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Summary of the long range fad.

CJS-6.5

CJS-6.5

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Minuteman
Sep 15, 2017
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So we are at a turning point in the shooting world. Everyone and their dog has a long range precision rig and can spout knowledge on drop, drift, ballistics, ectera...

For myself I am getting burnt out on all the chatter... I realize the market thrives on newcomers but seriously...just give me my .243 and a weekend mouth calling coyotes and I'm good. The more time I spend online and the less I spend hunting the worse I get at instinctive shooting in hunting scenarios.

You can't learn everything at a range behind a long range rig, shooting paper. Let's get out there and do it folks!

Pretty soon the wannabes will be wanting to be something else, and the industry will droop again. I say...teach a kid to hunt and he will shoot for a lifetime. Teach a kid to shoot and he will move on to the next thing. Reason is that to hunt successfully you need to be a good shooter. To be a good shooter is the end of the line. The beginning is the end.
 
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I respectfully disagree. Like you, we can all get tired of the chatter of those who want the "best, biggest, coolest etc..." (added: and talk about it, but not do it) Yes, it would be nice that the information espoused here gets used out in the field. That's why this all started.

However, saying that hunting requires shooting isn't necessarily true. I don't think we need to drop our long range shooting habit to go and hunt because that's what a lot of us have gone to for a pastime. I've hunted for years. But, with a bad back, knees and shoulders, packing a big game animal out isn't any fun anymore. Never really was, IMO. The thrill of the chase is, so I still like to hunt ...with a camera.:eek: ...:cool:

I also still like to go out and nail p-dogs all day when I get that chance. I never was into calling coyotes, but the occasional challenging shot on one is a thrill. As long as someone else wants to deal with the hide. My bird dogs got a shitty attitude when I came home smelling like a coyote.

When it comes to long range shooting, there is also a thrill in itself. I enjoy figuring out the weather variables and making those tough shots on steel, or paper, when it comes down. In short, I like shooting as much as I like hunting. No need for me to drop it all to go do that.

In short, I agree with your point of getting out behind the gun, whatever your choice is, needs to be accomplished as much as sitting behind a computer.
 
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sandwarrior said:
I respectfully disagree. Like you, we can all get tired of the chatter of those who want the "best, biggest, coolest etc..." (added: and talk about it, but not do it) Yes, it would be nice that the information espoused here gets used out in the field. That's why this all started.

However, saying that hunting requires shooting isn't necessarily true. I don't think we need to drop our long range shooting habit to go and hunt because that's what a lot of us have gone to for a pastime. I've hunted for years. But, with a bad back, knees and shoulders, packing a big game animal out isn't any fun anymore. Never really was, IMO. The thrill of the chase is, so I still like to hunt ...with a camera.:eek: ...:cool:

I also still like to go out and nail p-dogs all day when I get that chance. I never was into calling coyotes, but the occasional challenging shot on one is a thrill. As long as someone else wants to deal with the hide. My bird dogs got a shitty attitude when I came home smelling like a coyote.

When it comes to long range shooting, there is also a thrill in itself. I enjoy figuring out the weather variables and making those tough shots on steel, or paper, when it comes down. In short, I like shooting as much as I like hunting. No need for me to drop it all to go do that.

In short, I agree with your point of getting out behind the gun, whatever your choice is, needs to be accomplished as much as sitting behind a computer.
Click to expand...

I have been thinking of getting a good camera for the same purpose and reason.
 
I agree that there is a long range shooting boom going on. I wouldn’t call it a fad. I saw the same thing with 3gun a few years ago. There was a huge influx of new shooters. Most of them went away, but the ones that stayed moved the level of competition up a notch.

The good thing about this better products and manufacturer support than before. Even more benefit when everyone moves on to the next thing and sells their gear cheap.
 
“‘Long range fad”? For a lot of people on SH shooting is a way of life, not a fad. When we’re not shooting we’re talking and thinking about shooting.
Yes, it’s a means to and end in hunting, but I also hunt with a bow and a shotgun...

I will keep competing as long as I can and keep shooting till I die. No fad here.
 
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I would say that whether someone comes to the table to hunt, shoot competitively, shoot/hunt professionally or what have you, they be educated in safety and the Second Amendment. That ensures that even if they lose interest, he or she at least knows how to safely interact with firearms and why we have and should continue to have firearms.
 
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I don’t think it’s a fad at all. The industry is putting out products that make it easier and more affordable to get into than ever before. There’s also more local matches that I believe is a contributing factor.
 
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While I have to admit that I do a LOT more reading/talking/posting about shooting than I actually spend shooting, that's what my time and budget allow for. From where I live (the 'burbs of Dallas), it's not real easy to find decent (rifle) hunting within an hour or two... and when you DO find it, it tends to be damned expensive. I have friends that have some land that I can use, but I'm looking at ~3.5 hours each way, so it's not real conducive to "hey, let's just run out and call some 'yotes this evening". Not to mention that one of the owners (the one that I know the best) just had a baby, so his wife doesn't get too excited about him heading out to the land for a couple of days. I could probably talk him into letting me go out there without him, but I don't want to invite myself onto someone else's land... and my wallet won't support me buying my own chunk of land.

So, what am I left with? Reading/talking/posting about shooting. FWIW, when looking at which chamberings I choose or which projectiles I want to use, I have little interest in target projectiles, and I tend to include energy on target in my ballistic calculations (I am interested in terminal ballistics and the ability to potentially make clean, ethical kills at long range more than grouping on paper or pinging steel).
 
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I'm not so much a hunter but I love shooting.

I shoot every week and more if I can away with it. Especially on steel at longer distances with, PCP airguns, the rimfires, standard long range with tactical rifles, and ELR.

I'm not a benchrest shooter but I go to other sites to learn and improve accuracy with reloading in mind and apply it to what we do on this site. I spend a lot of time here too, I learn as I go and have met nice people I wouldn't have met otherwise.

Whatever turns your crank, do what you have a passion for, and we'll do the same.

The problem I've run across is many of the youth do their shooting and competing in front of a screen while gaming. Real life shooting isn't as fun to them. Oh well, we try and hope.

Gotta go shooting in a few minutes, be back in a couple hours. I have to fit in some reloading after that.
 
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I've been shooting since I could piss standing up, spent time in the Army as an Infantryman, hunted birds since I was a kid and its just now in my mid 30s that I can afford long range shooting. In my 20s I had a FN PBR, but I couldn't afford to feed it consistently. Same thing with deer hunting, I messed around with it, but beer and girls were more important.
 
In order to be a well rounded, competent human being you should possess certain skills.

You should know how to cook, how to perform personal hygiene, build an item from wood, seek shelter, first aid, math, verbally or in writing make and defend an argument, know something about space, aviation, seamanship and various other subjects, start a fire, catch a fish, as well you should be able to shoot a gun for whatever purpose you find yourself in need of at the time.

Its all good and its all necessary.
 
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atomic41 said:
We're allowing dogs to be snipers now? Holy crap...we've gone too far indeed!
Click to expand...
1545148268666.png
 
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I started this sport because I was done hunting. Hunted everywhere and killed everything I wanted to hunt. This is a hobby/sport for me.
I personally find the sport and training a hell of a lot of fun.
Buying the gear and trying different scopes etc... fun also.
Keep shooting.
 
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I came to precision shooting from hunting. Let me assure you that you don't need to be a good shooter, a competitor, or even very interested in shooting in order to be very successful as a hunter. The army of "shooters" that show up to the range the weekend before deer season opens, to sight in the rifle they haven't shot since they tagged their trophy the season before attest to that. The biggest buck taken off our lease this season was shot clean through the guts. Shooter got the yips. There's a video floating around on line where a famous hunting personality is talking about how the shockwave of his 50bmg killed a WT doe. There are a lot of skills and attributes that combine to create a consistently successful hunter. General firearm acumen is the last, and I would argue least important.

If you want your kids to have a passion for ANYTHING, nurture it. Piano, cooking, 3gun, waterfowling, whatever. Make it fun. Make it interesting. After my son's first shooting match, his first comment was "That was WAY more fun than hunting-" and he loves hunting. So do I. But, it tends to be hours of boredom punctuated by brief moments of excitement.

Sitting in a field calling coyotes sounds like fun, but it also sounds like a bore. That's the dichotomy of hunting, for me.

Good shooters are good shooters. Good hunters are good hunters. Neither necessitate the other, and the overlap is smaller than one would suspect.
 
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I agree. It is a FAD.
I'm 68, retired and just recently got into Mid Range paper.
As soon as I master that, I'm moving to 1000, and then on out.
I see myself getting bored somewhere down the road :)
 
Depends who you are. I’ve loved guns since I was little. Been long range shooting for 10 years. I fade in and out, but I will always have my rig and love shooting!
 
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pmclaine said:
In order to be a well rounded, competent human being you should possess certain skills.

You should know how to cook, how to perform personal hygiene, build an item from wood, seek shelter, first aid, math, verbally or in writing make and defend an argument, know something about space, aviation, seamanship and various other subjects, start a fire, catch a fish, know math, as well you should be able to shoot a gun for whatever purpose you find yourself in need of at the time.

Its all good and its all necessary.
Click to expand...


I agree 100% with this sentiment. The more we expect from technology and other people the less we expect from ourselves. The modern world has made us soft, impatient, and entitled. I almost envy the primitive ape's sovereignty. We live in a world where people are alienated from every single need they have, which is a precarious place to be for a species of however many billion it is currently.
 
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CJS-6.5 said:
For myself I am getting burnt out on all the chatter...
Click to expand...

Look around you. Do you see a symbol of a circle partially bisected vertically by a small line?
Maybe something like this:
powbutt.jpg


Now, is it glowing? If so press and hold it for a few seconds after you finish reading this.

This will cure your chatter burnout.
 
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Grew up HUNTING, could care less about it now except a good bird dog or squirrel dog. Talk about "chatter" I'm so glad deer season is over, I could go the rest of my life without hearing a play by play of someone's deer "hunt"
 
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CJS-6.5 said:
I say...teach a kid to hunt and he will shoot for a lifetime. Teach a kid to shoot and he will move on to the next thing. Reason is that to hunt successfully you need to be a good shooter. To be a good shooter is the end of the line. The beginning is the end.
Click to expand...

I've been trying to find a diplomatic way to say what I think of this, but I just can't so I'll come out and say it.........

You don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

Hunting and shooting have little to do with each other. They are peripherally connected to one another. The modern firearms big game season in most states is the shortest of all. The longest big game season in most states requires no firearms at all.

The Second Amendment has absolutely NOTHING to do with hunting.

I've killed everything I've cared to kill over my lifetime. I'm pretty much done with it. However, the pursuit of marksmanship skill is never ending. Whenever you think you know how to shoot, you don't.

Before you run your mouth again you might want to do some data mining and plot the number of hunting licenses sold over the last 20 years against the number of firearms sold/NICS checks done over the same period. Let us know what your interpretation of that data is.

I predict hunting will die before firearms ownership in this country does.
 
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This thread elicited the responses I expected. Lol.
 
Hunting with a rifle is one step up from farming. It takes the least ammount of skill and prep. It should be called harvesting. Now come out west and do some elk or sheep hunting with a bow and maybe you will learn what being a real hunter is. Any moron can sit still and quiet in a deer stand or take a 300yard shot to the vitals with the equipment we have today. Can you stalk within 30 yards of the same animal and take a shot without being seen or smelt?

Shooting and hunting have little in common.
 
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The OP sounds like a guy who got his clock cleaned at his first match after a lifetime of hunting had led him to believe he was "a good shot", and is now justifying his poor performance by telling us that LR shooting is a distraction from what he considers to be the pinnacle of shooting importance.
 
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CJS-6.5 said:
I say...teach a kid to hunt and he will shoot for a lifetime. Teach a kid to shoot and he will move on to the next thing. Reason is that to hunt successfully you need to be a good shooter.
Click to expand...

Although it's great to teach kids to hunt, I have to disagree with you. If you are a shooter, you will always shoot. I have hunted, but I've always been more of a shooter. I became a reloader so I can shoot more. I will always have a .22 whether I hunt with it or not. I have pistols for various things, like Smith revolvers for hunting, 1911s because they're 1911s, BHP because it's a BHP, plastic fantastic 9s, .22 target pistols. I have a skeet shotgun, I've shot trap before, I've hunted quail and ducks.

Most of the people I spent time with in deer camps , were hunters. That means they clog the range every year about the same time getting their barrel scorching hot with a box of shells to "sight in", so they can miss with the cold bore shot when it counts. What industry can survive on an annually diminishing amount of participants that spend less than $20? My last order with Midway or Powder Valley could have supported 2 families for a year in third worldistan.

If the firearm manufacturers and ammunition companies were counting on just hunters to stay in business, they'd all be belly up.
 
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Primus said:
Hunting with a rifle is one step up from farming. It takes the least ammount of skill and prep. It should be called harvesting. Now come out west and do some elk or sheep hunting with a bow and maybe you will learn what being a real hunter is. Any moron can sit still and quiet in a deer stand or take a 300yard shot to the vitals with the equipment we have today. Can you stalk within 30 yards of the same animal and take a shot without being seen or smelt?

Shooting and hunting have little in common.
Click to expand...
If I was you I would research production agriculture. If hunting is a step up from that, then it is at the forefront of technology.

As far as my style of hunting goes, I'm not very patient, so no stands for me. It's mostly stalking or ambush.

As far as hunting and shooting being different. I totally agree. However the current trend towards shooting animals at long range has been perpetuated by the fascination with long range shooting and the sniper intrigue. Everyone wants to fulfill their American Sniper fantasy.

I didn't mean my original post to sound like I hated long range shooting. Instead I see similarities to other things that have come and gone. In fact I love the challenge that long range shooting gives me. I do it as a stress reliever, after work. I have never competed and probably never will. That would take away from what I get out of shooting.

I am glad that long range shooting is so popular right now. It means money into the sport and advances in technology. However if the basics are lost to technology it will fade away like so many other past hobbies.

Feel free to post your opinion. Even critisism is welcome. Just make sure that you are giving the respect that you would demand from a fellow citizen and enthusiast.

And happy shooting!
 
CJS-6.5 said:
So we are at a turning point in the shooting world. Everyone and their dog has a long range precision rig and can spout knowledge on drop, drift, ballistics, ectera...

For myself I am getting burnt out on all the chatter... I realize the market thrives on newcomers but seriously...just give me my .243 and a weekend mouth calling coyotes and I'm good. The more time I spend online and the less I spend hunting the worse I get at instinctive shooting in hunting scenarios.

You can't learn everything at a range behind a long range rig, shooting paper. Let's get out there and do it folks!

Pretty soon the wannabes will be wanting to be something else, and the industry will droop again. I say...teach a kid to hunt and he will shoot for a lifetime. Teach a kid to shoot and he will move on to the next thing. Reason is that to hunt successfully you need to be a good shooter. To be a good shooter is the end of the line. The beginning is the end.
Click to expand...
And I say let people enjoy what they do and don’t worry about the fads. You know reading lrs stuff is optional right?
 
CJS-6.5 said:
However the current trend towards shooting animals at long range has been perpetuated by the fascination with long range shooting and the sniper intrigue. Everyone wants to fulfill their American Sniper fantasy.
Click to expand...

CJS-6.5 said:
I am glad that long range shooting is so popular right now. It means money into the sport and advances in technology. However if the basics are lost to technology it will fade away like so many other past hobbies.
Click to expand...


Any factual information to back up these opinions? ANY articles from ANY firearms publication, or anything from ANY firearms manufacturer?

You've created a world in your head where your statements above and in your OP are fact, but they're not.

Absent that it seems like you're just making shit up...
 
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1500varmint said:
Any factual information to back up these opinions? ANY articles from ANY firearms publication, or anything from ANY firearms manufacturer?

You've created a world in your head where your statements above and in your OP are fact, but they're not.

Absent that it seems like you're just making shit up...
Click to expand...

Pretty much all of his posts are like this. It’s all opinion with zero application of logic or common sense.

The fact that this very website has been around for the better part of 20 years (back in dialup internet days even) and LR shooting and comps have have been going on for decades debunks the bullshit that he came up with, but he still posted it.
 
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redneckbmxer24 said:
Pretty much all of his posts are like this. It’s all opinion with zero application of logic or common sense.

The fact that this very website has been around for the better part of 20 years (back in dialup internet days even) and LR shooting and comps have have been going on for decades debunks the bullshit that he came up with, but he still posted it.
Click to expand...
Thank you for answering his questions for me. The facts are irrefutable. Ten years ago the big gun stores had very few long range rifles. Now there is factory chassis rifles galore and affordable adjustable stock options like the Bergara Hmr everywhere. Why would the manufacturers offer these rifles if there was no demand? Why are long high bc bullets being made? Why are there long range hunting and shooting forums? Why do the hunting and shooting mags continually have articles and advertisements geared towards long range? Why do you even need me to provide you with evidence?

I joined this forum to learn and share knowledge about something we all love. I won't always agree with everyone and they won't always agree with me. But let's remember that its easier to type criticism than tell someone face to face. I guarantee that if you showed up out at my private range I would treat you right.

But maybe this is wasted on you. Maybe you can only feel ok about yourself if you can run others down...if so I feel sorry for you and can tell you that it's not to late to reach out for help.

Dr. Norman V Peale has an excellent book. The power of positive thinking.

Cheerio
 
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