Defiance Tenacity with Manners Gen 2 Mini Chassis - GAP PPR

[spoonz]

Hey guys,

I was excited for my new rifle but ended up really disappointed when cycling ammo. I have two brand new 10 round AI mags. The first 7 or 8 rounds out of the magazine require a lot of force to chamber. The bullet hits the feed ramp and stops. Then a lot of forward force on the bolt is required to actually chamber the round. I have to hold the gun down and the rifle still ends up moving over 6" due to the force required to get the round over the ramp. My bullet tips look slightly damaged too. I only have a browning A-Bolt for comparison which is really smooth.

The builder suggested bending the magazine feed lips, sanding the feed lips, and lubing the feed lips.

I mostly have HK pistols which run flawlessly out of the box. I assumed a $2500.00 rifle with $84.00 Mags would run smooth. I realize $2500.00 isn't crazy expensive but I anticipated it running better than a stock $600 Tikka. Are my expectations unrealistic? Am I missing something? I'm new to Bolt Rifles so maybe they aren't designed to run well with brand new mags. . Let me know if posting a video would help.

I was planning on having a lightweight hunting rig built, but now a Browning or Tikka looks better than ever.

Thanks for any thoughts

 

[spife7980]

The builders advice is right.

Measure the inside width of the feedlips with your calipers so you know where you started at and adjust from there.

 

[just browsing]

Definitely a product of the magazine more so than the action. Adjusting/sanding the feed lips along with the spring and follower should fix you right up.

Of course you could always try other mags too. PMags, MDT poly mags, or the MDT poly/metal mags could all be good choices as well if you simply cannot get the AICS to run.

But chances are with a little time spent working on the ones you've got will produce the results you're looking for.

 

[mtnhunter22]

Another one for bending feed lips. I had a Tikka in a chassis that took AICS mags. Had all sorts of issues with feeding until I opened the mag lips and then it was buttery smooth. I kept them opened up and run them in a TL3 now and still works and feeds great.

To my knowledge bending feed lips is a common-ish thing. They take time to break in and smooth all the high friction points out. Wouldn’t be worried about the build itself one bit...unless opening feed lips doesn’t work, then maybe start looking at what else it could be.

 

[Defiance Machine]

Have you contacted George or Kenny over at GAP yet? I'm sure they would be willing to get it sorted out with you over the phone quickly.

 

[NW Valkyrie]

My two cents is your expectations are unrealistic.

I see many people post on here with the same thought- "I paid X-dollars for a custom rifle/action and expect it to magically work with everything"

However this is asking a lot when you think about it.

You bought Accuracy International magazines, being held in a Manners chassis and cycling in a defiance action. Which company is the problem?

• Is it realistic to be upset at AI for a magazine manufactured specifically to run a .308 cartridge in an AI rifle?
• Is it realistic to be upset at Manners because of the above?
• It is realistic to be upset at Defiance for not overcoming issues caused by feed lips or magazine catch heights?

The reality is there is a tremendous amount of variance in magazines. You can measure mag catch and feed lips among MDT, AI, Magpul etc... and they are all over the place. You can purchase 10 AI mags and some work perfectly out of the box and some require a few minutes of work to get functioning correctly. It's just the nature of running bolt rifles on the AICS platform. It's the closest thing we have to an industry standard, but it's not plug and play.

You have 3 options.
1) Send the rifle to a gunsmith and let them deal with it
2) Adopt the mentality some have and just try a bunch of different mags until you find one that works
3) Spend some time learning more about your rifle and how to maintain it. You will be able to easily fix the problem you are experiencing now, as well as have the skill and knowledge to resolve issues in the future.

Judging by your description, it sounds like you need to open up the feed lips slightly. This is a common situation when running cartridges that have less taper than a .308, but again it could be the UPS driver drop kicked you package and they got bent. It's not a big deal. A seasoned rifle shooter can fix your issue in a matter of minutes.

My suggestion- get a tool that allows you to easily adjust the feed lips. Example- MPA sells one for fifteen bucks. Go on youtube and watch Phil adjust the feed lips using the tool to get the mag set up correctly.

You have an awesome rifle. This talk of going back to browning or tikka is crazy talk

 

[spoonz]

Those are some really good points. Its a custom gun chambered in creedmoor trying to use .308 mags. My cartridge has a slightly different case taper and therefore adjustments need to be made. Not what i expected, but I can understand a little better now. I would rather not fatigue the steel magazine lips but it seems as there is no choice. It is a great looking rifle and hopefully I can get this all worked out.

 

[spoonz]

With this logic, building a .308 and using .308 mags would present an unlikely situation of needing to adjust the magazine feed lips. Providing the other tolerance stacks were all good. Correct?

 

[Steel head]

Those are some really good points. Its a custom gun chambered in creedmoor trying to use .308 mags. My cartridge has a slightly different case taper and therefore adjustments need to be made. Not what i expected, but I can understand a little better now. I would rather not fatigue the steel magazine lips but it seems as there is no choice. It is a great looking rifle and hopefully I can get this all worked out.

Don’t sweat bending the lips.
They’re almost as resilient as a cooch.

You have a bunch of parts mixed in to form a rifle.
Adjusting mags is a common occurrence.

 

[spoonz]

Don’t sweat bending the lips.
They’re almost as resilient as a cooch.

You have a bunch of parts mixed in to form a rifle.
Adjusting mags is a common occurrence.

LOL!

 

[never_summer]

I think you are overthinking this, the adjustments made to the mag lips are very minimal. MPA has a magazine lip adjustment tool that makes it real easy, I’ve also used taped pliers. Taking very light sand paper to the lips will help also help with friction and the factory mags slicing up your brass.
If you had that same rifle but chambered in a .308 you would probably see the same tuning needed to the feedlips.

 

[DJL2]

I've read similar sentiment from a lot of published authors: "When you buy a rifle, you're really buying a kit. There's a decent chance it won't run as it "should" when you get it. That's the nature of the game. Buy a high quality kit and commit to making it right."

The only true exceptions to that expectation are rifles built in house as a system - and, even then, we're human.