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Will my retarded DIY equipment idea actually work?

TheGerman

TheGerman

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    • Jan 25, 2010
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    the Westside
    If its stupid and it works, its no longer stupid.

    Question is, will it work?

    Problem I am facing is 99% of the land in southern Utah to shoot on is loose sand/packed sand/sand with rocks in it. See a pattern here?

    While this in itself isn't the end of the world, the problem is that after a few shots your bipod is an inch deep in the sand or has started digging itself a grave in the ground. Problem here isn't as much with the bipod height as it is with the repercussions of what happens with recoil management while your loaded bipod is working itself into the ground with each shot and it's only a matter of time depending on the type of sandy ground it is. Never a big issue for hunting or running drills as you are constantly shooting on new ground, but for practicing or shooting from a great practice spot where you have steel/targets set up on; its fucking obnoxious.

    I've tried shooting mats and other various things but over time the sand underneath just starts giving way around the pressure points of the bipod feet.

    So my high tech idea? Get some thicker plywood, make either a full length shooting mat size version or one thats only maybe 2 feet x 2 foot and attach a single 2x4 to one end on its side as kind of a lip to load the bipod feet against. I'm guessing the hard footprint of the plywood (or whatever board I'd use) would deter the bipod pressure points as well as being able to load the bipod against the 2x4.

    Question here is, would loading the bipod feet properly into the stationary 2x4 thats laying on its side, attached to the board deter anything with recoil due to the bipod recoiling off a hard surface? I'm guessing I'd need the 2x4 up front unless I just somehow textured the board, so that I could have something that would 'grab' the bipod feet as they would otherwise just slide on the smooth wood board.

    Anyone every tried anything like this? Holes in my plan?
     
    I see one potential drawback. Shouldn't be too hard to overcome though.
    The smooth surface of the plywood is going to act like a skid atop a set of ball bearings. Try loading the bipod and your gonna take off forward. You would have to make it long enough to at least get your chest and maybe even your hips down on it.
    Another thing, you really don't need a 2x4 to load against. 1x2 should be more than enough.
     
    We do something similar here at our range (which has a sandy area in front of each position that shooters have to shoot from). It's either a 1'x2' 3/4" piece of plywood laid in front of the shooting mat, or something similar, but with a 3/4"x3/4"x2' piece of wood attached to the plywood's forward edge. This allows the bi-pod to be loaded against the small lip that the wood creates. We keep some at the range, and some guys have their own (and attach a screen door/cabinet handle to one side for ease of picking up and carrying back to their vehicle). It looks weird, but it works.

    Some even make a full blown drawer like box with the lip on it, to raise the bipod up some (we have some pretty elevated/high angle long range targets). Visually it looks like a drawer flipped upside down, with a lip along the bottom back of the drawer (which now faces up). Again, door handle on the side for ease of movement.
     
    There is no reason it won't work. I agree the 1x2 is probably enough to load the bipod against. You won't get that much hop that it will come off of or jump the "stop strip", espacially with a CM. You may need to play with spikes to anchor the board or make it long enough to lay on. At that point, it's essentially a table top without legs.

    If you have a mat with the straps/pockets for bipod feet I wonder if slicing open the side and sliding in a flexible or roll up plastic cutting board under the pockets would be enough to distribute the load and keep the sand under the bipod from shifting? Then, no extra gear to drag out or forget.
     
    We tend to use the scope covers as bipod support when shoting on soft sand. Works realy well and unless you are using spikes on bipod feet you will not damage the scope cover

    P8030001.jpg
     
    Have you considered attaching a piece of synthetic turf to a thin board? Like the kind used for golfmats? That stuff is durable, foldable and creates plenty of drag to load into depending on your bipod feet. Something like this:

    https://express.google.com/u/0/prod...oyayyivmf,eid-dqdncagwvd&utm_campaign=8175035

    Screenshot_20180708-100749.png


    You could tie Paracord through the corners to your mat to keep it tethered from sliding under recoil or even stake it down into the ground.
     
    If it’s a spot where you regularly shoot from, why not get a sack of quick crete and pour a small pad with lip troweled into it. If it’s that sandy, you could dig out the area a couple inches deep and let the excavated edge be the form.
     
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    JWG284 said:
    If it’s a spot where you regularly shoot from, why not get a sack of quick crete and pour a small pad with lip troweled into it. If it’s that sandy, you could dig out the area a couple inches deep and let the excavated edge be the form.
    Click to expand...
    Now that's a GREAT idea! I'm gonna do that that at my range!
     
    For years, I carried a super sized Frisbee and set my bipod up on top of this inverted Frisbee. Solved this issue completely.

    Now, in Arizona, the desert ground is about the consistency of concrete; so I no longer need to pack the Frisbee around. Plus, at 72, nobody's ever gonna get me to crawl around on the ground anyway.

    If I had it to do again, all I'd change would be to paint the Captain America shield pattern on it, in subdued camo mode.

    Humor mode off... Arr, Arr....

    Greg
     
    • Like
    Reactions: 762libertarian
    TheGerman said:
    If its stupid and it works, its no longer stupid.

    Question is, will it work?

    Problem I am facing is 99% of the land in southern Utah to shoot on is loose sand/packed sand/sand with rocks in it. See a pattern here?

    While this in itself isn't the end of the world, the problem is that after a few shots your bipod is an inch deep in the sand or has started digging itself a grave in the ground. Problem here isn't as much with the bipod height as it is with the repercussions of what happens with recoil management while your loaded bipod is working itself into the ground with each shot and it's only a matter of time depending on the type of sandy ground it is. Never a big issue for hunting or running drills as you are constantly shooting on new ground, but for practicing or shooting from a great practice spot where you have steel/targets set up on; its fucking obnoxious.

    I've tried shooting mats and other various things but over time the sand underneath just starts giving way around the pressure points of the bipod feet.

    So my high tech idea? Get some thicker plywood, make either a full length shooting mat size version or one thats only maybe 2 feet x 2 foot and attach a single 2x4 to one end on its side as kind of a lip to load the bipod feet against. I'm guessing the hard footprint of the plywood (or whatever board I'd use) would deter the bipod pressure points as well as being able to load the bipod against the 2x4.

    Question here is, would loading the bipod feet properly into the stationary 2x4 thats laying on its side, attached to the board deter anything with recoil due to the bipod recoiling off a hard surface? I'm guessing I'd need the 2x4 up front unless I just somehow textured the board, so that I could have something that would 'grab' the bipod feet as they would otherwise just slide on the smooth wood board.

    Anyone every tried anything like this? Holes in my plan?
    Click to expand...
    I have had similar challenges. I have come up with two solutions, and use either one depending on the area I'm going to.

    Solution #1 - I went and got a remnant of carpet that was 4 ft wide and 8 ft long. I took a 2x4 that is 4 ft long and rolled it up in the carpet at one end and stapled the fuck out of it and some small nails with washers under them for good measure. When I'm done shooting, I just roll up the carpet on the 2x4 and put it in the back of the truck.

    Solution #2 - I got a 3ft x 2ft piece of matting for a horse stall. They sell them here at the Tractor Supply Store. One side is smooth, and the other side has small ridges to give the horses more grip. I took 5"x 1/4" bolts and put them through at each corner and used washers on both sides. The ribbed side is up. I then sharpend the bolts. So I just push the bolts into the ground like spikes to keep the mat in place, and the ribbed surface is on top to give a grippy surface for the bipod. You wouldn't have to use bolts, You could just use big ass spikes if they are available in your area, I just used what I had on hand.
     
    Last edited by a moderator:
    Mr.BR said:
    We tend to use the scope covers as bipod support when shoting on soft sand. Works realy well and unless you are using spikes on bipod feet you will not damage the scope cover

    P8030001.jpg
    Click to expand...
    are those the TAB Gear covers?
     
    I have shot in southern Utah numerous times and understand what you are talking about. We usually lay a tarp down that extends a couple feet forward of my mat. I like the tarp as I can eject rounds, and if laying in sand, the tarp tend to roll all of the brass back to me.

    I’ve also used one of the flexible baseball bases, as they have a grid on the bottom and tend to stay were you put them.
     
    Subwrx300 said:
    Have you considered attaching a piece of synthetic turf to a thin board? Like the kind used for golfmats? That stuff is durable, foldable and creates plenty of drag to load into depending on your bipod feet. Something like this:

    https://express.google.com/u/0/prod...oyayyivmf,eid-dqdncagwvd&utm_campaign=8175035

    View attachment 6920212

    You could tie Paracord through the corners to your mat to keep it tethered from sliding under recoil or even stake it down into the ground.
    Click to expand...

    I’d recommend this as a starting point if using the method above. Drill two holes at 3 & 9 o’clock positions and make loops w/ 550 cord. Using the loops secure w/ tent pegs in sand.

    If you pour a pad using Quickcrete, I’d pour it at least 12” X 12” X 4” deep. I little mesh or re-bar wouldn’t hurt & it’ll last a long time. You could broom finish it & that should be sufficient to load your bipod. Also, if pouring a pad you can make your own lip at the front.

    ***With this option your not limited to a square shape either. You can pour a little bigger pad in the shape of a fan so you can shoot 180* should you feel the need.
     
    Last edited:
    For Ftr shooting with bipod, it is common to use a heavy mat or board to address this situation. Many styles as most are homemade. I use 3/4" plywood with carpet glued on top. For stability a piece of angle iron is on the bottom of each end, this rail runs parallel to the direction of the barrel and prevents rocking vs if only the flat board was laid on an uneven surface. For extremely porus surface such as sand, instead of steel rail use a wider rail such as 1/2" board to "float" on the sand.
     
    The door mat and a piece of 2x4 with holes drilled in it to take stakes pounded into the ground gives you a surface you won't sink into, and a stop for you to put forward tension on the bipod.
     
    Some good ideas in this thread , I’ve seen FTR guys drag a 24 inch by 10 inch plank of steel with carpet
    glued to the top , up to the firing line before ! I’ve had that problem , any more than 3 or so shots and the
    legs are drilling in . A buddy has some 1 x 1 sections of pine sewn into a shooting mat , and that worked
    fine on the soft stuff . I’ve used pack covers , towels , folded jackets etc . If it works it ain’t stupid .
     
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    so going off of what you were saying, why not just use a 2x6 x however long you want it. take 1" dowel rods cut to 1" in the back and 2" in the front. since every shot your bipod sinks in the sand, now the dowel rods will sink and provide a stable platform. With the different lengths of dowel rods, this will give it a slight angle back to you with a more stable preload. maybe not, but something to think about.
     
    In the snow I have used a full sized paper IPSC in a garbage bag.

    Frisbee is the winner, I’ve seen that work.

    FWIW - as a fellow field shooter, I believe the ski feet are substantially better that any form of post or spike. YMMV
     
    TacticalDillhole said:
    are those the TAB Gear covers?
    Click to expand...
    No idea just pasted a random pic, i myself use a custom made cover with tailored bottom part that also covers magazine and trigger ,but generaly looks similar and reading this above i am suprised what people are willing to bring to the range!.

    Scope cover is already on the rifle , its padded and when used under bipod on soft sand it will work similar to a mat.
     
    TheGerman said:
    If its stupid and it works, its no longer stupid.

    Question is, will it work?

    Problem I am facing is 99% of the land in southern Utah to shoot on is loose sand/packed sand/sand with rocks in it. See a pattern here?

    While this in itself isn't the end of the world, the problem is that after a few shots your bipod is an inch deep in the sand or has started digging itself a grave in the ground. Problem here isn't as much with the bipod height as it is with the repercussions of what happens with recoil management while your loaded bipod is working itself into the ground with each shot and it's only a matter of time depending on the type of sandy ground it is. Never a big issue for hunting or running drills as you are constantly shooting on new ground, but for practicing or shooting from a great practice spot where you have steel/targets set up on; its fucking obnoxious.

    I've tried shooting mats and other various things but over time the sand underneath just starts giving way around the pressure points of the bipod feet.

    So my high tech idea? Get some thicker plywood, make either a full length shooting mat size version or one thats only maybe 2 feet x 2 foot and attach a single 2x4 to one end on its side as kind of a lip to load the bipod feet against. I'm guessing the hard footprint of the plywood (or whatever board I'd use) would deter the bipod pressure points as well as being able to load the bipod against the 2x4.

    Question here is, would loading the bipod feet properly into the stationary 2x4 thats laying on its side, attached to the board deter anything with recoil due to the bipod recoiling off a hard surface? I'm guessing I'd need the 2x4 up front unless I just somehow textured the board, so that I could have something that would 'grab' the bipod feet as they would otherwise just slide on the smooth wood board.

    Anyone every tried anything like this? Holes in my plan?
    Click to expand...

    Maybe I am misunderstanding you but have you looked at the crosstac mat with bipod loading lip?
     
    Nik H said:
    Just buy the crosstac
    Click to expand...

    So sell me on this.

    I have the TAB mat everyone and their grandmother has and its too thin/flimsy to deter the pressure from the loaded bipod feet on a Harris from eventually working their way into the sand over time. Albeit much slower than without the mat, but it still moves from the recoil/sand.

    How thick/sturdy is the Crosstac? What is it putting between the gun and the ground?

    eta - Found a video. So it's foam and cordura. Ok. I'm assuming you have one? From my issue above, how likely is it this solves my problem 100%?
     
    Last edited:
    I think the crosstac will solve your problem. If needed in deep soft sand, you could bring along one of these to put underneath and increase the rigidity

    https://www.sunandski.com/p/3468025...HpB7tpG-5Fv9oZCdWY4QiUghGQv5E7dxoCAS0QAvD_BwE

    But I don't think you'll need to. The crosstac is so cush, I'm wondering what I did before I had one. Those little blue roll up sleds have a million uses too. Be a lot easier to transport than wood.
     
    I’m not familiar with the TAB gear mat, so you may need to adjust the placement to get your mat to still fold, but here’s what I did with a standard midway mat:

    Take your existing mat, buy a grommet kit. (Grommets are the metal eyelets commonly seen on tarps and banners)

    Install grommets about 6” left and right of where your bipod legs make contact with the mat.

    Buy a 3/4” or larger wooden dowel rod, or aluminum bar/tube stock. Drill both ends with a through hole. Secure the dowel to the grommets with paracord or whatever.

    Now you can load your bipod against the dowel, and your body weight acts as the counterweight as opposed to the rifle eating into the sand.

    With this solution the mat can still be rolled up, and doesn’t involve laying concrete, golf training supplies, a fabrication shop or carpentry skills.

    As others mentioned, the door mat is a good failsafe.
     
    TheGerman said:
    So sell me on this.

    I have the TAB mat everyone and their grandmother has and its too thin/flimsy to deter the pressure from the loaded bipod feet on a Harris from eventually working their way into the sand over time. Albeit much slower than without the mat, but it still moves from the recoil/sand.

    How thick/sturdy is the Crosstac? What is it putting between the gun and the ground?

    eta - Found a video. So it's foam and cordura. Ok. I'm assuming you have one? From my issue above, how likely is it this solves my problem 100%?
    Click to expand...

    I think it is the best mat out there. I have gone to a couple of classes where you spend all day in the prone position and the comfort is second to none. It is way thicker than most mats and due to the construction, it holds its shape.

    The rail just works. I can load the bipod properly regardless of what the mat is laying on. You have the thickness of the mat always providing a solid surface and the rail always provides the stop to take the load on the bipod.

    Quite frankly, it is genius. The only down side is that it is $$$ and it isn't all that portable. I do have a second mat that is a roll up type if I need to haul it around. However, if I am shooting in one spot for a while, I always take the crosstac.
     
    TheGerman said:
    So sell me on this.

    I have the TAB mat everyone and their grandmother has and its too thin/flimsy to deter the pressure from the loaded bipod feet on a Harris from eventually working their way into the sand over time. Albeit much slower than without the mat, but it still moves from the recoil/sand.

    How thick/sturdy is the Crosstac? What is it putting between the gun and the ground?

    eta - Found a video. So it's foam and cordura. Ok. I'm assuming you have one? From my issue above, how likely is it this solves my problem 100%?
    Click to expand...
    It’s so good I’ve used it as a sleeping pad.
     
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    A friend of mine who shoots F-TR with a Flexpod uses a piece of thick rubber mat with a soft squishy fatigue mat on top of it. The Flexpod is designed to be loaded, works great for him.
     
    Subwrx300 said:
    @TheGerman did you ever build/buy something based on above? How did it work out?
    Click to expand...

    So I bought a Crosstac mat. Overall, I like it and its built extremely well. The only downside to it for my use is that if you don't have a large flat area to use it on, or if the ground you are putting it on is uneven with pockets of missing ground, the mat has a bit of give in it as far as loading it onto the front ridge meant for your bipod and then getting some side to side play.

    Not really the mat's fault, but its something that I noticed right off, actually spoke to the designer about (really nice guy BTW) and then identified what was causing the issue. Again not the mat's fault, but it also isn't a 100% fix as yes, it keeps me from loading the bipod and sinking the legs or it not grabbing and pushing forward but then now also introduces lateral movement because the ground I'm on doesn't give the footprint of the mat a large enough footprint to settle on.

    I was actually going to try a rubber mat or fake grass and put tent stakes on the corners next. :D
     
    Damnit. This thread has likely costed me another $200. I had Tony sew a bipod rail into my TAB mat, and it works quite well, but Tony never designed the mat to do that. As a result, if you use the bipod rail you're damn near having your dick in the dirt hanging off the back of the mat and you miss the padding completely. No big deal in grassy fields and groomed spots, pretty messy otherwise.

    This also gives me an idea for a hellish stage at the next PRS Club match.......
     
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