Rifle Scopes Vortex glass/Savage action elevation issues?

[AZ.noob]

I hope this isn't a duplicate, I looked back a ways and could find little bits here & there, but nothing definitive; so here it goes:

Is it a foregone conclusion that a 20 MOA base on a Savage 10 action will prohibit a Vortex Viper from zeroing inside of 200-300 yards? Limits of elevation travel, I get that; the (tops of) Savage actions and barrels are two different planes, I get that too. Is it a certainty?

You might've guessed: I've got glass on the way; already have rings & a 20 MOA base; will I need to run a zero-MOA base?

 

[Fenix Mike]

I hope this isn't a duplicate, I looked back a ways and could find little bits here & there, but nothing definitive; so here it goes:

Is it a foregone conclusion that a 20 MOA base on a Savage 10 action will prohibit a Vortex Viper from zeroing inside of 200-300 yards? Limits of elevation travel, I get that; the (tops of) Savage actions and barrels are two different planes, I get that too. Is it a certainty?

You might've guessed: I've got glass on the way; already have rings & a 20 MOA base; will I need to run a zero-MOA base?

Yep... Two different scopes on a Savage 10 FCP 5R 308 and both couldnt get zero. First was a PST 4-16 SFP and second was a PST 4-16 FFP. the first Vortex was 3 inches high at 100 yards with 168 gr Hornady and the turret bottomed out on a Nightforce 20 MOA base, second vortex is 10 inches high at 100 yards with 168 gr GMM on the same rifle (sold it to my moms bf so I still get to shoot it and zero it for him). Calulating that into the equation, once I got out to distance everything else was fine and the Savage was incredibly consistent in the shots. I called Vortex and they said it had something to do with the Savage rifles and they had heard of the problems prior to and only with the Savage rifles. Using the ballistics calculators the gun now has a "400 yard zero" and our steel we shoot at starts at 500, so it didnt really bother me too much. I can see it as an annoyance though for those shooting under that distance. FWIW, the Nightforce 3.5-15x56 I put on there after didnt have the same issues, but I believe it has a lot more elevation adjustment.

 

[AZ.noob]

Thanks Mike, I appreciate the first-hand knowledge
Considering all this stuff is getting rubber banded/ziptied to the top of essentially the same rifle as you speak of, I'd better re-think my parts and pieces. I'm relatively new to LR (a year or so) and I'm not reaching out to the supersonic limits of the 308 Win cartridge just yet, but I'm working towards that end. In the mean while, my local range is 200 yard max. Of course the Sonoran desert is really big

 

[BoilerUP]

I run an EGW 20MOA base on a Savage 10FP action with 260 Rem barrel...no issues whatsoever achieving a 100yd zero with a Bushnell 4200 Tactical 6-24x50FFP (48MOA adjustment) or Vortex Viper HS 5-15x44 (75MOA adjustment).

 

[Fenix Mike]

Thanks Mike, I appreciate the first-hand knowledge
Considering all this stuff is getting rubber banded/ziptied to the top of essentially the same rifle as you speak of, I'd better re-think my parts and pieces. I'm relatively new to LR (a year or so) and I'm not reaching out to the supersonic limits of the 308 Win cartridge just yet, but I'm working towards that end. In the mean while, my local range is 200 yard max. Of course the Sonoran desert is really big

That rifle is a tack driver at any distance and the vortex scopes are crystal clear all the way out! I got "bored" shooting to 1,000 meters with it using 175 gr GMM because it just wasnt a challenge once everything was dialed in. I switched to a remington chassis system just to have a new toy and get the max I can get out of 308 before jumping back into a magnum cartridge, sounds like it should last you forever though!

 

[AZ.noob]

Thanks once again

It's been a ton of fun so far, with a 4x12 Nikon Monarch I had sitting around. Decent glass, but only so-so; thus the step-up.

With very little load development, it's consistently .5moa at 200 yards. Under 200 rounds down the bore, so it's still settling in. I haven't even done Phase II of my ladder yet, at smaller powder charge increments; I intend on doing that at 4-500 yards (out in the desert), thus I'm waiting on the new glass to proceed.

I really enjoy precision shooting; I didn't know what all I was missing all these years... while burning up hundreds of rounds a day through autoloaders with little to show for it. Now, I can spend the better part of the day at the range, and only go through 50-60 rounds. And advance my skills every time out. Good stuff

 

[Fenix Mike]

Thanks once again

It's been a ton of fun so far, with a 4x12 Nikon Monarch I had sitting around. Decent glass, but only so-so; thus the step-up.

With very little load development, it's consistently .5moa at 200 yards. Under 200 rounds down the bore, so it's still settling in. I haven't even done Phase II of my ladder yet, at smaller powder charge increments; I intend on doing that at 4-500 yards (out in the desert), thus I'm waiting on the new glass to proceed.

I really enjoy precision shooting; I didn't know what all I was missing all these years... while burning up hundreds of rounds a day through autoloaders with little to show for it. Now, I can spend the better part of the day at the range, and only go through 50-60 rounds. And advance my skills every time out. Good stuff

Try precision shooting with an autoloader My Sig 716 will shoot right next to the Savage up until about 800 meters, above that the extra barrel length and ability to run better ammo puts the bolt action ahead. I can still hit 1000m with the Sig, just not as consistently as the Savage and sometimes takes a couple to get on target since the bullets go subsonic before they hit.

 

[AZ.noob]

Actually, trying to apply precision marksmanship principles to my autoloaders (223/556) is what frustrated me to the point that I wanted a different platform.

Obviously still well supersonic at only 200 yards, but 1.5moa is about the best I could consistently squeeze out of them. Not custom race guns, but high-quality pieces. 3" groups @ 200 yards... and seeing the bolt gun guys with one ragged hole at the same distance... made me say "I want some of that" and now there's a hole in my wallet

 

[2ac]

Hmm, good to know. I'll soon be finishing up my 10pc, have the rings and optic. Guess I should go with a zero moa rail, seeing as I only have 200 yards to shoot right now.

 

[glassbeaver]

I have a 110 and a 10fcp and no issues obtaining a 100 yard zero with a 4-16 pst, razor, or 5-25 falcon menace with an EGW 20 MOA rail.

 

[bodywerks]

I didn't have any trouble zeroing with a 20moa Base and vortex pst scope. Something is amiss.

 

[Fenix Mike]

I didn't have any trouble zeroing with a 20moa Base and vortex pst scope. Something is amiss.

Who knows, matching Vortex rings, and Vortex knew of the issue already with the Savage so I know I wasnt the first one to have the issue. Maybe it was the NF base. Same setup with the Nightforce scope was fine though.

 

[BoilerUP]

What specific type of Viper did you have?

 

[AZ.noob]

The fellas who've posted here saying they've NOT had problems zeroing were using EGW bases... coincidentally, I have an EGW base. I'll slap it all together and see if it hits the broad side of a barn before I go out and buy more stuff.

There's a good shop just up the road from my local range (I'm spoiled) so if I run into any problems, I can run over and pick up something different. Or, I have a zero-MOA two-piece Weaver setup I could try as well.

Thanks y'all for the replies

 

[bodywerks]

What specific type of Viper did you have?

Who you asking? Mine was a 4-16 pst

 

[EL34]

Does anyone know if these are older Savages, or later models? Sounds almost like some of the Savage receivers might have some cant in them already?

 

[mailman]

I have a savage 10 (4.25" spacing, old style) barrelled in 260. EGW 20 moa base. Vortex matching rings with a vortex viper pst 6-24 ffp. I was able to get a one hundred yard yero but it only left me with 29 moa's to come up. Also had to use an o ring under the shims to set the zero stop because there weren't enough for where my zero was. I'm new so I'm confused about going to a zero base instead of the egw 20. If that helps anyone I'm interested to know too. Good luck with your set up AZnoob.

 

[jdgray]

My Savage 10FP had zero issues zeroing my VXIII at 100yrds, and very close to mechanical zero too... My 0 moa Farrell base did need bedding in the rear, but that would have lost elevation had I not checked the receiver levelness, and tweeked the base tight.

 

[bodywerks]

I have a savage 10 (4.25" spacing, old style) barrelled in 260. EGW 20 moa base. Vortex matching rings with a vortex viper pst 6-24 ffp. I was able to get a one hundred yard yero but it only left me with 29 moa's to come up. Also had to use an o ring under the shims to set the zero stop because there weren't enough for where my zero was. I'm new so I'm confused about going to a zero base instead of the egw 20. If that helps anyone I'm interested to know too. Good luck with your set up AZnoob.

Your setup sounds about normal. If you went with a 20 MOA base you'd be set.

 

[bodywerks]

Does anyone know if these are older Savages, or later models? Sounds almost like some of the Savage receivers might have some cant in them already?

Doesn't matter. There was never a savage receiver made with can't built in...

 

[Fenix Mike]

Does anyone know if these are older Savages, or later models? Sounds almost like some of the Savage receivers might have some cant in them already?

mine was brand new, production earlier this year.

 

[EL34]

Doesn't matter. There was never a savage receiver made with can't built in...

I did'nt mean to imply it had cant "Built" in, but that the reciever may be higher on the rear, than the front. Not something deliberate on Savages part.

 

[fireEMT5]

For what it's worth, I have a Savage 10 PC - .308 bought new a year ago. Have a Seekins 20 MOA base bedded on top. Have had a SS 3-9 and a SS 5-20 mounted to it using Aadland triple lug low rings. Have never had a problem zeroing either scope to a 100 yd zero. A buddy of mine has a Savage Cabela's exclusive .308 with Cholte stock. We had a hell of time getting that thing sighted in - Couldn't hit a 4'x5' cardboard at 100 yds. We tried everything. Incidentally he had a Vortex PST 6-24 also. The scope checked out fine - Vortex really worked hard to rule out any scope problems. Turned out it was a barrel problem. He sent the rifle back to Savage and they replaced the barrel under warranty - 3 week turn around if I remember right. Savage never really said what the exact issue was, but when the gun came back it was and still is capable of shooting clover leaves.