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Wierd thing happened at the range Saturday

phillip61

phillip61

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Jun 14, 2012
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About half way into my shooting spree a guy shows up with an awesome looking rifle case. The guy himself was built like John Sena, just freaking huge. He has this buddy with him (normal looking guy). A guy on my right starts talking with the big fella and he starts saying he was deployed at one time, spent 4 years with the Marines. The normal looking guy starts in about how he was deployed and spent most of his time training with "Seals". In the mean time the big guy unloads this awesome looking rifle, I mean sweet. They go down range and put up a target, come back and start shooting. They're right beside me so i'm looking thru my scope and see the guy is hitting the target but is no where near 1moa, more like 3-4 moa.

So at one point I ask the guy what kind of rifle it was. He didn't give me a name but started rattling off part names. It's got this kind of barrel, this kind of stock, this kind of butt pad, this went on and on. I was looking at his scope and thought that thing looks really small. I ask him what power it was and he said............"I'm not real sure, maybe it says it on here some where". I was stunned. He then starts to look all over the scope and finally says "I don't see it on here anywhere, but I was ringing a 10" plate @ 1500yds last week, it's dead on". I then ask what grain bullet he shot and again he said "man I'm not sure, I just bought what gander mountain had in stock". A guy on the other side of me ask was he shooting a 308. The big guy said yes, but when I ask about the ammo I looked at the rounds he showed me and they were bigger than my 308. I'm guessing 300WM.

At that point I just loaded up my stuff and left......them guys was making me nervous.
 
Idiots make me laugh sometimes... and it seems they're always claiming to be former special forces, etc. Publicly accessible ranges are the best for this type of entertainment. I accompanied my future father in law to the pistol range yesterday, and he shoots at an indoor publicly accessible private range (I usually avoid such places because they have too many rules: no "fast" shooting, no holster draws, etc). Anyway, the place was packed when we were there, and although the range allows for 20 yard shots, not a single person was shooting beyond 7 yards. Everyone had full-sized silhouette targets set up, and most of them couldn't even hit those targets reliably at 3-7 yards. A guy next to me was shooting a very nice looking Wilson Combat 1911. His grip, trigger squeeze, and overall form were just horrible, and he'd just dump the mag every time he raised the gun. Despite having a 3ftx4ft piece of target paper, he was barely on target at 5 yards.

In another instance I ran into a guy at a shooting club I used to belong to. He was shooting a nice .50BMG, and was kind enough to let everyone around him try shooting it as well. But, the poor guy couldn't manage to hit a normal sized pumpkin at 100-200 yards with the rifle. I felt sorry for him, since some folks were kind of rudely making fun of him there, but he just simply didn't know how to run his gun... having the money doesn't always mean that you have the skill!
 
Chances are : He wasn't ringing anything @ 1500yrs, not even a cellphone,;)
and none of them was deployed ,
the one training with the seals he meant the animal seals in the circus,
And if I was you I would done the same thing get the eck out of dodge :D before I could get shot or get my ass kicked by the big guy:rolleyes:
 
phillip61 said:
About half way into my shooting spree a guy shows up with an awesome looking rifle case. The guy himself was built like John Sena, just freaking huge. He has this buddy with him (normal looking guy). A guy on my right starts talking with the big fella and he starts saying he was deployed at one time, spent 4 years with the Marines. The normal looking guy starts in about how he was deployed and spent most of his time training with "Seals". In the mean time the big guy unloads this awesome looking rifle, I mean sweet. They go down range and put up a target, come back and start shooting. They're right beside me so i'm looking thru my scope and see the guy is hitting the target but is no where near 1moa, more like 3-4 moa.

So at one point I ask the guy what kind of rifle it was. He didn't give me a name but started rattling off part names. It's got this kind of barrel, this kind of stock, this kind of butt pad, this went on and on. I was looking at his scope and thought that thing looks really small. I ask him what power it was and he said............"I'm not real sure, maybe it says it on here some where". I was stunned. He then starts to look all over the scope and finally says "I don't see it on here anywhere, but I was ringing a 10" plate @ 1500yds last week, it's dead on". I then ask what grain bullet he shot and again he said "man I'm not sure, I just bought what gander mountain had in stock". A guy on the other side of me ask was he shooting a 308. The big guy said yes, but when I ask about the ammo I looked at the rounds he showed me and they were bigger than my 308. I'm guessing 300WM.

At that point I just loaded up my stuff and left......them guys was making me nervous.
Click to expand...

This is a common occurance. I also leave when they do something unsafe. I used to try and educate idiots; however, I've learned that most are beyond help.
 
Never enter into discourse with an idiot, he'll just bring you down to his level and beat you with experience.
 
This is why I love where I live. I never go to the ranges. I drive 12 miles away into the desert and just seek my peace. There is literally miles and miles to shoot. Heres an example of where I was on Sunday. I was shooting from the smaller greener ridge in front of the large Mt. range behind. The distance I was shooting was 600 yards from where I was laying to the target. Shooting my AR-15 just taking my time, getting some sun and enjoying the learning experience. Nobody was around for miles. Wifey was actually my spotter for the day against her will of course.
 

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Worst experience at the range. The yokels next to me were convinced the 7mm mag they had purchased was defective. I helped a little and got it on paper so they could zero it. I did not see them hand it to their 9 year old nephew who fired it and screamed as the scope kissed him. He then commenced to bleed and cry. They packed up and left. The idiots had bought a nine year old boy a 7mm mag for his first gun and then could not understand why that he could not handle it. The kid probably thinks shooting is highly overrated.
I don't disapprove of public access ranges where the range officers can instruct those who are clueless as to how firearms should be handled. The range where I shoot they always ask "is this your first time here?. If so they haul out the rules sheet and go over it with them.
 
Name Enough said:
Worst experience at the range. The yokels next to me were convinced the 7mm mag they had purchased was defective. I helped a little and got it on paper so they could zero it. I did not see them hand it to their 9 year old nephew who fired it and screamed as the scope kissed him. He then commenced to bleed and cry. They packed up and left. The idiots had bought a nine year old boy a 7mm mag for his first gun and then could not understand why that he could not handle it. The kid probably thinks shooting is highly overrated.
I don't disapprove of public access ranges where the range officers can instruct those who are clueless as to how firearms should be handled. The range where I shoot they always ask "is this your first time here?. If so they haul out the rules sheet and go over it with them.
Click to expand...


The Range I go to is small and a "Shoot at your own risk" range. There is no-one there over seeing anything.
 
Public ranges NEED many rules such as no fast firing, no drawing from the holster because of all those with no experience that come and put everyone else in harms way. That's why I avoid public ranges.
 
40xs said:
Public ranges NEED many rules such as no fast firing, no drawing from the holster because of all those with no experience that come and put everyone else in harms way. That's why I avoid public ranges.
Click to expand...

That same day when I arrived there was two guys on the first two shooting spots that had full silhouette targets set up about 12 feet in front of them. The conversation they were having went something like this. "So if you were in a 7-11 and a robber came in waving a gun, would you take him out? The other guy, well, it would depend on whether or not I thought he was gonna shoot me. The first guy, OK, if your in the bathroom at the 7-11 and you hear the place being robbed, do you come out slinging lead or stay in there and fiend for your self"? And this went on and on.

Later is when the big guy and his buddy showed up, but right before I left one of the guys at the other end pulled a AR-15 looking weapon out and emptied 50 rounds into one of the silhouettes that was still about 12 feet in front of him. Thats when I hit the road. I've been scanning the local newspaper to see if there was any reports of people being injured out the range that day!
 
Isn't everyone that shoots cool guns Navy SEALS? Didn't you get the memo?
 
LOL @ Ranges. Ill never understand why people insist on going to a range instead of loading up gear and heading miles and miles away from everyone...
 
6xcKY said:
LOL @ Ranges. Ill never understand why people insist on going to a range instead of loading up gear and heading miles and miles away from everyone...
Click to expand...

Yeah but, while that may be MUCH safer, it's not near as comical.
 
Anyone here from NY and been to the calverton shooting range?
Fun times.
 
Madzooki said:
That's not possible in Texas unless you own land or know somebody that does.

Paul
Click to expand...

It's the same here in southeast PA.

My last time at the public range (no ROs at public ranges around here) some douchenozzle swept the firing line a few times with his rifle, and I'm sure he didn't even realize he was doing it.

No one said anything so I went over and politely suggested that he keep the muzzle pointed downrange before someone with a shorter fuse than me put a few rounds into him.

Time before that, two Asian couples with poor grasp of the English language came straight from the gun show with an SKS, and they were pulling the same kind of inconsiderate and downright dangerous crap. I don't know why I'm always the one to get involved when the range is filled to capacity, but there I am, slowly over-enunciating the words to my version of range safety, accompanied by lots of gestures. No one died.

I joined my first private club after that.

Joe
 
Out west you have miles and miles of open land to shoot. Out east, you either have your own land or are subject to public shooting ranges..
 
phillip61 said:
About half way into my shooting spree a guy shows up with an awesome looking rifle case. The guy himself was built like John Sena, just freaking huge. He has this buddy with him (normal looking guy). A guy on my right starts talking with the big fella and he starts saying he was deployed at one time, spent 4 years with the Marines. The normal looking guy starts in about how he was deployed and spent most of his time training with "Seals". In the mean time the big guy unloads this awesome looking rifle, I mean sweet. They go down range and put up a target, come back and start shooting. They're right beside me so i'm looking thru my scope and see the guy is hitting the target but is no where near 1moa, more like 3-4 moa.

So at one point I ask the guy what kind of rifle it was. He didn't give me a name but started rattling off part names. It's got this kind of barrel, this kind of stock, this kind of butt pad, this went on and on. I was looking at his scope and thought that thing looks really small. I ask him what power it was and he said............"I'm not real sure, maybe it says it on here some where". I was stunned. He then starts to look all over the scope and finally says "I don't see it on here anywhere, but I was ringing a 10" plate @ 1500yds last week, it's dead on". I then ask what grain bullet he shot and again he said "man I'm not sure, I just bought what gander mountain had in stock". A guy on the other side of me ask was he shooting a 308. The big guy said yes, but when I ask about the ammo I looked at the rounds he showed me and they were bigger than my 308. I'm guessing 300WM.

At that point I just loaded up my stuff and left......them guys was making me nervous.
Click to expand...

I had two phone calls from SEAL supply gunny wanting to purchase backpacks and traps, they did spend time in Alaska training and I talked them so I can claim I trained with SEALs too! And they were deployed so I guess I also can claim I was deployed with SEALs.

Toucan Sam is everywhere.

This story happens daily working at a gun shop. Darn near everyday, some one claimed to be SF, SEAL or real bad juju. I had claims of CIA and he could not revel his identity on 4473 and that it was SOP to just let him have what ever firearm he wanted charged to the gov and one of the strangest claimed he was Massad. The goofiest was, a 18 year old kid, 5'5" and pear shaped around 250lbs was wearing a Delta patched operator hat, and of course he claimed he was Delta home from ops wanting to buy his next whizzpop lazer beam for his next op.

I had guys come in heeled with a drop down sporting Bersa or Highpoint on each thigh, multicam on, claiming all sorts of stuff when most of them barely know the deadly end of firearms, had them that could not even use slide stop claiming they were not qualified on that weapon so they do not understand how it works but they will order one at their base so then can get qual'd.
 
The exact opposite happened to me at the range. I started talking to an average looking kid(early 20's) because I noticed his GAP rifle. He told me he just got it recently and this was the first time he shot handloads out of it and was doing some load development. When we examined his target, he had 3 separate 3 shot groups that were between 1/8 MOA(looked like one bullet hole) and 3/8 MOA and they were all exactly 3/4" right of the bulleye's that he set up. I know a lot of you guys can shoot like this but this was the first time I saw someone do it in real life.

I learned two things from this. I need to get better at shooting, and GAP's are pretty amazing rifles.
 
I have shot with REAL SF guys, LE firearms instructors, and folks who have BTDT. This doesn't automatically make them great precision shooters.

In civy life now, I notice at the open courses I take, that the MIL/LE students often perform the worse than the plumbers and salesmen in class.
 
Wierd thing happened at the range Saturday

Being a wannabe doesn't always stop when one gets the job. I've met plenty of people who have the qualifications they claim and yet remain both ego-driven and clueless.
 
40xs said:
Public ranges NEED many rules such as no fast firing, no drawing from the holster because of all those with no experience that come and put everyone else in harms way. That's why I avoid public ranges.
Click to expand...
+2
I will occasionally visit a public range, especially when out of town. While some of the rules do cramp my style, having those rules that are being enforced makes it that much less likely that one of us will be winged or killed by one of the afore mentioned idiots.

Here in Florida, unless you own a large swath of land or really know someone who does, you'll be shooting at a range of some sort. Personally, I don't mind a little comradery at the club I belong to. Not everyone is the Lone Ranger.

And I too have seen the folks who just bought their first handgun w/laser sight and can't seem to hit the target at all, even with that red dot dancing all around. Personally, I wouldn't mind a handgun competency requirement for ownership. It would serve to provide at least a slight modicum of ability to use that handgun for self defense, God forbid the situation ever arose.
 
Graham said:
Being a wannabe doesn't always stop when one gets the job. I've met plenty of people who have the qualifications they claim and yet remain both ego-driven and clueless.
Click to expand...

The last time I saw something unsafe and not allowed at an indoor range I use I went to management and complained. They looked and told me that it was a cop, that they get a lot of them there, that they're some of the worst offenders, and often refuse to listen when they're told they're doing something unsafe or not allowed.

Of course I've seen the usual craziness from Average Joe as well.
 
Action movies make guns very cool and empowering. And most young men in urban areas did not grow up shooting. They get some money, buy a gun, and they're in business. Something that seems popular among Americans is the concept of "learning by doing". Sadly, there are often no do-overs when guns are concerned. And many "men" seem to think having to ask another man for help somehow threatens their sense of self.

Conversely, there are surely some country boys who grew up with guns, but learned something wrong or unsafe from the beginning. It is tough to convince someone who has done it the same way for 20 years with no deleterious effect that they've been doing it wrong.
 
I hate the range, but living in texas, its the only way to get my shooting fix in. I really do miss Montana, as I love shooting out in the wilderness with no one else around!
 
6xcKY said:
LOL @ Ranges. Ill never understand why people insist on going to a range instead of loading up gear and heading miles and miles away from everyone...
Click to expand...

I personally live in the middle of the city surrounded by Indian Reservation land with no vehicle larger than a sedan at my disposal to drive off into the terrain without worrying if I will be able to make it back.
 
ashih313 said:
I personally live in the middle of the city surrounded by Indian Reservation land with no vehicle larger than a sedan at my disposal to drive off into the terrain without worrying if I will be able to make it back.
Click to expand...

I understood AZ has public land for shooting, I PCS there early 80s for quite a few years and remember open desert. Cactus was juju though so maybe I am wrong or things have changed.
 
Most of the bullshitters are just one or two questions away from being found out. And most military guys who weren't trigger men at least remember range safety rules. For the unwashed I do everything I can to get them involved in competitive shooting, even if it's just a match or 2. It may be the first time they have the opportunity to have gun safety put right in their face, and that is far more important than knowing how to shoot well.
 
I use a public range frequently when I am unable to utilize the land of friends and I am pretty satisfied with it. Most people there are safety oriented and nice. We have our commandos and know-it-alls as well though. I remember not too long ago a guy came out there with a brand new Barrett M82 and was bragging to anyone who would ask that "the guy at the gun store told me this thing can nail a quarter at 800 yards". I was sitting a few tables down and just smiled to myself at that one. Perhaps I should have befriended him at that point so I could get a good price when he decides to sell it after he realizes it is a 2moa rifle at best. :p
 
i had a guy see the groups i was shooting at the range one day offer me to try his 'special AR loads' claiming they had 3x the amount of powder in them, something like 96 grains he said...i just laughed and kept shootin
 
Had a guy walk into a shop i was browsing the other day. Had the look of "new money" and "mid-life crisis" written all over him. He couldnt understand how a small startup gunshop in CA didn't carry .416 Barrett on hand. The lady behind the counter was nice enough, but i felt an obligation to inform him that unless he reloads or feels like ordering online, that he's SOL. Also informed him of the price per round. He did not leave happy. I always feel bad for guys who have means and money and who want to get in the game, but end up jumping in too deep out of the gate, not realiIng what they got into.
 
45.308 said:
I understood AZ has public land for shooting, I PCS there early 80s for quite a few years and remember open desert. Cactus was juju though so maybe I am wrong or things have changed.
Click to expand...

There certainly is public land that you are allowed to shoot on, but the closest areas are crowded by the very types of people mentioned in this thread who leave trash eventually leading to the shutdown of those areas. Without an off-road vehicle, it is essentially a no go for what we do. Luckily the outdoor range I go to isn't quite as bad as some of the examples here, and they do have a private high-powered range that you need to qualify for.
 
I had an older gent and his, presumably, grand son show up one day. The first sign of trouble was when the fellow took a cardboard box out to the 100. He had taped an X on it. So he proceeds to prop it up on my target stand. I whistled at him he moved to the next guys target stand, and then to the next, until he got the message. The then pulls out a fantastic looking A-bolt and fires a hundred or so rounds through it. He finally asks me if I can fix his gun. I had him move the target in to 25, went from there. The whole time he was shooting he hadn't hit the box. It was also a 30-06. Pure craziness to shoot that much, and not be able to zero the damn thing.

Chip
 
MosesTheTank said:
the opportunity to have gun safety put right in their face, and that is far more important than knowing how to shoot well.
Click to expand...

In the 90's, right after I got out of the Marine Corps, (I was in comms in artillery, but we all had to qualify), I was shooting at a well-used national forest spot near Boulder. Some guys with their new guns came out and swept me and my sister with a loaded mac 10 or tec 9 or something. I went off on them, they left, and I never returned to that spot.

This summer up at a public range in northern colorado some guys showed up with a bunch of guns. One guy swept me a few times with an AR as they pulled their guns out of the truck. I have matured since the mid 90's :)-), so I went up and asked him politely to not point his weapon at me. He apologized, then proceeded to point it at everyone in the parking lot. One of his buddies came up and took it from him, and started to inform him about keeping the muzzle pointed in a safe direction. I Just walked away. But no one else said anything to this guy. His friends didn't until I did.

This is one of the reasons why I shudder at the thought of the general public with guns. So many are incapable of of safe handling. When I was in college I worked at domino's. One of the managers of my store shot the other one while they practiced 'drawing' their pistols at their apartment.

In Aleppo Syria one of my crew lost a cousin and a friend in two days to weapons accidents in 'safe' areas. I learned to physically grab and control the muzzles of the weapons the guys around me carried when they were careless until they got the point. And these weapons always have one in the chamber. Don't get me started about the handmade grenades....

Sorry for my rant about gun safety. I guess my dad taught me well growing up. He wasn't a great shot or anything, but he taught me to handle guns safely and to respect them.
 
ashih313 said:
There certainly is public land that you are allowed to shoot on, but the closest areas are crowded by the very types of people mentioned in this thread who leave trash eventually leading to the shutdown of those areas. Without an off-road vehicle, it is essentially a no go for what we do. Luckily the outdoor range I go to isn't quite as bad as some of the examples here, and they do have a private high-powered range that you need to qualify for.
Click to expand...

Coolio, I was stationed near Tucson and hated it at first, left home 38, got there and it was 110 passed out but it grew on me as I learned and got out doing things, wife cannot deal with any cold these day have thought of moving back there, snow bird. I can see it getting trashed as AK has several areas that once where but those guys put a stop to it.

Might see you soon!

Thanks for the help
 
Although we actually have a real shooting range now I don't go out there much, mostly because we only because we only have 100Y max.

Anyway a friend and I were just driving back from our favorite shooting spot in the Forest Service when we looked over and saw a group of mall ninjas acting all bad ass trying to impress their girlfriends shooting at trash scattered everywhere. They were shooting at stuff like TV's, fruit and vegetables, etc, and having fantastic success hitting everything but what they were aiming at. Another sad thing is they had no backstop behind them so bullets were ending up who knows where.

Little did they know we were just hitting little 1.5-2 moa sized swingers 200-300 and 400Y with our precision 22rf's.
 
Blackjack988 said:
I've been there...once...just once....It wouldn't be so bad if the tables weren't set up 2 feet apart from each other.
Click to expand...

Never been to Calverton, but Brookhaven is the same. I couldn't sit at the next empty bench cause the guy next to me was a lefty so I had to skip a bench! It's a circus at Brookhaven too....last time I was there, the RO had to yell at some dude over the PA for at least 5 minutes to step away from one of the rifle racks......good times.....
 
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