Range Report Looking for REAL range reports for 6.5cm and straight .284

[anthonylapoint]

I know this has been beaten up a hundred times, but most answers are more opinions and suggestions. Im looking for real knowledgable answers and real range reports from people who have/had either the 6.5 creedmoor or straight .284, no other variations. Everytime somebody posts for help, half the replies are "why dont you go for....". Im only going one of two directions.

So, now that im done bitching. I have been beating myself up on which to go for. Both are great rifle cartridges and I have a long action to max out potential. Stretching out both cartridges out to 1 mile, the .284 holds the edge obviously BUT not by much. How much better in MOA drop/drift is worth the jump in cartridge in your opinion. The reason I ask for real world range reports is because im basing my knowledge off of numbers out of my head fed into a ballistic calculator.

I guess what im getting at, is the higher recoil and slightly better barrel life of a .284 worth the extra 10 grains per cartridge over a 6.5cm because so far, they both hold pros and cons that make them equal in my book. I justed wanted to hear from people shooting 1000 and beyond with these what they were ACTUALLY getting and would they stick with their current choice for their next barrel.

Roughly thinking: The 6.5cm I would go 26" barrel and shoot 140's. The .284 would be a 28" barrel and 180's. Probably Manners t5 and R&D muzzle break.

I REALLY appreciate honest answers and help from you guys with experience. Also, I love pictures and im sure others do too. If you have group and/or rifle pictures that would be great. Thanks everyone. I only ask because the search isnt very good and old snipershide posts in the google do not pull up anymore.

Tony

 

[turbo54]

I have a 284. I can't give you direct 6.5CM vs. 284 experience, because I haven't (knowingly) shot them side by side, but my partner has a 26" bbl 260. If we can agree that 6.5CM and 260 are pretty darn comparable, we can move on...

Bottom line:

Out to ~750, it doesn't make a LICK of difference which your shooting.
Out to ~1000, the 284 is a little more consistent and definitely shows splash better. The 6.5mm is within a few 1/10 of a mrad in both drop and drift.
Out to ~1200, the 284 is very clearly opening the gap between itself and the 260. Splashes are still obvious, time of flight is noticeably shorter, you aren't missing targets off one side, then the other, then off the other side again like you are with the 260.
Out at 1760, the splash of the 284 is not obvious anymore, but the 260 is almost non-existant. My partners rifle is a better rifle than mine, but I've still only hit the mile target with his rifle once out of 20+ tries, whereas I hit 3 times out of 10 with my 284. This is a 12"x12" target.

I run the 175smk @ ~2825fps from my 284, with 54gr H4831sc. It is a mild/moderate load. I could push it harder, but why? My dope is ~8.1 mrad @ 1000 yards.

On recoil:

Both my rifle and my partners are ~15 or 16lbs. He has an APA LB that has been seamlessly fit to an M40 profile barrel (~.900"). I have a BO thruster that is a full 1.125" diameter. My experience tells me the APA is a slightly more effective brake. That said, the recoil difference between the two is substantial. Mind you, my 284 unbraked, is not "unreasonable". It is totally acceptable, a definite step up from an unbraked 308, but nowhere near a 300WM. The brake definitely takes away a fair amount of recoil, but after shooting my rifle, my partner's rifle feels like a 223. It is a huge step down in recoil.

Anecdotally: I recently shot the Mammoth math, and quite honestly, would have preferred a 6.5mm rifle, mainly on account of recoil. Excellent, stable positions are rare at this match, and it is a significant advantage (to me) to use a rifle with less recoil when positions aren't good/great. Very, very few targets at this match past ~950 yards, so nearly no advantage in choosing the 284.

 

[JCH]

I will be able to give you hard data on both. I have a 6.5 CM (have had several) and my 284 will be done in two weeks.

I chose the 284 because it can push a higher BC bullet than the 6.5's at the same speed. I went 27" inches on my barrel and put a brake on it so recoil will be next to nothing.

I will use my Creedmoor for hunting coyotes and such and the 284 will be only for long range shooting and matches.

 

[jbailey]

Given that you are dropping this into a long action, I don't think a 6.5CM makes sense. If you wanted to go 6.5 and shoot a mile, do a 6.5-284.

I will say that my buddy's 284 Win on a long action is a beast. Much easier to load for than 284 on a short action, and he gets within ~150fps of the bigger short mags. It is starting to run out of gas at 1 mile, even with a 180gr Hybrid. Point them and you can probably get there super sonic, but without much ft/lbs for impact observation. I would disagree with your statement that the 284 doesn't have much of an edge at 1 mile vs a 6.5CM. Even with the biggest baddest 6.5mm bullet, maybe a pointed 140gr Hybrid, gets eaten up by a pointed 180gr Hybrid at that range, if nothing more than seeing the impacts.

Just out of curiosity, where are you shooting a mile in central CT? I grow up in the Farmington Valley. Maybe shoot off Avon Mountain

 

[anthonylapoint]

It seems that the 6.5cm can hold its own for its size against the creedmoor. I think that, if I wasn't shooting the 6X for competitions already, the 6.5cm is the way to go. Turbo54 is right about the recoil and luckily, the 6x is a pussycat to shoot and with 32.6 grains of varget, relatively cheap.

I shoot with a bunch of guys who have Gap and Savage .338's and although that maybe overkill for these parts, my 6x looks weak next to them. I'm not gonna get into a dick growing contest with them but it would be nice to at least show up with something competitive at those ranges. jbailey, you're right about the .284 having the clear edge and its time to build a beast. Jbailey, what barrel length was he using cause I may go all in and just do a 30" medium Palma. J, I have a buddy locally with a personal 600 yard range. We plan on clearing some trees further back and shooting from the access road. That will give us around 1000 and maybe close to 1500 from another vantage point. I'm also originally from the top of Vermont. There is plenty of places we could get a mile. Just gotta know the right people and not piss off the wrong ones.

Any .284 pictures?

 

[JCH]

Any .284 pictures?

only picture I have was texted to me from the gunsmith. It should be ready next week.

 

[anthonylapoint]

Damn JCH, looks good. Thanks for the picture. What barrel is it? You said 27" before the brake? Looks like its in an A5, almost the setup I was thinking. I like the a4 but More then likely, cause of funds, mine will be placed in an hs precision tactical with cheek piece.

Looks good. I can't wait to see a range report. Do you have anywhere to shoot beyond 1000?

 

[turbo54]

Creedmoor cartridge (with 7mm bullet seated) next to a 284:

My 284. FN SPR action, McM A4:

Same rifle, older pic, different (thicker/shorter) barrel:

 

[jbailey]

Jbailey, what barrel length was he using cause I may go all in and just do a 30" medium Palma.

Any .284 pictures?

My buddy's .284 is 26", 9 twist Krieger. Don't know the contour. Its on a TAC 300 action in one of those funky space-aged looking chassis stocks. He has a beautiful suppressor on it and it feels and sounds like a bee-bee gun.

I don't have any pictures of it.

Glad to hear there is some precision long-range shooting going on in central CT. Land is expensive there, so you are lucky to have a buddy w/ 600yds + ability to get more. Good luck with your new build.

 

[Killswitch Engage]

Does the 284 do anything the 7wsm doesn't? Just curious if these two were on par with each other. I have a creedmoor and love it to 1200yd it's solid as it gets. Running 140amax at 2870ish and its a hammer for the creed. Sorry no real data on 284 stuff.

 

[JCH]

Damn JCH, looks good. Thanks for the picture. What barrel is it? You said 27" before the brake? Looks like its in an A5, almost the setup I was thinking. I like the a4 but More then likely, cause of funds, mine will be placed in an hs precision tactical with cheek piece.

Looks good. I can't wait to see a range report. Do you have anywhere to shoot beyond 1000?

It's a bartlein in an A3. Yes there are some places here in OK to shoot that far.

 

[anthonylapoint]

Turbo, that thing is beautiful. I know you said the muzzle brake isn't very effective but is it fun to shoot at least? Are you switching to the creedmoor next rebarrel?

I got lucky Jbailey to find a friend with land. As you probably know, Ct sucks for shooting and now with the new laws that Malloy wants to pass, the state is crazy. I can't wait to leave.

Killswitch, 7wsm are a magnum cartridge that require a magnum bolt head and so forth. They are faster then a straight .284 but at the cost of barrel life. They are killing competitions right now. Look on accurateshooter and 6mmbr, they are doing very well.

 

[Killswitch Engage]

Our area matches are being dominated by the 6.5 stuff like cm and 260 and the 6mm stuff does well too. No one seems to run 7mm stuff really right now. I have a friend with a wsm and it is a monster but bad on barrel life

 

[anthonylapoint]

The 6.5 calibers are pretty much the cats meow. My 6x is only a 6mm but it is accurate as all balls and out to 600, its a joke how easy it is to make hits and that's why I want to make a jump to a .284. I feel my 6 is good enough up to medium ranges that a 6.5 may not be a big enough jump. I believe David tubb shoots his 6xc to a mile, that shows just how competent a round the 6mm can be. I'm sure if I loaded hot, I could do well out to 1200 with it. The .284 isn't as much of a monster as the wsm and saum but who gives to shits, I would jump to a 338 if I did. I just need something decent enough out to a mile to justify the jump without being extreme.

 

[raptor99]

I have a 260, 6.5x55 and a 284. The 284 is the best at long range over the 6.5s esp past 1000yds. I shoot the 162 AMAXs out of mine and its a hammer. I have never had a rifle that shoots with less vertical than my 284. I have seveal 5 shot groups at 1000yds that only have a vertical spread of 2"s and the groups sizes are in the 5" range. THe down side is the recoil. I don't use a brake and there is more recoil than with my 6.5s. I love the 6.5s and the 284 but if I had to pick one for long range it would be a 284.

 

[anthonylapoint]

Thanks raptor, I appreciate your experience. I'm most likely putting the most effective muzzle brake i can get on it, either a fat bastard or an fte. That should cut it down to a reasonable amount. I'm looking for a hammer a longer distance so I'm leaning towards a .284, no doubt

 

[Aimsmall55]

Thanks raptor, I appreciate your experience. I'm most likely putting the most effective muzzle brake i can get on it, either a fat bastard or an fte. That should cut it down to a reasonable amount. I'm looking for a hammer a longer distance so I'm leaning towards a .284, no doubt

I disagree sbout the .284 unless its a magnum. My 6.5 creed will shoot well over 1500 yards and is cost effective. Here's 10 at 520 yards.

 

[anthonylapoint]

Damn it aimsmall, I can't take it. I can't make my mind up. What barrel are you running and load if its not secret? H4350 around 41-41.5? 8 twist 26" barrel?

I found myself trying to use your ballistic calculator for a second. I realized it was a picture moments later and laughed at how stupid I am. What app is that? Looks way better then my iStrelok app.

 

[anthonylapoint]

Forgot to mention......what a group. Damn!

 

[Aimsmall55]

Damn it aimsmall, I can't take it. I can't make my mind up. What barrel are you running and load if its not secret? H4350 around 41-41.5? 8 twist 26" barrel?

I found myself trying to use your ballistic calculator for a second. I realized it was a picture moments later and laughed at how stupid I am. What app is that? Looks way better then my iStrelok app.

Haha... Thanks. It's Ballistic AE. My load is 42.4 h4350 with a 140 Berger vld. 2.140 to ogive. Fgm210m. Rifle is a GA Crusader with a 27" bartlein 1:8.5 twist. Nothing too complicated on the reloads. Just neck size to . 001" less than pre fired brass and that gives me the same #'s. fl when I have to but the creedmor brass is so damn good I love loading new brass

 

[anthonylapoint]

No wonder its a shooter, its a Gnats Ass Precision. Well, I can't afford those but I'm hoping to get a bartlien barrel at least, no matter the caliber. I'll look up the ballistic ae, iPad/iPod right? Anyway, great shooting and thanks for the input.