Gunsmithing Why not Browning?

[locomacdaddy]

Hey guys, I am well aware that most custom guns are any thing <span style="font-style: italic">but </span>Browning, I haven't been able to find info on why that is? What is it about the Browning Abolt action makes it not customized more? One thing that I see is that bolt seems chromed and maybe that is the major issue...any details would be helpful.

Also, would you even go down the route of trying to customize one (rebarrel, action and trigger work etc.) or just sell it and start over?

Thanks.

 

[BigOhio]

Re: Why not Browning?

Since no one else has given I response, I'll give it a shot. I think it has to do with the high initial cost of the rifle and lack of aftermarket. Most of my hunting guns are A-bolts and I love them having a Stainless Stalker in 300wsm, 2 A-bolt shotguns and a varmint boss in 22-250. All shoot great and have taken a ton of game but when it comes to building up a rifle I'm thinking a cheap remington action for a budget build or a custom action for the high dollar build.

Saying that, if I had an action around that i wasn't using for something no reason you couldn't have trued and rebarreled and have a great rifle.

 

[Goodwood]

Re: Why not Browning?

The browning rifles have a rather complicated trigger group "module" that contains the trigger and the safety mechanism. Because of this, the trigger is really expensive to replace. (There is only one that I know of for the A bolt, and that is the $300.00 Jard). If you are going to do trigger work, it is best to have the stock trigger spring replaced and the trigger adjusted as per Browning's instructions. Lighter springs are available, and they produce an end product that is much better than the average 6 pound browning triggers I have found on my A bolts.

As KTM mentioned above, the browning does not have a strong aftermarket support, and so finding "drop-in" parts for the browning is a challenge. I think this leads to far fewer folks "customizing" the Brownings like people do with their Remingtons.

There are still good stocks for browning (like McMillan and Bell and Carlson), and you can still bed the gun, re-barrel the gun, or true the action. But, as KTM mentioned, this means spending a couple hundred dollars more for the base gun to begin with.

The Brownings I have shot nearly always out-shoot the base model (less than the price of the browning) Remington 700s, so for an out of the box rifle they are great and In my opinion, worth the money. But, if you are after a custom built rifle why not buy a surgeon or stiller or etc... to build from. Most people find this is the better option instead of spending $900.00 on the browning and throwing all of it away (except the trigger because you are essentially stuck with it) to build a custom rifle off the browning action.

So, if you are after the pinnacle of accuracy that a real custom rifle can provide (whether for hunting, tactical, or target shooting) spend your money on building something other than the browning. If you are looking for a good quality, good accuracy, hunting rifle, than the browning can definitely give you this.

 

[locomacdaddy]

Re: Why not Browning?

Thanks for the info guys. Does make sense to just start over. My biggest issue is the lack of stocks. I know there are a fair amount of choices but, I'm looking to put a McM A3 or A3-5 to a ABolt long action. Guess I need to check with McMillan to see if they can inlet tactical stocks for the Browning. Can you get an ABolt trigger to around 2pounds with the change in spring?

Thanks again for comments.

 

[Goodwood]

Re: Why not Browning?

Yes, you can get about two or two and a half pounds with the spring swap. Most of my A bolt triggers are set at about four pounds because that is where I get the best "feel" from the factory trigger. To me, the take-up feels better with about three and a half to four pounds, and I think I shoot the browning trigger better about one pound higher than a Remington or savage because of this.

 

[locomacdaddy]

Re: Why not Browning?

Thanks Woodyguy! May just start over...might have to send it off to the Utah Gun Exchange now that KSL is out of the picture.

 

[Goodwood]

Re: Why not Browning?

Yeah, no KSL has put a damper on operations for sure! I've got a buddy who has been trying to part with his AR-15, and you would figure that would be easy right now, but with the usual classifieds out of commission, he is still holding on to it.

I used to work for Browning in St. Louis, so I have a little soft spot for the A bolt. I don't know if it is the same for the X bolt as it came on scene after my time, but I hate to be the encouragement for folks selling off their Browning rifles.

 

[MikeeBooshay]

Re: Why not Browning?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Woodyguy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yes, you can get about two or two and a half pounds with the spring swap. Most of my A bolt triggers are set at about four pounds because that is where I get the best "feel" from the factory trigger. To me, the take-up feels better with about three and a half to four pounds, and I think I shoot the browning trigger better about one pound higher than a Remington or savage because of this. </div></div>

If you are careful, you can remove the stock trigger, and shorten the spring on it, a little bit at a time, and lighten up the stock pull on it, without having to replace it. I have gotten it down to 3 to 3 1/2 pounds without any adverse effects. The usual warnings about monkeying about with triggers does still apply, don't get carried away and for sure perform safety tests afterward. If it fails ONCE, replace the spring and start over.

I have a shotout 300WM, that I have been planning to do something with for several years now. Has never made it to the top of the "have to do this" pile. Soon though, maybe.

 

[Goodwood]

Re: Why not Browning?

This does work, but only to a point.

As Mikee Booshay said, be careful! If the spring gets to short it will not work properly! If you shorten it, do it a quarter of a coil at a time, and flatten the coil out with some sandpaper so it sits on the two trigger surfaces equally and cannot move around under recoil and trigger reset. If it moves around, you will get (at best) erratic trigger function, and at worst, a rifle that discharges when you don't want it to.

Don't be tempted to stretch out a spring that gets to short, throw it away, and start again. Or get a couple of new springs and try a few until you find one that gives the proper function with the trigger pull weight you are after. The Browning trigger can get pretty good, especially if you take some time (or have your gunsmith take some time) polishing up trigger and sear surfaces.

I have not had a Browning trigger get quite as good as a properly worked old-style Remington trigger, or some of the aftermarket stuff, without getting into some serious work. Even then, the adjustability of the Remington is hard to compete with when you don't have the same with the Browning. You end up going through a lot of trigger parts (at least I do) trying to get it just perfect.

Doing this amount of work on a trigger is just not worth it when you can get 95 percent of the same by just swapping out the spring.

 

[matchking]

Re: Why not Browning?

Lack of aftermarket parts are a big negative. I also don't think you can find a good gunsmith to rebarrel an A-bolt.

Also, the A-bolt has some very shitty parts in it that can break if you look at them wrong. I have never had a Rem safety lever break in half, but I have had to order one for an A-bolt. While many fine firearms have worn the Browning badge, I don't consider the A-bolt one of them.

 

[BigOhio]

Re: Why not Browning?

Everyone has their own experience. I have never had an A-Bolt safety break but had a stock Remington 700 safety lever break on me a couple of weeks ago.

 

[JJones75]

Re: Why not Browning?

I rebarreled my brother in laws 270 A-bolt to 280 Ackley , I lapped the bolt lugs by hand(did not take much at all) and recut the reciever face true to the bolt bore , ground the recoil parallel.
I installed a Hart barrel , bedded it into a Elk ridge laminated stock , I replaced the trigger with a Moyers and a rifle basics spring and was able to get a consistant and SAFE 2 pound trigger with no creep.

This gun now shoots consistently into a quarter at 300yds (with a big scope) and hand loaded 150 balistic tips over 62g H4831 in Nosler brass , and will shoot just about 2" that with factory federal 140g 280 ammo at 300

 

[Goodwood]

Re: Why not Browning?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matchking</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I also don't think you can find a good gunsmith to rebarrel an A-bolt.

Also, the A-bolt has some very shitty parts in it that can break if you look at them wrong. I have never had a Rem safety lever break in half, but I have had to order one for an A-bolt. While many fine firearms have worn the Browning badge, I don't consider the A-bolt one of them. </div></div>

Re-barrel of the A-Bolt is not that big of a deal that there aren't any "good gunsmiths" around to do the job. There just aren't many that consistently work on the Brownings like there are to work on Remingtons.

I would agree with Matchking about the quality of SOME of the A-Bolts. I think the quality of the A-Bolt II went down when compared to the A-Bolt. I don't know if I would say the quality of the A-Bolt was ever poor, even with the A-Bolt II in that grouping. Browning is a firearms manufacturer building a mechanical device. If they build enough of them, they are going to have some failures.

Generally, I think the Browning is competitive with everything in its class, especially if your plan is to take a gun out of the box, scope it, and hunt.

 

[fish30114]

Re: Why not Browning?

Well, the reasons cited above are some of the reasons that A-bolts are seldom worked on, another is this simple fact. When Browning assembles the A-bolt they put on the barrel with some hell for stout thread locker--think brutal epoxy. Most smiths I know of have to use some heat to unscrew a barrel, even despite that I know of at least 2 smiths that have warped an action when trying to get a barrel off of an A-bolt. These guys had worked on enough of em to forewarn their customers about this possibility before commencing work on these rifles, but nonetheless there ended up being a problem. Also a few internal parts--I'm not sure which, are made out of poor materials.
These two major issues is why not many folks work on, or recommend Brownings as the base actions for custom rifles.

I too like the features and styling of A-bolts but I doubt I'm ever gonna customize the one that I own, or start a new project with one of them as a basic action for it.

 

[Casey Simpson]

Re: Why not Browning?


Ask Chad Dixon, or send it to him.

 

[locomacdaddy]

Re: Why not Browning?

Well, I did send him (Chad Dixon) a PM to ask if he worked on ABolt actions and he replied by clicking the "removing himself from thread" button?????? WTF? Guess he doesn't do it or doesn't want to do it---either way, why not just tell me?

 

[Powder_Burns]

Re: Why not Browning?

Most gunsmiths won't work on Brownings because Brownings are 'the best there is'--and don't require smithing.

 

[texote]

yea I can't find a gunsmtih to work on them either

 

[dinc]

Everything mentioned above plus they are tough to bed. Plain and simple you are going to have to work harder to consistently bring them to a high level of accuracy. Is it worth it?

 

[texote]

Yea I dont think it is, but i have a brand new one lying around collection dust. maybe itll make a good truck gun

 

[MarinePMI]

Just an FYI, but Bob Green works on Brownings and does a great job. I have a rebarreled Browning Micro-Medallion he did for me in 17AH. Stunningly accurate and a well done, well fit barrel.

JMTCW...

 

[yote_slayer31]

some brownings (dont remember which model at the moment) have 32 tpi reciever threads which strip if you look at them wrong. Most Smiths dont like eating reciever costs

 

[texote]

thanks for the heads up, Ill give bob green a call