Criterion 223 Remington match chamber

EODsniper

EODsniper

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Nov 28, 2020
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#1
Looking at a criterion prefit shouldered barrel for a Zermatt action chambered in 223 Remington match with a 1:7 twist. It will be fed from mdt .223 aics mags. My question is will this chamber shoot 69gr/
77gr SMK loaded at 2.26” just fine with the .090” freebore? I also intend to shoot heavier reloads which is why I am leaning towards the match chamber vs the Wylde. Anyone have experience with this?
 
#3
I have had two criterion 223 rem match chamber barrels

My COAL's with bullet jammed for my new one are.

berger 75vld 2.473
berger 80vld 2.464


In my old barrel I have shot probably a dozen different bullets from 69 to 80 and have had good
accuracy.

77 Sierra MK bullets are designed for a AR15 magazine there are way better bullets for a
bolt action rifle.
 
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#4
whatsupdoc said:
I have had two criterion 223 rem match chamber barrels

My COAL's with bullet jammed for my new one are.

berger 75vld 2.473
berger 80vld 2.464


In my old barrel I have shot probably a dozen different bullets from 69 to 80 and have had good
accuracy.

77 Sierra MK bullets are designed for a AR15 magazine there are way better bullets for a
bolt action rifle.
Click to expand...
Yeah I get that there’s better but I have a large stockpile of 77gr so was just curious
 
#7
I’ve been getting mine dialed in and it eat the 73gr GMM like a champ while throwing rounds through it before going to deep into load development with a fresh barrel. I’ve even run hornady 55 fmj’s through it with pretty good results considering the jump they are doing.

The couple powder charges I’ve run through it with 75 ELD-M’s have been pretty solid, not exactly to my standards (I’m used to the easy button 6BR stuff) but the barrel had less then 100 rounds through it at that point.
 
#8
King_beardsly said:
I’ve been getting mine dialed in and it eat the 73gr GMM like a champ while throwing rounds through it before going to deep into load development with a fresh barrel. I’ve even run hornady 55 fmj’s through it with pretty good results considering the jump they are doing.

The couple powder charges I’ve run through it with 75 ELD-M’s have been pretty solid, not exactly to my standards (I’m used to the easy button 6BR stuff) but the barrel had less then 100 rounds through it at that point.
Click to expand...

That’s good to hear. My main concern was basically getting a barrel that wouldn’t allow me to use factory ammo but from the sounds of it there is no issue whatsoever. The only deciding factor is that having criterion make a Wylde chambered barrel is a 18 week lead time and northland has the 223 rem match in stock. I have a Krieger 6arc barrel in another bolt gun and 220 rounds is where it finally shrank groups and sped up about 60-75 fps. Everything has still been less than an inch but now we are getting cloverleaf groups. Time to start the handloads.
 
#9
Northland is a great company to deal with and they keep a good variety of stuff on the shelf. I wanted a bull contour in 24” but didn’t want the lead time, so I called up northland and had a 26” to my door in under a week.
 
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#16
King_beardsly said:
I’ve been getting mine dialed in and it eat the 73gr GMM like a champ while throwing rounds through it before going to deep into load development with a fresh barrel. I’ve even run hornady 55 fmj’s through it with pretty good results considering the jump they are doing.

The couple powder charges I’ve run through it with 75 ELD-M’s have been pretty solid, not exactly to my standards (I’m used to the easy button 6BR stuff) but the barrel had less then 100 rounds through it at that point.
Click to expand...

What were the results you were getting with the 75 eldms? The price seems too good to be true on those. My biggest challenge is finding a bullet to go with before buying in bulk. Everything will be over varget since I have a very large amount of that and it already shoots great in my 6arc. So far I’ve narrowed it down to
75gr Berger vld
75gr Hornady eldm
77gr Sierra matchkings
77gr Hornady aeromatch
80gr Sierra matchkings
 
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#18
EODsniper said:
What were the results you were getting with the 75 eldms? The price seems too good to be true on those. My biggest challenge is finding a bullet to go with before buying in bulk. Everything will be over varget since I have a very large amount of that and it already shoots great in my 6arc. So far I’ve narrowed it down to
75gr Berger vld
75gr Hornady eldm
77gr Sierra matchkings
77gr Hornady aeromatch
80gr Sierra matchkings
Click to expand...
I’ve been able to get .5” groups if do my part with the ELD-M’s but most have been like .7” or smaller. I haven’t really worked up a load since I just hit 150ish rounds down the barrel, so I’m thinking it’ll shirk a bit more once I get them dialed in better.
 
#19
When the SMK 80s were unobtainable a few years ago I started shooting 80.5s. I'll never go back to the 80s.
Also the Berger 80VLDs when jammed I found to be very accurate.
 
#21
EODsniper said:
Are you talking about the Berger fullbore? I’ve heard that the vlds are nitpicky about seating depth.
Click to expand...
Yes, the 80.5 are the fullbore. I found them easy to tune.
Like I said about the VLD.. I believe I started at touch and worked my way in. I can lookup the recipe later if you like.
 
#22
TommyD11730 said:
Yes, the 80.5 are the fullbore. I found them easy to tune.
Like I said about the VLD.. I believe I started at touch and worked my way in. I can lookup the recipe later if you like.
Click to expand...

I am looking up the difference between the hybrid target, fullbore and vld from Berger.
I’m always down to see a recipe to tune in my starting point.
 
#23
EODsniper said:
I am looking up the difference between the hybrid target, fullbore and vld from Berger.
I’m always down to see a recipe to tune in my starting point.
Click to expand...
80.5 Bergers, Lapua Brass CCI 400,
CBTO 1.891" ( Measured with SAC comparitor) or 2.472" COAL. 23.70G VARGET , 2820 FPS on a 28" barrel.

The 80VLDS (Berger) 24.92 Varget at 1.907" CBTO or "touch plus .009"". 2960FPS.

YMMV
 
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#25
TommyD11730 said:
80.5 Bergers, Lapua Brass CCI 400,
CBTO 1.891" ( Measured with SAC comparitor) or 2.472" COAL. 23.70G VARGET , 2820 FPS on a 28" barrel.

The 80VLDS (Berger) 24.92 Varget at 1.907" CBTO or "touch plus .009"". 2960FPS.

YMMV
Click to expand...

Do you see any benefit using the 85.5 hybrids over the 80.5 fullbore?
Both show stability over 1.5 on the AB app over 2500fps
 
#27
TommyD11730 said:
80.5 Bergers, Lapua Brass CCI 400,
CBTO 1.891" ( Measured with SAC comparitor) or 2.472" COAL. 23.70G VARGET , 2820 FPS on a 28" barrel.

The 80VLDS (Berger) 24.92 Varget at 1.907" CBTO or "touch plus .009"". 2960FPS.

YMMV
Click to expand...
So finally got my rifle and was measuring things up with the Berger 85.5 hybrids
I am touching lands at 1.995 but the most I can get into my mdt mag is 1.935. Is .060 too much jump to even bother with and should I try a different bullet before loading up a bunch. I’ve never done more than .020 with my 6 arc.
I’m assuming it should be fine since most ARs with a wylde chamber and match ammo are making a good size jump.
 
#29
EODsniper said:
So finally got my rifle and was measuring things up with the Berger 85.5 hybrids
I am touching lands at 1.995 but the most I can get into my mdt mag is 1.935. Is .060 too much jump to even bother with and should I try a different bullet before loading up a bunch. I’ve never done more than .020 with my 6 arc.
I’m assuming it should be fine since most ARs with a wylde chamber and match ammo are making a good size jump.
Click to expand...
Every Berger hybrid I have loaded likes jumping .060-.080 including the 85.5
 
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#30
EODsniper said:
Looking at a criterion prefit shouldered barrel for a Zermatt action chambered in 223 Remington match with a 1:7 twist. It will be fed from mdt .223 aics mags. My question is will this chamber shoot 69gr/
77gr SMK loaded at 2.26” just fine with the .090” freebore? I also intend to shoot heavier reloads which is why I am leaning towards the match chamber vs the Wylde. Anyone have experience with this?
Click to expand...
No freebore is way to long. I spent all kinds of time with that bullshit chamber. If you are single loading 90 grain bullets its ok but thats about it
 
#31
reelserious said:
No freebore is way to long. I spent all kinds of time with that bullshit chamber. If you are single loading 90 grain bullets its ok but thats about it
Click to expand...
You didn’t like their match chamber? I’ve been playing around with it and it’s been pretty good to me thus far but then again I’m running stuff in the 2.46-2.48 range.

I will say one barrel didn’t like the 75 ELD-M’s but loved the 73 OTM in GMM, that one’s currently headed back for a little checkup. Now the other barrel I’m running seems to enjoy pretty much everything I’ve feed it thus far in the process.
 
Last edited:
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#33
I started off shooting the Hornady 88 grain bullets and they shoot best for me almost touching rifling so to do that the bullet is barely in the case and you have to use extreme care seating it to not get any runout as only about half the neck is holding the bullet. With super meticulous hand loads I was getting only 3/4 moa accuracy.

I was making hits on 12 inch plates at 1000 yards and it was very nice that the barrel never got hot but I took that barrel off and its in the closet now with other barrels i am not using. I waited 8 months for that barrel also as it was nitrided by criterion. BTW it was 1-6.5 twist
 
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#34
reelserious said:
I started off shooting the Hornady 88 grain bullets and they shoot best for me almost touching rifling so to do that the bullet is barely in the case and you have to use extreme care seating it to not get any runout as only about half the neck is holding the bullet. With super meticulous hand loads I was getting only 3/4 moa accuracy.

I was making hits on 12 inch plates at 1000 yards and it was very nice that the barrel never got hot but I took that barrel off and its in the closet now with other barrels i am not using. I waited 8 months for that barrel also as it was nitrided by criterion. BTW it was 1-6.5 twist
Click to expand...
After measuring everything I kind of wish I went with the wylde chamber instead. There was some miscommunication between me and the person that pushed me towards the match chamber.
 
#36
EODsniper said:
After measuring everything I kind of wish I went with the wylde chamber instead. There was some miscommunication between me and the person that pushed me towards the match chamber.
Click to expand...
bingo

the guy at Northland shooting supply (James) talked me into that chamber also. Its way too long for me. I wanted a repeater and not a single shot and the mag length loads were another problem also.
 
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#37
Le
reelserious said:
bingo

the guy at Northland shooting supply (James) talked me into that chamber also. It’s way too long for me. I wanted a repeater and not a single shot and the mag length loads were another proiblem also.
Click to expand...
Lessons learned. Unfortunately this barrel has been profiled for an AEM5 so it was quite the process. I’ll find a combo of some sort to make it work.
 
#39
I was able to actually shoot slow groups today and pull my target for measurements and I’ll say the match chamber with 80SMK’s definitely impressed me and even the 75ELD-M did pretty good. I’ll have to load some more to confirm the groups but for roughly 100 rounds through the tube it’s a strong start and yes the first group flyer was all me because I got overly excited.

image_cropper_DC7B30BC-5DDA-4DB8-9A21-6464064DCD69-55171-000016575B2262BE.jpeg
image_cropper_573295C0-E804-4EA3-A6C0-B65B0C63C63B-55171-00001658064F6FF7.jpegimage_cropper_FCE90AB4-317F-4EBA-9FD5-21AA685550E5-55171-00001658915468B3.jpegimage_cropper_F2D0BADD-D9D3-4E84-8C27-9B9D371B7E4C-55171-00001659139FC0A8.jpegimage_cropper_74D15ED9-5667-40B3-A314-DE88357CF7FE-55171-000016597EE8ABD8.jpegimage_cropper_61DB6BC6-373F-4B89-AA4C-ABBCAF0A02D2-55171-0000165A013DBEC7.jpeg
 
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#40
King_beardsly said:
I was able to actually shoot slow groups today and pull my target for measurements and I’ll say the match chamber with 80SMK’s definitely impressed me and even the 75ELD-M did pretty good. I’ll have to load some more to confirm the groups but for roughly 100 rounds through the tube it’s a strong start and yes the first group flyer was all me because I got overly excited.

View attachment 8743997
View attachment 8743998View attachment 8743999View attachment 8744000View attachment 8744001View attachment 8744002
Click to expand...
Great shooting. What’s the load and measurement? Mag fed?
 
#41
EODsniper said:
Great shooting. What’s the load and measurement? Mag fed?
Click to expand...
It’s a 80SMK over Staball match, CCI450 in Starline 223 brass, BTO is 2.46 and its mag feed after I opened up some accurate mags. I need to actually look at the powder charges since the weights written above the targets isn’t correct since I sorta mixed up the loads and shot them out of order, but they all will work just need to see which had the smallest SD/ES.

The 75ELD-M is what shot best out of the barrel I was having trouble with and is currently headed to see the boys at criterion for a little checkup. That being said, I’d still run that for PRS if needed maybe play around with it a little more to see if I can tighten it up.
 
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#42
King_beardsly said:
It’s a 80SMK over Staball match, CCI450 in Starline 223 brass, BTO is 2.46 and its mag feed after I opened up some accurate mags. I need to actually look at the powder charges since the weights written above the targets isn’t correct since I sorta mixed up the loads and shot them out of order, but they all will work just need to see which had the smallest SD/ES.

The 75ELD-M is what shot best out of the barrel I was having trouble with and is currently headed to see the boys at criterion for a little checkup. That being said, I’d
Click to expand...
 
#43
So I took my rifle out today just using mk262 77gr and it shot awesome with the rem match chamber and those are jumping something close to .100. My goal was to have a fun bolt gun to use with my AEM5 can and that was met. Next will be testing my Berger 85.5 loads
 
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#44
EODsniper said:
So I took my rifle out today just using mk262 77gr and it shot awesome with the rem match chamber and those are jumping something close to .100. My goal was to have a fun bolt gun to use with my AEM5 can and that was met. Next will be testing my Berger 85.5 loads
Click to expand...
I tried some 73GMM out of the new barrel this afternoon and it shot pretty fantastic, not handload good but not terribly far off the ELD-M’s
 
#46
I've got a 233 wylde that loves 75eldm/h4895, and 77smk/tac(650 loaded). I use mdt(plastic)and accurate 223(steel), both modded for oal. Pretty sure with a 20thou jump with 75 eldm, I've got enough room left to reach the .090 match freebore( only .025-.030 diff between wylde and "match" freebore) and still fit in modded mag. You guys that have oal/mag issue, have you tried modding the mags?
 
#47
6brshooter said:
I've got a 233 wylde that loves 75eldm/h4895, and 77smk/tac(650 loaded). I use mdt(plastic)and accurate 223(steel), both modded for oal. Pretty sure with a 20thou jump with 75 eldm, I've got enough room left to reach the .090 match freebore( only .025-.030 diff between wylde and "match" freebore) and still fit in modded mag. You guys that have oal/mag issue, have you tried modding the mags?
Click to expand...
What’s the way to mod them? I can actually load the 77gr smk closer to the lands even with the .090 freebore just due to the bullet design. The Berger 85.5s are just super long and pointy
 
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