting off a support? bipod / bag / rest / sled etc.

    How windy was it?

    What is the extreme spread in velocity for the ammunition you're shooting?
    At 50 meters wind is no issue. No wind though.
     

    wolfy

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    At 50 meters wind is no issue.
    No wind though.20210127_154351.jpg
    This is the setup.
    I think I can shoot well. I shoot a 300 win mag and do clays at 512 meters. That is my load. So I can hold a rifle steady.
    The bipod is loaded well. I do clamp a wood beam on the bench and load the bipod.
    The rifle is new. 60 rounds through it now.
     

    wolfy

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    No wind though.View attachment 7559400
    This is the setup.
    I think I can shoot well. I shoot a 300 win mag and do clays at 512 meters. That is my load. So I can hold a rifle steady.
    The bipod is loaded well. I do clamp a wood beam on the bench and load the bipod.
    The rifle is new. 60 rounds through it now.
    Clays 110mm diameter.
     

    wolfy

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    Ok so you guys have not heard of an AI being this bad before?
    After the test this week end if it doesn't do hole in hole at 100 meters might have to send it back and get AI to check.
     

    wolfy

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    Some other variables:


    Are YOU generally a capable and 'accurate' shooter?

    How many rounds does the barrel have through it?

    How long has it been since it was last fired? Is the bore in good condition?

    Is the muzzle brake on correctly? (not moving).

    Are you shooting off a support? bipod / bag / rest / sled etc.

    How windy was it?

    What is the extreme spread in velocity for the ammunition you're shooting?
    Will have the labradar with us this weekend.
    No info on the rounds yet.
    I have seen the same rifle with factory ammo do hafl moa and 1/4 inch groups at100.
     
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    MK20

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    Just for kicks, don't load your bipod next time you shoot and compare it. That shouldn't affect the rifle, but then again, an AI shouldn't shoot that way. The interesting thing is that the rifle isn't shooting generally horrible groups, as in a wide but equal dispersion of rounds radially from the center of the group in all directions, but is obviously vertically stringing, so something is interfering with the rifle system. If it was a bad barrel it would shoot differently than that.
     

    wolfy

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    Just for kicks, don't load your bipod next time you shoot and compare it. That shouldn't affect the rifle, but then again, an AI shouldn't shoot that way. The interesting thing is that the rifle isn't shooting generally horrible groups, as in a wide but equal dispersion of rounds radially from the center of the group in all directions, but is obviously vertically stringing, so something is interfering with the rifle system. If it was a bad barrel it would shoot differently than that.
    Yep I thought that was my breathing. I do believe I did not load the bipod on those shots. ( no wood to get good load).
    The bipod is an AI bipod. So the feet can roll. Thay will not jump like the Harris can.
    I think I should get more testing done.
    Maybe no bipod and see.?
    I want to thank all of you for suggestions.
     

    TangoSierra916

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    did you remove/reinstall the action rail to ensure it wasn't moving? Also, you mentioned you removed the barrel, when you reinstalled it did you torque the quick change screw down to the right 49 in/lb?
     

    THEIS

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    Hi,

    I hate to be the one to say it first but....from reading your replies about bipod can do this and bipod can do that....

    Have you let someone else shoot the rifle?

    From your replies it is pretty clear that your fundamentals are lacking and that 338LMM is EXPOSING every single piece of them.

    Bipods do NOT hop...no matter whom the manufacturer is, no matter what rifle/cartridge combination is....period...they just do not!!

    UNLESS you are not driving the rifle properly and with a 338LM....IF you do not drive it right it will definitely drive you and the target will show it.

    Sincerely,
    Theis
     

    chase723

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    Is it just me, but is there something going on with the concentricity of your muzzle brake? Maybe it’s just an optical illusion.4C804B81-A597-4984-B8C3-179D3292113C.jpeg
     

    MCHOG

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    I vote for shooter issue being the problem. I'd interpret the target photos as being essentially 2 MOA groups, which is probably better than typical for a shooter new to precision work on a 338. If my hunch that the OP is new to the game is correct, I'd suggest investing in a 308 bolt, a 6.5 barrel, and a two fundamentals classes about 6 months apart.
     
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    vh20

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    It's a new rifle, so where is the factory muzzle brake? Neither of my factory AXMC 338s came with a brake like that - have they changed them?

    Can you see any baffle strikes on the brake?

    I won't jump on the "shooter's issue" bandwagon quite yet. IF he's experienced and proficient with his 300WM as he says, the step up to a AXMC 338 isn't that much. As heavy as they are, they're pretty tame to shoot (but they still DEMAND proper fundamentals and will exploit every weakness). But if he's even just a sub-1 MOA shooter with his 300WM, he shouldn't be shooting THAT poorly with just the step up to 338 on a stable, heavy AXMC. Staying on the rifle through recoil and watching what the reticle does should answer the question for him. If it's all over the place, or he can't tell what happens, then that is the shooter (or a really bad barrel, or a baffle strike, etc, etc). If the reticle stays in view and doesn't jump wildly off POA, then it's something else. Definitely have a shooter known to be proficient with big magnums give it a try too though.
     
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    carlm338

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    He's from Australia - that IS a factory muzzle brake. The factory suppressor screws onto the exposed threads at the front of the brake.
     

    vh20

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    He's from Australia - that IS a factory muzzle brake. The factory suppressor screws onto the exposed threads at the front of the brake.
    While I was away from the computer I figured that must be the case (not in US) because he left clues I didn't pick up on - namely everything noted in metric measurements. Got back on and I checked his profile - duh. We get a much different brake on the ones here. Thanks.
     
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    vh20

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    B8BF1362-D80D-4868-B7E4-B2158435B4BD.jpeg

    Not the best pic, but this is a factory brake in the US.
     

    kthomas

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    We always like to place blame on the equipment before anything else, but most problems originate from the shooter behind the rifle. Equipment these days is damn good, especially AI. We never like to think that the problem revolves us, the shooter, but most commonly it is. Our hubris gets in the way at times.

    The bigger the cartridge, the more your lack of fundamentals get exposed and exploited. .338LM is not near as forgiving to shoot as smaller short action cartridges.

    I'm constantly reminded of this myself. When I shoot my ~21lb braked 6BRA, I think I'm a fucking stud. Then I pull out an unbraked .308 and I'm humbled awfully quickly. I'm not as good of a shooter as my 6BRA wants me to think I am.
     
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    Just Macca

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    I’ve noticed a massive difference in tolerable recoil in a light TRG42 just swapping from a mild 250gr load to a hot 285gr load.

    Shooting an unknown 300wm (which may be loaded with 168gr at an average velocity for all we know) versus a 338LM would be night and day.
     
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    vh20

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    I’ve noticed a massive difference in tolerable recoil in a light TRG42 just swapping from a mild 250gr load to a hot 285gr load.

    Shooting an unknown 300wm (which may be loaded with 168gr at an average velocity for all we know) versus a 338LM would be night and day.
    Yes. By the same token my unbraked .30-06 hunting rifle is much more of a challenge to manage recoil than my 338s.
     
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    wolfy

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    did you remove/reinstall the action rail to ensure it wasn't moving? Also, you mentioned you removed the barrel, when you reinstalled it did you torque the quick change screw down to the right 49 in/lb?
    Yes I have the fixit torque special 49 inch pound for this.
    The action is a bonded unit. It all looked ok.
    But will get that checked. Good point.
     

    Huskydriver

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    Yes I have the fixit torque special 49 inch pound for this.
    The action is a bonded unit. It all looked ok.
    But will get that checked. Good point.
    Mine shoots best at 55-60inlbs fyi.

    But it sounds like something else is going on.
     

    wolfy

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    Probably a dumb question, but can someone spell out for me how this factors in? (Assuming this has nothing to do with cold shooter).
    I think they might be on the path that it could have build corrosion in the barrel.
    I have heard of a case like that but it was an old rifle and steel. But this is a new rifle.
     
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    TangoSierra916

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    Yes I have the fixit torque special 49 inch pound for this.
    The action is a bonded unit. It all looked ok.
    But will get that checked. Good point.
    Yep the action is bonded, but I meant to check this part to make sure it’s torqued down. It has a built in recoil lug so not likely the issue but something to check.
     

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    wolfy

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    Mine shoots best at 55-60inlbs fyi.

    But it sounds like something else is going on.
    You torque the AI Axmc that much or is it a different rifle?
    To tell the truth it seems some one did something wrong before I got it. Unless it is the scope.
    So first thing first change scope over and test.
    Actually test again because refitted barrel.
    Then change scope with mount.
    Shoot of a bag.
    Then check if barrel can be changed over for test. I am sure they will have another 338 lap barrel.
    Then ammo. Ammo last.
    After that warranty.
     

    GIXXER2000

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    I was have the same issue when I first got my AI PSR I found that 49 in pounds was not enough so I got a 6nm(53.1 in pounds) preset T handle torque wrench and my groups settled right in. I also use it for the AI-AT. This is with hand loads. I shot some Hornady 285 factory but the box of 20 i had could never get it to group under 1 moa at best. I am shooting Berger 300 hybrids with N570 and it groups 1/2 moa or slightly better on a good day.
     
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    Huskydriver

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    You torque the AI Axmc that much or is it a different rifle?
    To tell the truth it seems some one did something wrong before I got it. Unless it is the scope.
    So first thing first change scope over and test.
    Actually test again because refitted barrel.
    Then change scope with mount.
    Shoot of a bag.
    Then check if barrel can be changed over for test. I am sure they will have another 338 lap barrel.
    Then ammo. Ammo last.
    After that warranty.

    No I torque my axmc quick loc with 55-60
     
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