Advanced Marksmanship Your dryfire experience

[TimK]

I got serious about dryfire a few months ago and learn something new every time I get behind the rifles. And that is sort-of the point of my post. What works one day sometimes works the next, but sometimes not. I did some DF on Saturday afternoon and had it dialed. I took some little notes on various physical cues as I always do and put it away. It's Monday evening and I just got up from another session. Things were considerably different than they were Saturday. I was pretty easily able to try a few different things with my firing hand and get it back, but it got me wondering if this situation is unique to me or if some of you more experienced shooters have the same issue.

It does seem like I'm narrowing down the aspects of my position that always work. Should I expect to ever get to the point where my position doesn't change in subtle ways?

 

[rotoflex]

Re: Your dryfire experience

When you dry fire are you using a dummy round? I was told never dry fire a weapon.

 

[Redmanss]

Re: Your dryfire experience

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tim K</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It does seem like I'm narrowing down the aspects of my position that always work. Should I expect to ever get to the point where my position doesn't change in subtle ways?</div></div>
Yes... and no...

Keep in mind that unless you're always shooting on the same groomed rectangular ranges, there will always be little differences with your positions. This will also vary depending on your clothing, angle/range you're shooting at, how high your bipod is set, etc. Any time you change anything about your equipment or environment, it can have an effect on your position requiring these little changes you speak of.

The real key is to be able to adjust to those different situations and still apply controlled pressure to the trigger causing the weapon to fire without disturbing the relationship of the sights on the target. Dry firing helps trigger control more than anything, especially when you're only practicing prone. The position work comes more from getting off your belly or from dry firing at a longer distance training target, such as a reduced targets at about 25-50yds or so. Think multiples forcing you to shift...

If you're having problems with your prone or other positions, then maybe you should expand on what little changes you're speaking of.

As for using a dummy round/snap caps, I always recommend them because while the risk of damaging your firing pin is very low, it can still happen. Me personally I always liked using dummy rounds for practicing bolt manipulation against normal feeding resistance, and also practicing rapid hand feeding/reloading (non-DBM M40A1).

 

[vman]

Re: Your dryfire experience

I enjoy putting the snap caps in from time to time... its just a shame I dont have any really large hallways in my house so that I could at least set up a small target to observe

 

[sled_mack]

Re: Your dryfire experience

vman,

Check out this thread for the IOTA. It's an amazing little piece of gear.

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2170458&gonew=1#UNREAD

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: Your dryfire experience

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Redmanss</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tim K</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It does seem like I'm narrowing down the aspects of my position that always work. Should I expect to ever get to the point where my position doesn't change in subtle ways?</div></div>
Yes... and no...

Keep in mind that unless you're always shooting on the same groomed rectangular ranges, there will always be little differences with your positions. This will also vary depending on your clothing, angle/range you're shooting at, how high your bipod is set, etc. Any time you change anything about your equipment or environment, it can have an effect on your position requiring these little changes you speak of.

The real key is to be able to adjust to those different situations and still apply controlled pressure to the trigger causing the weapon to fire without disturbing the relationship of the sights on the target. Dry firing helps trigger control more than anything, especially when you're only practicing prone. The position work comes more from getting off your belly or from dry firing at a longer distance training target, such as a reduced targets at about 25-50yds or so. Think multiples forcing you to shift...

If you're having problems with your prone or other positions, then maybe you should expand on what little changes you're speaking of.

As for using a dummy round/snap caps, I always recommend them because while the risk of damaging your firing pin is very low, it can still happen. Me personally I always liked using dummy rounds for practicing bolt manipulation against normal feeding resistance, and also practicing rapid hand feeding/reloading (non-DBM M40A1).</div></div>

This is a very good appraisal, I think, for the usefulness of dry firing. I'm betting, Redmanss is a brilliant shooter.

 

[TimK]

Re: Your dryfire experience

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Redmanss</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
If you're having problems with your prone or other positions, then maybe you should expand on what little changes you're speaking of.

</div></div>

To date I only shoot prone. The changes I have to make are all in the grip of my right hand and the actual trigger manipulation. The things that change from one day to the next are pretty subtle like the exact position of my finger on the trigger or the placement of my thumb. I'm suspicious that the changes occur because something else in my position has changed, something I'm not aware of.

It happens in my living room to a limited extent and outdoors, where shooting positions can be far from flat, to a greater extent. Actually, when it changes because I'm shooting from some lumpy spot that's angled two directions from the target, it makes sense to me.

 

[duaneb]

Re: Your dryfire experience

Here is something you may want to consider. When you practice with live fire use some dummy rounds (old primer, no power, exactly like what you are shooting) mix them into the box and this will show you what you are doing wrong. I favor this because when you know the rifle isn't going to go off you tend to be able to hold better and make fewer mistakes. Keep in mind you shouldn't know which round is being put into your rifle (live vs. dummy).

 

[armymedic.2]

Re: Your dryfire experience

+1 Duane

 

[Redmanss]

Re: Your dryfire experience

Tim: What rifle/stock are you using?

Your grip should remain the same when you're in the prone, and these little changes you're experiencing just requires a bit more attention to detail on it. Keep up the dry firing and also incorporate getting all the way into position, coming all the way out, and getting back in. Make yourself a checklist of what differences you're experiencing, and go through it each time to make sure you're doing everything the same/correct way. In case you didn't know, the correct way is the way you shoot best...

Your prone position should be pretty much the same all the time until you start shooting off the far slope of a berm where you cannot get your elbows on the ground. Like I said earlier while you'll have small changes all the time, the basics of your position will remain identical. Also, your position shouldn't be effecting your grip in the manner you speak of unless you're changing the position of your elbows in a significant way.

Duaneb has an excellent idea using dummy rounds with dry fire, but in my experience that more applies when you have improper trigger control and you're trying to identify a flinch/jerk/buck. Your problem as you describe it more relates to your grip.

Sterling: You're too kind, and thank you. I'm a far better coach than shooter, but that comes from a couple years working with recruits at Parris Island. Working there is where I really learned marksmanship and instruction. Getting a 17y/o city girl know-it-all to hit at 500yds with an M16A2 was a much bigger challenge than my getting my snipers or myself to hit at the grand with an M40A1.