- Thread starter Gunfighter14e2
- Start date
Aaahhh gotcha. Nope never said you couldn't have an opinion or that you couldn't state it. You just seem to word things as facts
So far none of you guys have stated a single reason for us to be there.
Maybe that’s why we’re still there....
Maybe that's because it's so obvious (whether we agree with it or not) that it defies logic that someone can't reason that out for themselves...
Stop being coy. Obviously I’m not in on your rationale. Why?
To kill Muslims? To win their hearts and minds?
How about we don’t let them immigrate here instead? Protect our border? Isn’t that even more obvious?
You "REALITY" don't have a clue do you?
So why does America have to fight in the Middle East? How does it benefit Americans?
You’ll go 50 posts mocking me but you can’t explain why in words.
You’ll go 50 posts mocking me but you can’t explain why in words.
How about you research Ike's farewell speech, then Kennedy warned about the same thing. Then came Ray-Gun saying basically the same fucking thing. If your going to live here, know what this country is about, an run by who.
Don't hold back @Frankly, tell everyone your real opinion on Israel and its people. You're the one being cryptic here on what your real stance is.
I understand the concept of the military industrial complex. Why would you support it? Why would you serve when the motivation is corporate profits?
As a voter why wouldn’t you vote against this?
Why should I when I believe in it's long term goals? Clue for you they ain't about the NWO or OWO either,...
Oh well F that. In the past if you were part of an Empire you enjoyed the fruits and spoils of the lands you conquered. By that measure America should be paying us dividends rather than we paying taxes.
Like Campaign Trump said before the Cucking, if we fight in the Mid East we should get the damn oil.
Are you an Israeli or an American? It’s either or.
Nothing against Jewish BJs.
Better question is why would we be doing another Nation’s bidding?
A stable China helps the world order too. Should we fight for them?
Nice attempt at a deflection, but really, don't hold back. Nobody likes a faker. Just let it all out.
You do understand that the "Military Industrial Complex" is limited by DFAR 5000 on how much profit they can make, right? Like 8%. You do also understand that ITAR limits what can be sold to foreign governments , and everything has to be approved by the State department, right?
So the voter should vote an against a capitalist motivated entity for making money, just because they make their business a business of providing war material and capabilities?
Sigh...perhaps this is a "teaching moment"....
Let me ask these questions...
Do you think it is better to fight the extremists over in the Middle East, or would you rather that happen in our own streets?
Do you think it wise to allow Iran to grow their sphere of influence in the Middle East, solidify their own military footing and industrial base, and grow in strength and power at a global level?
Do you think it wise to allow China and Russia to establish a firmer foothold in the Middle East, increasing their leverage when negotiating with the US?
If you think any of Iraq and Afghanistan is about oil, you're about as dense and simple minded as a run-of-the-mill liberal progressive.
Apparently critical thinking is becoming a lost art...sigh. Smdh...this ain't rocket science.
And how has that been working out? China just took over the other two major continents on the planet while we spent trillions to achieve a stalemate. They control much Africa and South America.
We backed the Saudis who are arguably no better than Iran. And in what way is Iran a threat to us when any attack would mean their own suicide? If we weren’t there we would not be fighting with them.
And the only reason we’d be fighting any Muslims “over here” is because we already let them into America. More than ever since 9-11. Ain’t that kind of stupid? Be a lot better to kick them out and close the border than to do a endless war but maybe my math is wrong SIR!
I don’t understand you, you’re just throwing disses but to be more clear I prefer Americans to Jews and Muslims, both of whom I suspect of dual or false loyalties. I want benefits to Americans before other countries, races, cultures.
Got no problem with individuals but I like Poles too. Doesn’t mean I want to fight for Poland.
What possible argument could you have against this?
But by all means, send your son to Israel to fight for the IDF cause IDGAF.
They're also the only democracy in the Middle East, regardless of being a friend or not. Same for Saudi (moderate Islamic Monarchy, not necessarily the people) and that straddles the Persian Gulf and the Red Sea.
Geography matters. Arguably more so than political leanings....
Geography matters. Arguably more so than political leanings....
Trust me no real vet wants ANY of your sympathy. A few of my reasons are right here...This was my war. No medal or honor can replace the look in a child's eyes when you teach them to draw their first stick figure with pen and paper they were forbidden to have before Americans got there to throw the Taliban out. You also couldn't possibly understand selfless service of a belonging to a platoon family. Be as ugly and pessimist about the US motives for being over there as you want but you will also never understand the smiles from getting a first pair of glitter jelly sandels. It's about freeing the oppressed and trying to fight the enemies of America in their backyard so your little son won't know what it's like to watch his buddies get ripped apart by a pressure plate dismounted ied because his dad only knows hatred and fear. It's about doing the right thing and not the easy thing.
Attachments
And again, the lack of anything but a binary categorization appears again...smh.
Perhaps you should go back to sniffing glue or licking windows, rather than offer statements about an environment you clearly do not understand, and with many variables you can not comprehend. It might save all of us some grief.
Frankly, I believe Frankly is a Rabbi.
He appears incapable of answering a question with an answer. His answers are just more questions.
I’m sorry. You’re defending choices you made when you were fed a crock of propaganda and now you have to rationalize what happened. You fought for a stalemate, were sold out and screwed over. You have every right to be an angry ass.
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Hi,
Holy shit.....
MIC, IDF, ITAR, Socialist, Why This, Why That....all in a single thread, lol.
That doesn't happen often but when it does it needs proper announcement:
Sincerely,
Theis
Holy shit.....
MIC, IDF, ITAR, Socialist, Why This, Why That....all in a single thread, lol.
That doesn't happen often but when it does it needs proper announcement:
Sincerely,
Theis
C'mon dude, you can do better than that...
Don't be a puss, stand by your beliefs and say what you really mean.
So you feel entitled. Maybe thats why you are a little bitch.
Nobody wants sympathy from a pussie like you.
Nobody wants sympathy from a pussie like you.
Go for it! Shalom!
Glass with rag head protein embedded, is not a bad thing,...
No he stood for something and walked the walk which is more than you can say guy
And where are we at guy? Sending your kid to Afghanistan too?
Cause Jeb Bush told you to Hoo Rah!
Can't tell yet but I'm sure your type was around for every war this country has fought to date and your entitled to your opinion but you sound like a racist Torry more worried about your own skin than anything else but maybe I'm wrong.
I didn't join for any other reason other than I felt that it was the right thing to do and I believe in America and what it stands for.
I can say in our own little way we made a difference. Not sure how that will play out in the history books but I know it and the regular people in the villages we fought for knew it, that's enough for me.
What have you done to make a difference again? Spew hate online to further your yet to be disclosed real views on people?
American citizens have fought and died on behalf of foreign countries both as part of official wars and also as individual volunteers almost since the beginning of our country. Fighting for the freedom of other countries and to protect other countries against hostilities is a well honored tradition.
At the same time, citizens of other countries from around the world have also come to America to fight with us, or joined us in battles throughout the years.
Before we got into WWI, Americans were traveling up to Canada to enlist to help fight the Germans. Before we got involved in WWII, there were Americans helping fight the Nazi's and the Japanese.
American individuals helped greatly with Israel's initial struggle to avoid being exterminated and reclaim their ancestral homeland after the Europeans tried to eliminate them (it was not just the Nazi's that hated the Jews).
The funny part about your comment on Poland is US troops are more likely to be helping defend Poland, by strong presence and equipment than a lot of other places, when it comes to "allies" in Europe and NATO, you'll find Poland and the former East Bloc countries are the most willing to put their money & actions where their mouth is and are happy to have our troops over there just in case the Russian bear gets a bit hungry for a snack.
While no country is perfect and Israel has it's flaws and problems (remember they are a young country like less than 80 years old, think about the USA 80 years after independence), of all the places around the middle east, it is by just about any measurable standard "the best". Unlike what you hear, the Israelis are more than happy to live in peace with Muslims who renounce the whole "must destroy Israel" thing. There are several large groups of Arabs that long ago chose to side with Israel & become part of Israel & as a group/sect officially announced that, they live just fine and well in Israel today, including having seats in their government.
It is very much in Israel's interest to have the USA as their best friend and ally, but it is also very useful in a global strategic way for the USA to have Israel as a firm ally.
If you want hate for Israel and pro Arab stuff, you are at the wrong place, you need to head over to the Democrats/SJW/Communist/Liberal/Woke side of the internet (most of it) and they are happy to spew hatred for Israel, but you'll probably find few freedom loving individualistic conservatives here to side with your views.
Thanks for being articulate and civil. I wonder how you square what you say with what Franklin, Washington, and Jefferson said about avoiding foreign entanglements?
And might you acknowledge that France went out of its way to assist the Revolutionary Americans in order to gain an advantage over Britain? Hardly altruistic of them.
Let's ignore that the early Anti Fascist volunteers from America were predominantly Communist sympathizers, it makes a better story that way!
Same with the fact that America didn't do much to absorb Hitler's unwanted Jews years before the war.
Or Campaign Trump dismissing the need for us the be funding a rudderless NATO protecting a billion first world people who could readily afford to defend themselves against a Russia with 5% of the EU GDP? Or why, Russia being an energy exporter, would want to conquer it's customers and have to absorb millions of European Muslims?
The Poles were just an example, I'm aware of their pleading for a "Fort Trump". Frankly if I were a Pole I'd be more afraid of the EU than Russia as the liberal immigration policies and welfare state are far more dangerous in reality than a hypothetical.
But nicer effort than the rest ?
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Franklin, Washington and Jefferson had those views long before the US became a world power. Context matters.
France was not altruistic in it's help to the colonies. If you read history, you'd know they were going through their own revolution of sorts (more accurately, the pre-cursor social and economic changes that brought about the strife and anger the predicated their Revolution). They helped us (quite belatedly), because they were in a weakened state; they just used the Colonies as a thorn to keep Great Britain from stepping on their own necks.
Not sure what the NATO thing has to do with any of your previous questions/statements.
I do have to ask though, Do you think all muslims are bad people? Your statements certainly imply that...
France was not altruistic in it's help to the colonies. If you read history, you'd know they were going through their own revolution of sorts (more accurately, the pre-cursor social and economic changes that brought about the strife and anger the predicated their Revolution). They helped us (quite belatedly), because they were in a weakened state; they just used the Colonies as a thorn to keep Great Britain from stepping on their own necks.
Not sure what the NATO thing has to do with any of your previous questions/statements.
I do have to ask though, Do you think all muslims are bad people? Your statements certainly imply that...
That "all" is a tricky lawyer-y phrase. Of course not ALL Muslims are bad people. Not all Germans were "bad" people in WW2.
I just prefer that Muslims stay in Muslim countries and GTF out of ours. But I say that about other invaders too.
Just seems to my ignorant liberal altright fascist SJW mindset that America ought to be cleaning its own house and setting things right here before we go spreading our wisdom throughout. When we can't run our own country right why are we trying to fix other ones?
I understand the military is full of Muslims, trannies, foreign citizens, LBGQTXXX but I'm just old fashioned and like traditional Americans.
What about the Chinese? Or the Irish? How about the Vietnamese? Or Mexicans? None of them should have been allowed in? Or is it just muslims? (Which is a religion, not an ethnicity) Is it muslims you don't like coming to the US, or middle eastern people more broadly?
Immigration and citizenship rights should be curtailed until the unemployment rate is near zero and wages have risen 10% for six years, then we should allow a small select number of European Christians to immigrate in order to restore the balance since the current population is taking us towards a majority minority within a generation.
I like how the Christian European pioneers and settlers set this place up. They had the superior culture by a long shot. I have no ill regard for other people and having a mix is fine but I'd like it to be more like it was. As it is, with the swelling Hispanic population we're going to be more like Brazil than traditional America.
Not apologizing for that.
It's all moot, we'll turn into Brazil come short of a bloody revolt and nobody has the stomach for that since we're mostly fat and happy.
Sometimes the reality of the real world gets in the way of what would be the "best" and as the world & technology around you evolves, sometimes it means changing things.
The USA started out wanting to not go running around fighting across the globe.
The Muslims were the first to awaken our need for an actual international world class fighting force, when they were brutally kidnapping our sailors and demanding 10% of our national GDP each year to not attack & pirate our ships. We soon learned that it's way cheaper to build a world class navy, go deal with the problem at it's source & then keep the navy around to prevent other issues than to have to start over from scratch each time.
The USA tried to be isolationist before WWI and before WWII, It didn't really turn out well, and we learned that despite all the problems it causes, it is in our national interest to have the most powerful military the world has ever seen and be able to take care of problems before they hit home too hard.
As technology and weapons progress, you have to have a strong standing army and lots of top of the line weapons if you want to stay free, otherwise you'll never have a chance to get back up to speed when your enemies come invading. Also you have to decide if you want to be the one to lead and make the decisions based on what you want, or get dictated to by others.
That France helped the American Revolution because it happened to coincide with their war across the globe against Britain is pretty much standard taught history. Enemy of my enemy is my friend, we did the exact same thing in Afghanistan, helping the Taliban and Bin Laden fight the Soviets. It was very successful and in important part of the eventual collapse of the Soviet Union. (Democrats messing it up afterwards not withstanding).
When it comes to NATO, today the Russian threat may be a bit over stated for western Europe, hence why they don't feel all that compelled to fully contribute to their own defense, however the guys in Eastern Europe see the threat as a lot more real. In any event, us being the main muscle in NATO gives us a huge boost in global strategic presence with bases all over Europe and the ability to be the ones with the biggest say in a lot of strategic matters in not only Europe, but also the middle east and north Africa.
Nothing is perfect and nothing is without cost, BUT the USA being the top dog on the planet, with the best military ever seen and the world reserve currency, is a good part of the reason why overall the USA is about one of the best & most prosperous countries as a citizen, to live in (Despite as much as the Democrat/Communist politicians try to destroy it).
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