Redding FL/NK sizing die jumping all over the place! Help please

[SDmtnbkr]

Hi, So I have the Redding FL/NK sizing die (the NON-bushing one) and I've been having issues with it ever since I got it and would love to know if it's something I'm doing, normal, or something is jacked up!

I have a lot of 50 fire formed brass that I shot last week. Dadum measures 1.624 - 1.626 on my Hornady Headspace tool attachment. So I screw the die in on the first case that's 1.624 until it bums .001. Move it a tiny touch more and get 1.622 (as I want to bump them all back to 1.622 to be uniformed). Next case goes in (1.625) comes out 1.622.5, which is acceptable to me. Next case come outs 1.622.

Ok good to go, so I get ready to start sizing away planning to check every 5th one, but I get a wild OCD hair up my ass and decide to check the next one... 1.624! Wha? So I put it aside and do another, same, 1.624! WTF. I do one more 1.623! NOW I KNOW the die hasn't moved because I kept a close eye on it after it doing something similar to this last week.

So I adjust the die and reset those ones to 1.622. Two more, both 1.622, good to go.... one more 1.623.5, 1.623 next one 1.622!


What the hell?! I know the die is seated tight, and not moving. Is this normal? Now I know how to trouble shoot... the first thing I thought of is that my digital calipers were playing a sick joke on me. But I remeasured every case 10 times by now and they all keep reading the same every time for that individual case, so I know it's not the calipers.

 

[sentry1]

I have this problem with my RCBS dies and .223 brass. Brass comes out over/under the ideal length. I've been wondering what the cause is.

 

[Kreeper]

Raise the ram on the press all the way to the die? Screw the die in until the press arm raises a bit,(you might need to raise the arm by hand in some cases just a bit) then lock in the die by pushing the press arm back until it gives you that little bump. Then tighten the ring on your die and tighten the screw. This will make the die level, sometimes the die is at an angle if its not supported. Another is to put a rubber o ring under the ring and set your die the same way. This should adjust for an uneven die. Good luck

 

[SDmtnbkr]

Raise the ram on the press all the way to the die? Screw the die in until the press arm raises a bit,(you might need to raise the arm by hand in some cases just a bit) then lock in the die by pushing the press arm back until it gives you that little bump. Then tighten the ring on your die and tighten the screw. This will make the die level, sometimes the die is at an angle if its not supported. Another is to put a rubber o ring under the ring and set your die the same way. This should adjust for an uneven die. Good luck

Not sure if I understand this..... I raise the ram all the way and then screw the die until it hits the ram, then back off the die a tiny bit and start screwing it down a little more every time until I start bumping the shoulder. So you're saying that I need to put pressure on the die somewhere when I tighten the lock ring so that it's level in the threads???

**Also, in case it matters I'm using Lapua brass on it's 3rd load (bought new), RCBS rock chucker in .308

 

[Kreeper]

Yes always support all dies with the ram (make sure the shell holder is on the ram). Adjust die 1/8 at a time until the arms raises were if you push on it the press should give you a little bump at its most extended position. Then tighten the ring, this will level the die and give you proper shoulder bump. I load 338 lm had the same problem until i noticed the die sitting a little uneven. So i supported the die and eliminated inconsistent readings.


I ALSO USE 338 LAPUA BRASS AND FL SIZE, MY READINGS ARE VERY CONSISTENT WHEN I USE THIS METHOD.

 

[427Cobra]

Your over working your brass, use the longest measurement to setup your FL die, in your case 1.626, as for the inconsistency in bump, because your bumping too much your lube Technique, too much too little is the reason why.

 

[SDmtnbkr]

Your over working your brass, use the longest measurement to setup your FL die, in your case 1.626, as for the inconsistency in bump, because your bumping too much your lube Technique, too much too little is the reason why.

Sorry I don't understand your comment, could you please clarify?

So first part: I'm overworking the brass. - Why would I use the longest measurement to size if there are cases shorter? All the cases were from 1.624-1.626 ...so by using 1.626 I would literally be doing nothing. The ones that are shorter would stay shorter and the ones that were longer would stay longer. Doesn't make sense to me, please help me understand.

ETA: Oh I take it you meant use the longest number to use to bump back .002... right? So I would be bumping everything to 1.624. Is that what you meant?

Second: "because your bumping too much your lube Technique, too much too little is the reason why" ...I must be reading this incorrectly because I can't make sense of it. My lube technique?

Thanks for the help!

 

[FLIGHT762]

Lubing the cases consistently/ evenly can help the bump issues. Work hardening of the brass can cause the brass to bump and spring back at different rates, that's why some anneal their cases. Cases will usually bump very even after annealing. Another thing that can cause uneven bumping is not lubing the inside of the case necks. When you pull that sizing button back through the neck on the up stroke, very dry and/or thick necks can pull the shoulder slightly forward.

I've done a lot of experimenting and measuring shoulder bump and I've found some of these things to cause uneven bumping.

 

[former naval person]

Agree with flight762. Polish the insides of the case neck with 0000 steel wool on a spinning bronze brush. Clean inside after each firing. Anneal every 4th time or so. Lube inside the neck with graphite dry lube. Use a body die for bumping and a Lee Collet die for necks. Works for me.

 

[sentry1]

Lubing the cases consistently/ evenly can help the bump issues. Work hardening of the brass can cause the brass to bump and spring back at different rates, that's why some anneal their cases. Cases will usually bump very even after annealing. Another thing that can cause uneven bumping is not lubing the inside of the case necks. When you pull that sizing button back through the neck on the up stroke, very dry and/or thick necks can pull the shoulder slightly forward.

I've done a lot of experimenting and measuring shoulder bump and I've found some of these things to cause uneven bumping.

I've noticed that as well. I annealed a batch of range pickup brass, and it came out sized very close, while a bunch of LC brass that I had only washed and lubed came out uneven sizes.

Making sure the necks are lubed inside is a pain when you're doing hundreds of cases, could I just get around this by using a bushing sizing die to avoid expanding the necks?

 

[FLIGHT762]

Making sure the necks are lubed inside is a pain when you're doing hundreds of cases, could I just get around this by using a bushing sizing die to avoid expanding the necks?

Yes, you could get around the pulling the button expander through the necks by using a bushing die or a Lee collet die with a Redding body die. For my AR's in .223 I use the standard button through the neck dies. I don't worry about a couple of thousandths difference in bumping for them. For my L/R bolt guns and my SR-25, I do use bushing dies.

I did buy a Lee neck collet die and a Redding body to use in my .223 Rem. bolt gun though.

You just have to justify to yourself if the expense of the bushing dies and the bushings (you will probably need 2 or more) are worth it for you. I use 5 TiN S bushings for my 308's. That's about $115.00 in bushings alone.

 

[SDmtnbkr]

Lubing the cases consistently/ evenly can help the bump issues. Work hardening of the brass can cause the brass to bump and spring back at different rates, that's why some anneal their cases. Cases will usually bump very even after annealing. Another thing that can cause uneven bumping is not lubing the inside of the case necks. When you pull that sizing button back through the neck on the up stroke, very dry and/or thick necks can pull the shoulder slightly forward.

I've done a lot of experimenting and measuring shoulder bump and I've found some of these things to cause uneven bumping.

This is great info thanks! The cases were brand new Lapua and this was only the 2nd time I've sized them so I'm sure the brass is still pretty tough. I'm sure I'll be anealing them in the short future. I always lube the necks really good using One Shot and spaying right down the necks, but maybe not as good as I thought. That and the combo of the newer brass could be the culprit.

I actually have the Lee Collet neck sizing die. When I was learning my friend was explaining that I might want to only use a body die and the collet neck die. I'm still on the fence and not sure. It seems like a lot of people swear by the bushing dies, but I've heard many opinions on only using my Redding die as a body sizer and finishing with the collet die. I'll have to do some more research as I feel like I'm in between the two right now just using the basic redding FL/NK sizing die and the extra money isn't an issue at all... just wanna figure out what method works the absolute best for me and stick with it!

Thanks again!

 

[Mad_Charlie]

I know this is a month old thread, but no one has suggested the Redding shell holder set.

It sure cleaned up a lot of shoulder bump inconsistency for me.

 

[SDmtnbkr]

I know this is a month old thread, but no one has suggested the Redding shell holder set.

It sure cleaned up a lot of shoulder bump inconsistency for me.

I've actually figured out what was wrong...... me!

Well me and my shitty bench. My bench top isn't the best and it flexes very easily, so when I would push too hard at the bottom of the cam the bench would flex more and add a .0005 to .001. I figured out that by having a more consistent pull of the arm and more consistent pressure (not pushing really hard on at the end of the throw) my cases are all now very consistent.

This was also happening with my seating die as well, and now I set the seating die so that I literally just let the handle fall until it stops and all my bullets seat within .0005 of each other. And to be honest, if I had the time and inclination to check every single one, making tiny pressure adjustments I could make them all identical to the 10 thousand of an inch. Absolutely amazing die... once you figure out how to use it correctly.