Rifle Scopes The truth about Leupold thread

[hrfunk]

Reading the thread below regarding Leupold Customer Service started me thinking about the various negative comments I've seen over the years directed at Leupold and/or its products. I have no reason to disbelieve anything that has been posted, but I thought I'd start this thread to see if we can get a large enough segment of hide members to comment in order to determine whether the complaints/defects are the exception or the rule. So here's the opportunity to post your experience with Leupy and/or its products positive or negative. Try to be specific about the effects of any problem(s) as to your ability to use the product. For example, if you observed a foreign object inside the tube, did that detract from your ability to use the optic, or did it just aggravate you when you saw it. This distinction will help identify personal expectations/preferences (which are fine, by the way), but the greater question of whether the product would perform its job might not necessarily be impacted. Also, if you just have a preference for a certain brand, reticle, feature, etc. that Leupold doesn't offer, that's not really what I'm after here. I'd like to try to avoid the "Ford-Chevy", "Remington-Winchester", "9mm-.45" sort of debate, and rather focus on actual experience/performance of specific products. I have some definite opinions, but I'm going to hold off on posting them for the moment.

So, with that intro, lets hear the truth about Leupold.

HRF

 

[SomeOtherGuy]

I've bought two Leupold scopes in the last two years, and that's enough for me. Here's why:

#1: I ordered a Leupold VX-R 3-9x42 firedot ballistic reticle from Cabela's shortly after they came to market. When I received it, I found that the ballistic reticle was incredibly lopsided - the bars were twice as thick on the left side of the crosshair as on the right, and not straight lines either. If that passes "quality control" then quality is meaningless. I returned it to Cabela's for a refund without a hassle. I also didn't like the plastic W/E knobs, although the glass clarity seemed very good (this was the most expensive scope I had bought at that time).

#2: I bought a used, as-new unmounted Mark 4 LR/T 3.5-10x40 on another forum. Before buying I had called in the serial # to make sure it was real. I received a real Leupold scope. Clarity was very good, adjustments and overall quality feel were no better than some of my sub-$200 Weavers. There was considerable lint on the glass-etched reticle, so I sent it in to Leupold to have that cleaned. They did clean it without a hassle, but they also put a big, roughly 3/16" circular ding in the ocular bell while it was there. I considered this to be somewhere between carelessness and F-you from them - again there's no way they could have missed it. I'm glad I paid well, well below retail for this scope ($730 I think) and I resold it for about that much, with full disclosure of the ding.

So my aversion to Leupold is this: their quality control seems very poor for both new manufacture and warranty service, and in my opinion their scopes, considering the features, clarity and durability reputation relative to the price, are a poor value compared to many other brands, including Burris, Vortex, Weaver, Bushnell Elite, SWFA SS, and Nightforce.

 

[hrfunk]

Thank you for your candor.

HRF

 

[SouthFork]

I have taken Leupold scopes hunting in Zimbabwe, South Africa, Montana, Idaho, Texas, the Northwest Territories and a bunch of other states. Add my father in the mix and you have a bunch more countries in harsh conditions. I have used them for 100 yard benchrest matches, 1000 yard benchrest matches, and misc in between.

NEVER had a problem and NEVER had to send one back. Guns have been dropped, falled, dinged, gun cases have gouges from the airlines, but still never had a problem with the scope.

And they are made in the USA.

 

[hrfunk]

That reminds me. I meant to put this in the original post. A lot of people mention that Leupold scopes are over priced. If you think that's true, please note why you think they're over priced, and maybe even what you think they SHOULD sell for. Don't misunderstand me here, I WISH they were less expensive. I also wish the same about gas, guns, ammunition, wives, kids, computers, etc.

HRF

 

[GUNNER10]

ive had leupold products when i first started shooting, they were allways decent scopes, that caried a premium, always worked, never had an issue with them. well as i got more experience, i found out about companies like US optics and NF, whom offered better products(glass quality, matching turrets, new milling recticles) and in the case of NF, at rougly the same cost as a standard mk4 LR/T. ended up being a big NF guy for five years untill this past year.

and there was really nothing in leupolds line up that intrested me, and viewed their line up as stagnant and not worth the time or money. not that they were bad scopes, but that they were outclassed by what NF was putting out. that essentailly was my complaint with leupold, they were not able to quickly adapt to the tactical shooting market as fast as in the early 2000's

fast forword to today, and i have done a complete 180 where as i am a big time leupold fan, and have been really put off by NF's odd fixation on SFP scopes. leupolds military discount, the MK6 and 8 line, the ER/T lines with locking turrrets are all things i wish NF would do

 

[roggom]

I commented in the previous post about sub standard customer service, but my overall experience with Leupold products is positive. I think the crux of the problem is the younger generation of CS reps that feel no obligation to task completion (could be older folks as well)

As for evaluation I have owned scopes from Redfield, Vortex, to Nightforce over the years, so my evaluations are based from those in comparison.

VX3 3-9x40 - purchased new online, durable, smooth mag ring, simple and effective. Good in low light/ Has range estimation mag ring.

Vari-x III LRT, purchased used from a hide member, this scope is very nice. FFP, tracks perfectly with M3 turret, can tell its been used well in the field yet functions close to new. Not as bright as the new scopes(VX3), but the scope is from 2003, we have come a long way in coatings.

VX-r 2-7x33 (CDS) This scope is light, compact and just neat, auto led turn-off and on. Smooth mag ring and cds, the bottle cap windage is tight, but I hold for wind. This is the scope I had problems with CS, so nothing wrong with the scope, just the rep.

Redfield Revolution 3-9x40, built in Beaverton by Leupold, not as bright and less contrast as the VX3 but half the price, it is built like a tank (compared to similar scopes, not as durable as the nightforce of course).

I will not have any problem buying another Leupold scope, they are a little pricey but to me the Made in the USA is rather important, I dont give a shit if some of the parts are from Japan, as the bulk of it is made in Oregon. If I run into issues with CS, just ask straight out to speak to someone else.

 

[Tactical]

I have used Leupold scopes professionally for nearly years. They have served me very well. Have I broken one? Yes. Have I broken most every other brand scope out there? Yes. If you treat stuff hard it will sometime break. I run Leupolds on my sniper rifles, carbines and Competition Rifles. They are great scopes

Have I had nothing but great customer service with Leupolds. Absolutely great customer service.

Now during this thirty years of shooting I have noticed that in my opinion many blame their gear because its easier than just admitting they f'd up. Flame me if you will but I have shot enough rifles that where "Fucked up" into one hole to have good reason for my opinion. BY they way on the US Team if we have a rifle not shooting well, we often get a hot shooter to shoot it to see if its the rifle or shooter, and that is with some of the best scope shooters in the world.

 

[Tactical]

Obviously the problems listed above, of bad quality control are not shooter related and Leupold needs to address that if they have not

 

[DeadNoise]

Last hunting season i stripped out the eye piece on my Leupold Tactical binos, called them up told them it was my fault and would pay just wanted them fixed, i paid for shipping there, and they fixed it and returned them free of charge in 3 weeks.

 

[George Az]

I was in Portland and met a few employees, seem like decent folks, men and women who take pride in their product. Genuinely enthusiastic about being at Leupold. Most of them are shooter and have tried their product. That being said, I currently do not own any of their products and this is due to absolute confusion from their website to various models being sold as new and contradicting information. This is not their fault, but it is difficult for me to try an ask the question when I am trying to find parralax on a variety of models and find out if the turrets are finger adjustable or need a tool. There is no excuse for a 3 x 9 x 40 with non finger adjustable turrets, 1/4 inch at 100 yard clicks with fixed parralax not being easily explained between the VX I, VX II, VX III, Vari X, Grand Slam, Rifleman and whatever the heck else all there confusing to me models are. Oh it is easy to figure out the higher end stuff, that is no problem at all. But for me it is easier looking at Burris or Vortex. This is their competition.

I think Leupold has not stayed current. I have been able to speak with real folks at Burris and Vortex which resulted in purchased products. On the other hand Redfield has been doing well, getting out their advertising, making the data readily available and most models are USA made too. I don't own a Redfield yet but the Battlezone which is Phillipines made I think is on a short list.

 

[hrfunk]

Just to clarify, you do know that Redfield is now owned by Leupold, right?

 

[hrfunk]

Ok, I guess I'll jump in here. I currently own 5 Leupold scopes, and several rings & bases. I've always been extremely impressed with their products. I did have one of their rings break under the recoil of a T/C contender, once. A call to CS resulted in a new set of rings delivered to my door within the week. As I recall, that's the only failure I've ever had with one of their products.

As far as their scopes are concerned, I've had a long relationship with this first one. It is a well used 4.5-14X40 Tactical (as I sit here, I can't say for certain whether its a Mark 4 or a Vari X III). This scope replaced the one that was attached to my issued rifle back when I first became a Sniper (1996). The original scope was a Redfield Ultimate Illuminator that I hated! That particular scope had some sort of problem that caused the reticle to blur when I looked through it for any amount of time (yes I tried to adjust the eye-piece, no it didn't help). It also did not have finger-adjustable turrets, nor did it have anything other than a standard duplex reticle. This was the scope that went with me to Sniper school, and it was a pain in the ass.

The first thing I did after completing Sniper school was requisition a new scope. Astonishingly, my request was approved. Still, the department was not going to spring for a top of the line optic, so I ended up with the Leupy tactical. After a year or so of using the Redfield, it was like someone had mounted the Hubble to my rifle. By today's standards, it's not too impressive. Standard Mil-Dot reticle (USMC style), no illumination, adjustable objective not side focus, SFP with .25 MOA clicks. I can hear you all yawning now. But here's what this scope does-1) it provides a bright, clear image, 2) it holds its zero, 3) it tracks reliably every, single time, 4) it allows me to range accurately using the reticle, And to engage reliably using holds, and 4) it allows me consistently maintain an average group size of about .6 MOA out to 300 yards. In short, it does exactly what it was designed to do, and it has done it over, and over, and over, for the past 15 years. How many of us can say the same thing about any other product we purchased a decade and a half ago? This scope has survived bumps, drops, scrapes, rain water, swamp water, freezing temps, hot temps, dust, brush, and probably a few more things that I've forgotten. There may be more modern scopes out there today with features that far exceed those of my Leupy, but its hard to imagine one that would have served me better.

In addition to that scope, I now have two Mark 4's that appear to be just as rock solid as my original scope. A Leupold handgun scope that is likewise a reliable performer, and a spotting scope that is impressive in its own right.

I suspect there are many more happy Leupold owners/users than the negative comments would lead you to believe. I also suspect that many of the negative comments have more to do with popular features that were late comers to the Leupold line than actual poor performance of the products they did offer. But, that's my opinion. I'd still like to know yours.

HRF

 

[CrazyDonkey]

I have owned 3 models and am on my 4th Mk4 right now and never had an issue with any of them.

 

[madppcs]

I have a Mk4 4.5x14 on my Rem700. I think its a great scope. The glass is identical to my NF 3.5x15 moar. I have set this Mk4 next to a few NF scopes, and the glass is equal. The turrets are consistent, and I don't baby the rifle either. Its fallen, knocked over, and even fell out the back of my truck. The scope remains consistent, and the only time I ever had to use customer service is when I had to order a new flip-up scope cover because when the rifle fell out the back of my truck, it broke. Cost me 5$ to ship to me. I wouldn't hesitate to buy a Leup again. It was half the price of a NF, and the only thing it doesn't have is an Illum Ret. But I don't need one on that rifle.

 

[TimK]

I had a MK 4 that had problems, most notably return to zero and a badly canted reticle. After the third trip back to Leupy, they gave up and replaced it. I sold it without even removing it from the box and will likely never go back. I can't fault their willingness to try to fix it, just their ability. They stood behind the product admirably, but I don't want another.

 

[SomeOtherGuy]

Regarding the value issue: The Mark 4 that I owned sells for $1100 new, for a SFP 3.5-10x40 scope with side parallax, turrets, a fairly basic but glass etched reticle, and nothing else.

In comparison:

1) Sightron SIII 3.5-10x44 mil/mil scope. Sells for $650. Very comparable to the Mark 4, but made in Japan, has better glass to my eyes, slightly better turrets, slightly larger objective and therefore exit pupil, and doesn't lag behind in anything I can see. This is the most direct comparison I see to the model I had, and it costs less than 2/3 as much for a better scope.

2) Burris MTAC 3.5-10x42 mil/mil scope. Sells for $400. It is in a lower tier and may not have the same durability as the Mark 4, and the turrets are not as nice. It still has a focus (but objective) and glass clarity is surprisingly good for its price. It also has a second generation mildot with the half-mil ticks, which I like (and it's also a glass-etched reticle). For training use this would be comparable, though admittedly I would not compare it for duty use.

3) SWFA SS 3-9x42 mil/mil scope. $600. Slightly lower magnification and no focus, but FFP reticle with a nice modernized reticle, very rugged, glass is maybe a tiny bit behind the Mark 4, maybe not.

4) Bushnell Elite Tactical 3-12x44 FFP mil/mil. $900. Broader magnification range, equal or better glass clarity, FFP reticle with G2 tree reticle option. It does more than the SFP Mark 4 for $200 less, with no drawbacks I can see.

I don't abuse my stuff and I can't tell you stories of how one of these scopes fell to Alaska from orbit and maintained its zero even though the rest of the rifle was vaporized on impact, or that it has stood up to 1,000,000 rounds of 50 BMG fired in a 6lb carbine. The MTAC is not in the same class as the Mark 4, but the other three seem, to me, to compare well.

The VX-R would have been an OK deal at $500 or so if it hadn't been so ridiculously defective.

 

[hrfunk]

So, how much should the Mark 4 sell for?

 

[AK Sgt Maj]

I have a number of Leupold scopes and have never had a problem with them. The Mark 4 scopes are expensive, but not anywhere near the Night Force. I have 2 VX-2's, 2 VX-3's and 1 Mark-4. I had taken the Mark-4, a 6.5x20 off from my .308 40x and put it on a .284 40X that I built last year. When I got the money to buy a scope for the .284, I would have liked to get another Mark-4 but the VX-3 was $400 cheaper so I got that, and put the Mark-4 back on the .308. I shot my first match last weekend with the VX-3 and the sight settings were exactly the same as they had been with the Mark-4, one being a 6.5x20 and the new one a 8.5x24, out to 600 yards. Not many companies scopes will do that, and I beat all of the other's, including my friends that keep telling me that I should get a Night Force. I think most of the ragging on Leupold is from people who just read and follow, but do not actually try the Leupold's out for themselves.
I do agree with buying good American products.

 

[Name Enough]

I have owned four Leupolds and now own only one. The one I have is a pistol scope mounted on a scout rifle. I have always had a problem with elevation and windage adjustments on the Leupolds. So they got sold. If I am not shooting well I want to know the problem is that nut behind the bolt and not another piece of equipment. I now own mostly Zeiss scopes and shall soon add a Vortex for long range. Could a Leupold tempt me - no not really.
Just one man's opinion.

 

[hrfunk]

Thanks to all. Please keep the comments coming. With regard to those who have mentioned their preference for buying Leupolds because they're American made, I wholeheartedly concur. I'll spend a little more to keep our fellow countrymen employed.

HRF

 

[JFComfort]

When I started long range precision rifle shooting I had a Leupold Mk4 3.5-10x40mm, mrad reticle/0.25 MOA turrets. The scope functioned just like it was supposed to and I wish I would have kept it as a spare, it would be the perfect scope for my .22 LR. I cannot say anything negative about the scope or Leupold. I have spent a very limited amount of time with some of their new offerings and I'm glad to see the direction they are going now.

 

[hrfunk]

I just sold a Vari X II 3-9 Tactical model Last week. I hope I don't end up regretting that!

HRF

 

[Stokes]

I've had nothing but great luck with Leupolds, and the few times I've used customer service, I've received much more benefit than I expected.

 

[OFIS]

My first 'real' scope was a Mk4 3.5-10x40 with a TMR. As I got more into long range, I found myself wishing it hat matched turrets and FFP... I sold it in 2008.

Fast forward to 2013, and Leupold makes the same scope with 1/10 clicks and in FFP. When I needed a second scope to use on secondary rifles, it was just a matter of picking a hide sponsor who had them in stock.

Made in USA is important to me.

 

[jasonZ]

Well I've owned 1 mk4 4.5-14x50 lr/t illuminated mildot. No real complaints on it's working order. I did however think the glass was overrated for the price. When compared to a PST the glass was no better. When compared to the regular viper, the glass was maybe marginally better....maybe. Not really sure if this fits the thread or not. My only point is that I was just not impressed with a $1250 scope that was not better than an $850 scope and only marginally better than a $450 scope. I didn't own it very long really.

 

[tsavo303]

I have at least 10 and a spotting scope (inc 4 mk4s) . all have served well. i did break one when i dropped it , but they repaired it quickly with one email. my dad has the first one he bought used at age 14 or something and 45 years later they refurbed it for free, even though he tried to pay.
everyone has lemons, and cs reps can all be bitches, but i trust leupold.

oh I have tried IOR and NF based upon recommendations and still ended up w/ a leupold. and with the mil/leo deal, I think they are a good value , both my precision rigs have mk4 6.5-20m5s

 

[SomeOtherGuy]

So, how much should the Mark 4 sell for?

I would value the Mark 4 3.5-10x40 LR/T SFP model at $550-600 as a new scope. That's based on glass and an assumption that it's more durable than something like an MTAC, balanced by the modest feature set and the $650 Sightron SIII I mentioned above.

 

[VJJPunisher]

I think I have owned 12 various MK4 lined scopes. I have used them for hunting, plinking, LR, and at work.I have used M3 Ultras for past 16 years off and on. I have no negative comments to add.

I did have to send one in for repair that I had bought second hand for a steal about 2 years ago, it was a fixed 10 M3 that the elevation knob was extremely stiff on so I sent it in to be checked out. It was a scope that was 14 years old, they disassembled the mechanisms, cleaned it up, and put it back together and it came back 16 days later like it was brand new.

Since I am retarded and of old school upbringings I am ok with MIL/MOA(yes i agree not ideal) but I will buy second hand MK4's for bargain prices from dudes dumping "lesser" scopes all day long like donkey kong

 

[SomeOtherGuy]

I do agree with buying good American products.

Does anyone know what the actual US parts content is for currently made Leupolds? I keep seeing the "Made in USA" factor mentioned in their defense, but I have read a lot of suggestions (no hard data) that they are sourcing most or all of their components overseas and just doing final assembly in Oregon. Kind of like some of the US-brand car companies that get all their parts from Mexico or Asia, up to and including the complete engine and transmission, and then pretend you're buying a US car, when the only things that happened in the US were design, marketing, and final assembly. Incidentally the Zeiss Conquest is assembled in the US with parts made in Europe, a mix of German (mechanism, I think) and Czech (glass), if I understand correctly.

I'm under the impression that the most US-made scope you can buy right now, in terms of the origin of parts, is probably Trijicon, though if it's US Optics or some Nightforce models I wouldn't be too surprised.

 

[Gillettehunter]

Perhaps 14 years ago my son and I were out deer hunting. He fell and broke the front "bell" of my leupold vxIII completely off. Sent it in and they replaced it at N/C. Great customer service in this case.
A few years later I missed the opportunity for a shot at a bull elk because of the difference in eye relief at different magnifications. I won't own one of them that has a lot of difference in eye relief at top and bottom magnification.
I will admit to being interested in a 3X18 VX6. New enough that I 'm waiting on some reviews. Bruce

 

[hlee]

There are 3 rifles with Leupold scopes on then sitting in my safe- a 20+ year old vari x ii, a relatively new vx-ii, and a fixed 6x that is at least 20 years old. My dad had at least 5 rifles with Leupold scopes on them- ranging from 30+ y.o. to pretty new. Adding in 2 uncles and a cousin brings the total of Leupold scopes to >20 between the 5 of us. I am the only one to have sent one in for service. The crosshairs appeared blurry and was not correctable by turning the ocular. This was a minor annoyance that opened up my groups some but did not affect the usability for its intended application (deer hunting). I called tech support and a real human answered the phone. She gave me the address to send the scope and said to put a note in the box explaining the problem. I think it took 3 weeks to turn around but one day the scope arrived back on my door. It was packaged well and was no worse for wear from the trip. The service dept had refurbished the scope back to factory new and the somewhat blurry crosshairs had been remedied. All told I was very happy with the service I received. This was 10-12 years ago.

My uncle dropped a 223 handi rifle wearing the shoved mentioned 6x fixed power scope. It landed on the objective bell hard enough to scuff the finish and permanently bend the one piece scope base. The scope, other than the scuff, is no worse for wear and was remounted on the rifle with a new base.

I should point out that neither I nor any of my family members are tactical or competitive shooters and our gear does not see the use, punishment, and neglect that some competition shooting gear is subjected to. But, for hunting I consider the vari x (and VX) line to be the standard, and a value to boot. There well may be better (how ever that is defined) scopes in the same price range but I have not found any. I have never felt that I got less than I paid for from a Leupold scope.

The problem with Internet polls is selection bias. The responses you get are not representative of the general population, because generally only those with something very positive or very negative feel compelled to respond. Think about it; How often do you go to a car forum to announce that "Today I got in my car and it started when I turned the key- just as I suspected it would?" Most customers of most companies are [just] satisfied, however, a very small but vocal minority can make any company sound much better or much worse (this is most common) than a properly sampled population would indicate.

The above notwithstanding, the last scope I purchased was not a Leupold.

 

[roggom]

Does anyone know what the actual US parts content is for currently made Leupolds? I keep seeing the "Made in USA" factor mentioned in their defense, but I have read a lot of suggestions (no hard data) that they are sourcing most or all of their components overseas and just doing final assembly in Oregon. Kind of like some of the US-brand car companies that get all their parts from Mexico or Asia, up to and including the complete engine and transmission, and then pretend you're buying a US car, when the only things that happened in the US were design, marketing, and final assembly. Incidentally the Zeiss Conquest is assembled in the US with parts made in Europe, a mix of German (mechanism, I think) and Czech (glass), if I understand correctly.

I'm under the impression that the most US-made scope you can buy right now, in terms of the origin of parts, is probably Trijicon, though if it's US Optics or some Nightforce models I wouldn't be too surprised.

There is no real "line in the sand" percentage, but on a case by case evaluation. It is all handled by the Fair Trade Commission Complying with the Made in USA Standard | BCP Business Center

 

[GhostFace]

I purchased a 3.5-10 M3 in 03 or 04. It has tracked perfectly up until late last year, it just one day took a dump. I had to send it back to them for repair, they had the scope for a month before it came back to me. I was told to put a note in the box that it was a LE scope and it would be given priority. I did and I know Leupold is a large company and I didn't think it was too long for them. At the same time I sent a newly purchased PST back for grease or something I side the scope. Same note and the s ops was returned to me the very next day!

We (dept) have purchased four 4-14x50 M1s. Three of the four stopped tracking within the first year of purchase. They were a little faster in repair then what my personally owns m3 was.

With that it has been said the other companies have/had surpassed Leupold in options versus value for money. I also read here that sometime in the early 2000s Leupold went with Chinese made internals and when repaired they are replaced with USA parts. I tend to believe this as mine took almost a decade to go tits up but the newer ones was less than a year. As long as Vortex and NF are around I will not buy another Leupold...

 

[dk-1]

I had a mark 4 LRT 4.5-14X40 on my work gun for 4+ years, went through sniper school with it, rode in a car in a soft case for that time, no issues at all. Sold that to fund a NF 3.5-15X50, when I got it I was so dissapointed that I sent it back to NF to evaluate the poor glass and lack of reticle/diopter focus. When they sent it back, saying it was just fine but they had to tweak the diopter a bit, I was still thoroughly unimpressed. I sold that scope and picked up a 10X40 M3 mildot. Great scope for what it was but I wanted variable. Sold that scope and went with a 3.5-10X40 M2 illuminated. Great scope but sold it on a rifle (wish I kept it, I could really use it on my gas gun right now!). Currently running a Mark 6 3-18X44 on my main bolt gun. I have ran SS, Weaver tactical, nikon buckmasters on hunting and plinking rigs, but to me and my taste Leupold tactical scopes are all I could ever want. Never tried USO, Premier, S&B, March and I'm sure they are great, but I'd rather save a bit of coin and put that money into other gear. A perk is that Leupolds are made in the USA and a days woth of transit time from me if I should ever need service.

 

[hornet shooter]

I own two vx2 3-9x50mm, a 3-9x40mm patrol, 3-9x40mm mark ar tmr illuminated, two vx2 6-18x40mm with turrets, and a mark 4 m5 6-20x50mm tmr ffp. They have been dropped out of 12' deer stands, run over, rode hard and put up wet. None of them have ever gone back to leupold I will buy another.

 

[Nysios]

Does anyone know what the actual US parts content is for currently made Leupolds? I keep seeing the "Made in USA" factor mentioned in their defense, but I have read a lot of suggestions (no hard data) that they are sourcing most or all of their components overseas and just doing final assembly in Oregon. Kind of like some of the US-brand car companies that get all their parts from Mexico or Asia, up to and including the complete engine and transmission, and then pretend you're buying a US car, when the only things that happened in the US were design, marketing, and final assembly. Incidentally the Zeiss Conquest is assembled in the US with parts made in Europe, a mix of German (mechanism, I think) and Czech (glass), if I understand correctly.

I'm under the impression that the most US-made scope you can buy right now, in terms of the origin of parts, is probably Trijicon, though if it's US Optics or some Nightforce models I wouldn't be too surprised.

Come here to Oregon and I will take you to the their plant where you can watch the CNC machines pump out part after part for all their scopes. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvLcYQiP4_s

 

[hrfunk]

This thread has now been up for about 24 hours. At this juncture, it looks like there's about a 2 to 1 ratio of positive to negative experiences (keep in mind, I went to public school and arithmetic was not my strong suit!). Still, that's a third of the owners/users who've had problems. We only have 37 posts, though. Please keep the comments coming and let's see how this plays out.

HRF

 

[mosin46]

usually don't get in these threads,but... got my first leupold in 76 after shooting 2 redfields into uselessness on my 338 wm. i have owned several since and as i recall had something wrong with only one of them. sent it back. they couldn't fix it so they sent me a brand new upgraded model,no charge. my experience with high end optics is limited to <$1000 scopes,so don't have the context many here do. better scopes for 1/2 the price? no way. better scopes for twice the price? you bet. same price,some better,some worse? of course. i will say this-that around here at shows etc leupolds hold their value much better than any other because of their long history of no questions asked repair/replacement. i and many others have bought them used and sent them in for no questions asked refurb. who else does that in any other field? not the auto makers,for sure. if you think that all the other companies went to life time repair policies because they love their customers,think again. these other companies went to leupold like quality assurance policies because they had to to compete. do i have leupolds now ? no. other companies have offered features i wanted at a lower price point with (forced by leupold) return/repair policies. would i use leupold again if my situations changed? of course.

 

[dwt]

Nothing but positive from me , lots of Leupold success stories in 35+ yrs of shooting all the games and hunting as well !!!

 

[Redmanss]

Mark 8 here, no problems and love that scope. Have another two Mark 6's waiting for me at the house to try out next leave. I'm not a huge fan of the Mark 4 line, but they function well. I prefer more mil/mil options though, that's all.

 

[RG in Idaho]

I've owned 6 Leupys. I'm down to 4 now. Two MK4's, a MK6 and a 3x9 w/duplex. Never an issue.

Called CS once for some subtension data and was treated with respect and had the info I needed the same afternoon.

 

[McCrazy]

During my military time I have had a total of about 24 Leupold scopes of various types (mostly M3As and Vari-X 3s) under my supervision. I cannot recall any failures with any of them during my time around them.

That said, I have had a M3 on a personal rifle for about 5 years now that tracks perfectly and has given me no issues yet.

Leupold has been slow to adapt to the tactical world which has been disappointing. Also, I really wish they would integrate reticle illumination into a turret rather than the stupid looking extra turret on the ocular bell that gets turned on by accident all the time.

 

[pinkhair]

I've had two MK4's, never had any issues and none needed any kind of repairs while I had them. Plan on getting a MK6 next, hard to beat that FED/MIL pricing leupold offers.

 

[pawprint2]

I own a number of Leupolds and will buy more, regarding the "1/3" of the posters have a complaint, can not be taken as any indication of quality. I'm sure, if you started a thread regarding almost any product, even those that buy ads on this board, you would have a number of complains (if they were allowed by the administrator). The fact is Leupold has been in business decades longer than many of the "new" scope makers, they have millions of happy owners, I don't know how many S and B scopes are sold in the US each year, but it is a fraction, a small fraction, of the number of scopes Leupold sells every month. When comparing how many scopes need fixing, it is funny that many scopes that have needed service, and that Leupold fixes, have been in service longer than many of the "new" scope companies have been in business. I rather see a comparison of like costs, for example is it fair to compare a VX-2 with any S and B? Along with years in service.

 

[hrfunk]

I don't expect that the results here will amount to anything remotely scientific. I just wanted to provide a thread that might indicate a trend among those who are good enough to post a response. Thanks.

HRF

 

[Niles Coyote]

After a long and detailed talk to CS rep about what I needed I ordered a M2 (.5 moa) dial for my mk4, they sent a dial for a .5 moa hunting scope and from the look of it a very old model... after several emails and a phone call I gave up getting the right turret. (This was just a standard turret, nothing custom) after 4-6 months it shows up in the mail.

I called once to see it I could convert my m3 turrets to m2, it was any old scope and I gave full details on what I had. Was told yes no problem and got a quote. When I had the money and was done using the rifle for hunting that year I called back to advise I was sending it and then told that they dont do that.

I have had 5 mk4's and 1 (pre mk4) vx-III m3 long range. That older one is head shoulders better in every way to the mk4's. It was more robust construction, better image when looking through it, turret feel, adjusted in moa and agreed with JBM generated drops (I never put it through a true adjustment test but if it was off it was so small it was lost in the environmental’s ). Not one of my 5 mk4's have every matched that scope even with their tuned indexing and supposed better, newer coatings. However, I had another vxIII that was just a standard 30mm long range hunting scope that also had noticeably improved image compared to my mk4's.

I have had one mk4 with noticeable cant in the reticle but lived with it until I couldn’t and upgraded to a different brand.

That’s my issues with Leupold. Now, there are two fellow long range shooters that are members of my range that I have personally talked to. One had a tracking issue that would dial just fine to your distance but when you came back to your zero it was not repeatable(in other words you would be where you zeroed it) that scope went back 3 times and never was right. The other was similar but it was mostly inconsistent when dialed. It too was sent back and worked for a bit... then went back to its old ways, I believe he said it is now a 22lr scope that does not get dialed...

On price/quality.

They were cheaper when they were privately owned and had a reputation for high quality then they went public and it was like a switch was thrown “how fast can we make them and lets maximize profits and charge 3-5 hundred more” overnight. Suddenly, or shall I say “Coincidentally” just after this time we have exact replicas showing up from Asia (minus the design of the illumination knob)...

I still consider the Standard Mk4 to be an ok value if you can get them at around five-six hundred. Newer features would bump that up a little. But YOU must understand that YOU are the quality control technician. I don’t doubt that the Mk6 and Mk8 are better but I am not going to risk the cash to find out even at promotive or mil/leo pricing, it’s just not worth the hassle to me when other options are out there. Depending on the price scale you are buying at... much better options are out there.

 

[sniperdude]

same here, but being that I do hear some other stories about them, as soon as I get a new one I test it for repeatability and operation, still haven't had a problem. I did have a 36x br scope and thought there was a crack in the inner lens , so I called cs , turned out to be a small piece of lint, was cleaned and returned in about 10 days

I've had nothing but great luck with Leupolds, and the few times I've used customer service, I've received much more benefit than I expected.

 

[hrfunk]

Nearly 1000 views and less than 50 responses? C'mon guys, everyone is waiting to read YOUR comments!

HRF

 

[KYpatriot]

I have had no problems with them. I care more about tracking and return to zero than glass, but I think the glass on them is better than most other scopes in the price range to include NF. with the mil/leo discount they are a no brainer, at retail price they are still cheaper than NF for comparable features. I do think the NF is more heavily constructed and would be able to survive a drop better.