I've seen more and more guys running the T-1 as an 45 deg offset option for CQB engagements. What's the practical effective range for this type of setup? I was thinking 75 meters and in.
Rifle Scopes Offset micro T-1
- Thread starter Christopher Rance
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Re: Offset micro T-1
I use an MRDS, and 200 yards is actually pretty easy, 300 is doable and 400 is maxed out, about a 60% shot. The position is not the best, and I'm using an 3.5 MOA dot, but COM shots are just fine. The other nice thing about the setup is not dialing the power ring as much. You can drive the rifle to the target area with the dot, then when you look in the scope it's usually in the FOV.
The MRDS or RMR are smaller and lighter than a T-1, but they all work the same.
I use an MRDS, and 200 yards is actually pretty easy, 300 is doable and 400 is maxed out, about a 60% shot. The position is not the best, and I'm using an 3.5 MOA dot, but COM shots are just fine. The other nice thing about the setup is not dialing the power ring as much. You can drive the rifle to the target area with the dot, then when you look in the scope it's usually in the FOV.
The MRDS or RMR are smaller and lighter than a T-1, but they all work the same.
Re: Offset micro T-1
CoryT, excellent observation:
"The other nice thing about the setup is not dialing the power ring as much. You can drive the rifle to the target area with the dot, then when you look in the scope it's usually in the FOV."
Much discussion is about using the MRDS only when something pops up at close range - very little is ever mentioned about the use as you have described. Very useful.
Mark H.
CoryT, excellent observation:
"The other nice thing about the setup is not dialing the power ring as much. You can drive the rifle to the target area with the dot, then when you look in the scope it's usually in the FOV."
Much discussion is about using the MRDS only when something pops up at close range - very little is ever mentioned about the use as you have described. Very useful.
Mark H.
Re: Offset micro T-1
It's actually the main reason I've put it on there. I run with the gun on min (3.5 - 5) power and normally have no problem with snaps from 100 to 10 yards. I do see a lot of students having a challenge getting onto a target where the spotter can talk them to an area or they can identify a far off point visually, but they can't put the rifle on it. I let them try this and WHAM, on target.
It's actually the main reason I've put it on there. I run with the gun on min (3.5 - 5) power and normally have no problem with snaps from 100 to 10 yards. I do see a lot of students having a challenge getting onto a target where the spotter can talk them to an area or they can identify a far off point visually, but they can't put the rifle on it. I let them try this and WHAM, on target.
Re: Offset micro T-1
The caveot, in my opinion, about a RDS at distance is that I find it is greatly affected by conditions. If the sun is behind me and my target is bright and clear then yes I can engage to 200. However, if the sun is ahead of me and the target is shadowed or not very distinct that distance shrinks real fast to sub 100. As a result of this I consider the rds to be potentially limited to 100 and under depending on conditions. If I were engaging a 200 yard target and my primary was a magnified optic, why would I use the RDS? So in my opinion in a dual setup, yes the rds is for danger close only.
The caveot, in my opinion, about a RDS at distance is that I find it is greatly affected by conditions. If the sun is behind me and my target is bright and clear then yes I can engage to 200. However, if the sun is ahead of me and the target is shadowed or not very distinct that distance shrinks real fast to sub 100. As a result of this I consider the rds to be potentially limited to 100 and under depending on conditions. If I were engaging a 200 yard target and my primary was a magnified optic, why would I use the RDS? So in my opinion in a dual setup, yes the rds is for danger close only.
Re: Offset micro T-1
What type of red dots are you all running on the off set mounts?
I am interested in trying one out... but did not know how much one is... I would be running it on a 223
Matt.
What type of red dots are you all running on the off set mounts?
I am interested in trying one out... but did not know how much one is... I would be running it on a 223
Matt.
Re: Offset micro T-1
I use the Burris FastFire II. It was half the price of the Leupold Deltapoint, although the auto-adjust on the Deltapoint was brighter than the auto-adjust on the Fastfire II.
The FastFire III introduced at SHOT Show 2012 addresses this - the FastFire III has three preset brightnesses in addition to the auto-adjust.
The more I use it, the more I like it.
FastFire II
Mark H.
I use the Burris FastFire II. It was half the price of the Leupold Deltapoint, although the auto-adjust on the Deltapoint was brighter than the auto-adjust on the Fastfire II.
The FastFire III introduced at SHOT Show 2012 addresses this - the FastFire III has three preset brightnesses in addition to the auto-adjust.
The more I use it, the more I like it.
FastFire II
Mark H.
Re: Offset micro T-1
I am running a Aimpoint R1 on my patrol rifle in a off set Larue mount and on my three gun rifle and on my Larue Stealth (fun precision rifle) I am running Primary Arms micro dots in Larue off set mounts.
Pat
I am running a Aimpoint R1 on my patrol rifle in a off set Larue mount and on my three gun rifle and on my Larue Stealth (fun precision rifle) I am running Primary Arms micro dots in Larue off set mounts.
Pat
Re: Offset micro T-1
not on my weapon. running 175smks at 2600 fps. And our sight heights are probably very diffrent.
not on my weapon. running 175smks at 2600 fps. And our sight heights are probably very diffrent.
Re: Offset micro T-1
Im thinking about running a Insight MRDS on the GDI mount with a NF F1 on a LMT 308. Any input on the Insight MRDS?
Im thinking about running a Insight MRDS on the GDI mount with a NF F1 on a LMT 308. Any input on the Insight MRDS?
Re: Offset micro T-1
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Alaskapopo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What is your load because a 200 yard zero should put you dead on or close to it at 50 yards not 25.
Pat </div></div>
fwiw, we zero at 25m for 200 zero for our 5.56 in the army. Not 50
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Alaskapopo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What is your load because a 200 yard zero should put you dead on or close to it at 50 yards not 25.
Pat </div></div>
fwiw, we zero at 25m for 200 zero for our 5.56 in the army. Not 50
Re: Offset micro T-1
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: taseal</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Alaskapopo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What is your load because a 200 yard zero should put you dead on or close to it at 50 yards not 25.
Pat </div></div>
fwiw, we zero at 25m for 200 zero for our 5.56 in the army. Not 50 </div></div>
No wonder the army gets a bad rap for its marksmanship, considering your round would be hitting roughly 8-9 inches high at 200m with a 25m zero.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: taseal</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Alaskapopo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What is your load because a 200 yard zero should put you dead on or close to it at 50 yards not 25.
Pat </div></div>
fwiw, we zero at 25m for 200 zero for our 5.56 in the army. Not 50 </div></div>
No wonder the army gets a bad rap for its marksmanship, considering your round would be hitting roughly 8-9 inches high at 200m with a 25m zero.
Re: Offset micro T-1
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pgh_rugger</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: taseal</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Alaskapopo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What is your load because a 200 yard zero should put you dead on or close to it at 50 yards not 25.
Pat </div></div>
fwiw, we zero at 25m for 200 zero for our 5.56 in the army. Not 50 </div></div>
No wonder the army gets a bad rap for its marksmanship, considering your round would be hitting roughly 8-9 inches high at 200m with a 25m zero. </div></div>
We aim center mass at a reduced target but impact abdomen
its the new zero that we do that works well.
Just aim center mass at any target and you'll hit the silhouette. I get regular 40/40 this way all the way from 25m to 300m popups
http://db.tt/tL9DwLS0
That's the target.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pgh_rugger</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: taseal</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Alaskapopo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What is your load because a 200 yard zero should put you dead on or close to it at 50 yards not 25.
Pat </div></div>
fwiw, we zero at 25m for 200 zero for our 5.56 in the army. Not 50 </div></div>
No wonder the army gets a bad rap for its marksmanship, considering your round would be hitting roughly 8-9 inches high at 200m with a 25m zero. </div></div>
We aim center mass at a reduced target but impact abdomen
its the new zero that we do that works well.
Just aim center mass at any target and you'll hit the silhouette. I get regular 40/40 this way all the way from 25m to 300m popups
http://db.tt/tL9DwLS0
That's the target.
Re: Offset micro T-1
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pgh_rugger</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: taseal</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Alaskapopo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What is your load because a 200 yard zero should put you dead on or close to it at 50 yards not 25.
Pat </div></div>
fwiw, we zero at 25m for 200 zero for our 5.56 in the army. Not 50 </div></div>
No wonder the army gets a bad rap for its marksmanship, considering your round would be hitting roughly 8-9 inches high at 200m with a 25m zero. </div></div>
Wrong. The Marines also do it that way btw. Your impact depends almost ENTIRELY on the height of the sight over the bore axis and muzzle velocity.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pgh_rugger</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: taseal</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Alaskapopo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What is your load because a 200 yard zero should put you dead on or close to it at 50 yards not 25.
Pat </div></div>
fwiw, we zero at 25m for 200 zero for our 5.56 in the army. Not 50 </div></div>
No wonder the army gets a bad rap for its marksmanship, considering your round would be hitting roughly 8-9 inches high at 200m with a 25m zero. </div></div>
Wrong. The Marines also do it that way btw. Your impact depends almost ENTIRELY on the height of the sight over the bore axis and muzzle velocity.
Re: Offset micro T-1
I ran the T-1 yesterday up at Storm Mountain and I have it offsetted at the 3 o'clock, and we were able to engage steel from 80 yards to 430 yds with 1st hit capability. We favored left shoulder on the farther engagements to compensate for the 9 o'clock 10-13 mph winds. All shots were taken from barricade positions and under an increase heartbeat. We didn't run the T-1 in the traditional way as seen by other offset configurations. We put the t-1 on the strong side of gun, then for weak hand transition, we just canted in at 45 deg. Seemed easier and faster. I do recommend a 2 Moa dot though.
I ran the T-1 yesterday up at Storm Mountain and I have it offsetted at the 3 o'clock, and we were able to engage steel from 80 yards to 430 yds with 1st hit capability. We favored left shoulder on the farther engagements to compensate for the 9 o'clock 10-13 mph winds. All shots were taken from barricade positions and under an increase heartbeat. We didn't run the T-1 in the traditional way as seen by other offset configurations. We put the t-1 on the strong side of gun, then for weak hand transition, we just canted in at 45 deg. Seemed easier and faster. I do recommend a 2 Moa dot though.
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