Self-proclaimed Pit Masters of SH- I've got some questions

[diverdon]

Bumping the thread as I've run into another question- this one specific to those who have experience using charcoal barrel smokers like the Weber Smokey Mountain that I have. Here's a quick stock photo for reference...

View attachment 8730912

So onto my question- for those unfamiliar with this particular model, it has 3 dampers at the bottom (and one on the lid) used to control airflow/temperature. The 'quirk' I'm finding though is that the grate which the coals sit on is actually placed low enough that it dissects the area where the damper is. The issue this is causing me is when I'm doing larger cuts of meat/longer smokes I'm going through a lot of charcoal and the ash that accumulates beneath the grate actually rises to the point where the bottom two holes of that damper (so 6 holes total) actually end up being "clogged" and out of commission due to this ash.

As an example, I just finished a ~10 lb pork butt which took a bit under 20 hours with going 225º the first 12-13 hours & bumping it up to 250-275º for the last part (trying to get it done to time) and that amounted to around 30lbs of Kingsford charcoal. Had I used Royal Oak charcoal, I'd imagine that I would have used as much if not more since it seems to burn hotter & faster than the Kingsford. When I screw with the dampers and see a chunk if not most of the holes covered by ash I'd have to pressure this is reducing my abilities to control the O2 coming in and thusly my ability to control temperature at the end of my smokes.

So the TL/DR- for long smokes using a charcoal barrel smoker, what's the "trick" (or any tips) on controlling the ash buildup to prevent this? I thought about getting something like a wet/dry vac to suck up the ash when it's getting to a certain height but as many here will know- that ash isn't necessarily cold, especially in the middle of a smoke and I have to believe sucking it into a wet/dry vac is a surefire way to either (a) ruin it (b) cause a fire or (c) both. But I'm completely at a loss of how to handle this particular issue.

I've got a few smokes under my belt since I started this thread- a number of Boston Butts, ribs, hams & chickens and I'd like to tackle a big ol' brisket this summer but I'm already nipping at the heels of the limits with the ash build up and the brisket will likely take even longer than the pork butt and I don't know how to stay on top of the ash and don't want to find myself with smothered coals, unusable dampers, and a $100+ slab of brisket that isn't fully cooked with an audience waiting for me to know how to 'fix' it.

Any thoughts/tips on this rather... specific situation?

-LD

Definitely not a pit master and my smoker is very different from yours.

Still a couple things I'll toss out there. Early in longer cooks I'll use dry firewood to supplement the charcoal. Usually wild cherry but sometimes apple or Birch. Second, I find kingsford ok for grilling, but I'm not fond of the smoke.

 

[LuckyDuck]

Definitely not a pit master and my smoker is very different from yours.

Still a couple things I'll toss out there. Early in longer cooks I'll use dry firewood to supplement the charcoal. Usually wild cherry but sometimes apple or Birch. Second, I find kingsford ok for grilling, but I'm not fond of the smoke.

Appreciate you sharing that.

Thus far I've only played with the blue label Kingsford (red label being the match light which seems to impart a lighter fluid taste) and Royal Oak. As I mentioned, the Royal Oak (think big hunks of charred wood) has seemed to burn hotter & faster but the Kingsford seems to burn cooler & longer (which is why I've been using it for my longer smokes). Interesting suggestion on firewood... I wonder how that'd work out in barrel smoker & whether it'd impart other variables like creosote or potential carcinogens.

I know my question is oddly specific but I have to believe that I'm far from the first one to go down this path and run into this particular situation.

-LD

 

[ColbyLang]

Why not use lump charcoal instead of briquettes? Longer burn rate at those temps and less ash.

 

[mi650]

Appreciate you sharing that.

Thus far I've only played with the blue label Kingsford (red label being the match light which seems to impart a lighter fluid taste) and Royal Oak. As I mentioned, the Royal Oak (think big hunks of charred wood) has seemed to burn hotter & faster but the Kingsford seems to burn cooler & longer (which is why I've been using it for my longer smokes). Interesting suggestion on firewood... I wonder how that'd work out in barrel smoker & whether it'd impart other variables like creosote or potential carcinogens.

I know my question is oddly specific but I have to believe that I'm far from the first one to go down this path and run into this particular situation.

-LD

I think I've found your problem.

I have the 18.5 WSM and my only issue is I wish I'd gotten the 21. But then, I've never used briquettes in it, either.

 

[kthomas]

Bumping the thread as I've run into another question- this one specific to those who have experience using charcoal barrel smokers like the Weber Smokey Mountain that I have. Here's a quick stock photo for reference...

View attachment 8730912

So onto my question- for those unfamiliar with this particular model, it has 3 dampers at the bottom (and one on the lid) used to control airflow/temperature. The 'quirk' I'm finding though is that the grate which the coals sit on is actually placed low enough that it dissects the area where the damper is. The issue this is causing me is when I'm doing larger cuts of meat/longer smokes I'm going through a lot of charcoal and the ash that accumulates beneath the grate actually rises to the point where the bottom two holes of that damper (so 6 holes total) actually end up being "clogged" and out of commission due to this ash.

As an example, I just finished a ~10 lb pork butt which took a bit under 20 hours with going 225º the first 12-13 hours & bumping it up to 250-275º for the last part (trying to get it done to time) and that amounted to around 30lbs of Kingsford charcoal. Had I used Royal Oak charcoal, I'd imagine that I would have used as much if not more since it seems to burn hotter & faster than the Kingsford. When I screw with the dampers and see a chunk if not most of the holes covered by ash I'd have to pressure this is reducing my abilities to control the O2 coming in and thusly my ability to control temperature at the end of my smokes.

So the TL/DR- for long smokes using a charcoal barrel smoker, what's the "trick" (or any tips) on controlling the ash buildup to prevent this? I thought about getting something like a wet/dry vac to suck up the ash when it's getting to a certain height but as many here will know- that ash isn't necessarily cold, especially in the middle of a smoke and I have to believe sucking it into a wet/dry vac is a surefire way to either (a) ruin it (b) cause a fire or (c) both. But I'm completely at a loss of how to handle this particular issue.

I've got a few smokes under my belt since I started this thread- a number of Boston Butts, ribs, hams & chickens and I'd like to tackle a big ol' brisket this summer but I'm already nipping at the heels of the limits with the ash build up and the brisket will likely take even longer than the pork butt and I don't know how to stay on top of the ash and don't want to find myself with smothered coals, unusable dampers, and a $100+ slab of brisket that isn't fully cooked with an audience waiting for me to know how to 'fix' it.

Any thoughts/tips on this rather... specific situation?

-LD

I don't have that specific Weber, but I do have a Kettle that I occasionally smoke in.

I think if you are serious about smoking, especially longer smokes, you need to get a proper smoker - such as a nice offset smoker.

Webers are just way too thin of metal for adequate temp control on longer smokes, and the fire management is less than ideal.

While you can make them work for smoking, it's an uphill battle with big temp swings and constant fuel management.

 

[ColbyLang]

Don’t need to spend 3 grand plus on an offset. Get a Kamado Joe or a Big Green Egg.

 

[SkyScrapin]

I don't have that specific Weber, but I do have a Kettle that I occasionally smoke in.

I think if you are serious about smoking, especially longer smokes, you need to get a proper smoker - such as a nice offset smoker.

Webers are just way too thin of metal for adequate temp control on longer smokes, and the fire management is less than ideal.

While you can make them work for smoking, it's an uphill battle with big temp swings and constant fuel management.

Get what you’re saying and while true, the slow and sear is the easiest way to control temp and moisture. Not quite pellet easy, but I can walk away for a few hours without feeling to concerned. It’s not a cheap upgrade at about the price of a standard Weber 22”.

 

[Taylorbok]

Get what you’re saying and while true, the slow and sear is the easiest way to control temp and moisture. Not quite pellet easy, but I can walk away for a few hours without feeling to concerned. It’s not a cheap upgrade at about the price of a standard Weber 22”.

if it weren't for pellet smokers I'd have to greatly reduce the amount of smoked meat I eat. So easy to just throw it on in the morning and forget about it until after work.

 

[LuckyDuck]

Gents-

I have my first brisket on the smoker tonight. I tried to incorporate a lot of the suggestions here but what's throwing me off is it's a bit of a baby cut (only about 6lbs trimmed) so most "recipes" don't seem to apply to such a relatively small cut. So in many ways I'm going to wing it and hope for the best.

Wish me luck.

 

[ColbyLang]

It should have been done for some time now. How’d it come out?

 

[LuckyDuck]

It should have been done for some time now. How’d it come out?

I've got it resting in the cooler resting now but pulled it earlier this morning at 203º. It certainly has good bark but I'm a bit concerned that I should have pulled it sooner.

It was probing between 200º-205º and I had juices running out but it's nowhere near as tender as my pork butts were since they were absolutely falling apart when I pulled them. Not sure if that's normal for brisket (like I said, first attempt and had to make it up as I go since it wasn't a large cut) as compared to pork shoulder but it not wanting to fall apart when I pulled it was what I immediately noticed.

I smoked it at ~225º-235º for a bit under 10 hours (the stall at ~160 took a bit longer than I expected it to). I used a mixture of hickory & some pecan wood this time around and I'll say it at least smells fantastic but keeping fingers crossed that I didn't dry it out.

Appreciate the follow-up though.

-LD

 

[ColbyLang]

I’m a brisket guy. 250°. Bout an hour per pound. I trim very little. Fat cap up. Naked, don’t wrap post 165° like some do. Usually pull between 202-205 internal. When it probes like a warmed knife in butter in the thickest part of the flat

 

[LuckyDuck]

I’m a brisket guy. 250°. Bout an hour per pound. I trim very little. Fat cap up. Naked, don’t wrap post 165° like some do. Usually pull between 202-205 internal. When it probes like a warmed knife in butter in the thickest part of the flat

My first attempt was… mixed. There was a metric crap ton of flavor but also too dry. Still edible though & hopefully have a better one next time around.

 

[AmmoFort]

Never owned a smoker before and I'm about to put my first brisket on tonight. Been texting one of my buddies who is way into this. He warned me,

"That it isn't just about temperature. Needs to be at least 200, but It's also about being probe tender and having a feeling like jello. Like slapping a gals little bit jiggly ass."

 

[LuckyDuck]

Never owned a smoker before and I'm about to put my first brisket on tonight. Been texting one of my buddies who is way into this. He warned me,

Best of luck to you!

 

[TahoeDust]

View attachment 8673757

Got her all put together tonight and, as they say, "cooking with gas now".

I have a Weber Genesis II 3 burner natural gas that I love. It is a tank..and I love it does not take a tank. For smoking I have Rectec 590 pellet smoker. It is like an easy bake oven. Holds temp incredibly well.

 

[502Chevelle]

My son mixes pickle juice and mustard together into a slime and spreads it on his brisket. I know it sounds gross, as I don’t really like either, but it bakes into a hard shell of bark, and seals the meat. All of the moisture stays inside the shell, and the meat comes out moist and tender. I need to have him post his method here. He tells it to me all the time, but after five minutes, my eyes glaze over, sort of like his do when I’m telling him about a stage at the last PRS match. lol…

 

[Mbaysinger89]

My personal opinion is a whole chickens are the easiest pit protein. Tgeyre skin wrapped to keep the moisture in, cook them to 165 in the breast and pull out of the pit. Always good, always moist, probably 2.5- 3 hours at 215-220 degrees.

 

[ColbyLang]

View attachment IMG_7052.jpeg

This was my last meteor. 14.2# American Wagyu for Father’s Day. Just under 13 hours to get it where I like it. Another 2 hours rest before slicing

 

[AmmoFort]

<Shrugs> I don’t fucking know? It kinda stalled…? Looks good to me. Still seems juicy. Probing decent. It’s just going to go way faster than I thought? The pit temp started high as it was still coming down from the burgers I made earlier.

I’ve only done steaks, burgers, and some shrimp so far. I may just wrap it in parchment paper when it reaches 200 degrees. I keep waiting for a real stall to appear. People talk about going backwards. I saw the flat drop 0.1 for a few minutes, then it just kept going. This was Prime from Costco, and I really did a hatchet job on trimming the fat.

Again <shrugs> I don’t fucking know…

 

[notacos4u]

<Shrugs> I don’t fucking know? It kinda stalled…? Looks good to me. Still seems juicy. Probing decent. It’s just going to go way faster than I thought? The pit temp started high as it was still coming down from the burgers I made earlier.

I’ve only done steaks, burgers, and some shrimp so far. I may just wrap it in parchment paper when it reaches 200 degrees. I keep waiting for a real stall to appear. People talk about going backwards. I saw the flat drop 0.1 for a few minutes, then it just kept going. This was Prime from Costco, and I really did a hatchet job on trimming the fat.

Again <shrugs> I don’t fucking know…
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You’ve pretty much reached around 165 on both probes, I don’t worry about temp as much as I do in getting the bark I want. When you get the bark and color you like, then wrap it and leave it alone till you get around 205, then that’s when you’re going to start probing it for tenderness, NOT TEMP. when the probe goes through the meat like it were going through warm butter, you’ve reached the tenderness you’re looking for, from there, let it rest and you’re off to the races

As far as the “through warm butter” comment, it’s a feel thing, and that’s the best way to describe it. What you’re really looking for is not to have resistance when putting your probe through the meat. And you’re probing multiple locations when you do it so you make sure the entire brisket has reached the tenderness you’re looking for want.

 

[Big Phish]

If you want to to pull brisket like pork butts then you will need to do brisket till about 180. Put in a foil pan add some beef broth 1 1/2 cup at most depending on size, onions and about 1/3-1/2 stick of butter, cover it with aluminum foil and put back on smoker till temps get to 205. rest it and then start pulling.

 

[ColbyLang]

If you want to to pull brisket like pork butts then you will need to do brisket till about 180. Put in a foil pan add some beef broth 1 1/2 cup at most depending on size, onions and about 1/3-1/2 stick of butter, cover it with aluminum foil and put back on smoker till temps get to 205. rest it and then start pulling.

If you’re gonna do that, might as well use chuck roasts instead of brisket

 

[TC.TURTLECREEK]

I have a weber SMC 18" absolutely love it (used it for 10+ years). so much good advice above. Specific to the weber:

1. after you use a while, the grease/soot whatever will seal things more and more as you use it. i never clean mine. i do burn off things if i let it sit for a long time without using.
2. the barrel is thin metal and bends easy. mine fell over once and was out of round. i didn't even notice until smoke was rolling and it was leaking all around the lid. with a little time and effort, i was able to squeeze it back into round and it is almost as good as ever.
3. open the top vent and use the bottom vents to control temp. as said above, fire it up an hour or so before you are ready to let the smoke go from thick/white/grey to thin blue smoke before putting meat on. it makes a difference to me.
4. i have never used the water bowl since early on. i couldn't tell a difference and its a pain to clean. i'm not debating if it makes a difference. i'm just saying for me, it didn't make a noticeable difference and I'm lazy....
5. as others said, i'd start with the butt. smoked chicken meat is not hard, but the skin gets rubbery and is an art to get it right.
6. my SMC can hold temp (i generally run 275, but do ribs down around 220) for hours once i have it up and running. i may tweak the vents twice in a 6-8 hour smoke for brisket, as an example.
7. get ahead of the temp. in other words, when it starts moving up, shut down the vents sooner rather than later or it will overshoot. it is easier to allow temp to go up and to get it to go down.
8. i put 4-6 chunks of wood on the bottom. then i pour in the charcoal to fill the ring. i then take out about 15-20 brickets from the center of the pile to make a depression in the middle. i start them off line. once they are going, i pour them into the middle of the depression and close it up. this allows the temp to ramp up controllably and seems to produce the best smoke for me and the SMC.
9. i use to use probes for temp of the smoker and the meat as you described. i think it is a good tool to learn with. that being so, i replaced the top thermometer with a better unit to make sure the temp was accurate. i've stopped using the thermometers, except an instant probe as i've done it enough that with the top temp, i'm good to go. as someone said, especially with brisket, its cooked to feel, not temp. with lots of notes, you'll learn as you go. outside temps, heavy winds, etc all impact how it cooks.

for reference, my butt is fine, people pay me to do brisket and after 10 years, i finally have ribs that i like. i cook my chicken on the weber kettle.

over the years, i added a hunsaker vortex and rib hanger to my setup. both seem to be good products.

just a few things i learned over the years. enjoy the journey! my family is glad i did!!

 

[Big Phish]

If you’re gonna do that, might as well use chuck roasts instead of brisket

Exactly what i am referring to.