I mean we all ues ear protection. What does reducing recoil have to do with the class? I wanted to try and shoot but my rifle has a brake. I have an artifical shoulder and it helps mw alot?
Diego
Diego
- Thread starter diego-ted
- Start date
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
This might be one for the F-Class section.
This might be one for the F-Class section.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
^^^ needs to be moved, but mostly has to do with respect to other shooters. I own a break on my rifle, and can't compete. I don't get down or anything about it just shoot by myself.... Yes I'm odd lol.
^^^ needs to be moved, but mostly has to do with respect to other shooters. I own a break on my rifle, and can't compete. I don't get down or anything about it just shoot by myself.... Yes I'm odd lol.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
Even with ear protection, muzzle brakes are obnoxious. When you've got a line of 10-20+ rifles tightly packed together, each taking ~25 shots per string, it would be absolutely obnoxious.
Secondly, I think they are trying to keep ballistics "reasonable". My TRG42 in 338LM is really easy to shoot. What skill would it take to shoot clean with a braked rifle firing 300gr bullets with a BC of .75 going 2850fps? Not much.
Even with ear protection, muzzle brakes are obnoxious. When you've got a line of 10-20+ rifles tightly packed together, each taking ~25 shots per string, it would be absolutely obnoxious.
Secondly, I think they are trying to keep ballistics "reasonable". My TRG42 in 338LM is really easy to shoot. What skill would it take to shoot clean with a braked rifle firing 300gr bullets with a BC of .75 going 2850fps? Not much.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
You can always have your rifle fitted with a removable brake. I have one and it works out really well.
Another alternative if you really want to shoot f-class is to use a rifle that has very little recoil to begin with. F-class allows rigs to weigh up to 22 lbs. Even a .284 that weighs that much doesn't have much recoil. A 6BR would have virtually none.
You can always have your rifle fitted with a removable brake. I have one and it works out really well.
Another alternative if you really want to shoot f-class is to use a rifle that has very little recoil to begin with. F-class allows rigs to weigh up to 22 lbs. Even a .284 that weighs that much doesn't have much recoil. A 6BR would have virtually none.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
Muzzle blast and concussion would be ungodly with a line of big bores with brakes.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Another alternative if you really want to shoot f-class is to use a rifle that has very little recoil to begin with. F-class allows rigs to weigh up to 22 lbs. Even a .284 that weighs that much doesn't have much recoil.</div></div>
Absolutely! a 21+ pound rifle goes a long way in reducing recoil!
Muzzle blast and concussion would be ungodly with a line of big bores with brakes.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Another alternative if you really want to shoot f-class is to use a rifle that has very little recoil to begin with. F-class allows rigs to weigh up to 22 lbs. Even a .284 that weighs that much doesn't have much recoil.</div></div>
Absolutely! a 21+ pound rifle goes a long way in reducing recoil!
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
Are suppressors allowed?
Or does it go back to the shooting large cals with no recoil?
THanks,
DT
Are suppressors allowed?
Or does it go back to the shooting large cals with no recoil?
THanks,
DT
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
Nope.
Nope.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
if your muzzle breaks, your rifle probably won't shoot good enough. i wouldn't recommend shooting any competition with a broken muzzle.
if your muzzle breaks, your rifle probably won't shoot good enough. i wouldn't recommend shooting any competition with a broken muzzle.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
I have shot next to a guy with a 300 mag and a break. It was not enjoyable.
I have shot next to a guy with a 300 mag and a break. It was not enjoyable.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
F Class rules are a subset of NRA Highpower rules. If the F Class section does not cover it, it's governed by the Highpower rules. "No brakes" is in there somewhere and for the reasons posted by someone already. They are very disruptive on a packed firing line and there may be other reasons, but I don't know.
Paul
F Class rules are a subset of NRA Highpower rules. If the F Class section does not cover it, it's governed by the Highpower rules. "No brakes" is in there somewhere and for the reasons posted by someone already. They are very disruptive on a packed firing line and there may be other reasons, but I don't know.
Paul
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
I have shot on the line between a 300WM and 300WSM, even with earplugs and headphones up it was pretty obnoxious.
I have shot on the line between a 300WM and 300WSM, even with earplugs and headphones up it was pretty obnoxious.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
Paul covered it.
Personally, I use adequate hearing protection and do not have an issue with them, and that includes shooting prone 6'-8' alongside a braked .338LM.
I usually try to make some effort not to find offense easily. Maybe that makes me different.
Greg
Paul covered it.
Personally, I use adequate hearing protection and do not have an issue with them, and that includes shooting prone 6'-8' alongside a braked .338LM.
I usually try to make some effort not to find offense easily. Maybe that makes me different.
Greg
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
I have serious issues shooting next to braked rifles.
Even with plugs and muffs, it is impossible to operate without loss of concentration or gun movement.
I have literally had the bill of my cap turned sideways from a fellow shooter's blast. I have had my action and scope lense coated with dirt and debris from a fellow shooter's blast and my rifle will actually move when the blast hits. You can literally see it in the scope.
We ran our last competition with all brake shooters squaded together. This was fair to all and let the brake shooters enjoy the effects of their own equipment.
Very interesting that the last few Snipers Hide Cups and many other major comps have been won very handily by shooters running naked barrels! No brakes and no suppressors. Hmmmm. That's what the F.B.I. would call a clue....
I have serious issues shooting next to braked rifles.
Even with plugs and muffs, it is impossible to operate without loss of concentration or gun movement.
I have literally had the bill of my cap turned sideways from a fellow shooter's blast. I have had my action and scope lense coated with dirt and debris from a fellow shooter's blast and my rifle will actually move when the blast hits. You can literally see it in the scope.
We ran our last competition with all brake shooters squaded together. This was fair to all and let the brake shooters enjoy the effects of their own equipment.
Very interesting that the last few Snipers Hide Cups and many other major comps have been won very handily by shooters running naked barrels! No brakes and no suppressors. Hmmmm. That's what the F.B.I. would call a clue....
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Terry Cross</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have serious issues shooting next to braked rifles.
Even with plugs and muffs, it is impossible to operate without loss of concentration or gun movement.
I have literally had the bill of my cap turned sideways from a fellow shooter's blast. I have had my action and scope lense coated with dirt and debris from a fellow shooter's blast and my rifle will actually move when the blast hits. You can literally see it in the scope.
</div></div>
This^^
My partner uses the APA little bastard, and is almost always on my left. If he takes the brake off, I can send a well-aimed round within 1/2 second of him firing. If he's got the brake on, it takes me at least 2 seconds to recover from his blast. It blows the rim of my hat up, and onlookers have told me they can see my cheek wiggle/flop around. It blows debris on my rifle, my optic and me. It blows spent varget up my nasal passages at 250mph. It singes my nostril hairs (maybe a slight exaggeration. We've begun putting one of our packs off to the side of his muzzle, which works nice if we have the time in a stage to do it. Not exactly "tactical" though...to take the time to set up a "blast gaurd" between shooters.
In regard to shooting WITH a brake, as compared to shooting NEXT to a brake... The concussion/shock wave seems to catch me off gaurd. I've not shot much with a brake, but I think it actually hinders me when shooting a "reasonable" caliber. I shoot a 15lb 308. The recoil, while existent, is negligable. Shooting my partners 15lb braked 308, I find it literally has zero recoil to "deal" with, but that damn blast is very disruptive, and even causes me to flinch. When shooting an unbraked rifle, I have zero flinch.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Terry Cross</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have serious issues shooting next to braked rifles.
Even with plugs and muffs, it is impossible to operate without loss of concentration or gun movement.
I have literally had the bill of my cap turned sideways from a fellow shooter's blast. I have had my action and scope lense coated with dirt and debris from a fellow shooter's blast and my rifle will actually move when the blast hits. You can literally see it in the scope.
</div></div>
This^^
My partner uses the APA little bastard, and is almost always on my left. If he takes the brake off, I can send a well-aimed round within 1/2 second of him firing. If he's got the brake on, it takes me at least 2 seconds to recover from his blast. It blows the rim of my hat up, and onlookers have told me they can see my cheek wiggle/flop around. It blows debris on my rifle, my optic and me. It blows spent varget up my nasal passages at 250mph. It singes my nostril hairs (maybe a slight exaggeration. We've begun putting one of our packs off to the side of his muzzle, which works nice if we have the time in a stage to do it. Not exactly "tactical" though...to take the time to set up a "blast gaurd" between shooters.
In regard to shooting WITH a brake, as compared to shooting NEXT to a brake... The concussion/shock wave seems to catch me off gaurd. I've not shot much with a brake, but I think it actually hinders me when shooting a "reasonable" caliber. I shoot a 15lb 308. The recoil, while existent, is negligable. Shooting my partners 15lb braked 308, I find it literally has zero recoil to "deal" with, but that damn blast is very disruptive, and even causes me to flinch. When shooting an unbraked rifle, I have zero flinch.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
Yea, its not so much the noise but the concussion. I could actually feel his muzzle blast punching me in the face and then the powder fumes and debris on top of that.
Yea, its not so much the noise but the concussion. I could actually feel his muzzle blast punching me in the face and then the powder fumes and debris on top of that.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
My F class rifle is on the way, I will compete next year. I know there is no way I could concentrate with brakes near me. My shooting buddies have braked 300 Roy's and I move way down the line when they shoot with me.
My F class rifle is on the way, I will compete next year. I know there is no way I could concentrate with brakes near me. My shooting buddies have braked 300 Roy's and I move way down the line when they shoot with me.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
i thought we shoot "tactical" matches or at least posting on a "tactical marksman" forum. part of the "tactical" in my opinion should be the ability to deal with distractions.
i see no reason other disciplines such as f-class and benchrest that don't claim to be "tactical" shouldn't have a "no brake" rule if they so choose.
i thought we shoot "tactical" matches or at least posting on a "tactical marksman" forum. part of the "tactical" in my opinion should be the ability to deal with distractions.
i see no reason other disciplines such as f-class and benchrest that don't claim to be "tactical" shouldn't have a "no brake" rule if they so choose.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
NRA high power rifle rule 3.16.1 Compensators and Muzzle Brakes- The use of compensators or muzzle brakes is prohibited.
NRA high power rifle rule 3.16.1 Compensators and Muzzle Brakes- The use of compensators or muzzle brakes is prohibited.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
suppressor for everyone
suppressor for everyone
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
Ever been in a fire fight???
Talking about noise ! ! ! !
Oh, wait, that's different.
OK, off topic . . .
Back to topic . . .
Ever been in a fire fight???
Talking about noise ! ! ! !
Oh, wait, that's different.
OK, off topic . . .
Back to topic . . .
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
I shot beside a breaked 300wssm at the last match I was in. It was raining so we laid tarps down on the firing line. This was a bad idea. The tarps held water so it was like getting prone in a pond. Every time that SOB pulled the trigger on his 300 it was like a tidal wave pouring down on the rest of us. Totally not fun.
I shot beside a breaked 300wssm at the last match I was in. It was raining so we laid tarps down on the firing line. This was a bad idea. The tarps held water so it was like getting prone in a pond. Every time that SOB pulled the trigger on his 300 it was like a tidal wave pouring down on the rest of us. Totally not fun.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
Yes I have, with my Bozo Buddy using my shoulder as a rest for his M-14.
Whaaaat...?y
Just another one of the many reasons I just got my new hearing aid from thw VA.
Yes I have, with my Bozo Buddy using my shoulder as a rest for his M-14.
Whaaaat...?y
Just another one of the many reasons I just got my new hearing aid from thw VA.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
I respectfully and totally disagree with 300 and Skeptic about dealing with distractions. . . . in a competition. At least random distractions that are not the same for every shooter.
I am a strong believer in TRAINING with stress, distractions and anything random you can throw in.
COMPETITION is a totally different horse. You are paying to have access to good shooters and be tested on a level playing field. While mother nature, out of necessity, has to be allowed her variances - the course of fire has to be as consistent and fair as possible for each shooter.
The competitor shooting a muzzle brake is not exposed to the same environment at those on either side of him.
While you are certainly free to post your opinions regarding this topic, I think the suggestion to 'man up', 'quit complaining' and 'it ain't realistic without distractions' doesn't hold water when you are talking about competition instead of training.
And No. They are not the same.
Best,
TC
I respectfully and totally disagree with 300 and Skeptic about dealing with distractions. . . . in a competition. At least random distractions that are not the same for every shooter.
I am a strong believer in TRAINING with stress, distractions and anything random you can throw in.
COMPETITION is a totally different horse. You are paying to have access to good shooters and be tested on a level playing field. While mother nature, out of necessity, has to be allowed her variances - the course of fire has to be as consistent and fair as possible for each shooter.
The competitor shooting a muzzle brake is not exposed to the same environment at those on either side of him.
While you are certainly free to post your opinions regarding this topic, I think the suggestion to 'man up', 'quit complaining' and 'it ain't realistic without distractions' doesn't hold water when you are talking about competition instead of training.
And No. They are not the same.
Best,
TC
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
I believe Mr Cross covered the points I'd bother typing quite well.
I shot next to Hellbender's braked SAKO TRG22 last week in OK, and even with my ruck between the brake and my face the wind created made it so I got a mouthful of grass dirt and cowshit if it was open when he fired.
I think they are OK for dynamic shooting positions to help the shooter recover, but I hate shooting next to them enough that I do not run one out of consideration.
I believe Mr Cross covered the points I'd bother typing quite well.
I shot next to Hellbender's braked SAKO TRG22 last week in OK, and even with my ruck between the brake and my face the wind created made it so I got a mouthful of grass dirt and cowshit if it was open when he fired.
I think they are OK for dynamic shooting positions to help the shooter recover, but I hate shooting next to them enough that I do not run one out of consideration.
Re: Why no muzzel break in F Class
I agree with Terry 100% on this one.
Although, you say you have an artificial shoulder and it helps a lot. Talk with the guys in charge, they may make exceptions and try to position you away from other shooter or something. This sport is made of excellent people that promote participation. I have seen rules bent for similar instances.
Speaking local level anyway. When you get into the larger comps they don't bend as easily.
I agree with Terry 100% on this one.
Although, you say you have an artificial shoulder and it helps a lot. Talk with the guys in charge, they may make exceptions and try to position you away from other shooter or something. This sport is made of excellent people that promote participation. I have seen rules bent for similar instances.
Speaking local level anyway. When you get into the larger comps they don't bend as easily.
