Gunsmithing Longshot Rifles, inc

[SDWhirlwind]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shootindude</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hell i even have a couple 308 barrels unfired and a douglas blank id send ya with it, no charge either. just let me know brother. </div></div>

Just have to let you know that you are a hell of a lot better man than the one this thread was started over!!!!!! My hat is off to you Sir!!! Seriously!

 

[monteboy84]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shootindude</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Redx, i dont have a dog in this hunt either. What i DO have is thank yous to you for serving our country and sorry you got screwed. What kind of action did you send him that you got shafted out of? I have a rem700 long action 30 06 B.F. i was going to build a LA 308 out of that id probably give ya so you can get your gun built. Its a perfect rifle i was just gonna use as a donor. I dont want to charge you for it as you have paid your dues to me over and over being in the armed forces. Pm me and ill ship you the action no charge. If of course it fits your stock. </div></div>

Stand-up guy right there! I'll pile on and throw in a free bolt knob install on that 700 action. shootindude, shoot me a PM when you have a chance.

-matt

 

[ackleyfan]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Very nice gesture from you guys ...maybe a rifle builder will show up also...

 

[Jim See]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

How many of you guys have contacted a field agent in the area for ATF? If you sent him a receiver and it has disappeared from his possession he would have to file a missing firearms report, failure to do that will get an FFL in some hot water.
Assuming it disappeared would be a logical conclusion if he won't return them.

Like I said get copy of e-mails, proof of payments, and shipping receipts, write down your serial numbers. Make copy's and send them all to the Sheriffs dept detective in charge. They need evidence for a investigation/search warrant so give it to them.

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Update - no filed bankruptcy as of this afternoon when I checked the docket.

If you are "involved" with one of these unsuccessful deals with Mr. Matthews, send me a PM and I'll give you the Morgan County Sheriff's contact info and officer in charge. They are continuing to take an active interest.

Jeffvn

 

[Duck Diggler]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Thank God for the internet. I had one rifle built for me by Chris and he did an outstanding job. Its sad this has come to pass as I am in the market for someone to build a new bench gun for me. Sorry to hear about everyone's hard earned losses here, my heartfelt condolences. I'll be watching this thread closely.

 

[jacack]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Jeffvn

thanks for the heads up with the sheriffs office, i have sent them my 35+ pages of lies I mean emails from Chris and a copy of my paid in full receipt.

 

[corey4]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

message deleted

see below

 

[corey4]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Buckey</div><div class="ubbcode-body">He'd be firing his wife then jasonk!!!!! </div></div>

i fired mine!!!

she thought she knew what she talking about, but she had no clue. so i told her to get in the truck and go home. she hasn't been on site with me since.

 

[redx]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shootindude</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hell i even have a couple 308 barrels unfired and a douglas blank id send ya with it, no charge either. just let me know brother. </div></div>

I appreciate your offer, I had a Stiller action but since I lost everything with Chris I had to cheap out and get a standard Remington action. I already have a shop on here (who I will mention later) That a: tried to help in the beginning by being a go between and b: is willing to help put the rifle together for me. Right now we are just waiting on my barrel (broughton 7.1 size) Hopefully it will be done in a couple months.

Edited to add, in a way this has been a blessing because by me having to go to a new shop, I have met some great friends and learned some great information. Plus I know this rifle will be a whole lot better now.

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Update - no filed bankruptcy as of Friday morning when I checked the docket.

If you are "involved" with one of these unsuccessful deals with Mr. Matthews, send me a PM and I'll give you the Morgan County Sheriff's contact info and officer in charge. They are continuing to take an active interest.

Jeffvn

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Update - no filed bankruptcy as of Friday morning when I checked the docket.

If you are "involved" with one of these unsuccessful deals with Mr. Matthews, send me a PM and I'll give you the Morgan County Sheriff's contact info and officer in charge. They are continuing to take an active interest.

Jeffvn

 

[jacack]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

jeff, anything on the docket yet

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Update - no filed bankruptcy as of Friday morning when I checked the docket.

If you are "involved" with one of these unsuccessful deals with Mr. Matthews, send me a PM and I'll give you the Morgan County Sheriff's contact info and officer in charge. They are continuing to take an active interest.

Jeffvn

 

[Capt Beach]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

NO DOG IN THIS FIGHT...that said...

If you sent this man an Action or Rifle and he has not returned it do yourself a favor and contact the BATF office in his AO...If he took possession of your firearm/action on his forms and then sold it to another individual he is playing with federal time...

Even if he files for bankruptcy YOUR RIFLES/ACTIONS should be exempt as THEY ARE NOT HIS LEGAL PROPERTY...they are YOURS legally, registered to YOU...barrels, stocks, scopes and other parts are a different story...

Go see/call/email the BATF in his jurisdiction ASAP.

Capt Beach

 

[redx]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Update, Accurate Ordnance donated an Obermeyer 5r Barrel for my project and I was blessed to draw second prize at the Vern Harrison Invitational Match and won a free build by them as well. This is the finished project which I know had more love and devotion dedicated to it than LR inc. ever could so in the end things worked out for the best. If you go to Accurate Ordnance's face book page you can see more detailed pics.

Thanks to David, Jason and Mark for their time and services.

 

[redx]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

 

[jacack]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

any new info?

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Update - no filed bankruptcy as of Thursday morning when I checked the docket.

If you are "involved" with one of these unsuccessful deals with Mr. Matthews, send me a PM and I'll give you the Morgan County Sheriff's contact info and officer in charge. They are continuing to take an active interest.

Jeffvn

 

[jeo556]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

First to all the guys offering actions, barrels, bolt work and the like. You guys are truely standup and should give yourselves a pat on the back, in this day and age there aren't too many like you around.

To anyone who has an action lost to this guy, CALL THE ATF! I also had a huge problem with a AK builder a few years back. He had my reciever, parts kit, and money and I had no answers. Long story short, this asshole had no intention of get my parts and money back to me. I finally broke down and called the ATF and had resolution to my problem in less than a week.

From my personal expierence this isn't something that the ATF takes lightly. Good luck to all of you and take care.

 

[Kodiak61]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: redx</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

</div></div>


That's pretty.

....eighty second.... patch on my shoulder...

Sorry whenever I see that unit logo that little marching ditty comes to mind.

 

[redirt78]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

This thread took a turn for the better. Awesome how things worked out with Accurate Ordnance and the build. They are some good guys. Cool to see the generosity shown by some members towards a soldier who was done wrong also. I hope similar luck falls on to anyone else involved with this

 

[callen3615]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: redirt78</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This thread took a turn for the better. Awesome how things worked out with Accurate Ordnance and the build. They are some good guys. Cool to see the generosity shown by some members towards a soldier who was done wrong also. I hope similar luck falls on to anyone else involved with this </div></div>

+1

Im constantly amazed at the altruism I see toward total strangers on a gun forum. Glad there are still some people of decent character around.

 

[redirt78]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

There are a ton of good, cool people here. Almost forgot to mention how good I think that gun looks. Better check it for the mark of the beast though, got to be there somewhere haha. Looks like an undercover version of that evil GAP build

 

[1J04]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Who could pass on commenting on THIS? Way unfortunate situation that has turned out for the good, imagine? Damn nice Rifle. You've gotta helluva story behind that one. My following comment is based on this limited experience in life. I am a 10yr Naval Vet (80-90), 6yrs of Carrier service (Constellation & Midway), lived in Japan for 6 yrs, Philippines for 3yrs, been to more Countries than we have States, am currently enjoying my 15th yr of Law Enforcement (Corrections), seen the best and worst this world has to offer, and reside with some of the worst individuals you've never laid your eyes on for a living. And then this!! There is obvious hope out there and I salute with pride each and every one of you who are an integral part of what is still good with this country!! You and this site are absolutely amazing. Paying it forward works for me.

How damn cool is that? Rock On Brother!!

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Update - no filed bankruptcy as of Friday afternoon when I checked the docket.

If you are "involved" with one of these unsuccessful deals with Mr. Matthews, send me a PM and I'll give you the Morgan County Sheriff's contact info and officer in charge. They are continuing to take an active interest.

Jeffvn

 

[eracer]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

I've seen several posts alluding to property in receivership due to bankruptcy.

Could a court 'seize' property that belongs to someone else and use it to pay creditors? Or does the court assume that possession equals ownership?

 

[nzgrip]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eracer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've seen several posts alluding to property in receivership due to bankruptcy.

Could a court 'seize' property that belongs to someone else and use it to pay creditors? Or does the court assume that possession equals ownership? </div></div>

I would say that you would have to be able to prove ownership of your items. There is a process to go through though, all creditors have to lodge their claim with the receivers. If any parts that you can prove are yours are still there i would assume you would eventually get them back. Any money you are owed you may or may not get back depending on the state of the finances after everything is sold off.

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

So far no bankruptcy has been filed.

The court itself does no come after anything, that is the job of the Bankruptcy Trustee. Speculating about what an individual Bankruptcy Trustee would or would not do is a waste of time right now.

Jeffvn

 

[jacack]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

anything new JeffVN?

thanks
Jared

 

[Keith Johns]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

If you guys have his full name, FFL number etc. I dont understand how the ATF cant step in and deal with it real quick, or put him behind bars. One or the other I would think would happen real quick.

Or maybe the ATF would send all the guns to mexico and call it 2fast2furious.

 

[LRI]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Keith Johns</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you guys have his full name, FFL number etc. I dont understand how the ATF cant step in and deal with it real quick, or put him behind bars. One or the other I would think would happen real quick.

Or maybe the ATF would send all the guns to mexico and call it 2fast2furious. </div></div>

It's because its a civil matter. Unless someone is selling guns to the cartels, straw men, or felons, the BATF is going to try and stay out of it.

For example:

If Bob owns a gun shop thats failing and you send in your rifle for rebarrel whats the process if Bob sells that barreled action to Chris who walked into his shop?

What did Bob do? More importantly, what DIDNT he do?

Assuming Chris isn't a felon/strawman and assuming Bob had him fill out the 4473, all Bob did was retail property that wasn't his to sell.

That's a matter for local law enforcement. Stealing a gun is no worse crime that stealing someones bicycle. It's a matter of property value. Not the type of device.

At this point all Bob has to do is gin up an invoice and tell the coppers that YOU failed to pay. At that moment the coppers MIGHT contact you and notify you what Bob said. Of course you'll stomp your feet and call BS.

And the cops MIGHT ask for a record of the deposit/final payment.

More than likely they'll tell you its a civil matter. At which point you get really pissed and have to decide whether or not its worth trying to sort this out from several states away.

Point is, Big Brother BATF has bigger fish to fry than your beef over a 700 Remington.

Sorry, but its how this stuff works.


C.

 

[Keith Johns]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Seems like taking in and keeping, with no plans of returning, a <span style="font-weight: bold">pile</span> of firearms, "snipers rifles" particularly, that don't belong to you would be a crime on a <span style="text-decoration: underline">Federal</span> level... Not a job for local Sheriff Andy Dick. Especially considering that Sheriff Andy Dick cant return all the weapons to where they belong.
Those rifles then become off record and the ATF has no idea where they are. They don't care about that? That doesn't make it easier for the weapons to wind up in the hands of bad people?



They definitely aren't too busy doing anything helpful about the drug cartels getting weapons. I mean ones the ATF aren't giving straight to them fast and furiously.

 

[rideHPD]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Just a question, but would the fact that the "crime" occurs across states lines warrant federal involvement over local or state?

 

[LRI]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Keith Johns</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Seems like taking in and keeping, with no plans of returning, a <span style="font-weight: bold">pile</span> of firearms, "snipers rifles" particularly, that don't belong to you would be a crime on a <span style="text-decoration: underline">Federal</span> level... Not a job for local Sheriff Andy Dick. Especially considering that Sheriff Andy Dick cant return all the weapons to where they belong.
Those rifles then become off record and the ATF has no idea where they are. They don't care about that? That doesn't make it easier for the weapons to wind up in the hands of bad people?


They definitely aren't too busy doing anything helpful about the drug cartels getting weapons. I mean ones the ATF aren't giving straight to them fast and furiously. </div></div>


Since when does the BATF track weapons? Isn't that against the constitution? There's no Federal Firearms Registration database or process. Think of BATF audits for a minute. They come in and check compliance to ensure we (FFL holders) are maintaining the standard as dictated by Federal Law. It's not like they come in and burn reams of paper through a copier to have a file that contains every gun manufactured or sent out the door. Consider for the moment just how daunting a task that would be. You think taxes are high now? Ha, pull this off and see what it costs. WE WILL be owned by China by the time that's done.

Even with an 07 type FFL (what I have) which is to manufacture guns, I'm not required to submit detailed lists of serial numbers. The Feds do ask that I send in a report each year itemizing the volume and type. But no serial numbers.

4473's are background checks on <span style="font-weight: bold">individuals</span> to determine eligibility to own/possess a firearm. Notice how the NIC's rep doesn't ask for the serial number. Only the TYPE of gun.

Those checks are conducted by the FBI. Not the BATF.

Whether its a "sniper" rifle or Daddy's 22 it really doesn't matter. It would matter if it were an NFA device like a can or full auto, but in this case I don't think it applies.

As for crossing state lines. It's one thing to set up a stawman store front and begin conducting business with the willful intent to commit fraud. It's quite another to be a legitimate business with good intent, only to have things erode beyond ones ability to manage successfully.

I don't think Chris ever intended when he started to go burn bridges with the firearms community. He just got in over his head.

If he was licensed to take in customer guns, I doubt the state line issue will matter much.

Just my thoughts.

C.

 

[Keith Johns]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

I thought the point of our A&D book was to keep track of weapons.
If a rifle comes from John Smith to us, and back to him, the only reason I can see that they'd have us record it is for tracking it.
They can look at the book and know who it came from, if it has left our shop, and where it went. So I think they sorta do track them.
We're an 07 FFL too, and we have to record serial numbers incase they ever want them.

They read here, so maybe you're right and it's not their concern.
Or they are doing something about it and we just aren't aware.


Whole situation looks real shitty. I don't understand how it can happen. Unless he had a partner that really did him dirty.
There's a HUGE difference between getting in over your head, and this.



<span style="font-weight: bold">And Chad, your little alligator video in your signature slows my old computer down to the point that I can barely scroll past your posts.</span>

 

[RTK]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: C. Dixon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[Since when does the BATF track weapons? Isn't that against the constitution? There's no Federal Firearms Registration database or process. Think of BATF audits for a minute.
Even with an 07 type FFL (what I have) which is to manufacture guns, I'm not required to submit detailed lists of serial numbers. The Feds do ask that I send in a report each year itemizing the volume and type. But no serial numbers.

4473's are background checks on <span style="font-weight: bold">individuals</span> to determine eligibility to own/possess a firearm. Notice how the NIC's rep doesn't ask for the serial number. Only the TYPE of gun.

Those checks are conducted by the FBI. Not the BATF.

Whether its a "sniper" rifle or Daddy's 22 it really doesn't matter. It would matter if it were an NFA device like a can or full auto, but in this case I don't think it applies.

</div></div>

Years ago a friend of mine that had a FFL license let another friend barrow a pistol to shoot. This other digledorf left it on the tailgate of his truck and drove off forgetting about it. A motorist picked it up and gave it to the sheriffs department. With in a day they gave it back to my buddy. This particular weapon was 5 years old, so somebody keeping track. Here in california the serial number is attached with the 14 day waiting period paper work.

 

[pure_mahem]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

I like the alligator! Kind of relative to this thread if you think about it.

 

[LRI]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And Chad, your little alligator video in your signature slows my old computer down to the point that I can barely scroll past your posts.</div></div>


Solution

 

[LRI]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RTK</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: C. Dixon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[Since when does the BATF track weapons? Isn't that against the constitution? There's no Federal Firearms Registration database or process. Think of BATF audits for a minute.
Even with an 07 type FFL (what I have) which is to manufacture guns, I'm not required to submit detailed lists of serial numbers. The Feds do ask that I send in a report each year itemizing the volume and type. But no serial numbers.

4473's are background checks on <span style="font-weight: bold">individuals</span> to determine eligibility to own/possess a firearm. Notice how the NIC's rep doesn't ask for the serial number. Only the TYPE of gun.

Those checks are conducted by the FBI. Not the BATF.

Whether its a "sniper" rifle or Daddy's 22 it really doesn't matter. It would matter if it were an NFA device like a can or full auto, but in this case I don't think it applies.

</div></div>

Years ago a friend of mine that had a FFL license let another friend barrow a pistol to shoot. This other digledorf left it on the tailgate of his truck and drove off forgetting about it. A motorist picked it up and gave it to the sheriffs department. With in a day they gave it back to my buddy. This particular weapon was 5 years old, so somebody keeping track. Here in california the serial number is attached with the 14 day waiting period paper work. </div></div>


California being the key word. That's at a state level. What a state does vs Federal are apples/oranges.

Weed is a schedule 2 drug. Illegal for any purpose at the Federal level. Yet you can buy it in CA as a way to relieve the pain associated with "acne". (I made that up)

Whenever shipping a gun to CA I have to first go through the state justice dept. They want everything before it even crosses the state line.

 

[RTK]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

We are pretty screwed up here in california

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Update - no filed bankruptcy as of Thursday afternoon when I checked the docket.

If you are "involved" with one of these unsuccessful deals with Mr. Matthews, send me a PM and I'll give you the Morgan County Sheriff's contact info and officer in charge. They are taking an active interest.

There may be movement so it "might" get interesting. I will post updates as I get them.

Jeffvn

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

Here we go this is copied directly from the email that I received yesterday from Deputy Hess, Morgan County Sheriff, Missouri.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The ATF has become involved. They revoked his license and seized his records. I forwarded the file to the Missouri Attorney General’s Office and the investigator was happy with my investigation and is now pursuing his own. At this time I have no further information. Once I get positive feedback I will inform you of any details I may have. I have also sent this to my prosecutor as well. Once it goes to our prosecutor it is out of my hands. You are more than welcome to contact their office. Doug Kinde is our prosecutor and you can reach him at 573-378-4694</div></div>

Anyone that wants to contact the Prosecutor directly, should do so, as I will not be doing so anytime soon.

Jeffvn

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

I received a letter from the Missouri Attorney General's investigator. I'll post up a copy of the letter for everyone to see. If you do not receive one from the Investigator and you submitted a complaint form to the Sheriff, you need to contact the investigator directly.

They want copies of everything that I sent to the Sheriff. I'm happy to see this moving along, but it would be nice to see law enforcement share their file with each other.

Jeffvn

 

[jacack]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

I have also received the same letter.glad something is being done

 

[jacack]

Re: Longshot Rifles, inc

jeff hear anything new

 

[Jeffvn]

Well, well, well..... Mr. Matthews finally filed a bankruptcy. Anyone wishing to file a claim needs to potentially do so. A call to the Bankruptcy Court to find out if he filed a "no asset" chapter 7 is the smart thing. If he did file it as a "no asset" then they will not even let you file a claim regarding the amounts that he owes you. It does not stop you from filing a cause of action for nondischargability regarding your claim if you think he committed fraud. Here is his case number. The case was filed yesterday.

United States Bankruptcy Court for the Western District of Missouri, Case number: 2:14-bk-20046

Debtors: Christopher Clint Matthews and Diana Kathleen Matthews

Date Filed: Jan. 22, 2014

Chapter 7

 

[wnroscoe]

Well, well, well..... Mr. Matthews finally filed a bankruptcy. Anyone wishing to file a claim needs to potentially do so. A call to the Bankruptcy Court to find out if he filed a "no asset" chapter 7 is the smart thing. If he did file it as a "no asset" then they will not even let you file a claim regarding the amounts that he owes you. It does not stop you from filing a cause of action for nondischargability regarding your claim if you think he committed fraud. Here is his case number. The case was filed yesterday.

United States Bankruptcy Court for the Western District of Missouri, Case number: 2:14-bk-20046

Debtors: Christopher Clint Matthews and Diana Kathleen Matthews

Date Filed: Jan. 22, 2014

Chapter 7

Filing bankruptcy, whether chapter 7, 11 or 13, does not exempt you from or afford you protection against prosecution from criminal acts.

If you are a victim of theft, act swiftly and deliberately, make his acts known to the local authorities and to the Bankruptcy Trustee of that Federal District. Strike while the iron is hot and without hesitation.

 

[Jeffvn]

true enough ... there is no exemption from criminal acts. However, to date no one in law enforcement has shown much of an interest in pursuing this guy. He is rapidly getting to the statute of limitations for at least some of his bad acts. When that date passes he will be exempt from criminal prosecution.

That having been said chasing him in his bankruptcy will not produce a financial return unless you get your debt determined to be nondischargable. If you prove fraud or other element of nondischargabilty and your debt is found to be "nondischargable" under the bankruptcy code, then you can continue to chase him after the bankruptcy to try to collect on your debt. If not, then once his bankruptcy case closes you'll not be able to pursue him for the debt.

Stated simply this is your last chance to try to recover anything from this guy for his misdeeds.

Jeffvn